Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[CodeBlue_]

Honestly I don't know if I should be surprised or mindlessly numb to people harassing Verge. I've seen several people on this site and other smash related sites with an absolute hatred for him.

But I didn't really expect people on this site to *defend it*.

You really gonna see someone reacting to someone repeatedly antagonizing you doesn't make soft? This isn't about Vergeben, this is about your snide hatred for anything that threaten's your envisioning of a hype "pure" reveal period, where there a no leaks or leakers.

People use Verge as a scapegoat and go on a crusade like their ****ing family was murdered and the moment he lashes out, you pretend like he's the one at fault? That he had it coming? Kicking a man while he's down with petty victim blaming doesn't make you an intelligent or balanced person, it makes you a selfish hateful human being. You really think you are smart for pretending to be a tough guy because you obsess over a god damn's children's video game? Who's really ****ing soft?

There's a place for people like you, it's the youtube comment section.

For any sane people, reminder to click the Ignore button. The more we give the Jims attention, the more the ideology will be normalized. Don't waste the energy over them.

 

[Buzzwole]

So...
How many characters left? I'm guessing at least 5 (2 new and 3 echoes, like the last smash direct)

Same guess for me.
I don't believe Verg knows everything, and I certainly don't believe that a placeholder box image means anything at all.
I think our we'll reach fighter #70, and get a few more echoes to go along with them.

I'm guessing we'll get Incineroar and Geno as the last two unique newcomers, and Shadow, Ken, and hopefully Dixie as echoes.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Implying you can play them at all anymore

After Walking Dead and Minecraft, it’s all done for

and then shoot the dog stories...

One of the worst things to do in any of their game is to shoot a dog...or worse

If I have to put my Adult hat on and think realistically, I do not think Dixie, one of my most wanted newcomers will make it in the game this time around.

If she wasn't revealed with K.Rool, even as an Echo (think Richter), she won't be in the game.

and we’re given separate reveals while and are 3rd party characters...so of course they would have a trailer and be revealed together

 

[ReeseBalaski]

Here's a thought. They should bring this track back for Ultimate.

It would make perfect sense, imo. Ultimate is a celebration of Smash Bros., and there's a dedicated stage for the training mode. Why not bring it back.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Dark Samus was likley considered way after Ridley's trailer was created

 

[Will]

Dark Samus was likley considered way after Ridley's trailer was created

that would be so many months of time tho

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Oh nice, music theory is unarguably dead, now let's see what happe-
*Verge gets a bunch of harassment to the point he's had enough*
While I'm not happy with the guy making fun of autism, are people REALLY that ****ing braindead to harass a guy? For ****'s sake this fanbase is the ****ing worst

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, I want the Pokemon newcomer next.

Not for Verg or Box theory.


Because it'll prove that, once again, we're ****ing stupid for trying to find patterns where they don't exist.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Oh also Steven's theme is fantastic. I'm thrilled we're getting more Hoenn music.

Now if only we had a Hoenn stage to play this song on...

 

[Buzzwole]

Now if only we had a Hoenn stage to play this song on...

Smash has a lot of songs that don't feel like they have any good stage to go with. Its a bummer. Gangplank Galleon, the Mario 3 Boss remix, etc. Great songs, but they don't necessarily fit any stages.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Honestly. Vergeben and his supporters are just being annoying. You can't even speculate about any other potential Pokemon reps, because people and Incineroar fans take his word as gospel and say you're wrong. And if you point out that Vergeben said there wouldn't be any new DK characters or that Isabelle would be an echo, they'll just backpedal.

 

[Shroob]

Honestly. Vergeben and his supporters are just being annoying. You can't even speculate about any other potential Pokemon reps, because people and Incineroar fans take his word as gospel and say you're wrong. And if you point out that Vergeben said there wouldn't be any new DK characters or that Isabelle would be an echo, they'll just backpedal.

I don't even think Vergeben is legit, but this is cherrypicking.


Vergeben messaged Loz18 about a leak he had received that he himself didn't believe in regards to K.Rool, and for Isabelle, he said he flat out didn't know. He claims to have heard Echo, but he wasn't sure.


