Smash 4 Speculation Chart [WE UPDATE NOW]

[Swamp Sensei]

I say add Pichu, but Young Link was completely replaced with Toon Link.

You could also add Plusle and Minun and Ray. Just my opinion.

 

[Kain VKail]

I say add Pichu, but Young Link was completely replaced with Toon Link.

You could also add Plusle and Minun and Ray. Just my opinion.

I like the idea of a "Plusle & Minun" and I think that Ray is great also, but for ray I think they should do a Wario idea and make a different Costume for each re-color be a different Ray Version.

 

[peeup]

Only Plusle and Minun. I want Smash 4 to have no characters except Plusle and Minun.

And maybe a Landmaster.

 

[Ferio_Kun]

I'm also going to go ahead and request Lip be included in this one. Having multiple items and Sakurai liking her, I think she has a good shot.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Prepare to add a Yoshimitsu slot in that row and see Heihachi & Co. turn grey.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Great idea Golden. I like this a lot. Pretty much every character will heavy support around here is on this. Although i'll be honest, I don't see quite a few characters on this making it in. But that's the point.

Again, great idea!

 

[Deleted member]

Great topic, Golden.

I was thinking concerning the Pokemon XY slot.
Could Sylveon or the Gen VI Trainer hold it ?

 

[Vintage Creep]

I think it's a little too late to get a Gen VI rep unless Sakurai already knows the entire generation from a while ago. I don't really think he gets to know new pokémons the same time we players do though, so it's possible that months ago he was "told" to put a new Lucario/Zoroark type of pkmn in the game. If that's not the case, I think a gen VI rep has a possibility only as a DLC (man I'm hyped for DLCs possibilities, that's a new thing for me).

 

[Deleted member]

I heavily doubt any Trainer outside of the one we have in Brawl will be playable. Red is the most well-known player character (with some NPC appearances), Charizard is one of the most popular and recognised Pokemon in the world, and Squirtle has its share of notability as well.
To get rid of them (....and Ivysaur) would be replacing icons with nobodies for the sake of "relevancy", which is not a wise decision.
You may be wondering why I'm not talking as if both Trainers would be included. Well, Pokemon Trainer is 3 characters to make. A second Trainer would be yet ANOTHER 3 characters to make, being counterproductive in development.

As for Sylveon, it has an improper body type to work, and unlike the common example, Ivysaur, it has no alternative means of limbs (it doesn't look as if the ribbons can be used like the vines).

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Konami. The same company that makes Metal Gear Solid and Silent Hill.

And Ganbare Goemon/Mystical Ninja, Gradius and more SHMUPS, Twinbee, Rocket Knight Adventures, Penguin Adventure, Contra, Tokimeki Memorial...

I seriously love this company, ya don't know.

 

[Opossum]

And Ganbare Goemon/Mystical Ninja, Gradius and more SHMUPS, Twinbee, Rocket Knight Adventures, Penguin Adventure, Contra, Tokimeki Memorial...

I seriously love this company, ya don't know.

Props for mentioning Rocket Knight, Horsetail. I gotta get around to playing the new one. I think it looks pretty good.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Of course Opossum. Because Sparkster is the real Awesome Possum, unlike that other... "Awe-ful" Possum.

 

[Opossum]

...Don't even mention that name...*shudders*

Seriously, if anything screamed "Awful Sonic Wannabe," it was Awesome Possum Kicks Dr. Machino's Butt...

 

[Bowserlick]

I don't see Andross on this chart. Sadly.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Andross would be definitely in the "unexpected" row. Lol Mother Brain has more chance to get in the game.

 

[Zzuxon]

I Think that Sheriff and Fawful should be on the chart.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Mr. Hanafuda and Tempo please?

 

[Deleted member]

@Lyn: I heavily doubt that Lyn will be considered if both Chrom and Roy are looked over. This goes for ANY Fire Emblem character that isn't them. So no Lyn, no Micaiah, no Shiida, no Lucina, no Robin, no etc.

@Pichu/Young Link: They were excluded for Brawl completely; no character data exists for them. Aside from that, Young Link had been replaced by Toon Link, making it very unlikely he will return at all. If they somehow manage to show up, they will be added to the list of Upexpected Characters.

