Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[NintenZ]

Despite me thinking she's sorta boring in her game, I'm totally for Elma in Smash.

If only because she is the only Xenoblade Chronicles X rep that makes sense at all, and because she uses dual swords, and that's damn cool!

I had an idea about her down-special being that she switches between her blades and swords, what would you guys think of that?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I had an idea about her down-special being that she switches between her blades and swords, what would you guys think of that?

That's the idea I'm using for my WIP moveset.

Fiora also has dual swords too and I imagine her down special to switch drones that have a special attack (Laser Gun, Cannon etc)

Even though they're both dual wielders, they're different at the core.

 

[PushDustIn]

Ok guys, last reminder: If your image is too big, you will get a straight warning, or an infraction (depending on your history and just how big the image is). I've been nice and spoilered two posts today, but that'll end. Please refer to the OP if you are unsure about the rules.

Spoiler

inb4 Ridley jokes.

Also, no Famitsu Column this week.

 

[NintenZ]

That's the idea I'm using for my WIP moveset.

Fiora also has dual swords too and I imagine her down special to switch drones that have a special attack (Laser Gun, Cannon etc)

Even though they're both dual wielders, they're different at the core.

And maybe Elma's Final Smash could be where she goes into a Skell, and Fiora's...

Spoiler: Spoilers for Xenoblade

Could be Face
Nemesis

Or it could be where she teams up with KOS-MOS from Xenosaga and does a Chain-Attack with her, but that seems really unlikely. But they both have so much potential, and I hope they someday can be worked on.

Oh and PushDustIn ,

Spoiler

This image is pure gold!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

And maybe Elma's Final Smash could be where she goes into a Skell, and Fiora's...

Spoiler: Spoilers for Xenoblade

Could be Face
Nemesis

Or it could be where she teams up with KOS-MOS from Xenosaga and does a Chain-Attack with her, but that seems really unlikely. But they both have so much potential, and I hope they someday can be worked on.

Oh and PushDustIn ,

Spoiler

This image is pure gold!

Just Final Cross for Fiora's FS would suffice. My Elma moveset plan has two FS's like Ryu, this time one in air (Skell) and one on ground (Overdrive)

Welp time for work, later everybody~

 

[NintenZ]

Just Final Cross for Fiora's FS would suffice. My Elma moveset plan has two FS's like Ryu, this time one in air (Skell) and one on ground (Overdrive)

Welp time for work, later everybody~

That actually would work best!

Alright, see ya later!

 

[Champ Gold]

Is Sakurai a Liar?

SG's research into the topic is finish. Hope you guys enjoy it. The header is amazing!

Would you be upset if I posted this on other websites?

 

[ChikoLad]

I feel so awful right now.

Caught the flu on Monday and haven't got a wink of sleep.

Well I guess I slept through some of the DAY at least but, not much during the night.

Anyway, I always wondered why Sakurai thought Samus was the best in the E3 build. I kinda want to say he MEANT to say Zero Suit Samus, but just made a mistake (or the translator did).

Most of the characters in the E3 build didn't have any substantial differences between that build and the final game. The only one I know of is that Rosalina was heavier in the E3 build.

 

[PushDustIn]

Would you be upset if I posted this on other websites?

Are you talking about reddit? Sites that link to the article is fine.

If you are talking about a new article, please don't post the entire thing. See the SmashBoards version of the post on how it should be done.

I feel so awful right now.

Caught the flu on Monday and haven't got a wink of sleep.

Well I guess I slept through some of the DAY at least but, not much during the night.

Anyway, I always wondered why Sakurai thought Samus was the best in the E3 build. I kinda want to say he MEANT to say Zero Suit Samus, but just made a mistake (or the translator did).

Most of the characters in the E3 build didn't have any substantial differences between that build and the final game. The only one I know of is that Rosalina was heavier in the E3 build.

He says Samus in Japanese. Samus wasn't picked.

 

[Furret24]

I feel so awful right now.

Caught the flu on Monday and haven't got a wink of sleep.

Well I guess I slept through some of the DAY at least but, not much during the night.

Hope you get better. :/

 

[Burruni]

I still find it off that Rosalina's so friggin light in the game.
I mean she's like a 7'6" entity of gravity that, in-universe, is around the same weight class as .
I think she's even lighter than in Smash.