These are really poor points to use against him.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly. Vergeben and his supporters are just being annoying. You can't even speculate about any other potential Pokemon reps, because people and Incineroar fans take his word as gospel and say you're wrong. And if you point out that Vergeben said there wouldn't be any new DK characters or that Isabelle would be an echo, they'll just backpedal.

1: This has nothing to do with "Maybe it's not Incineroar"
2: This is about how he's getting harassment because a bunch of children are unable to act properly and are yelling at him because "BUT THE MUSIC THEORY HAS TO BE REAL/NO THE CHARACTERS I WANT ARE ABSOLUTELY IN/whatever sad excuse these pathetic excuses of human beings have". The fact this game is coming out is proof there's no god because we don't deserve all this content considering all these ****ing adult sized babies

 

[Plumstar]

I'm new to this matter but did Vergeben mention anything about the music theory while leaking which characters are in base game? If not, then why are people ganging up on him or harrassing him for not making that leak in the first place? I just think what the users did to him wasn't very smart and was a bit childish, even with his comment regarding autism.
Just curious.

 

[Shroob]

You'd think the music theory being dead's a good thing, because if it's legit, then the amount of newcomers we can realistically get are Elma....and maybe a Sonic newcomer, that's it besides new IPs.


With a dead music theory, characters like Bandanna Dee, Skull Kid etc are back on the table.

 

[Pakky]

Still not sure what a Roblox is...

Spoiler: Roblox Noob

Spoiler: Johnny Cage

Spoiler: Mc ballyhoo

 

[perfectchaos83]

I'm new to this matter but did Vergeben mention anything about the music theory while leaking which characters are in base game? If not, then why are people ganging up on him or harrassing him for not making that leak in the first place? I just think what the users did to him wasn't very smart and was a bit childish, even with his comment regarding autism.
Just curious.

Music Theory and Vergeben's leaks can't co-exist (Unless, for some reason, Incineroar is an Echo)

You'd think the music theory being dead's a good thing, because if it's legit, then the amount of newcomers we can realistically get are Elma....and maybe a Sonic newcomer, that's it besides new IPs.


With a dead music theory, characters like Bandanna Dee, Skull Kid etc are back on the table.

Music Theory doesn't rule out unrepresented franchises, fwiw.

 

[Shroob]

Music Theory and Vergeben's leaks can't co-exist (Unless, for some reason, Incineroar is an Echo)



Music Theory doesn't rule out unrepresented franchises, fwiw.

Which is what I said when I said "New IPs"

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I'm new to this matter but did Vergeben mention anything about the music theory while leaking which characters are in base game? If not, then why are people ganging up on him or harrassing him for not making that leak in the first place? I just think what the users did to him wasn't very smart and was a bit childish, even with his comment regarding autism.
Just curious.

He said Incineroar's in and always claimed a Gen 7 mod, which according to a bunch of babies is fake because there's no way the theory that already had broken pattern would be false and end up breaking. Those infants do the same **** whenever someone claims to be Verge on 4chan or whatever because they're pathetic and have no impact on any lives so out of desperation to be heard they go low and harass people

 

[G-Guy]

can someone update me on the music theory? Do people assume that Incineroar is debunked because of today's music track?

 

[perfectchaos83]

can someone update me on the music theory? Do people assume that Incineroar is debunked because of today's music track?

Basics of the Music theory

1. Newcomers are accompanied by music from their franchise following their reveal.
2. Only one remix per series will be on the website.
3. If a franchise has a music Sample on the website they will not get a unique newcomer
4. Echoes are not affected by Music theory. Only Uniques.

Basically, as time goes on, it narrows down potential unique newcomer candidates by franchise. Thus far, nothing proves it wrong and the delayed Nintendo Direct provides us with evidence supporting it since Animal Crossing's Music Update was also delayed. This was found out due to each post on the blog having a unique ID number.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

It's also possible Incineroar is DLC

 

[SuperSceptile15]

I don't think I've ever felt so torn about someone having a meltdown. I empathize with Verge's situation, having hundreds of voices belittling you at every turn will destroy your spirit, to get that for simply talking about video games is ridiculous. But he lit that fire under himself through his own behavior. There's a reason people are going after him in this way and not, say, Jon Cartwright, or Nibellion, they aren't acting like massive donkey butts (Pardon the language) over the information they've acquired.