@Plusle and Minun: We have no absolute proof about them being "pra_mai" or not, and I'd rather not do speculation on that issue. Also, Plusle and Minun have Mewtwo and two later Gens to worry about.

@Ray: There really is no reason to speculate the appearance of a Custom Robo at this point in time.

@Andross: Given the fact that a StarFox character alone is rather shaky, and for the most part, Krystal is sort of the dominant force (though Slippy is equal in Japan unless I am wrong) for speculation, and that Andross doesn't quite have a feasible body to begin with means that if the off-chance he does get in as a character, he will be added to the list of Unexpected Characters.

@Sheriff: I already discussed possibly including him on the basis that he's Nintendo's first protagonist.

@Fawful: Not enough reason to add him to speculate. Nowhere near as discussed as the 5 Mario characters already on it, which is kind of pushing the number of characters already. If he manages to appear in Dream Team (which I find unlikely), then possibly I would add him due to the inevitable discussion about him. Same with King Boo for Dark Moon, if he gets enough discussion about him as a result of it.

@Tempo: He seems to be a good contender, so I might include him (though out of fairness, I should probably add Mallo with him).

@Mr. Hanafuda: Seeing as he doesn't actually exist persay, if he is somehow confirmed for the game, he would be Unexpected.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

@Ray: There really is no reason to speculate the appearance of a Custom Robo at this point in time.

Why not? There's really no reason to not at least think about him. He's popular and from a critically acclaimed series. He hasn't had a game in a while but then again, Samus was included in Melee after a console of absolutely no Metroid games on the N64. He has a better shot than several other characters.

 

[3Bismyname]

Why not? There's really no reason to not at least think about him. He's popular and from a critically acclaimed series. He hasn't had a game in a while but then again, Samus was included in Melee after a console of absolutely no Metroid games on the N64. He has a better shot than several other characters.

Ray isnt really comparable to Samus cause Samus at least appeared in the previous Smash. at best Ray is comparable to Marth who hadnt been seen since the Famicon either and obviously wasnt in smash64. but Ray doesn't have nearly as much popularity or a cult following that Marth had. i personally would like Ray. his moveset writes itself and we could always use more futuristic based characters. but i highly doubt he would get in over characters seen within roughly the same time frame as Custom Robo like a rep from Golden Sun, Sin and Punishment, or Starfy who have much larger (or at least more vocal) fanbases. and even their possibilities for inclusion are very debatable.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Ray isnt really comparable to Samus cause Samus at least appeared in the previous Smash. at best Ray is comparable to Marth who hadnt been seen since the Famicon either and obviously wasnt in smash64. but Ray doesn't have nearly as much popularity or a cult following that Marth had. i personally would like Ray. his moveset writes itself and we could always use more futuristic based characters. but i highly doubt he would get in over characters seen within roughly the same time frame as Custom Robo like a rep from Golden Sun, Sin and Punishment, or Starfy who have much larger (or at least more vocal) fanbases. and even their possibilities for inclusion are very debatable.

I'm just saying he should be considered. I'm not saying he's likely. Several characters on the list aren't likely. I feel that we shouldn't give up completely.Not yet.

 

[Deleted member]

Why not? There's really no reason to not at least think about him. He's popular and from a critically acclaimed series. He hasn't had a game in a while but then again, Samus was included in Melee after a console of absolutely no Metroid games on the N64. He has a better shot than several other characters.

It takes more than being a "critically acclaimed" series, as anyone can say that about any series.

If we take into account that after 5 games, the best the series can do is an Assist Trophy that is smaller than even Kirby/Meta Knight, the smallest characters in the game, it is kind of a hint that the series has no "suitable character" as a fighter (an issue Sakurai raised about series after Pikmin, though it still kind of applies here). It also doesn't help the case that the "character" in question itself, Ray, is just one of many models within a series that has had a different model in spotlight per game.
With Custom Robo 1, it was the original Ray model.
Custom Robo 2, it was the Ray MK II, which was a trophy in Melee.
Custom Robo GX, it was X-Ray.
Custom Robo: Battle Revolution (the Gamecube game simply known as "Custom Robo" in America), it was Ray 01.
Custom Robo Arena, it was Ray MK III, the Assist Trophy in Brawl. (Though Ray MK II was initially used.)

None of these are the same "character".

