Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[Cadillac]

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

 

[Silo777]

This. He would be the thanos of fan rules:

"Mr. no upgrades, i dont feel so good" lol

Isaac would literally be an upgrade of all things at once since he is every single thing in the game except playable atm.

Even if certain people didn’t like Isaac, they’d still have to admit that his reveal was insanely hype for what it meant. He’s a win for everyone at the end of the day.

Wait wait wait, that makes me wonder. If Isaac got in as a fighter, would that make him the single most represented character in the entire game?

 

[Cadillac]

Even if certain people didn’t like Isaac, they’d still have to admit that his reveal was insanely hype for what it meant. He’s a win for everyone at the end of the day.

Wait wait wait, that makes me wonder. If Isaac got in as a fighter, would that make him the single most represented character in the entire game?

Fighter, AT, Costume. But I don't know if they'll keep the AT if he gets added.

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Fighter, AT, Costume. But I don't know if they'll keep the AT if he gets added.

They'll most likely just leave it in there. It isn't too much of a hurdle to have him play the role of both in the game

 

[Kalaam]

Even if certain people didn’t like Isaac, they’d still have to admit that his reveal was insanely hype for what it meant. He’s a win for everyone at the end of the day.

Wait wait wait, that makes me wonder. If Isaac got in as a fighter, would that make him the single most represented character in the entire game?

Well, Isaac can get the ninja class and there is a glitch to clone him in the game after all sooooo....

 

[MeatOfJustice]

At this point I wouldn't be suprised if they were holding it until after New Horizons for its sales or they're waiting for E3, but the latter would mean this year will not have much in terms of new games and turn investors off as Nazyrus said.

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

Isaac. Not saying he's likely but rather that I don't expect Nintendo of Japan picking one as fully playable over a character from a bigger company.

 

[Cadillac]

Well, Isaac can get the ninja class and there is a glitch to clone him in the game after all sooooo....

Then would his recovery be Kage Bunshin no Jutsu like Naruto?

 

[Kalaam]

Then would his recovery be Kage Bunshin no Jutsu like Naruto?

It'd be more line the pile diver that rock lee does.

 

[Pinguino21v]

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

If you count Minecraft as indie, then indie. I'm strongly believing in Steve this pass, way more than Isaac.

 

[Guynamednelson]

If you count Minecraft as indie, then indie. I'm strongly believing in Steve this pass, way more than Isaac.

Remember, they're not going for the biggest names. Except Hero if you're Japanese.

This. He would be the thanos of fan rules:

"Mr. no upgrades, i dont feel so good" lol

Isaac would literally be an upgrade of all things at once since he is every single thing in the game except playable atm.

I see Isaac as being more like Hulk's snap than Thanos'.

 

[Kalaam]

I see Isaac as being more like Hulk's snap than Thanos'.

Bringing back everyone into speculation.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Call me crazy, but I somewhat think Isaac still has a chance for this game. If we hear any news soon about a upcoming Golden Sun game than I'm putting Isaac on my predictions list.

 

[Silo777]

Been doin some thinking. Just gonna kinda spew out my thoughts.

Isaac just generally has more going for him than the other assists in terms of being made into a fighter. I think the most important thing is that not only does he come from what would be a brand new series to smash, but also is the main character of said series. This makes it very easy to make a fighter pack around, as you can add pretty much anything from the Golden Sun series into it. This isn’t even mentioning how a Golden Sun game might be coming soon, giving further reason to consider Isaac.

The thing with characters like Waluigi is that they are side characters from pre-existing franchises in Smash. Waluigi doesn’t have his own game within that franchise, either. With Byleth, he was from an existing franchise but he had his own game that they could easily pull content from. Waluigi doesn’t even have that, so everything that they add in the pack has to be directly related to Waluigi. This isn’t impossible, but it’s not easy. His stage would have to be Waluigi’s Pinball or something and the songs and extra content would all have to be Waluigi’s themes and stuff. This wouldn’t be that hard if Waluigi was a more prominent character in Mario, but he rarely appears in anything that isn’t a side game that needs a bigger roster. He’s never in the spotlight.

