"Samus+ aka Why wasn't the Phazon Suit in vBrawl?" Guide and Discussion Thread *WIP*

[Rkey]

I believe it happens when Samus' momentum is moving away from the ledge when you press Z.

I'm a bit horrid at explaining stuff, but I'll try. Samus' tether beam will stretch out to the exact amount of length needed to snap the ledge at the moment you press Z. Since the beam is rather slow-reaching when you use it, any movement away from the ledge when you press Z may leave a gap. This can happen when falling as well.

I've had this happen with Lucas as well since he and Samus have slow tethers, I think. You can prevent it by making sure you have momentum towards the ledge when you zair.

As for the explode-on-touch morph bombs, I thought they were working on it or is it off the table now?

Oh, thanks. I guess that's the different between Samus' and Link's zairs, Link can save himself with a zair for the edge if knocked away (could in vBrawl at least) when Samus can't.

THANK YOU! :D

 

[Perfect Chaos]

I believe it happens when Samus' momentum is moving away from the ledge when you press Z.

I'm a bit horrid at explaining stuff, but I'll try. Samus' tether beam will stretch out to the exact amount of length needed to snap the ledge at the moment you press Z. Since the beam is rather slow-reaching when you use it, any movement away from the ledge when you press Z may leave a gap. This can happen when falling as well.

I've had this happen with Lucas as well since he and Samus have slow tethers, I think. You can prevent it by making sure you have momentum towards the ledge when you zair.

As for the explode-on-touch morph bombs, I thought they were working on it or is it off the table now?

That's not the reason. There are two reasons why that happens: either you are right on the border of the tether range when you use it (and for some reason, it causes this problem, when when moving towards the ledge) or someone hogs the ledge at the very moment you try to tether. I guess the "delay" could be part of (or indirectly) the reason why this happens, but it's not just with certain tetherers; I've seen it happen at least once to EVERY tether move in the game.

As for the issue regarding the bombs; are they? Maybe they stopped working on that before due to coming to a dead end with the options they had at that time? But with PSA, there might be hope, again?

 

[Rkey]

The thread is dying D:

I could start it up with the 0-death combo I found: d-tilt -> fair (yes, it can combo) -> uair (sometimes you need to fastfall slightly before you DJ into this one) -> charge shot. I killed Mario and diddy with it so far.

I think all the bombs need are IASA frames, which means you could for exampl lay a bomb and zair before you touch the ground. That by itself would make bombs very useful.

Edit: oh, that's right, no discussion of improvements here >_>. Anyways, boms are good for recovery...

 

[shanus]

That's not the reason. There are two reasons why that happens: either you are right on the border of the tether range when you use it (and for some reason, it causes this problem, when when moving towards the ledge) or someone hogs the ledge at the very moment you try to tether. I guess the "delay" could be part of (or indirectly) the reason why this happens, but it's not just with certain tetherers; I've seen it happen at least once to EVERY tether move in the game.

As for the issue regarding the bombs; are they? Maybe they stopped working on that before due to coming to a dead end with the options they had at that time? But with PSA, there might be hope, again?

I know the functions of manipulating the morph ball, but the bombs are a prop and therefore cannot be editted.

 

[ph00tbag]

I know the functions of manipulating the morph ball, but the bombs are a prop and therefore cannot be editted.

That's really unfortunate. I still can't believe Sakurai nerfed an already mediocre move so harshly. Bombs would have been the first thing I'd have fixed about Samus. What about instant canceling the morph ball bomb jump?

 

[BG3]

I know the functions of manipulating the morph ball, but the bombs are a prop and therefore cannot be editted.

Is this predicted to be fixed in the future? So we may be able to edit everything, including props?

 

[The Phazon Assassin]

I picked up Samus recently, and it was just for one reason. My friend showed me an Iron Man texture. unbe-****ing-lievable. But, actually, I've grown attached to her. I want to make her my main, which I'm close to doing now. Her spacing game is incredible, and has a very solid close range game too. And I love spamming Zair. Except when I'm playing on my friend's Wii, and it randomly crashes duuring a Zair, and it happens often.

If I had a camera, I'd throw up some recent vids, one of which I 0-Death a Falco. Not a full-on combo, just excellent predictions. Anyways, I hope to stay active here, unlike what I did in the Kirby thread. And the Dedede thread. And the Link thread.....I think I have commitment issues....

 

[Rkey]

Nice to have you here : )

 

[The Phazon Assassin]

Wow this place is quiet.

So, next weekend i got a B+ tourney. I think my Samus is pretty good, but I don't have too much experience against humans. Any small tidbits of advice you can give me?

 

[Mattnumbers]

I recommend you post in the new Brawl+ Character forums (even though it's AiB)
link

 

[matt4300]

This is sad guys.... We need to get something going in here... I mean have you been on that AiB samus thread? theres One thread with a dude talking to himself for the first 4 posts... Thats not acceptable.
Saddly I've been to caught up with link, bowser, and ness balance I also havent had a whole lot of time with samus... but I'm sure some of you must have?