I'm certainly not condoning what's happening to him, but I'm also not surprised in the slightest that he's gotten this kind of feedback.

And... as terrible as it is, I won't deny that a part of me feels vindication over it:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

People really underestimate the toll leaks take on game developers. Morale plummets and teamwork stagnates as everyone becomes paranoid of who the culprit was. Exploiting the hard work of people like Sakurai, is, frankly, a really ****ed up thing to do.

THIS. THIS. THIS. Why are people even supporting Vergeben to begin with? Leakers do nothing but spoil surprises, and for what, so that they can have their small piece of fame on the Internet at another person's (in this case Sakurai's) expense? **** that.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

can someone update me on the music theory? Do people assume that Incineroar is debunked because of today's music track?

Yes because "There's no WAY the pattern I thought of is fake!" and Smash fans can't do anything better than their ability to look for patterns that aren't there or dismiss stuff because "Nah I don't like that so it can't be possible"

 

[ColietheGoalie]

1: This has nothing to do with "Maybe it's not Incineroar"
2: This is about how he's getting harassment because a bunch of children are unable to act properly and are yelling at him because "BUT THE MUSIC THEORY HAS TO BE REAL/NO THE CHARACTERS I WANT ARE ABSOLUTELY IN/whatever sad excuse these pathetic excuses of human beings have". The fact this game is coming out is proof there's no god because we don't deserve all this content considering all these ****ing adult sized babies

Tone it down a bit will ya? Yes, certain people are being assholes, but throwing the whole community under the bus and/or insinuating that people don’t even deserve to get to play the game is a little much.

 

[G-Guy]

Basics of the Music theory

1. Newcomers are accompanied by music from their franchise following their reveal.
2. Only one remix per series will be on the website.
3. If a franchise has a music Sample on the website they will not get a unique newcomer
4. Echoes are not affected by Music theory. Only Uniques.

Basically, as time goes on, it narrows down potential unique newcomer candidates by franchise. Thus far, nothing proves it wrong and the delayed Nintendo Direct provides us with evidence supporting it since Animal Crossing's Music Update was also delayed. This was found out due to each post on the blog having a unique ID number.

Thank you very much!

The theory sounds kind of odd to me, though....I don't know, I just would try to keep an open mind about the way music tracks and characters are released. Not everything has to follow a pattern.
I believe that the Dev team surely wants to have each franchise represented in the music department somehow, but I wouldn't say that each newcomer will be revealed with his own track on the site.

The new Ridley Battle theme hasn't been featured on the site outside of the short fighter intro video, for example.

 

[Shroob]

THIS. THIS. THIS. Why are people even supporting Vergeben to begin with? Leakers do nothing but spoil surprises, and for what, so that they can have their small piece of fame on the Internet at another person's (in this case Sakurai's) expense? **** that.

Because a lot of us flat out don't want to be surprised.


We have jobs and lives to attend to. Maybe if I was still in high school and had the time to look at the blog in anticipation, it'd be one thing, but two things:


1# This game's blog is ****ing awful, there's no reason TO watch it.

2# The game's almost 2 months away, it'll be out before we even know it.

 

[Plumstar]

Music Theory and Vergeben's leaks can't co-exist (Unless, for some reason, Incineroar is an Echo)



Music Theory doesn't rule out unrepresented franchises, fwiw.

Yeah I know they can't both be right, but I thought he was more confident about Incineroar's chances because of the music theory? Did he even talk about the music theory at all or what he thought about it when leaking Incineroar?
Again I don't know everything about Verg, so plz fill me in about him.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Tone it down a bit will ya? Yes, certain people are being ********, but throwing the whole community under the bus and/or insinuating that people don’t even deserve to get to play the game is a little much.

I'm not saying people don't deserve to play the game, I'm saying the game existing is something that this community doesn't deserve and I'm genuinely surprised Sakurai hasn't been burned out because of toxic stuff he receives too

THIS. THIS. THIS. Why are people even supporting Vergeben to begin with? Leakers do nothing but spoil surprises, and for what, so that they can have their small piece of fame on the Internet at another person's (in this case Sakurai's) expense? **** that.