So yeah, Waluigi has Isaac beaten in terms of being loud about it. However, Isaac isn’t that far behind in that regard plus he has everything I just mentioned going for him. Considering this, a new Golden Sun is basically the thing that makes it go from them being at somewhat the same likelihood to completely tipping things in Isaac’s favour. That being said, if Nintendo really wanted to they could find a way to fill up a pack with Waluigi. It would just be much more difficult and constrained.

Also, I don’t think we can treat this possible new Golden Sun like we would with any other requested fighter getting a new game. This particular game is from a series that has been dead for a decade, and is most likely only seeing the light of day again because of Smash. The developers said it themselves. If a new game was to happen, it would be because people expressed interest in the series. I’m not saying Smash is the sole reason, but it definitely would’ve played a huge part. So if a game is happening because a ton of people went crazy over wanting the main character to join Smash, it’s probably pretty likely that they’ll at least consider putting this character in Smash alongside it.

God, I gotta stop going off on tangents like this. I don’t usually like to rate chances, because I don’t think that a character’s chances for the game necessarily translates into a percentage or number. However, I’ll do it just this once.


Without new Golden Sun - 10%

I think it’s still possible, he still has a lot of demand behind him. He just doesn’t really have that advantage he could have which makes him a lower priority.

With new Golden Sun - 65%

While it’s nowhere near a guarantee, I think a new game sets Isaac apart and fixes his only two weaknesses (dead franchise, irrelevant). I genuinely don’t believe assists are a problem for vol. 2, and neither are spirits and costumes (as long as it’s from the base game)

 

[MeatOfJustice]

Been doin some thinking. Just gonna kinda spew out my thoughts.

Isaac just generally has more going for him than the other assists in terms of being made into a fighter. I think the most important thing is that not only does he come from what would be a brand new series to smash, but also is the main character of said series. This makes it very easy to make a fighter pack around, as you can add pretty much anything from the Golden Sun series into it. This isn’t even mentioning how a Golden Sun game might be coming soon, giving further reason to consider Isaac.

The thing with characters like Waluigi is that they are side characters from pre-existing franchises in Smash. Waluigi doesn’t have his own game within that franchise, either. With Byleth, he was from an existing franchise but he had his own game that they could easily pull content from. Waluigi doesn’t even have that, so everything that they add in the pack has to be directly related to Waluigi. This isn’t impossible, but it’s not easy. His stage would have to be Waluigi’s Pinball or something and the songs and extra content would all have to be Waluigi’s themes and stuff. This wouldn’t be that hard if Waluigi was a more prominent character in Mario, but he rarely appears in anything that isn’t a side game that needs a bigger roster. He’s never in the spotlight.

So yeah, Waluigi has Isaac beaten in terms of being loud about it. However, Isaac isn’t that far behind in that regard plus he has everything I just mentioned going for him. Considering this, a new Golden Sun is basically the thing that makes it go from them being at somewhat the same likelihood to completely tipping things in Isaac’s favour. That being said, if Nintendo really wanted to they could find a way to fill up a pack with Waluigi. It would just be much more difficult and constrained.

Also, I don’t think we can treat this possible new Golden Sun like we would with any other requested fighter getting a new game. This particular game is from a series that has been dead for a decade, and is most likely only seeing the light of day again because of Smash. The developers said it themselves. If a new game was to happen, it would be because people expressed interest in the series. I’m not saying Smash is the sole reason, but it definitely would’ve played a huge part. So if a game is happening because a ton of people went crazy over wanting the main character to join Smash, it’s probably pretty likely that they’ll at least consider putting this character in Smash alongside it.

God, I gotta stop going off on tangents like this. I don’t usually like to rate chances, because I don’t think that a character’s chances for the game necessarily translates into a percentage or number. However, I’ll do it just this once.


Without new Golden Sun - 10%

I think it’s still possible, he still has a lot of demand behind him. He just doesn’t really have that advantage he could have which makes him a lower priority.