There is also no new game in the horizon either that could influnce Sakurai (unlike Starfy), and even if there was, that would raise the issue of yet ANOTHER new Ray model to usurp spotlight from MK III, who currently holds it.

There is also less than considerable fan demand for a character in the series, unlike Golden Sun and Sin & Punishment.

Honestly, the only way that speculation for the series is viable is if there will be an upcoming game, but speculation would only apply for the Ray model that spotlights in it, none of the older ones.

 

[Shorts]

Why Bayonetta? What company owns her? At least with companies like Capcom, Level - 5, SEGA, Namco, and SquareEnix we know they have at least a decent relationship with Nintendo. (Either through buisness, or personal ties to Sakurai/Iwata/Miyamoto)

 

[Deleted member]

Why Bayonetta? What company owns her? At least with companies like Capcom, Level - 5, SEGA, Namco, and SquareEnix we know they have at least a decent relationship with Nintendo. (Either through buisness, or personal ties to Sakurai/Iwata/Miyamoto)

Sega owns the IP, though Platinum Studios (who has been on good terms with Nintendo as of late with Bayonetta 2 being a Wii U Exclusive with Sega's permission and The Wonderful 101 being another exclusive) develops the games. The subject of her being in Smash has also been repeatedly brought up to Hideki Kamiya, the series' creator, who mentioned that her being in Smash would be "cool", though he tells the fans to ask Sakurai.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I don't see Andross on this chart. Sadly.

1. He only was seen in full body in the Nintendo comics
2. Unlike Ridley, he's too big.
3. He had Rafiki's voice in Adventures.

 

[Bowserlick]

But still... a monkey with steel gloves. He could turn into a moon-sized face and hands for his final Smash.

* I really just wanted to draw Andross with a body, but despite long, long odds of getting in, I would love to see him as a playable character.

 

[Vintage Creep]

I'm not against him but I would prefer to see him officially with a body first in a StarFox game to be honest.

 

[AEMehr]

So Golden asked me to update the picture.

Changes from the Last Version:
- Added King Boo (Luigi's Mansion)
- Added Rick Wheeler (F-Zero Anime)
- Added Robin / Avatar (Fire Emblem: Awakening)
- Added Hades (Kid Icarus: Uprising)
- Artwork Update for Gray Fox
- Added Karate Joe (Rhythm Heaven)
- Added Mallo (Pushmo)
- Added Tempo (HarmoKnight)
- Added Sukapon (Joy Mech Fight)
- Added Lip (Panel de Pon)
- Added Sheriff (Sheriff)
- Added Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)
- Added Simon Belmont (Castlevania)
- Added Wreck-It Ralph (Wreck-It Ralph)
- Removed Smash Original Character
___________________________________
Expect Golden to make a post explaining these changes later today.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Seriously remove Ralph and Wheeler... An original character has more chance and sense than these two.
If you want another F-Zero rep, Deathborn.

 

[Deleted member]

Seriously remove Ralph and Wheeler... An original character has more chance and sense than these two.
If you want another F-Zero rep, Deathborn.

Don't like the choices, do your own chart.

Wheeler was the only other major protagonist of the alternate continuity other than Falcon (essentially being the only major protagonist in ANY F-Zero continuity that isn't Falcon himself, but at the same time he becomes the new Falcon anyway...), which had two games of its own, the latter of which being a continuation after the anime where Rick is the new Falcon.
Before you bring up that he debuted in the anime, bear in mind that Lucario debuted in his movie before he was in any game, yet was perfectly acceptable for Brawl.

Wreck-It Ralph is kind of a strange issue. On one hand, he is a movie character, but on the other, there is the fact that the Fix-It Felix Jr. arcade game he came from was defictionalized months prior to the movie's premerie, thus technically bypassing Sakurai's rule that a guest MUST be of video game origin.
There is also the fact that there was a deal with Sega to where Ralph would be in Sonic and All-Stars Racing Transformed in return for Sonic to have a plot relevant role in the movie. The director mentions that for the planned sequel, Mario is planned to make an appearance, which could possibly mean a deal with Nintendo to include Ralph in their crossover. (Nintendo is also seemingly supportive of Ralph, as when the movie lost the Oscar to Brave, they posted on their Facebook an image of Bowser upset that Ralph lost.)
Now, this wasn't enough for me to add him to the chart initially, but then....THIS came up....
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Wrec...er-Smash-Bros-Possibilities-Sequel-36068.html
Now, ignore the title of the article, as that is heavily misleading, but the director of the movie has tossed around ideas for the sequel, and he directly mentions possibilities of "Super Smash Bros. type games", which seems to hint that the idea of Ralph being in Super Smash Bros. had been discussed at some point.
This makes Ralph a possibility, but like Bayonetta and Layton, there is a lot going against him to where that's all he is until further notice.