 

[ChikoLad]

Are you talking about reddit? Sites that link to the article is fine.

If you are talking about a new article, please don't post the entire thing. See the SmashBoards version of the post on how it should be done.



He says Samus in Japanese. Samus wasn't picked.

I know but a part of me still thinks he meant to say Zero Suit Samus and just said Samus. It's an easy mistake to make.

And while she wasn't picked for the Invitational, there was plenty of gameplay of her that people recorded on the show floor. In particular, VGBootCamp were able to get a ton of down time with the 3DS version (the lines weren't nearly as big for it and you were allowed to play that version for much longer than the Wii U version), and uploaded in-depth analyses of the characters, and even discovered advanced techniques that early on, like pivot tilts. And in all of that, Samus didn't stand out at all.

Maybe Sakurai and his team play very projectile spam heavy matches and just aren't good at avoiding projectiles. Otherwise, I see no possible reason why he thought she was the best character even then.

I still find it off that Rosalina's so friggin light in the game.
I mean she's like a 7'6" entity of gravity that, in-universe, is around the same weight class as .
I think she's even lighter than in Smash.

The reason Rosalina is light in Smash is because she is purposefully making herself lighter with an anti-gravity spell, as Sakurai explained in a Miiverse post.

Basically, Rosalina is the only character Sakurai has literally said is holding back in Smash. :V

 

[wedl!!]

I don't think we need a psudeo-Ice Climber who has a respawning Nana to be able to survive for long without her puppet.

 

[Bedoop]

I still find it off that Rosalina's so friggin light in the game.
I mean she's like a 7'6" entity of gravity that, in-universe, is around the same weight class as .
I think she's even lighter than in Smash.

Lighter than and
Why Tho
( is heavier than but lighter than )

 

[ChikoLad]

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20160106005600/en/

The Nintendo World Store is closing down temporarily for a few weeks because it's being renovated.

 

[Arcturian]

I slipped and nearly fell on black ice three times this morning. It's going to be a long day.

 

[Burruni]

I don't think we need a psudeo-Ice Climber who has a respawning Nana to be able to survive for long without her puppet.

Except, in spite of a "similar mechanic," they're handled entirely differently.

RosaLuma is about spacing and walling out with remote control of the "puppet." Rosalina's just as strong as Luma and since they're programmed differently they can't standardly follow up on eachother. It's a matter of Rosalina's fragility and a game of keep away.
Ice Climbers is about in-bound teamwork through desynching and grabs; that their strength is minimal without the other.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I slipped and nearly fell on black ice three times this morning. It's going to be a long day.

Oh, man. I hate all this ice. Glad you're doing okay.

 

[PushDustIn]

I know but a part of me still thinks he meant to say Zero Suit Samus and just said Samus. It's an easy mistake to make.

And while she wasn't picked for the Invitational, there was plenty of gameplay of her that people recorded on the show floor. In particular, VGBootCamp were able to get a ton of down time with the 3DS version (the lines weren't nearly as big for it and you were allowed to play that version for much longer than the Wii U version), and uploaded in-depth analyses of the characters, and even discovered advanced techniques that early on, like pivot tilts. And in all of that, Samus didn't stand out at all.

Maybe Sakurai and his team play very projectile spam heavy matches and just aren't good at avoiding projectiles. Otherwise, I see no possible reason why he thought she was the best character even then.



The reason Rosalina is light in Smash is because she is purposefully making herself lighter with an anti-gravity spell, as Sakurai explained in a Miiverse post.

Basically, Rosalina is the only character Sakurai has literally said is holding back in Smash. :V

The whole point of Sakurai saying that was essentially to say, 'Hey these guys didn't pick the best character. It should be an interesting fight'. Seriously, watch it again. There is 0% doubt.

 

[Burruni]

The whole point of Sakurai saying that was essentially to say, 'Hey these guys didn't pick the best character. It should be an interesting fight'. Seriously, watch it again. There is 0% doubt.

Sakurai.
Mains IN BRAWL.
Says is the strongest character (in the build).

I think this man doesn't understand what makes a good fighter in a competitive sense.