With new Golden Sun - 65%

While it’s nowhere near a guarantee, I think a new game sets Isaac apart and fixes his only two weaknesses (dead franchise, irrelevant). I genuinely don’t believe assists are a problem for vol. 2, and neither are spirits and costumes (as long as it’s from the base game)

But what if... Waluigi gets his own game?

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

There's a new rumor going around regarding a direct this month from a journalist called Jeff Grub from Venturebeats is hinting at

OK. Look. Nintendo is far into the process of preparing a Direct. It's likely coming next week. That could change. Pencil in March 18 (maybe March 19). It'll have a number of third-party games along with whatever it shows to fill out its 2020 lineup. https://t.co/QFcfs9rUi6

— Grubb (@JeffGrubb) March 10, 2020

Apparently in his podcast he also said there were a good chunk of ports and remakes in the direct which could potentially be really good for us
Still take this with a huge grain of salt, it's just a potential rumor to pass the time with and could easily be false like a ton of others that have come and gone.

 

[N3ON]

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

If you really wanted an impartial answer you're better off asking this kind of question in a thread not dedicated to one of the two options.

 

[Cadillac]

If you really wanted an impartial answer you're better off asking this kind of question in a thread not dedicated to one of the two options.

Maybe, but this is like the only thread I take part in, and if I ask the same thing in a different thread I thought everyone will just say both won't happen.

 

[Silo777]

But what if... Waluigi gets his own game?

Not gonna lie, I’d love that.

 

[Cadillac]

Not gonna lie, I’d love that.

Waluigi Golf?

 

[Silo777]

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

Depends on what indie rep. The only indie character I personally think has enough under their belt to earn their spot in Smash is Shantae, although you could argue whether she’s truly “indie” or not.

 

[Guynamednelson]

If you really wanted an impartial answer you're better off asking this kind of question in a thread not dedicated to one of the two options.

Regardless of what thread this is, the fact that indie fandoms are more submissive to minor content should tell you the answer.

 

[MeatOfJustice]

There's a new rumor going around regarding a direct this month from a journalist called Jeff Grub from Venturebeats is hinting at

OK. Look. Nintendo is far into the process of preparing a Direct. It's likely coming next week. That could change. Pencil in March 18 (maybe March 19). It'll have a number of third-party games along with whatever it shows to fill out its 2020 lineup. https://t.co/QFcfs9rUi6

— Grubb (@JeffGrubb) March 10, 2020

Apparently in his podcast he also said there were a good chunk of ports and remakes in the direct which could potentially be really good for us
Still take this with a huge grain of salt, it's just a potential rumor to pass the time with and could easily be false like a ton of others that have come and gone.

How reliable is this guy? The timing is interesting too, as some insiders aren't talking about Direct dates anymore.

Either way, I'll believe a Direct date when I see it from Nintendo themselves.

Waluigi Golf?

Makes sense with Camelot in mind, but I'd rather see his game be of a genre Mario games have never/rarely touched.

 

[Silo777]

Makes sense with Camelot in mind, but I'd rather see his game be of a genre Mario games have never/rarely touched.

Waluigi: Modern Wahfare coming to Switch this Fall!

 

[ZelDan]

A question. Who do you think it's more likely: Isaac or getting promoted or an Indie rep? It would be great if both happens but it's just my dream.

If Shovel Knight didn't get AT'd as well and Sans didn't get disconfirmed recently like he did, they would have had more of a chance becoming playable.

Since the above HAS happened, then, I guess ISaac has more of chance? His disconformation was much sooner during the base while Sans's was more recent, probably happening after base roster/FP1 planning. AS far as AT promotions go, IF it becomes a thing, I could see Isaac having more of a chance based on fan demand, unless Nintendo really wants to promote Shovel Knight Dig.

 

[Cadillac]

How reliable is this guy? The timing is interesting too, as some insiders aren't talking about Direct dates anymore.

Either way, I'll believe a Direct date when I see it from Nintendo themselves.



Makes sense with Camelot in mind, but I'd rather see his game be of a genre Mario games have never/rarely touched.

Waluigi and the Holy Grail as a new RPG?

 

[clearandsweet]

You had me at "remakes', random journalist.

