Work In Progress SWF Community Voted Tier List - 3.0 COMPLETE

[Wintermelon43]

As I said originally, unless customs on is the tournament standard, this list is no customs.

I know. But, right know, it seems equal, which is why I asked that. Like, are you waiting for another major tournament (Like Apex 2016) to be confirmed to see, or another major tournament, or what?

 

[Browny]

I don't care about majors more than any other tournament, until the standard ruleset for most tournaments is customs on, this list will remain customs off.

 

[Diddy Kong]

+ ZeRo's dominance against Mr.R's Sheik definitely is a big plus to Diddy's overal viability. A clean 3 game lead against one of the best Sheik players in the world is not something to take lightly. Sure, it's ZeRo, but also, it's done with Diddy.
+ Always thought he was way better than everyone gave him credit for. EVO 2015 proved this further.
- Overrated, doesn't quite cut it in international tournaments, guess Luigi just got lucky a few times and has been massively overrated ever since. His obvious weaknesses should've given that away.

 

[A-money2121]

If I may be allowed to, why don't you think Charizard should go up? Thanks to the recent balance changes, Zard has more good matchups and is, in my own opinion, solid mid-tier material. He's not flawless, but putting him near the bottom does a great disservice to the great buffs he got recently.
He's in no way close to as bad as or due to the recent buffs he's got improving him a lot, like Ike, so his current placement should change positively, not drop him to nearly unusable levels (which, as demonstrated by vaBengalz in customs tournaments, is not anywhere close to 'Zard's place). 'Zard has a solid moveset even without customs, and he only really has awful MU's against characters like Sonic, Shiek and Zamus (who all are really good anyways), so putting him in bottom seems incorrect. Again, vaBengalz is a great example to how good Charizard can be in the right hands.

I believe anyone can be great with any character, even Charizard, however this is MY experience with him. Charizard has never been a character I've enjoyed playing with and never thought was a good character in general, even after the buffs he's received in the recent update. In my opinion, I think he is certainly as bad as characters like Palutena. But if you think Charizard is mid-tier, I can respect that.

 

[The_Devious]

+1
-1
-1

 

[neohopeSTF]

-1
-1
+1

 

[Kasai]

+1
+1
-1

 

[superange]

I'm interested to see how votes will go now that EVO is finished and I assume the next voting period will be in a day of two

 

[PsiPax]

I feel like alot of people vote based on tourneys, and matches instead of how good they think the character is.

 

[Wintermelon43]

I feel like alot of people vote based on tourneys, and matches instead of how good they think the character is.

They do

 

[Paxadin]

I feel like alot of people vote based on tourneys, and matches instead of how good they think the character is.

That's because that's how it works.
A tier list is based off the best play we currently know about.
Sorry, but we don't know how good "friend A" is with "this character", we can only base it off known tournaments with results.
Do you really think Sheik would be anywhere near #1 if we were talking casual play?

 

[Wintermelon43]

That's because that's how it works.
A tier list is based off the best play we currently know about.
Sorry, but we don't know how good "friend A" is with "this character", we can only base it off known tournaments with results.
Do you really Sheik would be anywhere near #1 if we were talking casual play?

Oh yeah, that's a brillant idea. Let's make Yoshi low tier, and Game & Watch high tier. And while we're at it, let's put Luigi in a tier above everyone because he has OP Representation!!!!!

 

[lijero13ss]

GW +1
Pacman +1
Rosalina +1

 

[_gold_]

You guys need to chill
@ Paxadin makes a valid point though

 

[SpottedCerberus]

Oh yeah, that's a brilliant idea. Let's make Yoshi low tier, and Game & Watch high tier. And while we're at it, let's put Luigi in a tier above everyone because he has OP Representation!

Since when does Luigi have OP representation? Did you follow EVO at all? Luigi was barely more present than Yoshi in terms of results. (Which are not the same thing as representation. We've been over this.) CEO wasn't much better.

Also, there was only 1 G&W main. He was very good, but the limitations of the character were made exceedingly clear when he went up against Dabuz.

