sHell's Wario Guide*UPDATED*AUG17 More Matchup changes

[PhantomX]

I wouldn't lie to you about the Marth thing, Ace XD

You need to outplay them/out predict them to win as Wario, pretty much. Land the farts, shieldgrab or fsmash if you can (if you can't, space), maybe through some dairs on their nairs... that's about it. Don't chase them offstage unless they suck offstage.

 

[Ace55]

Lol, there is a vid of me vs the winner of the tourney, only he kinda had a handicap, but you will see that.

http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=-d3bAYQ367M

And yes I was playing very badly. Kind of akward playing against someone with one hand after just coming out of poules.

 

[PhantomX]

How does someone win with one hand? I guess the handicap is a huge mindgame in and of itself XD

 

[Ace55]

I guess the handicap is a huge mindgame in and of itself XD

Lol I guess so. But when you can't block or grab it will only get you so far.

 

[Popertop]

We have a handicapped guy in Texas that plays with one hand and his tounge.
He's beastly too.

 

[DMG]

We have a handicapped guy in Texas that plays with one hand and his tounge.
He's beastly too.

He is beastly no lie. He was one win under me in pools at HOBO and he made our set of 2 matches 1-1.

Blue sHell, if you can read this, I demand you go back to Wario and quit Bowser lol. Only if you want though

 

[AndrewCarlson]

Pit match-up is incorrect. It's generally agreed that Pit has the advantage, more or less 60-40 in my opinion. You should get some input from the Pit mains as there's basically no write-up under the Pit section.

 

[Ace55]

Pit match-up is incorrect. It's generally agreed that Pit has the advantage, more or less 60-40 in my opinion. You should get some input from the Pit mains as there's basically no write-up under the Pit section.

Generally agreed by who, just the Pit boards? And BluesHell hasn't been here in months so you're better of trying dr mario guy's matchup thread.

 

[AndrewCarlson]

Generally agreed by who, just the Pit boards? And BluesHell hasn't been here in months so you're better of trying dr mario guy's matchup thread.

dr. mario guy has contacted me, and I have relayed my thoughts on the matter. As for the match-up, the general match-up thread puts the match in Pit's favor. The Pits support this, putting the match-up as neutral at worst. I think it's a small advantage, and I'm a Marth main. Not trying to pick arguments, I just wanted to let you know the accepted information. I actually like Wario better as a character than Pit.

 

[Ace55]

dr. mario guy has contacted me, and I have relayed my thoughts on the matter. As for the match-up, the general match-up thread puts the match in Pit's favor. The Pits support this, putting the match-up as neutral at worst. I think it's a small advantage, and I'm a Marth main. Not trying to pick arguments, I just wanted to let you the accepted information. I actually like Wario better as a character than Pit.

Whoops didn't mean to offend I just put it down pretty blunt.

 

[AndrewCarlson]

Whoops didn't mean to offend I just put it down pretty blunt.

No worries. Just trying to contribute any way I can.

 

[DMG]

I still think Wario has an advantage, I'll make a thread or something in the Pit boards.

 

[AndrewCarlson]

It's neutral at the most for Wario in my opinion. I'm still pushing for an advantage in Pit's favor. Maybe put 50:50 or 55:45 Pit to compromise? A bunch say 60:40, but I can see why that would be a bit much for you to accept.

 

[7FO]

been a while since this has updated i think there is probally more to add about the match ups

 

[PhantomX]

Wario's can gimp Pits pretty well. I don't believe Pit has anything that beats Wario's backair that isn't a smash. Granted, we can't do much, if anything, about their ledgecamping, but we can just go to our own edge and sit there.

Pit vs Wario really is even to me when both know the matchup.

 

[Popertop]

Wario has teh gimps, and Dair issexy.

 

[Jeepy Sol]

So I was bored, and decided to make a Wario sig. Check it out! ^^;

 

[Timbers]

Wario's can gimp Pits pretty well.