And yeah, Isaac much more likely than Shantae, the only real indie rep who would even be on the radar. Side note, I'm a Shantae fan as well, have played all her games because I somehow ended up with a copy of Shantae for the GBC as a child and enjoyed it.

As for Waluigi, they always go the other way when making a game. Gameplay first, then put or create an IP on it. you'd have to find some sort of new, untapped gameplay space and then slot Waluigi onto it, instead of going the other way around.

A tall ask, imo.

heh.

 

[Silo777]

You had me at "remakes', random journalist.

And yeah, Isaac much more likely than Shantae, the only real indie rep who would even be on the radar. Side note, I'm a Shantae fan as well, have played all her games because I somehow ended up with a copy of Shantae for the GBC as a child and enjoyed it.

As for Waluigi, they always go the other way when making a game. Gameplay first, then put or create an IP on it. you'd have to find some sort of new, untapped gameplay space and then slot Waluigi onto it, instead of going the other way around.

A tall ask, imo.

heh.

Get rich quick scheme:

Step 1: Own Shantae on the GBC.
Step 2: Profit.

On another note, if both GS1 and TLA are remade, the one addition I really want is a super boss against Isaac and his party during TLA. They’d have all the gear and djinn that you put on them during your playthrough of GS1. It would be like the Trainer Red battle but even better.

 

[Cadillac]

Get rich quick scheme:

Step 1: Own Shantae on the GBC.
Step 2: Profit.

On another note, if both GS1 and TLA are remade, the one addition I really want is a super boss against Isaac and his party during TLA. They’d have all the gear and djinn that you put on them during your playthrough of GS1. It would be like the Trainer Red battle but even better.

That's a good idea.
But the question is, when? In the story, or after the ending like a bonus?

 

[Nazyrus]

E3 2020 seemingly about to get cancelled, several sources are reporting.https://t.co/PTGxJ85kH5https://t.co/OtAWwPMGDDhttps://t.co/lYUAItHaAVhttps://t.co/jXUrfnAvJ0https://t.co/JrR1AjOrbk pic.twitter.com/dLeHvOD51r

— Gematsu (@gematsu) March 11, 2020

See, this is why i said pages ago to drop the "no direct till e3" logic, lol. Not only it would make no sense for companies to rely on events in this situation, but also nintendo is already known for doing their thing whenever they want regardless anyway really. Sorry this isnt thread related but it was partially mentioned before in the mix up of golden sun and such and i felt like clarifying why that logic was simply flawed. Hopefully we get our gs vs golf camelot situation answered as soon as possible during the year (or we could probably get both in the end anyway lol).

 

[Silo777]

That's a good idea.
But the question is, when? In the story, or after the ending like a bonus?

I was thinking after the credits there will be a small scene with Isaac talking to Felix and at the end he’ll ask if Felix wants to spar.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I feel like the likeliest option for an indie rep is Shovel Knight being promoted to be honest....or maybe Shantae being added. I don't see any other indies having that level of...."presence" to just get added as playable right now. (especially when Undertale and Cuphead got mii costumes)

Hollow Knight screams mii costume to me.

A playable indie in this iteration of Smash doesn't seem super likely to me....but I do think the next Smash game will be the game to get a playable indie rep. (basically I think if Shovel Knight is still relevant by that time he's got a great chance)

 

[Pinguino21v]

Depends on what indie rep. The only indie character I personally think has enough under their belt to earn their spot in Smash is Shantae, although you could argue whether she’s truly “indie” or not.

I'm a Shantae supporter myself, but I really can't see her happening honestly.

If an Indie gets a character, it's Steve (if you still consider it indie) or Reimu. Quote feels too much niche nowadays. Hollow knight is too young. Etc.

As far as indie goes, I can see a Wargroove spirit event however.


BTW, Ring Fit will have spirits. It's one less competitor for a first party.

 

[Silo777]

I'm a Shantae supporter myself, but I really can't see her happening honestly.

If an Indie gets a character, it's Steve (if you still consider it indie) or Reimu. Quote feels too much niche nowadays. Hollow knight is too young. Etc.

As far as indie goes, I can see a Wargroove spirit event however.