 

[A-money2121]

Since when does Luigi have OP representation? Did you follow EVO at all? Luigi was barely more present than Yoshi in terms of results. (Which are not the same thing as representation. We've been over this.) CEO wasn't much better.

Also, there was only 1 G&W main. He was very good, but the limitations of the character were made exceedingly clear when he went up against Dabuz.

He was only giving an example, in hopes of contradicting Paxadin's claim.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

Kirby +1
Zelda +1 Really people? *facepalm*
Tink +1

 

[ShortcutButton]

-1
-1
-1

 

[dbwithlemon]

Must we do this every few pages, stop worrying about how other people decide to vote.
I'm going to vote up any character that has a red alternative costume from now on.
If you have a yellow alt, you get a down vote.

That's just how it is, stop complaining and make your votes.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Must we do this every few pages, stop worrying about how other people decide to vote.
I'm going to vote up any character that has a red alternative costume from now on.
If you have a yellow alt, you get a down vote.

That's just how it is, stop complaining and make your votes.

Sme characters, such as Kirby and Yoshi, have both a yellow and red coustome.

 

[Zionaze]

Sme characters, such as Kirby and Yoshi, have both a yellow and red coustome.

That was an example

 

[dbwithlemon]

Sme characters, such as Kirby and Yoshi, have both a yellow and red coustome.

Seriously?

Fine
-1 Sheik, for hiding the fact that she is a woman. Be proud
-1 Kirby, cause he has red and yellow, but no orange
,+1 Wii Fit, cause it's almost WTF, and I appreciate that

EDIT: On second thought, kirby may have orange, in which case, -2 Kirby for having orange.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Seriously?

Fine
-1 Sheik, for hiding the fact that she is a woman. Be proud
-1 Kirby, cause he has red and yellow, but no orange
,+1 Wii Fit, cause it's almost WTF, and I appreciate that

But Kirby DOES have orange. He has Pink, Yellow, Light Blue, Red, Green, Grey, Orange, and Dark Blue LOL

 

[dbwithlemon]

Just remembered that, so -1 Kirby, because Wintermelon

 

[16Pains]

+1 to diddy: I really think he should be an A+ character, due to he still requires an extreme amount of skill to take out people like shiek and ZSS, but ZeRo recently proved through all the nerfs, Diddy is still high up there, however pit does pretty well against him since his arrows can screw his recovery, chase him around and his bow can cut throughh diddy's aerials without to much end lag after the hit
+1 to wii fit. man he/she has so much potential and was represented well in the EVO tourney. of course wii fit is better with customs, Dabuz even admitted he has a tough time with pro wii fit trainers. Wii Fit belongs in low B/high B- tier without customs, because he/she definitely isn't worse than mewtwo. plus the ability to kill throw people at 120%, 145% if you're heavy, with deep breathing is good. Plus, she is great at avoiding edge guard with the ability to wall jump, stop momentum in the air with header, and a decent vertically ranged recovery. Her projectile are awesome and her aerials have almost no land lag; quicker than rosalina's! Might I add she/he can crouch under Falco's laser/reflector, almost all of ZSS attacks including grab and dash attack, and most moves in general. crouching is a very useful mindgame for someone who is as tall as rosalina!
+1 Zelda: up smash is getting closer to melee kill power, up b kills earlier, down throw combo, deserves B-; not really useable in tourneys.
+1 Charizard: better jab, less end lag on nair, combo down throw, kill up throw, deserves B rank, or B-. A smasher named StylesX2 went to Evo and used Charizard, lost, but got shiek to 60%. That's a little hard to do with a C ranked character. There are some mind games people aren't usingwith charizard, and he isn't represented well, so i guess i can see why
-1 luigi: i can't see luigi in S tier. he does very well, but he is no better than yoshi IMO in terms of rank. I can't see him being better than Cap Falc, Ness, Pikachu, or ZSS, but fits well where yoshi is!