 

[Meltingbox]

I added a new video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnnlMlwIkA8

It's using the RC1 version. `-`

 

[K-Pat]

I just started using her recently, she's fun, definitely reminds me of my Melee days with Samus. I love her missile game now, so much better than Melee (even though missile cancel isn't as good).

Dair is so sexy now.

Exactly! She was one of my first mains in Melee, and when I played her in Brawl she totally sucked... But then I got Brawl+ and just decided to play her randomly and I was like "WHOAMYGOSH I LOVE HER AGAIN!" So yeah... I need to get some new kyewel n' kawaii textures for her.

 

[cobaltblue]

So how has everyone's experience been with samus so far?

 

[skstylez]

i love samus, she is not my main but i enjoy her a lot. She has a lot of options she can do now in B+ to never keep you bored or low on openers. And yes her dair is just sexy. She also has my fav jab in the game (:

they just need to (hopefully) add mine contact, mine canceling, and speed up mine jump animation

 

[ph00tbag]

I think the thing that makes me happiest about Samus is that fsmash kills now. I'm still bummed that it doesn't have its Melee range, but whatever. Samus feels right, now. She's all about that game of keep-away, and she can actually play it and get her kills now, unlike in vBrawl, where she had to play keep away until 150% or so before even getting her opponent off the stage.

 

[Krobat]

I have always been a casual Samus player, even as far back as '64. It is only recently, after the newest Brawl+ build that I began to main her with dedication. She is better than ever now and can be a real beast in capable hands, but still has some glaring weaknesses so you'll never have to feel cheap. Except while you're camping someone to death.

I think the idea about bombs having IASA frames is a terrific one, at the moment bombs are a really terrible attack that are pretty much only useful for recovery and air stalling. Sometimes it can be a good fake-out to run up and suddenly bomb while DI'ing away, since you can do it out of dash it fakes them out pretty well the first time, but once they catch on it's very punishable.

Her combo'ing ability is redunkulous when you factor in projectile hitstun, jab canceling, and buffering from ariels. She is also really equipped for edge combat, both guarding and returning.

 

[The Prophet_]

So I read this page and I heard that the frames of the down B have been reduced; about time.

How about her missiles? ; are they any faster?

I main G&W in Melee and B+ but I occasionally pick Samus in both Melee and B+.

 

[skstylez]

down b frames have not been reduced yet... at least i don't think. missiles cancel when u hit the ground and her shorthop is lower, so that kinda answers in a way

 

[Krobat]

So what do you guys think of the nightly samus? Jab lock is gone but personally I'm glad cause it was bunk. You can still jab cancel just fine though and get like 1-3 jabs in depending on their DI.

The only real buff is the new bomb jump IASA. You can bomb jump cancel into a dair for instance, or bomb jump off the ground and cancel for a super-short hop bair. Also, if you bomb while crouching, you can cancel immediately into any aerial without bomb jumping. Only from a crouching position. It's completely badass on defense, but I think it was an unintentional change so enjoy it while you can.

 

[matt4300]

So what do you guys think of the nightly samus? Jab lock is gone but personally I'm glad cause it was bunk. You can still jab cancel just fine though and get like 1-3 jabs in depending on their DI.

The only real buff is the new bomb jump IASA. You can bomb jump cancel into a dair for instance, or bomb jump off the ground and cancel for a super-short hop bair. Also, if you bomb while crouching, you can cancel immediately into any aerial without bomb jumping. Only from a crouching position. It's completely badass on defense, but I think it was an unintentional change so enjoy it while you can.

The Samus bomb thing was unintentional but will stay in as its a cool surprise.

Keep in mind you can only have 3 bombs on the field at one time. So you cant lay 2 bombs then crouch into 2 more the 4th won't come out, but Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Aerial works fine.

Can't wait for people to master this. Finale samus is back!

 

[WheelOfFish]

Does the new nightly improve Samus's fastfall?

 

[matt4300]

Does the new nightly improve Samus's fastfall?

Hmm... She feels quicker but thats probably because chars reach the apex of there jumps faster now... but really I don't know.

DUDES! start talking about New bomb properties... OMG they are amazing. The crouched bomb into aerial is the SH shes always wanted. Its sooo close to the ground. Bomb fair is an amazing setup because it stuns them for tilts and smashes and MAYBE grabs. Bomb Bair is so perfectly low for hitting the shorter chars. To top it of you have also just layed a bomb so if your shield grabbed the bomb will get them off you....

DISCUS!

Her ALR is so **** low its criminal! TALK!