BTW, Ring Fit will have spirits. It's one less competitor for a first party.

I don’t really see Steve as indie, not since Microsoft bought it out. Is it wrong that I wouldn’t mind Steve, though? It was a big part of my childhood and it is the best selling game of all time.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I don’t really see Steve as indie, not since Microsoft bought it out. Is it wrong that I wouldn’t mind Steve, though? It was a big part of my childhood and it is the best selling game of all time.

I don't get the appeal of Steve at all. I can understand wanting to see Minecraft represented....but I don't see Steve as being a strong representative for the series at all.

To my mind a stage similar to Mario maker except with breakable voxels and a Creeper assist trophy would represent the series in the most iconic way.

Playable Steve just feels tacked on just for the sake of having a playable fighter. I mean, the sheep from Minecraft are probably more iconic than Steve is.

 

[Cadillac]

I don't think Steve is an indie anymore, especially how big it got. I remember someone saying Travis was an indie, but I'm not sure.

 

[Silo777]

I don't get the appeal of Steve at all. I can understand wanting to see Minecraft represented....but I don't see Steve as being a strong representative for the series at all.

To my mind a stage similar to Mario maker except with breakable voxels and a Creeper assist trophy would represent the series in the most iconic way.

Playable Steve just feels tacked on just for the sake of having a playable fighter. I mean, the sheep from Minecraft are probably more iconic than Steve is.

I agree. If they’re gonna take that direction though, I wouldn’t mind. I’d much prefer that to say, an 8th gen Pokémon.

 

[Nazyrus]

Ori mii costume is probably the next indie thing i see us getting honestly. But this is getting too off topic at this point lol

 

[Cadillac]

Ok then, something about GS. Sorry about starting the whole indie thing.
What kind of new GS things would you like to see? Like what song or what kind of spirits?

 

[Kalaam]

On another note, if both GS1 and TLA are remade, the one addition I really want is a super boss against Isaac and his party during TLA. They’d have all the gear and djinn that you put on them during your playthrough of GS1. It would be like the Trainer Red battle but even better.

I think it'd require some tinkering to make it an actual boss fight, like with Saturos or the Colosso guys. If it's just a "copy" of your characters it would make for a very short and unsatisfying fight (like the ones you can do in the arena).
Probably have a "boss template" with variables based on the number of djinn collected, and what weapons they had.

Ok then, something about GS. Sorry about starting the whole indie thing.
What kind of new GS things would you like to see? Like what song or what kind of spirits?

For spirits i'd love a Saturos&Menardi one, with a second phase where a rathalos appears with a giant Ridley.
Music wise, Isaac battle theme and Saturos theme obviously. Venus ligthouse would be nice but having some quieter musics like Lemuria would be enjoyable, could be part of a TLA medley.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Ok then, something about GS. Sorry about starting the whole indie thing.
What kind of new GS things would you like to see? Like what song or what kind of spirits?

For tracks: Elemental Stars, Saturos’ theme, Jenna’s theme, Walking with Determination, Venus Lighhouse and Isaac’s theme. Also a Sea of Karagol/Vale medley.

As for spirits: Sheba, Piers, Kraden (his spirit battle should have tons of Timers), Karis, Reif, Tyrell, Amiti, Sveta, Eoleo, Himi, Saturos & Menardi, Karst & Agatio and Alex (who always has invincibility in his spirit battle and never directly fights).

I don't get the appeal of Steve at all. I can understand wanting to see Minecraft represented....but I don't see Steve as being a strong representative for the series at all.

To my mind a stage similar to Mario maker except with breakable voxels and a Creeper assist trophy would represent the series in the most iconic way.

Playable Steve just feels tacked on just for the sake of having a playable fighter. I mean, the sheep from Minecraft are probably more iconic than Steve is.

The appeal of Steve is that he’s the main character of a hugely successful game that people enjoyed and thus want to see represented. Playable representation is seen as the highest honour and Steve supporters believe he could make for an interesting fighter. Personally, I don’t really care about him and don’t personally see the exclusion of Minecraft content as anything eyebrow-raising.