Recovery Tier List (Updated 1-5-07)

[plasmawisp6633]

Jigglypuff is light and easy to KO, yet he has an outstanding recovery

Although Jigglypuff maybe extremely light, he's got insane DI and pound (to stop him from flying), so it actually makes him sorta tough to KO. The really long recovery can keep a person guessing.

 

[Airo]

THIS LIST IS NOT ABOUT SURVIVABILITY!!!!

how many times does this need to be repeated =/
its really about recovery... and recovery only.

 

[AIDS]

very true but with recovery doesnt only come range if i might add it also very much depends on the effects of the up B like how shiek is easy to edge hog and unless she grabs edge there will be lotsa lag and Fox's has great as zeldas, but zelda cant DI worth **** after her up B so there is a lot to depend on also how fox can rub on stage for sweetspot if zelda trys she is dead, so if you post put some of that into consideration

 

[Elemennopee]

That is one of the biggest run on sentences i have ever seen.

 

[MaskedMarth]

ROFL I told people that Jiggs and Mew2 were the best recoverers and Roy and Doc were the worst for over a year now and they didn't believe me, but now this list has it exactly how I do.

Isn't it lovely when you're ahead of the trend? I've always said Jiggly and Mewtwo had the best recoveries (though I put Roy and Doc higher than bottom), but I met a lot of opposition by the Samus party in previous recovery tier threads. Seems people have caught up to my reasoning.

I recommend putting Ganondorf higher. Sure, it's easy as cake to edge-guard him, but then he comes back again. Compare to, say, edge-guarding Fox or Kirby, where he's tough to hit but you only need two good hits to keep him off for good.

 

[Airo]

i always had confidence in my mewtwo. but so many of you just cant admit that mewtwo is good at something.

unless mewtwo screws up, the only way to kill him is to knock him out of the stage.

 

[Epsilon52]

THIS LIST IS NOT ABOUT SURVIVABILITY!!!!

how many times does this need to be repeated =/
its really about recovery... and recovery only.

recovering as in making it to the stage or recovery as in succesfully making it to the stage and being able to survive....i belive the liklyness of how easily or difficult edge gaurding these particular characters should eb taking into account..sheik shoudl be just one or 2 higher....

i work wonders getting her back using her false 3rd jump into the real 3rd jump...(referring to the intial smoke which pops u up and then the 2nd whihc determines ur direction)

 

[BigRick]

Why isnt Peach in top tier right below Samus? She's floaty, has a huge double jump, stupid horizontal rec with her float and parasol, and one of the longest airdodge. I agree that her vertical recovery is worse than Pichu's and Pika's, but when she goes vertical, she has a disjointed hitbox protecting her. So with her horizontal rec being better than Samus' and with her vertical being lower than Pika's, I'd say she deserves the 4th spot.

Upper tier and high tier could be merged. Pika's up+b has more range and mobility than Fox's, but Fox's has less lag, even when Pika ends his up+b in the air.

Marth deserves middle tier with his decent horizontal and vertical and his ability to defend himself from edgeguards.

Boozer for bottom tier: inexistant double jump, crappiest airdodge, his up+b is less vertical than DK's and has less hitboxes to protect him.

 

[highandmightyjoe]

Peach isn't top because of bad vertical recovery and being easy to edgeguard with certain characters. She also recovers very slowly. Bowser is pretty appropriately placed I think. He may have little range but his fortress has insane priority and can even go through the shine. He can also use his bomb to grab the ledge from above it, which is situational but great when its available. It isn't good but at least compared to Doc, Roy, and Falco its alright. I do agree though that Marth could go alittle higher. It has always seemed fairly good to me, but maybe I'm just missing something. I know it can be lightshielded but that doesn't entirely justify it being so low. To me any character who can save their second jump till later in their recovery is pretty good. That includes Marth, Ganon, Mario, and maybe some others I forgot. Granted some who can do that still suck, like Roy, or Captain Falcon, but for the most part if you can keep your second jump till right before you make it back its always helpful.