 

[Wintermelon43]

+1 to diddy: I really think he should be an A+ character, due to he still requires an extreme amount of skill to take out people like shiek and ZSS, but ZeRo recently proved through all the nerfs, Diddy is still high up there, however pit does pretty well against him since his arrows can screw his recovery, chase him around and his bow can cut throughh diddy's aerials without to much end lag after the hit
+1 to wii fit. man he/she has so much potential and was represented well in the EVO tourney. of course wii fit is better with customs, Dabuz even admitted he has a tough time with pro wii fit trainers. Wii Fit belongs in low B/high B- tier without customs, because he/she definitely isn't worse than mewtwo. plus the ability to kill throw people at 120%, 145% if you're heavy, with deep breathing is good. Plus, she is great at avoiding edge guard with the ability to wall jump, stop momentum in the air with header, and a decent vertically ranged recovery. Her projectile are awesome and her aerials have almost no land lag; quicker than rosalina's! Might I add she/he can crouch under Falco's laser/reflector, almost all of ZSS attacks including grab and dash attack, and most moves in general. crouching is a very useful mindgame for someone who is as tall as rosalina!
+1 Zelda: up smash is getting closer to melee kill power, up b kills earlier, down throw combo, deserves B-; not really useable in tourneys.
+1 Charizard: better jab, less end lag on nair, combo down throw, kill up throw, deserves B rank, or B-. A smasher named StylesX2 went to Evo and used Charizard, lost, but got shiek to 60%. That's a little hard to do with a C ranked character. There are some mind games people aren't usingwith charizard, and he isn't represented well, so i guess i can see why
-1 luigi: i can't see luigi in S tier. he does very well, but he is no better than yoshi IMO in terms of rank. I can't see him being better than Cap Falc, Ness, Pikachu, or ZSS, but fits well where yoshi is!

Sorry to be that guy, but you can only vote for three.

Heheheheheheh I'm backkkkkkkk

 

[16Pains]

In that case
-1 Luigi
+1 wii fit trainer
+1 charizard
p.s. i'm purposely not includding rosa or shiek because everyone knows they are the best in the game,
even if shiek beats rosalina, rosa can take on anyone else
ness beats her slightly, and she's even with C. Falc, Pikachu, and Yoshi
Shiek...rules all lol

 

[Levateinn]

sorry guys I took his bait, wanted to wait till the next voting period, but I lost it.

Oh yeah, that's a brillant idea. Let's make Yoshi low tier, and Game & Watch high tier. And while we're at it, let's put Luigi in a tier above everyone because he has OP Representation!!!!!

Spoiler: john hammond said it best

my favorite part is how you hate people making use of competitive environment information for a competitive ranking for characters in a game we are considering from a competitive angle. I honestly don't get how you think you can only look at a character's "on paper" stats to determine how good or bad they are......and then completely ignore how they fare when put in use because you blame it on things like popularity!? What even is this logic?

 

[Calzorz]

-1 : Personally pikachu has been over rated for a while now i think esam is a great player but lets break it down , evo just went by and with customs pikachu recieves a buff with heavyskullbash and the jolts that paralyze why? because it takes away his weakness of not being able to kill a jolt will lead to a smash or a heavy skullbash 80% of the time providing your positioned for it. Now with that in mind we have to use esam as the example being the pikachu who we got to watch in the higher levels of play vsing players on his level , to start off esam vs regi was a close game and regi used NO customs imo esam won because of heavy skullbash setups without them would he have lost? , esam lost to ally also who also used NO customs , and then esam lost to abadango who used NO customs on pacman so basically buffed pikachu is loosing to no customs chars so normal pikachu will loose more , pikachu has great matchups but also has alot of even ones vs ALOT of the cast not just top tiers the character needs to stop being over rated. i am a pikachu main and was a top brawl player so i can relate more to a post about my experiance with pikachu too pika is not top 5 in game he fits around the top 10 reigion imo.

+1: A solid char with awesome set ups why is he this low in the tier list and hes 100% above link he is a better version with the same sort of gimpable recovery

+1 Evo has just shown us what a good pacman can do and hes a little better than where he is sitting at the moment imo not by a huge amount but needs a little touch on the tier list

 

[Wintermelon43]

sorry guys I took his bait, wanted to wait till the next voting period, but I lost it.

Spoiler: john hammond said it best

my favorite part is how you hate people making use of competitive environment information for a competitive ranking for characters in a game we are considering from a competitive angle. I honestly don't get how you think you can only look at a character's "on paper" stats to determine how good or bad they are......and then completely ignore how they fare when put in use because you blame it on things like popularity!? What even is this logic?