That's a terrible misconception Phantom.

If you're basing that off of just the terrible Pits you've played on GB then find better Pits, lol. Glide attack outranges everything Wario has in the air, just for starters.

 

[PhantomX]

Fair clashes with glide attacks (even MKs), and we have time to get another attack in before they can pretty much do anything. Also, our Backair beats their fairs if they try to return on stage -_- Not much we can do about their camping though, unfortunately.

 

[DMG]

Fair clashes with glide attacks (even MKs), and we have time to get another attack in before they can pretty much do anything. Also, our Backair beats their fairs if they try to return on stage -_- Not much we can do about their camping though, unfortunately.

PS regular arrow or just dodge, throw tires if he's trying to run after camping/stall somewhat, or do what I did to Infinity Phantom. I told you I had an answer to ledge camping

Pit's camping is nowhere as good as many people make it out to be. He is also not extremely hard to gimp, and one of Wario's strong points is killing soon, so it doesn't matter if Pit's recovery is stellar when Wario can kill him at or below 70 anyways.

 

[Ace55]

PS regular arrow or just dodge, throw tires if he's trying to run after camping/stall somewhat, or do what I did to Infinity Phantom. I told you I had an answer to ledge camping

What? You fart on them?

 

[DMG]

What? You fart on them?

Ledgehog actually.

10Iknowtheweaknessofledgecampers

 

[Ace55]

Ledgehog actually.

10Iknowtheweaknessofledgecampers

Not really revolutionary, but I guess it get's the job done.
Ledgecamping (with MK) is suprisingly powerful, I have a casual friend who pretty much plays like Plank every match (except he's obviously much less good at it) and he actually two stocked my Falcon just by hanging there and mixing between aerials and shuttle loop. My answer was actually to get the edge myself and work from there, but that just got me footstooled twice (after my DJ of course). D*mn MK, poor Falcon.

 

[PhantomX]

Trying to edgehog MKs and Pits is silly, they can keep you off if they're being smart about XD

 

[Timbers]

Fair clashes with glide attacks (even MKs), and we have time to get another attack in before they can pretty much do anything. Also, our Backair beats their fairs if they try to return on stage -_- Not much we can do about their camping though, unfortunately.

If you clank with Pit's glair, he's already moved behind you. You can bair him but you're only sending him back to the stage.

Pit is required to make a huge mistake for you to gimp him.

 

[PhantomX]

You're silly... you forget that Wario's DI > everyone w/ a glide attack. Fair > fair or Fair > nair works on MKs, it also works on Pits.

 

[Timbers]

This is the part where I tell you that Pit's glide>>>Wario's air movement.

lol.

Also MK's aerial movement is horrendous.

 

[DMG]

This is the part where I tell you that Pit's glide>>>Wario's air movement.

lol.

Also MK's aerial movement is horrendous.

This is where I tell you that Pit is weak from below during a glide, and that Clap ***** his glide.

 

[Timbers]

This is where I tell you that you still won't be gimping him out of a glair >_>?

I already know what Phantom's thinking of, he plays a bunch of scrubby Pits on wifi that try to camp offstage with arrows until they're forced to WoI and then he goes out to hit them, or they're really bad at being aggressive on the ledge.

That's not how a competent Pit player..plays.

 

[FzeroX]

Wario's can gimp Pits pretty well. I don't believe Pit has anything that beats Wario's backair that isn't a smash. Granted, we can't do much, if anything, about their ledgecamping, but we can just go to our own edge and sit there.

So I guess Wario's Bair also beats marf's fair. I guess wario is god tier also. Yea Ledgecamping is a ***** but learn to deal with it. wait for the pit to get predictable then punish.

Fair clashes with glide attacks (even MKs), and we have time to get another attack in before they can pretty much do anything. Also, our Backair beats their fairs if they try to return on stage -_- Not much we can do about their camping though, unfortunately.