 

[Bedoop]

Sakurai.
Mains IN BRAWL.

That's cause he prefers the heavyweights. (, , , , etc)
He even uses them in Smash 4.
What if developer of Street Fighter mained someone like Dan Hibiki?
Does it really matter who he plays?

 

[Burruni]

That's cause he prefers the heavyweights. (, , , , etc)
He even uses them in Smash 4.
What if developer of Street Fighter mained someone like Dan Hibiki?
Does it really matter who he plays?

It was a joke.
Because Ganondorf is agreed to be like the top 3 worst characters in that game.
And then his belief that Samus was the strongest character in Smash 4 out of the like 14 present at E3.

 

[Champ Gold]

Sakurai.
Mains IN BRAWL.
Says is the strongest character (in the build).

I think this man doesn't understand what makes a good fighter in a competitive sense.

To be honest, he didn't handle all the balance in this game and he's just going by how she was at the start.

The only time he truly had balancing was in 64 and Melee. Brawl had a very bad team who had some bias in a sense and Smash 4 was and is now starting getting feedback from fans

 

[KenboCalrissian]

The reason Rosalina is light in Smash is because she is purposefully making herself lighter with an anti-gravity spell, as Sakurai explained in a Miiverse post.

Basically, Rosalina is the only character Sakurai has literally said is holding back in Smash. :V

The same is true of Mewtwo using levitation over walking and thus reducing his weight, though it's not necessarily intentional and more a side-effect of being a lazy jerk.

 

[Chrono.]

Pre orders for the Oculus Rift went up and the thing costs a whopping $600 us dollars.

 

[ChikoLad]

The whole point of Sakurai saying that was essentially to say, 'Hey these guys didn't pick the best character. It should be an interesting fight'. Seriously, watch it again. There is 0% doubt.

But it still comes off as strange since Samus very clearly wasn't that great even in the E3 build.

I dunno, the whole thing just doesn't really add up.

I'm not saying he was lying, but it's definitely not a very well backed up statement that he made. It's not like we couldn't play as Samus in that build and assess her ourselves, so it came across as an ultimately pointless statement.

The same is true of Mewtwo using levitation over walking and thus reducing his weight, though it's not necessarily intentional and more a side-effect of being a lazy jerk.

Pretty much, but my point is more that Rosalina is the only character Sakurai has gone and said is flat out holding back.

Other characters obviously are too but Sakurai has never weighed in on that with any other character.

 

[BluePikmin11]

What games does the Oculus Rift offer?

 

[Chrono.]

What games does the Oculus Rift offer?

If you pre-order it comes with Lucky's Tale and EVE: Valkyrie, if you buy it off the shelves it just comes with Lucky's Tale.

 

[PushDustIn]

To be honest, he didn't handle all the balance in this game and he's just going by how she was at the start.

The only time he truly had balancing was in 64 and Melee. Brawl had a very bad team who had some bias in a sense and Smash 4 was and is now starting getting feedback from fans

Melee and 64 are terribly balanced and were balanced by Sakurai alone.

At least with Brawl and Smash for Wii U/3DS he had a team (a relatively small team).

Also:
Of course, I don’t approve all of their proposals right away. There’s no point in making the game more balanced if it decreases the fun factor. To give an extreme example, I could make all the characters perform similarly to Mario and achieve perfect balance. However, that probably wouldn’t be very fun at all. We work together by making adjustments while trying to preserve the characters’ individuality, then testing out the characters again. I consider all the data the playtesters collect on all the characters and eventually finalize the changes. --Source

But it still comes off as strange since Samus very clearly wasn't that great even in the E3 build.

I dunno, the whole thing just doesn't really add up.

I'm not saying he was lying, but it's definitely not a very well backed up statement that he made. It's not like we couldn't play as Samus in that build and assess her ourselves, so it came across as an ultimately pointless statement.



Pretty much, but my point is more that Rosalina is the only character Sakurai has gone and said is flat out holding back.

Other characters obviously are too but Sakurai has never weighed in on that with any other character.

You are literally projecting your expectation/opinion onto Sakurai. "Its obvious X (is to me) so why doesn't he think that?"

 

[ChikoLad]

Melee and 64 are terribly balanced and were balanced by Sakurai alone.