That's fine and dandy but verge doesn't deserve to get at his expense either

Yeah I know they can't both be right, but I thought he was more confident about Incineroar's chances because of the music theory? Did he even talk about the music theory at all or what he thought about it when leaking Incineroar?
Again I don't know everything about Verg, so plz fill me in about him.

He never mentioned the music theory and never needed to mention it because it's irrelevant to the fact he has sources who know what the end product is going to look like

 

[perfectchaos83]

Thank you very much!

The theory sounds kind of odd to me, though....I don't know, I just would try to keep an open mind about the way music tracks and characters are released. Not everything has to follow a pattern.
I believe that the Dev team surely wants to have each franchise represented in the music department somehow, but I wouldn't say that each newcomer will be revealed with his own track on the site.

The new Ridley Battle theme hasn't been featured on the site outside of the short fighter intro video, for example.

The music itself has nothing to do with the character revealed. Metroid's Music Sample on the site is Brinstar Depths which was there alongside Ridley.

From a Marketing perspective, it makes sense since you keep the blog relevant to the recent reveals. Animal Crossing's music update had no reason to be delayed since the song itself isn't directly tied to Isabelle, but it was very likely to coincide with her reveal.

Yeah I know they can't both be right, but I thought he was more confident about Incineroar's chances because of the music theory? Did he even talk about the music theory at all or what he thought about it when leaking Incineroar?
Again I don't know everything about Verg, so plz fill me in about him.

Verge has said nothing regarding the music Theory.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

Because a lot of us flat out don't want to be surprised.


We have jobs and lives to attend to. Maybe if I was still in high school and had the time to look at the blog in anticipation, it'd be one thing, but two things:


1# This game's blog is ****ing awful, there's no reason TO watch it.

2# The game's almost 2 months away, it'll be out before we even know it.

1. Okay. Yes. The blog is pretty pointless if it wasn't for the music updates.

2. So what if it's only two months away? Are you so impatient that you're fine with many people being spoiled just because you're not in school anymore but several others are? It is not okay to ruin others fun just because of whatever personal situation you're in. And even if I did have a job or a family, I still wouldn't want to be spoiled.

 

[CannonStreak]

I'm not saying people don't deserve to play the game, I'm saying the game existing is something that this community doesn't deserve and I'm genuinely surprised Sakurai hasn't been burned out because of toxic stuff he receives too

Even if that is the case, you seem to be acting arrogant/acting like you are better than such people you call babies or those with no lives with that kind of attitude (No offense). You are no better than them by acting like that, so tone it down, will ya?

 

[Deleted member]

Because a lot of us flat out don't want to be surprised.


We have jobs and lives to attend to. Maybe if I was still in high school and had the time to look at the blog in anticipation, it'd be one thing, but two things:


1# This game's blog is ****ing awful, there's no reason TO watch it.

2# The game's almost 2 months away, it'll be out before we even know it.

Define "a lot of us" and that second reasoning, because that surely didn't help practically all of Smash 4's case.

 

[Shroob]

1. Okay. Yes. The blog is pretty pointless if it wasn't for the music updates.

2. So what if it's only two months away? Are you so impatient that you're fine with many people being spoiled just because you're not in school anymore but several others are? It is not okay to ruin others fun just because of whatever personal situation you're in. And even if I did have a job or a family, I still wouldn't want to be spoiled.

The idea of trying to keep secrets in 2018 is commendable, but pointless.


We live in an era where ****, no matter how well kept, is going to leak.


I don't hate leakers, I hate this archaic mindset of "Okay, we're going to draw **** out to try to build hype up until release!" because by doing that, you invite the leaks happening.


People were already sold after E3, dragging out the reveals isn't fun, it's tedious, especially with a useless blog.



MAYBE if the blog were actually useful, I'd sing a different tune, but no, I DON'T want a blog post on the banana gun an entire TWO MONTHS after it was revealed, thanks.

