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ROB OFFICIAL MATCHUP DISCUSSION: Link

Syde7

The Sultan of Smut
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Ok, so we are winding down (finally) and I am stoked. So, we're gonna do 2x/week from here on out until the remaining characters are finished. This week is Ike/Link, with this thread being about the LINK matchup.

ROB's Advantages:


ROB's Disadvantages:

Opponent's Advantages:

Opponent's Disadvantages:

What ROB should try to do:

How to do it:

How opponent can stop it:

What Opponent should be trying to do:

How they'll do it:

How ROB can stop it:

Counterpicks (what ROB should pick)
Bans (what ROB should ban 1 via stage strike, 1 via personal ban)
Preferred Neutral (what ROB wants)

Ratio:
 

Sudai

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Edit: Real thing now.

It's too easy.

Advantages:
-ROB wins the camp game.
-ROB wins the up close game. (I'll explain how later for you naysayers)
-ROB can barely be touched while recovering.
-ROB gimps the **** out of Link. Like.. Link's recovery bad, but I've had matches with pretty decent Links and they still die at 55% of lower 2/3 stocks a game. That or they get camped to 120%+ and then other stuff happens.

ROB's disadvantages:
-As per usual, ROB's blindspot below. Link's UAir has a strange way of punishing. His UAir when placed right -will- beat airdodges and do serious damage/kill. It punishes in a different way thanks to it's long hitbox.
-There's a very thing range (like, 1 link's body) that Link can stay in to make things difficult for us. It's hard, but I'm sure someday someone will experience it hard core.

Opponent's Advantage:
-The thin range you need to stay in makes it way too easy to pressure ROB. I'll explain it below.
-Keeping us in the air if we're not smart.

Opponent's Disadvantages:
-As said before, bad recovery.
-Gets out camped easily.
-Can't really punish ROB's recovery.


What ROB should be trying to do and how he should do it:
Camping. Camping like Hell. Not really to be annoying or because it's necessary, but because it forces Link to approach by a ledge when you can try to knock him off and gimp him. With the comparative recoveries, it makes the center of the stage the wrong place to play for us. The very slightly added risk is worth the huge risk added to Link. When Link starts throwing projectiles, powershield bombs. This makes them blow-up but not hurt you instead of bouncing off your shield. If you learn to powershield only one projectile, I recommend this one. It reduces the amount of hitboxes he has out for the next half a second or so. That's enough to find an opening if he's throwing a boomerang or shooting an arrow. Ideally you'll powershield either of those options too so the most dangerous one to look out for is Bomb throw > bomb pull. If you play a number of Toon Links, learn to powershield based on visuals and Link's projectiles are basically the same but slower and less options. It's really not that difficult to do if you just sit there for a while and powershield a barrage of TLink spam. I find it easier than PSing Falco lasers.

Anyway. You move in once they're at spam range because you don't really want to be pushed off the ledge, even if you don't mind. You want to get in at that range so you can throw them and have them near the corner of the stage. Once there, you rush in (The same exact way as you did last time. They may be able to hold you back with spam, but don't let them past you.) and shield pressure with Jabs, DTilts, and FTilts. Mix in things like Jab > Grab and DTilt > Jab > Grab randomly with the other mix-ups, you can generally get something. Just some extra damage and then you'd have really pushed him off stage. Punish attempts to get past you with Pivot Grabs or Pivot Grabs OoS and just throw him back. Link can't really leave unless you make a big mistake. Oh, and DACUS can get them out, but you should have a laser charged at all times against Link just for this and if you see him use it, shoot him off the other side of the stage. He got out, but the situation's a perfect mirror basically.

It's all about spacing. really. Oh, that reminds me. Keep him out of the small range just between where your Jab -can't- hit and, but where your FTilt can hit excluding near the very tip. In there I've always had issues for some reasons. I think it's because it's within Link's Jab range and it's the fastest point he can grab from or something. It's just weird and it's the only times I've ever had an issue with a Link. That's easy to solve though, just back up or approach real quick. It's not that big a deal. Haha.

EDIT: I FORGOT THIS NEXT SECTION!
Oh, if we get hit up, we can completely avoid juggling. Fly off stage with Up-B, go out of reach of Link and recover horizontally/from below with your DJ. No juggling and you can get off Scott free fairly easily.
END OF EDITED AREA

How opponent can stop it:
Learn to powershield. Powershielding makes things in this game sooooooooooooo much easier and I wish everyone would just learn to do it. It'll make it so you can get past ROB and to ROB. You'll take less damage approaching a camping ROB and you'll be able to get out of his pressure easier meaning you'll have more chances to get past ROB's range and into the sweet spot for you guys. That's your goal.

What Opponents should be trying to do:
Ahhh.. those are kind of redundant. Same for the next two categories..so I'm not gonna answer them.

Counterpicks
-Japes: I looooove this stage, but y'all will find that out in the interview thingy. XD Really though. It limit's Link's approach options while you camp and there's easy gimps here. My favorite gimp on this stage, works on everyone too: They hit the water, even if it's between the left and middle platforms, shoot a laser at them and the hitstun + extra water stun -will- kill them if it's a weak laser. This is the only stage I recommend not keep a fully charged laser against Link and any other character specifically for that reason. It's situational, but my aim before I retired was good enough for this situational thing to be worth it.
-Frigate: Japes is either banned or the Link will ban it. Frigate for the obvious reasons. We can infinite camp the platform in second form even vs Link, btw. FAir beats Arrows and Boomerang > DJ Laser is 100% safe. Z/Airdodge catch bombs > Throw them. So Link's best options, but slowest, is probably bombs. You can actually just back up and camp from further and you're 100% safe, btw. My favorite thing to do with the platforms is to go close to the blast zone. Just out of camera sight, but just before you're in the bubble. You don't take damage unless you're in the bubble and there's no way for Link to see you. This means instant projectiles as far as the opponent's eyes can see. It's still blockable, yes, but you just made it a good deal harder. You need a really good sense of where you character is, but you should have that already because you shouldn't be looking at yourself anyway. Follow your opponent's character and just know where your's is. That's a whole different topic though.