At least with Brawl and Smash for Wii U/3DS he had a team (a relatively small team).

Also:
Of course, I don’t approve all of their proposals right away. There’s no point in making the game more balanced if it decreases the fun factor. To give an extreme example, I could make all the characters perform similarly to Mario and achieve perfect balance. However, that probably wouldn’t be very fun at all. We work together by making adjustments while trying to preserve the characters’ individuality, then testing out the characters again. I consider all the data the playtesters collect on all the characters and eventually finalize the changes. --Source

You are literally projecting your expectation/opinion onto Sakurai. "Its obvious X (is to me) so why doesn't he think that?"

Except I have explained why it doesn't really add up in my previous posts. Don't single out that line when you know well I've already done that.

It's not projecting anything. Sakurai hasn't backed up the opinion and literally everyone else disagrees with him and did at the time, for perfectly justified reasons. Unless he were to suddenly back up the opinion today, then his statement at the time ultimately comes across as pointless and confusing, and without any substance. It kinda comes across as him simply stating an opinion and expecting us to take it as fact because he's the developer.

Please don't act like he's a god we're not allowed to disagree with or criticise and then accuse us of doing things we aren't doing by focusing on one line of our posts and decontextualising it. I said "it doesn't add up or make sense" because I had already explained why in my previous posts. And whether or not Samus was great in the E3 build is something we can determine as factual, and yeah, she objectively wasn't any better than she is now. Even in the E3 build, it was pretty clear she got bodied by some characters, like Villager and Rosalina (who are virtually immune to projectiles, Samus' standout form of attack, even in novice/beginner play).

 

[Deleted member]

Sakurai stated the reason why Samus was considered the most powerful character in the build and that was her Up-B which could apparently KO at early percentages
The Treehouse members even demonstrated it in one of the streams

 

[ChikoLad]

Sakurai stated the reason why Samus was considered the most powerful character in the build and that was her Up-B which could apparently KO at early percentages
The Treehouse members even demonstrated it in one of the streams

And it can still do that.

But like, pretty much everything Bowser has can KO you super early.

Doesn't make him the best in the game though.

 

[PushDustIn]

Except I have explained why it doesn't really add up in my previous posts. Don't single out that line when you know well I've already done that.

It's not projecting anything. Sakurai hasn't backed up the opinion and literally everyone else disagrees with him and did at the time, for perfectly justified reasons. Unless he were to suddenly back up the opinion today, then his statement at the time ultimately comes across as pointless and confusing, and without any substance. It kinda comes across as him simply stating an opinion and expecting us to take it as fact because he's the developer.

Please don't act like he's a god we're not allowed to disagree with or criticise and then accuse us of doing things we aren't doing by focusing on one line of our posts and decontextualising it. I said "it doesn't add up or make sense" because I had already explained why in my previous posts. And whether or not Samus was great in the E3 build is something we can determine as factual, and yeah, she objectively wasn't any better than she is now. Even in the E3 build, it was pretty clear she got bodied by some characters, like Villager and Rosalina (who are virtually immune to projectiles, Samus' standout form of attack, even in novice/beginner play).

I haven't seen anywhere where you provided evidence why Sakurai would think exactly like you. I'm not "singling out that line". That line is representative to your thought process. Please tell me where I misrepresented your argument. I've read your statement multiple times. You are saying Sakurai's OPINION is wrong because you/ other don't agree with it.

He said, "We believe that Samus is the best character".

You know that Sakurai doesn't just look at 1v1 situations? He has to consider a wide variety of fighting styles and match-ups. The game was made for four players playing at the same time.

I literally can't understand your thought process, it's not based in any form of logic.

Anyway, I'm done arguing with you.

 

[Champ Gold]

Melee and 64 are terribly balanced and were balanced by Sakurai alone.

At least with Brawl and Smash for Wii U/3DS he had a team (a relatively small team).

Also:
Of course, I don’t approve all of their proposals right away. There’s no point in making the game more balanced if it decreases the fun factor. To give an extreme example, I could make all the characters perform similarly to Mario and achieve perfect balance. However, that probably wouldn’t be very fun at all. We work together by making adjustments while trying to preserve the characters’ individuality, then testing out the characters again. I consider all the data the playtesters collect on all the characters and eventually finalize the changes. --Source

I can understand that but Brawl is probably the worst with its balance despite having a team. Casually and competitively.