 

[Nemuresu]

So, found out the whole drama with Verg's usage of possible insults and I'd like to throw my 2 cents on the topic:
I'm an aspie. That's no lie. And I've personally had my own issues with the word's flanderization from "unique brain behaviour" to "synonym of ******" and I do not advocate for such usage. However, I think some people here are forgetting that all of this happened because of constant harassment towards Vergeben's persona. I mean, seriously, people are using either old or cherrypicked stuff to insult and discredit him (the old "guests leak" he posted from pre-Ridley and Simon stuff for the former, or "he didn't mention K. Rool!" for the latter). If I were him and got attacked for such petty stuff, I'd be angry too, maybe not to insult, but it'd clearly grind my gears (though we shouldn't expect everyone to have such patience, much less in such a large community like Smash's).

THIS. THIS. THIS. Why are people even supporting Vergeben to begin with? Leakers do nothing but spoil surprises, and for what, so that they can have their small piece of fame on the Internet at another person's (in this case Sakurai's) expense? **** that.

Easy. Because I have fun speculating about leaks. I don't care about their veracity, I just like to brainstorm how or why certain characters would join in.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Even if that is the case, you seem to be acting arrogant/acting like you are better than such people you call babies or those with no lives with that kind of attitude. You are no better than them by acting like that, so tone it down, will ya?

1: That's not my intention to come across as
2: Of course I'm better, I'm not harassing people for the smallest **** constantly due to the fact I'm a ****ing adult

Because a lot of us flat out don't want to be surprised.


We have jobs and lives to attend to. Maybe if I was still in high school and had the time to look at the blog in anticipation, it'd be one thing, but two things:


1# This game's blog is ****ing awful, there's no reason TO watch it.

2# The game's almost 2 months away, it'll be out before we even know it.

I wouldn't say "A lot of us don't want surprises" but rather "Most of us have better priorities and would rather know what we're going to spend our money on upfront"

 

[PLATINUM7]

The idea of trying to keep secrets in 2018 is commendable, but pointless.


We live in an era where ****, no matter how well kept, is going to leak.


I don't hate leakers, I hate this archaic mindset of "Okay, we're going to draw **** out to try to build hype up until release!" because by doing that, you invite the leaks happening.


People were already sold after E3, dragging out the reveals isn't fun, it's tedious, especially with a useless blog.



MAYBE if the blog were actually useful, I'd sing a different tune, but no, I DON'T want a blog post on the banana gun an entire TWO MONTHS after it was revealed, thanks.

So basically you'd either want:
1. Not everything shown in chunks to have a wothwhile blog which would just make it more likely for stuff to leak and annoy you more
or 2. Literally everything shown at once followed by basically nothing until release and annoy you more

???

 

[CannonStreak]

2: Of course I'm better, I'm not harassing people for the smallest **** constantly due to the fact I'm a ****ing adult

Not by talking about them like that you aren't. I know they are acting childish, but you shouldn't really act as if you are better by calling them out like that. There are better ways to handle this, let alone express yourself and how you see things.

EDIT: Also, being an adult doesn't make you better. You can be an adult and still be worse or just as bad.

 

[Shroob]

So basically you'd either want:
1. Not everything shown in chunks to have a wothwhile blog which would just make it more likely for stuff to leak and annoy you more
or 2. Literally everything shown at once followed by basically nothing until release and annoy you more

???

Or option 3:


Have Directs that focus on stuff like characters and game modes, while saving less important things like items, stages and Assists/Pokemon for blog reveals.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So basically you'd either want:
1. Not everything shown in chunks to have a wothwhile blog which would just make it more likely for stuff to leak and annoy you more
or 2. Literally everything shown at once followed by basically nothing until release and annoy you more

???

lol the Smash blog isn't worthwhile at all, there's NOTHING new we see get to see other than songs and no goofy stuff of Sakurai's typical brand. I've always said that it'd be much better if they saved those character trailers for whenever they get a blog post

Not by talking about them like that you aren't. I know they are acting childish, but you shouldn't really act as if you are better by calling them out like that. There are better ways to handle this, let alone express yourself and how you see things.

EDIT: Also, being an adult doesn't make you better. You can be an adult and still be worse or just as bad.

Oh I'm sorry is it bad to call a bunch of screaming crybabies as such? Why do you care? Do you feel addressed or something?