 

[StripesOrBars]

Peach isn't top because people in this thread are, well, nvm.

But Ganon needs to be higher.

And Pichu needs to be above Pika because Pichu rides walls.

 

[Elemennopee]

He may have little range but his fortress has insane priority and can even go through the shine.

ONLY on the ground as an attack. Besides, i haven't seen many Bowser vs Fox match ups. Maybe in a combo video, but that's it.

He can also use his bomb to grab the ledge from above it, which is situational but great when its available.

Edge hogable.


Anyways, yeah joe is right, Mario, Marth, and Ganny should be higher. Mario can stop the knockabck of an attack with his cape, use his Tornado, save his double jump for getting more distance or U airing or D airing just incase someone tries to edgeguard him, and extend the horizontal distance of his Up B. Marth can do everything Mario does except better and he doesn't have a tornado. Ganny should be higher for reasons already explained in this topic.

 

[Airo]

recovering as in making it to the stage or recovery as in succesfully making it to the stage and being able to survive....i belive the liklyness of how easily or difficult edge gaurding these particular characters should eb taking into account..sheik shoudl be just one or 2 higher....

i work wonders getting her back using her false 3rd jump into the real 3rd jump...(referring to the intial smoke which pops u up and then the 2nd whihc determines ur direction)

oh offcourse.. i was adressing people few post before mine that thinks weight should be a factor =.=

 

[marthsword]

And Pichu needs to be above Pika because Pichu rides walls.

...thank you. there's more than just that though.

RECOVERY COMPARED

Pikachu's up b

- move in 8 directions

- slightly faster than pichu.

Pichu's up b

- move in almost any direction

- slower than pika



Pichu's is the most versatile recovery in the game. Pikachu's is close, but not.

This, essentially makes pichu harder to edgeguard.

Pichu also has a better double jump...that's a factor right?


btw, samus < mewtwo

 

[Wave⁂]

also, pika and pichu have a kinda infinite stall on the edge.

 

[Airo]

mewtwo does too!! infact, he has 2 different infinite stalls.
and samus has none.... Buahaha..

 

[Earthbound360]

Really?
Care to enlighten me? I'm just curious.

 

[Earthbound360]

Please... move him up... consider the following.

Distance: Ness covers a great distance while using PKT2. It’s generally the same as Fox’s Firefox move. Also, it takes similar start up time, unless you are aiming for special recovery. Not to mention Ness has the largest sweetspot range in the game.

Eaten Thunder: People also complain that Ness’ thunder is too easy to eat and screw him. First, they should note that only some characters can do this. Characters like Mario and Falco wouldn’t want to attempt this. Also, if the Ness is smart, he will try to keep it away from the stage making it harder for opponents to eat it. Not to mention PKT is fast in itself, making it even harder to catch. With inverse PKT2s (Putting PKT in front of Ness instead of behind him) and delayed PKT2s (waiting before hitting ness with PKT), eating PKT is just plain not a great edgeguarding option. And if you are out by Ness anyways, why not just hit him?

Other Facts: Ness can easily sweetspot the ledge very quickly. In one frame from ANYWHERE during PKT2. he is also provided with a good amount of invincibility frames in the beginning. During that time, PKT2 has just as much priority as Peach Parasol. PKTB is like an off stage shield, so edgeguarding one who has mastered this isn’t easy. Also, Ness’ unique wallhugging ability can help him greatly. If you hit him in the air while he is using PKT, he CAN reuse it. Not to mention the obvious “Any direction you choose’ thing. Also, his recovery is among the most versatile, and you can even mindgame his recovery.

PKT2 Recovery Aid Techniques
PKTB
PKTBC
Inverse PKT2
Delayed PKT2
Wallhugging (important to Ness since his is different than others as in he changes direction)
Perfect sweetspot (1 frame)
PKT Reverse edgeguard
Pray
Double sided sweetspots (crash into the ledge during PKT2 and Ness can grab on both sides of him)

I vote above marth.

