Super Meter

[knuckles213]

yep, just how it sounds. tell me, what is your opinion on super meters being added to the game. (the meter would be place under your % damage and would build up for supers possibly more than one super)

I feel it could be implemented quite nicely and could slightly fix some of those bad MUs and probably add combos to the characters (or game) giving it a new feel to the series, without changing any of the smash elements. you would either give or received damage to build up and you could have choice of turning on or off. I know this would have had some life changing/MU changing/tier impact on brawl if was in.

I wanna hear your thoughts

 

[Mypantisgone]

Smash ball is already confirmed,unless you want to add something like an option.

 

[LiteralGrill]

If this is ANYTHING like PSASBR count me out.

If this meter would allow me to charge and then use my Final Smash? Maybe,

 

[Branman64]

Perhaps if they made gaining meter an option final smashes would be allowed in tournaments.

 

[TewnLeenk]

Only if you have to fill the meter up to use a Final Smash, then I'd be fine with it.

BUT

If it's ANYTHING like that garbage Playstation All Stars bullsh*t tried to pull :

 

[DakotaBonez]

I guess it wouldn't bother me at all.
Just include an option to turn Supers on/off.
I'm more concerned about how balanced the supers are. I really want the Final Smashes to be a part of fights but I always end up turning them off due to how overpowered Land Masters and Hyper Sonic are.

 

[Arteen]

I hate meters in fighting games. I like SSB because it doesn't have any of that nonsense.

 

[Ulevo]

In regards to using a super meter for Final Smashes, I think that's a terrible idea. Not only are there balance concerns around how the super meter builds, and cases of abuse with certain characters being able to build it faster than others, but Final Smashes are horribly, horribly imbalanced and overpowered.

 

[SKM_NeoN]

What everyone else said. Unless Final Smashes become severely weaker it would break the game.

 

[knuckles213]

I wouldn't cross the idea of a final smash and super meter cause that may be too broken or implemented wrongly, I was thinking along the lines of like how street fighter or MVC series utilizes the meter where you can build it up during the fight (like 1 to 3 bars). Characters would get special moves, other than the b button, that they can use when 1 or more bars have been fulled, but only when their filled.

 

[Uffe]

I never liked the idea of meters in Smash. Especially for creating a Smash Ball attack. This isn't your average traditional fighting game we're talking about, and that's what I like about Smash. It's a fighting game, but doesn't restrict itself to traditional boundaries. I remember when I was in San Jose, people playing MvC2 or MvC3, they would always build up their special and just sit in a corner spamming their specials until they ran out. It was only interesting when someone who was actually good got around those and kicked all their asses like some pro. I fear that implementing this idea would only do the same.

 

[APC99]

OK, I've got it. What if the Smash Ball became really strong? Let's say there is a meter that can be filled by sufficiently dealing damage. The more the meter is filled, the stronger your punches become against the Smash Ball, making it so that you have to work to be able to break a Smash Ball?

 

[Ulevo]

OK, I've got it. What if the Smash Ball became really strong? Let's say there is a meter that can be filled by sufficiently dealing damage. The more the meter is filled, the stronger your punches become against the Smash Ball, making it so that you have to work to be able to break a Smash Ball?

Then characters that dealt more damage % wise would be at an inherent advantage. Some characters are able to remain competitively viable without having to resort to high damaging moves because they have strong knock back ratios or trajectories, are able to gimp really well, have methods to safely rack damage up over time (such as with projectiles), etc. Those assets would become invalidated in favor of damage just for breaking Smash Balls to use your Final Smash. It also doesn't solve the balance around Final Smashes.

There's nothing balanced about having Fox/Falco/Wolf taking away your stock with a tank, then killing you again as your halo spawns by lifting you in to the ceiling again with no counterplay.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

2 words smash ball

Ps I think there should be 2 final smashes per character

 

[Crystanium]

I've played around with the thought when smash balls were introduced. I see people speak of final smashes for some odd reason, since they're not used in tournaments. A meter would be an interesting idea, however. I can see why some would want the option to turn it off, but let's be honest. In a tournament setting.

 

[Lemonwater]

I like Smash BECAUSE it's not like most other fighters. I personally disliked even Smash Balls/Final Smashes, let alone meters.

 

[Dr. James Rustles]

In competitive play, I don't like the idea of rewarding a player based on how they perform, which is usually what a super meter is built on. A meter that rewards a player for performing well means the winning player will likely continue to win, negating opportunities for the other player to make a comeback, making the rest of the match feel less like an exhibition and more like domestic violence. A meter that rewards the player for performing poorly is just there to be a safety net to the other player's ego. The only reward should be for players that perform well, and that reward should be victory.

