Roll Cancel Grabs

[Phoenix_Dark]

Awesome find I'll have to test this out.

 

[Kempatsu]

@Leon Trotsky from the Lil Mac boards discovered this late last night.

Videos - https://gfycat.com/CreativeBitesizedHen

and

From a standing position, you can input Forward or Back -> R -> L or A and do a boosting grab with rolls. You should see the flash from the roll animation. This is made possible because of the buffer system.

This cannot be performed from a dash without letting the stick return to neutral like Boost Grab can, nor can it be done OoS as far as I know.

Lil Mac and Wario visually have the most drastic Roll Cancel Grab, their are probably plenty of characters with the same effect.

Some characters go farther then their dash grabs and boost grabs, some go the same. Go ahead and test it out!

So what is exactly the input? The video says "Forward + Shield (hold) -> Attack but you're saying Forward or Back -> R -> L or A. Can you clarify this for me?

 

[B0NK]

So what is exactly the input? The video says "Forward + Shield (hold) -> Attack but you're saying Forward or Back -> R -> L or A. Can you clarify this for me?

It's what I said, in that order. R and A/L are almost press at the same time, but technically you must hit R first or else you'll do a dash attack or shield grab.

The idea is to buffer a roll using your initial Left or Right input, then canceling that roll immediately with A or L. If you use A, your finger must keep the R button held until the grab starts. For L, it should work either way.

 

[Kempatsu]

It's what I said, in that order. R and A/L are almost press at the same time, but technically you must hit R first or else you'll do a dash attack or shield grab.

The idea is to buffer a roll using your initial Left or Right input, then canceling that roll immediately with A or L. If you use A, your finger must keep the R button held until the grab starts. For L, it should work either way.

Ok got it...thanks a ton, I appreciate it! The video described it differently but your explanation is much clearer.Thank you

 

[domino]

Haha, found this in the demo and actually took a vid of it, but never posted. Glad someone else did...
Liking the quick evolution of the techs on smash 4! Can't wait for wiiu.

I just want the Wii U version already man.

 

[Xiao-Xiao]

...Because this tech will be considerably more practical on a GCC and I don't want to mess up my 3DS attempting to emulate these movement options. Maybe I should have wrote that earlier.

 

[Myran]

Hey could someone test this with Olimar to see if it increases his range and all? I've been trying, but I'm not the most technical and I can't put it in 1/4 speed in training mode since my L button is broke.

 

[Cho]

Hey could someone test this with Olimar to see if it increases his range and all? I've been trying, but I'm not the most technical and I can't put it in 1/4 speed in training mode since my L button is broke.

To me it looks like his grab range is increased by roughly the same amount as a dash attack cancelled grab increases it.

Btw... sound weird I know- but it "repaired" my R button once...
have you tried blowing into your L button?

 

[Myran]

To me it looks like his grab range is increased by roughly the same amount as a dash attack cancelled grab increases it.

Btw... sound weird I know- but it "repaired" my R button once...
have you tried blowing into your L button?

Thanks for testing that for me.

I have, and it does nothing. It very rarely works if I mash it in the right spot. I'm not worried though I just use Y to grab, and I'm holding out to buy a New 3DS. I'm still using my original from 2011.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Hey could someone test this with Olimar to see if it increases his range and all? I've been trying, but I'm not the most technical and I can't put it in 1/4 speed in training mode since my L button is broke.

You don't need the L button for 1/4 speed, there's a standard 1/4 speed option as well as a "hold L to play at 1/4 speed" option.

 

[Myran]

You don't need the L button for 1/4 speed, there's a standard 1/4 speed option as well as a "hold L to play at 1/4 speed" option.

Shows how much I looked into training mode speed option lol.

 

[ADAPT Chance]

Smash's version of a kara-grab huh, need to test this out and abuse it.

 

[B0NK]

Smash's version of a kara-grab huh, need to test this out and abuse it.

Just to let you know, Smash has always had a kara-grab in boost grabbing (dash attack > grab). This is just another way to do it, now with roll, that benefits some characters.

 

[Kit Cal-N]

This is GREAT out of moves you can roll out of (Sun Salutation especially)

 

[LoreLes]

Doesn't work so well for marth, but when I pivot/reverse this technique it starts producing some weird results. Sometimes I get melee grab range and others it makes marth's body distorted for like a second (when it lands doing it reverse).

 

[liDanTheManil]

don't think this work for the wii u trying to do it and not coming out so did they patch it

 

[Saltix]

don't think this work for the wii u trying to do it and not coming out so did they patch it

Pretty sure it's still in, just work on the timing!

 

[liDanTheManil]

Pretty sure it's still in, just work on the timing!

oh i think i'm doing it now i was trying to do it with the L button but when i started with the R it was coming out why is it like that...?