 

[cobaltblue]

I do not know much on Samus techs, but does is it just me or does it seem easier to pull of bomb cancels into aireals after jumping into the air once? I can do cancels alright in training mode under normal speed. Yet even in 1/4 speed I can barely pull off multiple cancels in a row without jumping into the air first as if I have to renew it.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

Wow...this thread is like...dead. To kick off things again, since GSH2's Samus deserves more discussion (or any, period), I'll quote what I posted in the nightly thread. People should try out the Crouch(ed) Bomb Canceled Missile, if people haven't already discovered it for themselves.

She can do almost everything that Melee Samus can do, now. She's slowly reaching that (IMO, ideal) Samus.
In this, you can do stuff like the full jump double missiles (or double jump after the first to get a triple missile); something I truly missed from the Melee Samus days. But since homing missiles come out faster than smash ones in B+ (as opposed to being slower in Melee), you can also mix in homing ones where and whenever needed. I particularly find full jump homing then smash missiles to be effective in covering your front, tremendously limiting the opponent's approach options.

And to easily do the CBCM (much shorter to type... ) rapidly, I now use b-sticking with Samus. (And this is faster than simply SHing missiles, since the bomb hop is significantly lower.)
Hold diagonal back-down and press B to lay a crouched bomb; then missile to cancel it at the desired time; then B again after landing, while still holding downwards; etc., and you will stay relatively in the same place for every missile, while shooting smash missiles. If you wait until the very last moment to missile, you can even retreat a tiny bit every time. Holding straight down, would instead let you approach forward slowly with smash missiles. Diagonal forward-down lets you quickly approach with homing missiles to lead your approach. A variation of downward angles and missile release timing will let you adjust how much you move after every missile.
It's quite a shame that a land-canceled smash missile will always be higher than standing ones, so it'll go over the heads of short characters.

 

[Super SGT. Ike]

DUDES...i have the hardest time getting information! apart from this awesome modification, can SOMEONE, anyone, help me understand how to change missile velocity... how to change rocket velocities and effects (such as icing an opponent)?? How in the heck do you change anything?? i thought i knew, but now im even more confused...

 

[Perfect Chaos]

This isn't really the place to ask for help on editing characters. Also, people haven't figured out how to alter the moving speed of the missiles, yet.

 

[Super SGT. Ike]

now see? that helps. even though in the videos the projectiles did seem to travel faster. not trying to be an ***, but its like I said: finding info (particularly here) is hard as hell to do!

 

[SymphonicSage12]

It's because youtube plays at a faster speed than the game actually is....

also, what is everyone's opinion on her throws?

 

[Deleted member]

It's because youtube plays at a faster speed than the game actually is....

also, what is everyone's opinion on her throws?

Fthrow kills and throws them offstage. Sets up spacing for projectiles. Good KB Angle
Bthrow throws them offstage well. Sets up spacing for projectiles. Good KB Angle
Dthrow for tech chase at low %, dtilt at low %, then at high % Nair to kill
UThrow use at low % to combo into Uair, higher % to throw on platforms and tech chase them for a KO with bair,nair, usmash from below.

Her throws are great regardless, and the grab start up speed is too slow compared to other tether grab chars with longer missed grab resets. But, its probably from her good projectile game with KO power that Link and Tink lack. Just a faster starting grab speed is all she needs really.

 

[eisley]

Well while messing around with the bomb canceling, I noticed that if you do it fast enough, the bomb doesnt even come out...just thought I might mention it in case someone has not found this out yet

Will upload a video of me playing against my brother soon. Has a nice bomb cancel combo kill at the end.

 

[eisley]

Well here's the vid, granted it's quite long (little over 4mins but seems like matches with samus take this long for me )

Thoughts?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek5hCYaP34A

 

[[TSON]]

Also, people haven't figured out how to alter the moving speed of the missiles, yet.

Just dropped in to say that's not true. Kirk found it out on like the 2nd.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

Just dropped in to say that's not true. Kirk found it out on like the 2nd.

Oh...if that's the case, then that's awesome. Hurray for Samus development!

 

[Ryose]

BC's has become a real habit for me now. Almost anytime I land from a jump or hop and my opponent isn't breathing down my neck I'm doing it out of reflex. I love the GSH2 Samus (though I may have adjusted her SH a bit because it felt as if she dangled just above ground a bit too long)

BCC's (bomb cancel combos) are my new Samus fetish. At low-mid % Dair> BC> Uair/Dair/Nair has worked consistently and racked damage though I'm severely lacking human competition.

If anyone would volunteer for some matches pm me plz I havent played a Samus ditto in a looong while

 

[Ninka_kiwi]

thats a preety cool hack

 

[bleyva]

bump because B+ samus is ****ing awesome.

ladies and gentlemen, this is bombs-exploding-on-contact, KOing-super-missiles and z-air all in one package. not to mention moves that can kill now.

this is the greatest rendition of samus in a smash game. seriously needs more attention.

 

[kr3wman]

Smash64 Samus is still better.

...

I like Samus, but I don't like playing Samus at all. Weird.