Last I checked Pits Glair > MKs Glair. Also that means that Warios Fair also beats Lucarios Fair. Even more reason Wario is god tier, so **** much priority. Since when do pits use fair to return, I never see pits do that, its arrow glide or FF jump uair.

Pit's camping is nowhere as good as many people make it out to be.

So says the guy who has no real good theory on how to stop it.

He is also not extremely hard to gimp, and one of Wario's strong points is killing soon, so it doesn't matter if Pit's recovery is stellar when Wario can kill him at or below 70 anyways

Yea I guess you are absolutely completely 9001% right that wario can consitently KO pit at 70%. But whats it matter when pit can kill wario at 60%.

Trying to edgehog MKs and Pits is silly, they can keep you off if they're being smart about XD

Yea you have personal experiance of that horror dont you. XD GB is gaysauce.

You're silly... you forget that Wario's DI > everyone w/ a glide attack. Fair > fair or Fair > nair works on MKs, it also works on Pits.

agian why relate MKs Glair to Pits, Its completely different. Pits Glide is way faster for one thing so good luck timing your fair. Oh wait I forgot that your fair has uber priority.

This is where I tell you that Pit is weak from below during a glide, and that Clap ***** his glide.

Last I checked pit is weak from above when he is gliding, his Glair hitbox comes out below him first so I have no idea where you got your info.

Anything else????

My personal thought is that it is 50:50 maybe maybe maybe 55:45 Wario MAYBE

 

[PhantomX]

Wario's fair clashes w/ Lucarios, for the record... and bair's priority is ridiculously high. It cancelled out a 140% Lucario Aura Sphere when timed right, just letting you know. Oh, and fair startup is 5 frames, that's pretty fast, lol.

 

[FzeroX]

Wario's fair clashes w/ Lucarios, for the record... and bair's priority is ridiculously high. It cancelled out a 140% Lucario Aura Sphere when timed right, just letting you know.

Vids or it didn't happen

 

[PhantomX]

You can ask Timbers, he's generally regarded as a reputable source as far as Lucario is concerned, and he's been arguing in your favor this whole time. Unless he feels like being a dickweed he'll attest to both my claims XD

Also, I guess I'll rephrase. While gimping Pit is not something that should be reliably counted on, it is a very viable option, especially if you keep the pressure on them.

 

[DMG]

So says the guy who has no real good theory on how to stop it.

Anther made a post a little bit back about dealing with ledge camping and his advice was almost exactly like mine; you hover around them right around the time they can first move from the ledge. You can either hit them if they stay, hog the edge if they move, or DJ back to the stage if you feel that you need it. And if Anther's idea's are like mine, then that probably means I know what I am talking about. He also talked about holding your shield up near the edge, which works wonders against a lot of characters.

Yea I guess you are absolutely completely 9001% right that wario can consitently KO pit at 70%. But whats it matter when pit can kill wario at 60%.

Wario CAN kill Pit at pretty low %'s compared to how long it takes Pit to kill Wario. I wasn't too literal about that %, but you can kill that low on most stages with an almost fully charged waft. Either way, I just meant Wario's killing power negates part of the advantage Pit has in most matchups of being able to recover well.

agian why relate MKs Glair to Pits, Its completely different. Pits Glide is way faster for one thing so good luck timing your fair. Oh wait I forgot that your fair has uber priority.

He's relating them both because you CAN clank with them... that is fairly useful IMO.

Last I checked pit is weak from above when he is gliding, his Glair hitbox comes out below him first so I have no idea where you got your info.

Uair has a huge hitbox, and since Pit travels at the same horizontal speed basically while only being able to change his vertical height, then you can come from below and smack him with Uair. Plus, the hitbox for his glide attack doesn't reach very far below him.

My personal thought is that it is 50:50 maybe maybe maybe 55:45 Wario MAYBE

Give me better reasons other than just saying "U guys are wrong."