 

[B0NK]

It works for WiiU.

And are you right handed? That's probably why lol.

The other reason could be cause you're using the same hand for both inputs when you use R.

 

[Prawn]

Posting for later

 

[Silverrida]

I don't seem to be able to do this at all, but I'm still new to ATs. Also I don't know how controls transfer from the 3DS to the Wii U. None of the inputs themselves are the grab buttons? Aren't R and L both shielding and A a normal attack? I don't understand why this would result in a grab and I am assuming I'm interpreting it incorrectly and that is the problem I'm having but I really don't know.

I don't seem to be cancelling the roll at all. Every time I try this I do the full roll animation, which is also part of my problem I'm sure. I don't know why it's not cancelling?

Sorry for the utter befuddlement. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[B!squick]

Guessing Bowser doesn't gain much from this? How does it compare to his pivot grab? If someone could check for me that would be grand.

 

[B0NK]

Bowser might as well not do it lol

I don't seem to be able to do this at all, but I'm still new to ATs. Also I don't know how controls transfer from the 3DS to the Wii U. None of the inputs themselves are the grab buttons? Aren't R and L both shielding and A a normal attack? I don't understand why this would result in a grab and I am assuming I'm interpreting it incorrectly and that is the problem I'm having but I really don't know.

I don't seem to be cancelling the roll at all. Every time I try this I do the full roll animation, which is also part of my problem I'm sure. I don't know why it's not cancelling?

Sorry for the utter befuddlement. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

And the reason why pressing R/L and then A immediately after works is because Shield+A = Grab. It's how most people shield grab. Since there's some window of buffer in this game (idk how many frames), you can do one after the other before the end of the buffer window and get a grab.

As for 3DS to WiiU, you gain another "R" or Shield button, "L." And you're grab button is now "Z." Using R, L, or Z will work.

 

[M15t3R E]

This is a great find... for Little Mac players. His roll canceled grab is the only one that has a very noticeable difference in distance from his dash grab.

 

[B!squick]

As I feared. More tech behind locked doors Bowser can never open...

 

[busken]

This is so confusing and hard to do in the heat of a battle, but I guess the extending your grab range is always good. How can you apply this though? I have seen people use this to punish landings, making your opponent think their safe. Can you use this to punish rolls, and what factors make some roll canceled grabs longer then others. Wario really surprises me because his grab range is above average. but his pivot length is short? The variables that make this more viable over dash grab is a mystery to me. Can you use this OOS?

 

[B0NK]

I wouldn't really call it hard. (There's much harder stuff in Smash people get consistent at).

Is it that useful? Anytime you'd be doing a dash grab, you can replace it with this if you want, that's about it. People punish rolls with dash grabs.

Pivoting with this isn't that useful for anyone.

You can't do this OoS.

 

[mangamusicfan]

Great find gonna try this right away

 

[Adrian Marin]

This tech is absolutely amazing for Wario! It's definitely going to make punishing and approaching easier.

 

[SirIanAsh]

Is there a more in depth tutorial for this? I would love to know how to do this.

 

[alexthepony]

is this the same thing as a boost grab

 

[LightLV]

@Leon Trotsky from the Lil Mac boards discovered this late last night.

Videos - https://gfycat.com/CreativeBitesizedHen

and

From a standing position, you can input Forward or Back -> R -> Z/L or A and do a boosting grab with rolls. You should see the flash from the roll animation. This is made possible because of the buffer system. (L is for 3DS).

This cannot be performed from a dash without letting the stick return to neutral like Boost Grab can, nor can it be done OoS as far as I know.

Lil Mac and Wario visually have the most drastic Roll Cancel Grab, their are probably plenty of characters with the same effect.

Some characters go farther then their dash grabs and boost grabs, some go the same. Go ahead and test it out!

Good god, Kara throw from SMASH 4 ROLLS? We third strike indeed

So you saying everybody can be C-Falcon now?

 

[Pokedex649]

I've tried this with Villager, and though it really doesn't help much normally, I have noticed that when you pivot it, with certain timing, Villager slides in the direction you rolled a decent distance. There might be some competitive use for this. Like during a tech chase to boost his mobility so that you can go behind them in the grab, resulting in a back throw. This is of course speaking in theory. I'll look through the other characters' RC-Pivot grabs to see if anyone else has a similar effect. If I come across any, I'll post it here.

Edit: Never mind. Apparently the sliding of the RC-Pivot grabs depends solely on what point of an initial dash the roll is inputted. They slide almost as far (maybe just off by a few pixels) even if they don't roll-cancel the pivot grab. I guess it's still useful for style?