Shine Cancelling via projectiles

[M@v]

I will probably make a Fox Guide at some point, but here's a HUGE fyi for Fox players who do not know about this tech:

As you may know, Shine has a set amount of lag you are stuck in (How long shine stays out once you hit down b). In Brawl, this lag was nearly nothing, so you could instantly react out of shine vs opponent, for following up, or for shine stalling. In smash 4 however, its lag time is back to its melee version. In melee, this isn't a problem because you can Jump Cancel Shine. This is not an option in smash 4 however...unless your shine reflects something.

Turns out if you reflect something with shine (aka when the shine makes that unique reflect noise and gets "bigger") , you can cancel out of it instantly. You can do it with multiple moves, such as jump, spotdodge, etc. This is a really big deal, as you can basically instantly punish an opponent who used a projectile too close to you, because not only can you reflect the projectile right back at them, you can cancel your shine to follow it up quickly.

I'm sure some players knew about this already/discovered it on their own, but I want to make sure this is known to all Fox players, as it is an extremely useful tech.

 

[luke_atyeo]

yeah, you can cancel into a jump or a shield (and because you can cancel into a shield, you can cancel into a roll or spotdodge)
I think this is actually pretty well known because shine worked the exact same way in brawl (that is, being able to instantly cancel it into these things right after a projectile hits your reflector)
very useful against characters that like to use projectiles to cover approaches (samus, link, diddy, etc)

 

[EndlessRain]

This is handy against DDD. The stars that pop out when he lands with his upB can make punishing it slightly trickier (though still not difficult) but shining them so they hit him and pop him up, then cancelling the shine into a aerial makes it easier. It also annoys DDD players to no end, because once Fox hits DDD once, he can get crazy damage on him from there.

 

[M@v]

Well it worked in brawl because you could get out of shine whenever you wanted anyway because it had no sort of duration unless you held the b button. Otherwise it would just "flash"

 

[Jasudin]

Actually, in brawl, you could act immediately out of shine after reflecting something.
I'll find a vid.

EDIT: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PC-JECSWUxI

EDIT 2: Someone beat me to the claim.

 

[EndlessRain]

Yes, but in Brawl it didn't matter because it had basically non-existent endlag anyway, so you could just let go of B and get on with your life at absolutely any time.

 

[Sonicjamareiz]

this is pretty limited tech

 

[DEHF]

Well it worked in brawl because you could get out of shine whenever you wanted anyway because it had no sort of duration unless you held the b button. Otherwise it would just "flash"

You have a noticeable amount of lag out of Fox's shine if you didn't reflect something and jump cancel it in Brawl just like in Smash 4.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Yeah, this is nice. It's pretty good against anyone with a linear projectile (Zero Suit Samus especially, you can run up afterwards and U-smash her to KO).