 

[Timbers]

You can ask Timbers, he's generally regarded as a reputable source as far as Lucario is concerned, and he's been arguing in your favor this whole time. Unless he feels like being a dickweed he'll attest to both my claims XD

Luc fair outranges Wario fair.

Bair outprioritizing a projectile is irrelevant given that aerial vs. aerial and aerial vs. ground, priority plays no part. Aerials don't clash either.

flarecast@hotmail.com (11:19:04 PM): i like being a dickweed

He also talked about holding your shield up near the edge, which works wonders against a lot of characters.

Pit's uair eats your shield really **** well, and shieldpokes easily. Pit is unlike a lot of ledgecampers in the sense that his WoI pushes away anyone that's near him, and his prime tools for ledgecamping have ridiculous amounts of range. Also he has a huge sweetspot on the ledge.

I don't think his ledgecamping is as effective as MKs, but it's definitely a pain to deal with.

 

[PhantomX]

When Luc does an approaching fair, they exchange hits, we do this all the time -_-

 

[Timbers]

When Luc does an approaching fair, they exchange hits, we do this all the time -_-

That's because the aerial isn't spaced to it's fullest extent, and therefore hits trade.

If we were to assume that the only way two aerials could trade hits is if they were of the same range, then Wario would be terrible, as almost everything outranges him.

 

[FzeroX]

Anther made a post a little bit back about dealing with ledge camping and his advice was almost exactly like mine; you hover around them right around the time they can first move from the ledge. You can either hit them if they stay, hog the edge if they move, or DJ back to the stage if you feel that you need it. And if Anther's idea's are like mine, then that probably means I know what I am talking about. He also talked about holding your shield up near the edge, which works wonders against a lot of characters.

A smart pit wont let invincibility ware off if you are tht close, GL trying to hog the edge through a uair or a ledge poked fair followed by an upb sweetspot. yea the DJ thing works but it doesnt get you anywhere. As for the shield my suggestion is the make sure that you aim it down cause uair likes shields, second favorite food iirc. and tehn again you cant punish it the pit did it right. ub sweetspot is too fast.

Wario CAN kill Pit at pretty low %'s compared to how long it takes Pit to kill Wario. I wasn't too literal about that %, but you can kill that low on most stages with an almost fully charged waft. Either way, I just meant Wario's killing power negates part of the advantage Pit has in most matchups of being able to recover well.

Everytime I have played this match-up, and I lost most to LeoFTW cause he is a beast. I found that pit racks up damage faster than wario, therefore closing your gap with low% killing power. Warios KO potential is still slightly better.

He's relating them both because you CAN clank with them... that is fairly useful IMO.

Vids or it didnt happen,I have yet to see anything clank with pits glair, it is either faster than glair or isnt.

Uair has a huge hitbox, and since Pit travels at the same horizontal speed basically while only being able to change his vertical height, then you can come from below and smack him with Uair. Plus, the hitbox for his glide attack doesn't reach very far below him.

Pits Horizontal speed is equal to CFs run speed so try to keep up with that, and changing vertical height means changing spacing, who ever said I would even try to glair your uair. 70% of the time when someone goes head on to my glide I try to avoid I because I know they know they have a move that can possibly beat it, so I go risk free and reset the momentum.

Give me better reasons other than just saying "U guys are wrong."

No

 

[Ace55]

Lol at Wario's killing power beeing 'slightly' better.

I don't about you guys but I often just throw a dair or Nair over the ledge is someone's hanging there. The only way not to eat it is rolling on stage, which means I succesfully got them away from the edge, or I hit them.

And please dmg don't start coloring your text. You're better than that (before you know it you'll be typing in an larger font too.

 

[PhantomX]

That's because the aerial isn't spaced to it's fullest extent, and therefore hits trade.

If we were to assume that the only way two aerials could trade hits is if they were of the same range, then Wario would be terrible, as almost everything outranges him.

Yes, but he was arguing about priorities, and this shows that they have equal priority when Lucario doesn't abuse his spacing -_-