Bans:
-Personal Discomfort Stage: Yeah, no stages are inherently -bad- against Link. Some are worse than others, but not by much so they'll probably go for a personal CP.
-Opponent's Personal Comfort Stage: This is the other option. It's what I usually do. Playing on your favorite stages is an advantage in itself. It's just something I've noticed. It's probably just because you know that stage far better than most other CPs.

Preferred Neutral:
Two options really:
-Biggest stage possible via striking: If you want to camp.
-Smallest stage possible: If you want to be aggressive. The smaller stage provides you with an easier time pushing them to the edge.

Ratio:
70-30 ROB
I'll be honest. I think it's that bad for Link. Once both players can powershield 70-80% of the time, it's clearly in ROB's favor since Link just has so much more lag with such a punishable recovery and the fact that he's forced to approach.

Edit: Y'all better appreciate this. I spent 45 minutes making sure I detailed everything. :[
 

Camalange

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I'm not going to comment on Sudai's WoT (sorry >_>) I just wanted to say that Lawz and Fishy both better have some serious discussion up in hurr.

But I'm sure what you said is very good too, I don't play either character though so I'm not going to bother reading <3

:093:
 

Lawz.

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I play against two ROB mains that come to these boards so I know it pretty well.

ROB's Advantages:
1. ROB outcamps
2. Wins up close
3. Wins in the air
4. Can gimp Link
ROB's Disadvantages:
1. ROB is limited when above
2. It's tough when at mid-range
Opponent's Advantages:
1. Can kinda juggle ROB
2. ROB hates zair lol
Opponent's Disadvantages:
1. Loses the camp game
2. Loses up close
3. Loses in air
4. Can get gimped
What ROB should try to do:
1. Camp Link
2. Go through Link's spam and fight up close, though this can be difficult to do
How to do it:
If you can PS his bombs, boomerang, arrows, and zair all in one go then you beat on Link. But like I said it can be difficult because like ROB, Link also has a flexible spam game.
How opponent can stop it:
1. The Link will have to PS the laser and watch for the gyro. Link will want to make sure ROB doesn't get the gyro again.
What Opponent should be trying to do:
1. Link will be tossing bombs, arrows, and boomerangs to keep ROB away. He will also use zair which is difficult for ROB to deal with because he is kind of a big target.
2. Link will just have to space as much as possible at mid-range in order to avoid getting camped and avoid fighting against ROB's awesome tilts and jabs.

While ROB is recovering back to the stage, the Link will obviously NOT be able to gimp ROB (unless some miracle happens) but he will just try to shoot arrows to mess with it and get some extra damage on him.


Ratio:
65:35 ROB
 

TheMike

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ROB's Advantages:

ROB can gimp Link very easy
Punishes Link very well with Dsmash OoS when he link is pillaring him, for example
Can also stage spike Link with Bair very easy if he recovery with Zair
Nair has more piority against Link's Up B

ROB's Disadvantages:

Big. So, he will be hitted with Link's projectlies/smashes/zair very easy
Can't edgeguardve
ROB sucks above Link

Opponent's Advantages:

Camp ROB and when he approaches, try to take him over u
Link can use his shield(not L/R) so as to avoid ROB's camp in help of his crounch

Opponent's Disadvantages:

Gimp is his worst nightmare
ROB can punish his recovery very well
Bad Air Game against ROB

What ROB should try to do:

Gimp Link
Avoid the spam game and be attenion to power shield Link's projectlies

How to do it:

Try to put Link off stage and never let he get onto it again

How opponent can stop it:

Camp as much as possible and try to be far from ROB

What Opponent should be trying to do:

Camp
Camp
Camp
and Camp
and besides camping, camp some more
also, camp
lol seriously, take advantage when ROB is above Link

How they'll do it:

Use the projectlies well
When ROB approaches, try to take him in the air with Utilt, for example

How ROB can stop it:

Power Shield the projectlies
when above link, u can't do sh**. So, space well when close to link so as not to get over him

Counterpicks: Delfino Plaza(easy kill from the side, be under the stage and get up with Uair whenever u can so as not to be over him. Smashville, easy gimps.
Bans: Battlefield's platforms helps Link to be under u. Final Destination can hel Link with his camp
Preferred Neutral: Smashville, eassy camps

Ratio: 65:35
 

Syde7

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Well, ****... Sudai & co. mentioned literally... everything I was going to say. :|
 

A2ZOMG

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This matchup is only really annoying on a stage like BF where the platforms make it a lot easier for Link's projectiles and stuff to mess you up if you go above him (oh and if I recall, his Bombs hit through the platforms if you're below them. Sorta gay). Also, the platforms help his recovery for that matter if you don't stop him from making it to the ledge.

I like doing this matchup on FD a lot since I'm good at reading landings. Link is one of those characters who is pretty disadvantaged when you D-throw him since he's very slow in the air and not that safe coming back down. If you have nothing better to do, chase his landing and D-throw him multiple times for some fun free damage.

That trick works best on Ike, but that's a different matchup.
 

GreyClover

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ROB is one of the hardest matchups for Link. Even one of the toppest Links like Deva loses to Shadowrob constantly.

All ROB needs to gimp Link is a quick Bair or Fair, there's almost nothing to do about it but let it happen.
 

koing

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i say 70:30
due to links easily gimped recovery but thats just my opinion
i mean one well placed gyro or fair and link is done a 50% lower even
 
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