 

[BluePikmin11]

It doesn't directly relate to the actual Super Smash Bros.

 

[Deleted member]

"which seems to hint that the idea of Ralph being in Super Smash Bros. had been discussed at some point."

Simple logic; if he's talking about Ralph being in "Smash Bros. type games", it means the idea of Ralph being in Smash had come to his mind.

It's better reasoning than what Simon has; he's only on the chart because Kojima controls Castlevania now, and Kojima is the one who got Snake in Brawl.

 

[Vintage Creep]

God I hope not. Ralph would be bad exactly like Naruto or Goku...
Lucario's case is completely different, it's common for some pokémon to have cameo appearances before their time, that doesn't mean they're created for the anime and then implemented in the games... It's like saying that Nu Dante is a Playstation All-Stars character which later had his own game as DmC.

 

[AEMehr]

God I hope not. Ralph would be bad exactly like Naruto or Goku...
Lucario's case is completely different, it's common for some pokémon to have cameo appearances before their time, that doesn't mean they're created for the anime and then implemented in the games... It's like saying that Nu Dante is a Playstation All-Stars character which later had his own game as DmC.

Except Ralph has actually been with some of the characters in Smash before and he actually fits in with the other characters.

Also Cameo =/= Movie starring that Pokemon

 

[Vintage Creep]

Except Ralph has actually been with some of the characters in Smash before and he actually fits in with the other characters.

Also Cameo =/= Movie starring that Pokemon

I was referring to pokémon like Munchlax or Bonsley which were in a movie or the anime series before their gen was out. And that's not even the point, these pokémons are created for the GAME, it doesn't matter if a movie comes out first. Wheeler was created only for the anime and later was in the game, I think Maximum Velocity.
You seriously want/expect Ralph in Smash Bros.?

 

[Deleted member]

There are no exceptions. Either Wheeler is just as elligble as Lucario is or Lucario must be cut.
Especially since there was only ONE talking Lucario, and that one was specifically from the movie.

Then of course, we have the Team Rocket Meowth as a trophy in Melee....

EDIT: Also, you seriously expect Yoshimitsu. Insult against wanting Ralph is invalid.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

There are no exceptions. Either Wheeler is just as elligble as Lucario is or Lucario must be cut.
Especially since there was only ONE talking Lucario, and that one was specifically from the movie.

Then of course, we have the Team Rocket Meowth as a trophy in Melee....

EDIT: Also, you seriously expect Yoshimitsu. Insult against wanting Ralph is invalid.

Touchy. We have different opinions. No need to get upset.

 

[Vintage Creep]

I don't expect Yoshimitsu, sadly I think he has not many chances to get in. I want him though.
The example of Lucario isn't that strong. If he's the talking one from the movie (never heard the one in the game can't talk), why the Trainer is not Ash? Lucario is a race, not a character. Saying he's the one of the movie is... odd.

And anyway any videogame character would make more sense than Ralph. Even Kratos.

I'm not attacking your chart anyway dude, I couldn't care less, I actually find it funny. But seriously expecting Ralph?

 

[Deleted member]

There is no anger in that post.
I'm telling Vintage that there are no exceptions to the rule; Lucario, being the talking one from Movie 8, debuted in the Pokemon anime. The Lucario species itself does not appear in a video game until Diamond and Pearl, but has a special mention in the first Mystery Dungeons.
Another example is TR Meowth being a trophy in Melee, as well as the anime designs used for Prof. Oak's and Misty's trophies rather than artwork from R/B.
And the biggest example, the ZERO-ONE trophy mentions Todd Snapp, a character created for the anime that later got a spin-off title in Pokemon Snap.

 

[Vintage Creep]

There are trophies of things never appeared in any videogame before Smash Bros... We're talking playable characters. Do you consider Lucario an anime character, like Goku and Naruto?