If you're only going by results, then you're going with how good people can play them. That isn't how a character should be placed on a tier list. The character ITSELF is what a tier list is. If we were to go by results, we'd have a tier list on players, not characters. But this has characters, so we go by how good the character is. I'm not going by "on paper" I'm talking about what we know.

 

[Wintermelon43]

I'm surprised Toon Link took this long to go up lol

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'm surprised Toon Link took this long to go up lol

Yeah same here, he's a steady secondary for me, albeit a character I decided upon making a secondary far later than DK, Ike, Ness and Mewtwo. But Toon Link is real solid. He doesn't exactly has the range of other sword fighters, but hey, I hear nobody complain about Roy about this either. Toon Link has got the mobility and projectile game to make up for this though. He's just a real fun character to play as overall.

 

[Fuerzo]

So when does the new version come out?

 

[shadowmm151]

-1 : Personally pikachu has been over rated for a while now i think esam is a great player but lets break it down , evo just went by and with customs pikachu recieves a buff with heavyskullbash and the jolts that paralyze why? because it takes away his weakness of not being able to kill a jolt will lead to a smash or a heavy skullbash 80% of the time providing your positioned for it. Now with that in mind we have to use esam as the example being the pikachu who we got to watch in the higher levels of play vsing players on his level , to start off esam vs regi was a close game and regi used NO customs imo esam won because of heavy skullbash setups without them would he have lost? , esam lost to ally also who also used NO customs , and then esam lost to abadango who used NO customs on pacman so basically buffed pikachu is loosing to no customs chars so normal pikachu will loose more , pikachu has great matchups but also has alot of even ones vs ALOT of the cast not just top tiers the character needs to stop being over rated. i am a pikachu main and was a top brawl player so i can relate more to a post about my experiance with pikachu too pika is not top 5 in game he fits around the top 10 reigion imo.

+1: A solid char with awesome set ups why is he this low in the tier list and hes 100% above link he is a better version with the same sort of gimpable recovery

+1 Evo has just shown us what a good pacman can do and hes a little better than where he is sitting at the moment imo not by a huge amount but needs a little touch on the tier list

Completely agree about &. I've been saying is overrated (a bit not a lot) for a while now, yet everyone wants to talk about theories all the time. Sure he's good on paper, but ONLY ESAM has done anything impressive with him. Do people honestly think he wouldn't get the same results with &etc.? It's more ESAM than to be honest. That being said he's still very good and likely top 10. Until I see some more results though I can't put him up in top 5. That's my same problem with . Everyone wants to put him in top 10, but nobody has really done anything with him. Is he good? Yes, obviously he is, but no one seems to get anything done with him. Everyone wants to talk up &yet push down in to top 15, yet he has more results than the two combined. I get his faults and don't disagree with him in top 15, but why should these two who have yet to take off (remember it's only ESAM pushing ) get such strong pushes into top 5 and top 10 respectively?

That being said, i disagree about somewhat. I definitely think he's underrated, but to say he's 100% better than is just wrong. has guaranteed kills out of grab. That's important when ranking characters in this game. received solid buffs that don't necessarily put him into higher tiers, but definitely solidifies him as a mid-tier (even if it's lower mid-tier). has some solid advantages over . I'm not entirely sure who I think is actually better (although I prefer ), but one is not 100% better than the other.

 

[SpottedCerberus]

So when does the new version come out?

Probably later today. It's pretty much every 3 to 5 days. And the votes have pretty much stopped, so Browny just has to tally them up.

 

[Apeirohaon]

-1 yoshi
-1 palutena
+1 marth

 

[Browny]

-1 Megaman, Metaknight, Ryu

UPDATED

 

[Jiggly]

This is a post so Browny doesn't double post. But it's not spam.

*ahem*

Pika isn't really overated, he has all the tools of a top tier, and honestly deserves top 3. He has good results as well, unlike cap

 

[shane3x]

List is starting to look kinda nice at the moment

Rosa +1
Robin +1
Pit -1

 

[Jiggly]

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