From a designer perspective, it feels really forced. You could make it a bit more complex with some give and take like in MK9, but most of the time it's just free damage.

 

[Z1GMA]

No, no, no. Just no.
This is Smash - not Street Fighter, King of Fighters, etc...
The Smash Ball suits the game perfectly for those who wanna play with items.

OT: There should be a %-switch on how often a specific item will appear, similar to how you can select how often a song will play in a stage.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Sakurai said he disqualifies characters that are in street fighter based games

 

[Rodriguez5]

Why would you even consider it, besides the super meter is over used by many games. No need to at it to this game.

 

[Z1GMA]

I'd rather want some kind of Wild Card Move for each character, that you can only use once per game.
Nothing overpowered, just a fun addition.

Megaman could use up an E-tank to regain 20% health.
Samus could fire a cluster of 5 Seeker Missiles, dealing a maximum of 25% damage with low knockback.

 

[DakotaBonez]

In regards to using a super meter for Final Smashes, I think that's a terrible idea. Not only are there balance concerns around how the super meter builds, and cases of abuse with certain characters being able to build it faster than others, but Final Smashes are horribly, horribly imbalanced and overpowered.

Ya can't use imbalanced final smashes as an argument until we see what the final smashes are. But yeah they will probably be imbalanced as F$#@ again.
I really wish they'd make em all balanced and dodgeable. Primarily just complaining about the Landmasters being too epic and Hyper Sonic being completely undodgeable.

 

[Big-Cat]

My goodness, look at all the negativity in this thread.

You guys are hating on meters way too much. Yes, Smash is not a traditional fighting game, but that doesn't mean that it can't use traditional mechanics. By that logic, Mario and Luigi shouldn't be shotos when everyone knows they are Smash's shotos.

Meter building has to be balanced along with the Final Smashes themselves and this would be no easy task. Believe it or not, the most balanced way to go about it is to give every single move individual values for meter building. The system ultimately needs to be able to accommodate the different playstyle differences. HOWEVER, there would naturally be characters that a larger reliance on meter than others so this is where things get interesting. Those that need meter would be those that really need their EX moves to get big damage done or as a safer means of reversal.

On the topic of Final Smashes, those need to be balanced big time to where they can be punished for not being used properly. Miss Fit's Final Smash seems to be going in this directions. The only thing I need to see is the knockback and shield damage that are being done per pose. Otherwise, her FS reminds me of Storm's Ice Storm.

 

[rawrimamonster]

My goodness, look at all the negativity in this thread.

You guys are hating on meters way too much. Yes, Smash is not a traditional fighting game, but that doesn't mean that it can't use traditional mechanics. By that logic, Mario and Luigi shouldn't be shotos when everyone knows they are Smash's shotos.

Meter building has to be balanced along with the Final Smashes themselves and this would be no easy task. Believe it or not, the most balanced way to go about it is to give every single move individual values for meter building. The system ultimately needs to be able to accommodate the different playstyle differences. HOWEVER, there would naturally be characters that a larger reliance on meter than others so this is where things get interesting. Those that need meter would be those that really need their EX moves to get big damage done or as a safer means of reversal.

On the topic of Final Smashes, those need to be balanced big time to where they can be punished for not being used properly. Miss Fit's Final Smash seems to be going in this directions. The only thing I need to see is the knockback and shield damage that are being done per pose. Otherwise, her FS reminds me of Storm's Ice Storm.

The point is we play smash because it's not traditional fighters, to stay away from crutch elements like supers. If you want super attacks, use items and have smashballs on. I prefer to do my combos myself, not have my hand held and watch a flashy animation.

 

[Big-Cat]

Honestly, I can live without a meter, but supers are NOT crutch elements. The Ultras in Street Fighter 4 are, but supers are generally not. And most of the time, you can't just watch a flashy animation, you have to combo into supers 95% of the time.

I don't give a hoot if Smash is traditional or not. That doesn't mean it can't learn from other games. Seriously, why is it that the Smash fanbase is so headstrong about being oh so unique?

 

[Salty the SLUG]

Get that "meter" garbage outta here!

 

[SmashBro99]

Probably not, smash isnt a fighting game

 

[Uffe]

My goodness, look at all the negativity in this thread.