I can have massive fun with Link, Ness, Mario and Ganondorf in Melee but I can't do that with Brawl

 

[Deleted member]

And it can still do that.

But like, pretty much everything Bowser has can KO you super early.

Doesn't make him the best in the game though.

No, it can't
Screw Attack only KOes over 100% if used on the ground
It could probably kill earlier in the E3 build
It could be even worse than pre-patch Sonic Up-Smash

 

[NintenZ]

So has anyone ever seen this?

That was...
That was certainly a thing...
Huh...

 

[Z25]

Haven't been here in a while and wanted to return with a leak. Sorry if it's already been discussed.

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/gen...tendo-tv-and-nintendo-go-nx-reveal-1789698/#3

Also goodnight. I will be sleeping and unable to discuss.

Let's break this down:

The poster: just started with no posts. Seems legit so far....

Some secret NX event... Eh maybe...

Talk about premise and setup for the system. Well I don't know much to say what it could be.

Now the games...

They all sound pretty cool, but the names are terrible and reek of fan ficton to much.... Concepts are nice though...

The only one that sounds reasonable is Smash Bros 300% edition. I feel like there would be 5 characters not two though.

 

[Burruni]

Let's break this down:

The poster: just started with no posts. Seems legit so far....

Some secret NX event... Eh maybe...

Talk about premise and setup for the system. Well I don't know much to say what it could be.

Now the games...

They all sound pretty cool, but the names are terrible and reek of fan ficton to much.... Concepts are nice though...

The only one that sounds reasonable is Smash Bros 300% edition. I feel like there would be 5 characters not two though.

I just get 404'd whenever i try to see it.

 

[NintenZ]

Is it okay to say that the Sonic fanbase is kinda weird?

 

[ChikoLad]

I haven't seen anywhere where you provided evidence why Sakurai would think exactly like you. I'm not "singling out that line". That line is representative to your thought process. Please tell me where I misrepresented your argument. I've read your statement multiple times. You are saying Sakurai's OPINION is wrong because you/ other don't agree with it.

He said, "We believe that Samus is the best character".

You know that Sakurai doesn't just look at 1v1 situations? He has to consider a wide variety of fighting styles and match-ups. The game was made for four players playing at the same time.

I literally can't understand your thought process, it's not based in any form of logic.

Anyway, I'm done arguing with you.

I'm well aware of how Sakurai doesn't just look at 1v1, but the same applies, especially going off of the Screw Attack.

You are saying Sakurai's OPINION is wrong because you/ other don't agree with it.

Again, you're decontextualising and singling out my statements.

I said that his opinion is wrong because literally everyone else disagrees with it for factual reasons, and based on analyses performed by various people.

It's also worth nothing that literally EVERY player at the Invitational disagreed with him and had the opposite stance. While nobody played as her in the Invitational itself, all of the players got a whole day to play the game before the Invitational and could try out any character they pleased, both 1v1 and FFA...which explains why Samus isn't represented in the Invitational, nobody thought she was viable (keeping in mind the Invitational was both 1v1 and FFA...primarily FFA actually). The video below represents this.

And while it may be his "opinion", opinions can indeed be wrong or nonsensical if they don't reflect the facts on the subject matter, and therefore, they are invalid. This appears to be the case with Sakurai's statement on Samus in the E3 build. Literally nothing supports the claim and all facts indicate that the opposite is true.

No, it can't
Screw Attack only KOes over 100% if used on the ground
It could probably kill earlier in the E3 build
It could be even worse than pre-patch Sonic Up-Smash

I haven't seen any videos of it KO'ing from particularly early percentages in the E3 build, and it's primarily a move designed for trying to KO people already in the air anyway. On it's own, it wouldn't make Samus the best in the game, especially since it leaves you in free fall. This is a move that definitely isn't as powerful as any of Bowser's strongest moves even in the E3 build, and leaves you WAY more open due to propelling you in the air and leaving you in free fall. Even if it was stronger than it is now, Screw Attack didn't make Samus the best in the E3 build, not by a long shot.