You guys are hating on meters way too much. Yes, Smash is not a traditional fighting game, but that doesn't mean that it can't use traditional mechanics. By that logic, Mario and Luigi shouldn't be shotos when everyone knows they are Smash's shotos.

So Super Mario Bros. is a fighting game, then?

 

[Big-Cat]

So Super Mario Bros. is a fighting game, then?

Well, duh. You're fighting goombas, koopas, and other creatures.

My point was that just because it's not a traditional fighting game doesn't mean it can't use elements from them. Smash already does this believe it or not. Besides, games are already using aspects of different genres to begin with. Metroid is part platformer and part action adventure, and that's just freaking 1986.

 

[Uffe]

Well, duh. You're fighting goombas, koopas, and other creatures.

My point was that just because it's not a traditional fighting game doesn't mean it can't use elements from them. Smash already does this believe it or not. Besides, games are already using aspects of different genres to begin with. Metroid is part platformer and part action adventure, and that's just freaking 1986.

I know what you mean. I remember one of my friends asked another friend of mine, "Because Mario and Luigi's up B acts like a shoryuken, are they technically shotos?" He replied saying yes to that. Of course now with Mega Man in the game, he's got one as well. Of course I'd like to think that they're basing that off of Street Fighter. In any case, the shoto idea totally slipped my mind when I made my previous comment.

 

[Big-Cat]

Well, shotos are determined more by their playstyle than anything else. The shoto has a projectile (usually), a rushdown technique, and an uppercut anti-air. The shoto is the all-around character, but the emphasis on offense or defense will vary depending on the game. For the most part, Mario and Luigi are Smash's shotos. Mario is Ryu (mainly when he gets his Down B back), and Luigi is Ken.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Meter for Final Smash possibly, I'm kind of warming up to the idea.

I can live without it though, if the Smash Ball returns I'm fine with it.

I don't want any other kind of charging meter unless it involves the Smash Ball, or moves like Wario Waft or Robo Beam.

 

[[Corn]]

If Implemented, it would reward camping or characters with projectiles/fast/mobile moves without them doing anything really.
Add that to the fact that Final Smashes arent balanced for gameplay, or even considered for, they would be broken beyong belief.

Think of Snake throwing Nades for a bit, tacking on damage whilst opponent moves in, and get hit to a point where he is gimped. Activates FS and instantly is ungimped and at a huge advantage with the potential to take off 2 stock without much effort.
Mario on the other hand, has a large recovery on his FS and it can be simply jumped over and rarely results in a kill.

 

[grizby2]

If Implemented, it would reward camping or characters with projectiles/fast/mobile moves without them doing anything really.
Add that to the fact that Final Smashes arent balanced for gameplay, or even considered for, they would be broken beyong belief.

Think of Snake throwing Nades for a bit, tacking on damage whilst opponent moves in, and get hit to a point where he is gimped. Activates FS and instantly is ungimped and at a huge advantage with the potential to take off 2 stock without much effort.
Mario on the other hand, has a large recovery on his FS and it can be simply jumped over and rarely results in a kill.

pretty much this. a character should NOT be balanced/dependant on a Final smash or "meter" move if the mechanic can be TURNED OFF/ON.

 

[Alzi]

A meter would just not make it smash bros.

Smash bros is a very unique fighting game you don't want to be adding in anything that is going to lose that.

 

[Big-Cat]

A meter would just not make it smash bros.

Smash bros is a very unique fighting game you don't want to be adding in anything that is going to lose that.

Then let's get rid of projectiles, sex kicks, throws, etc.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Then let's get rid of projectiles, sex kicks, throws, etc.

The point is that while it does have some fighting elements in it, it shouldn't just go ahead and borrow all the things, especially when we already have a similar mechanic. Why would anyone replace a unique mechanic with something that every other game in the genre has? Let the super meters stay in the traditional fighting games, we can do with Final Smashes.

 

[Big-Cat]

You do know that unique does not mean better right?

 

[SKM_NeoN]

You do know that unique does not mean better right?

Super Meters are definitely better than the smash orb. As long as you can disable it I don't care what they go with to be honest.

 

[Ove]

I agree with KumaOso; it's not wrong implementing great mechanics from other fighting games into Smash. Adding Super Meters won't make Smash less unique than it already is, only tweak it up a bit.

Personally, I'd like to see something in the manner of Super Meters with Super Combos from the Street Fighter 4 games, as I'd think it could add a lot to Smash with some flashy moves that you can combo into. Rather than being Final Smashes that knock out your opponents, they could be used to rack up great damage with a carefully placed combo.