 

[Wave⁂]

you know, i just typed about a line about a char edgeguarding Ness, but....i deleted it. go Ness.

i vote above marth.

 

[Mcscruff]

Marth low tier? marth has a really good recovery. much better than yoshi's and ganon's.

 

[Wave⁂]

wow....really baad post.

Yoshi:

best double jump in the game
increased wieght
HAS AN AIR DODGE.

ganon:

infinite jumps.

 

[arrowhead]

what do you mean by infinate jumps

 

[<π]

...thank you. there's more than just that though.

RECOVERY COMPARED

Pikachu's up b

- move in 8 directions

- slightly faster than pichu.

Pichu's up b

- move in almost any direction

- slower than pika

also pichu has a way shorter landing lag than pika. I was just about to argue this point, but yeah, pichu above pika.
(since you can go almost the same direction twice with pichu you get way more distance, just a little fun fact that should be concidered)

 

[Wave⁂]

ganon has infinite jumps by using his vB, wizards foot. in one of the other recovery tier lists, by like Falco_Assasin or someone, had ganon as one of the top 5.

 

[mood4food77]

my old one with doodah had ganon up in 4th, since he can recover from anywhere samus can but she's also much harder to edgegaurd, jiggs has the best recovery, she can recover from anywhere, peach can recover from almost anywhere since she does have pretty above average vertical recovery but it's not as good as jiggs or samus', pika and pichu are light so they don't get as many chances to recover, yes it's very good and hard to edgegaurd but once edgegaurded they are most likely not coming back, mewtwo is the same as the pika's

 

[arrowhead]

ganon has infinite jumps by using his vB, wizards foot. in one of the other recovery tier lists, by like Falco_Assasin or someone, had ganon as one of the top 5.

it's not really infinate jumps, is it?

 

[thesage]

I still am confused to how bowser has a better recovery than Ness.

 

[arrowhead]

he doesn't

 

[CDorrian]

I still am confused to how bowser has a better recovery than Ness.

Gimpyfish explains it in his essay. I'll find the fortress section for you.

Here it is!

The Fortress
did it occur to anyone that i wrote that whole thing up there without even typing the word 'fortress'? bowser's up b is THE BEST up b in the game, as well as the 2nd best move in the game. it is the 2nd fastest move in the game next to a shine at only 4 frames. it has HUGE damage (30% in the air), gets low % kills, breaks combos, is highly mobile, has an INITIAL RANGE that is larger than the hitbox for link's upb IIRC. it also has invincibliity frames and high priority. htis move will 'ting' with a lot of other moves, and at 4 frames, you can get off anotehr one faster than they can get their move off again. this move, simply put, is amazing. nobody can deny shieldfortressing has got to be one of the best tactics there is. Now if we include the edge cancelled fortressing it gets EVEN BETTER. When you think of all of the positives of the fortress then add the words ZERO LAG to the end of it, its a whole new level of awesome. you can edge cancel a fortress on any stage, great for comboing, escape, edgehogs you name it, it does it pretty much. once you've edge canceled your open to do any number of things, ledgehopped arials, klaw, firebreath, you can do your <100% ledge attack to give yourself some space... its just unreal.

he doesn't

See above, B****. Don't hate on Bowser. Bowser just wants friends.

 

[Earthbound360]

I'll add on to my essay in a bit. I just need to get my flash drive. But my dad wont let me use it yet.

 

[CDorrian]

Your gonna call me a noob, but...

EB360, just what exactly is the difference between PKT1 and PKT2?

 

[Earthbound360]

N00B!!!
J/k
PKT=PK Thunder
PKT2=PK Thunder jibaku (as in hitting Ness with PKT to lauch him as a recovery move)

 

[CDorrian]

Oh.

Fair enough. Thanks for clearing that up fo me.Did you want your rep Now or Delivered through the post?

 

[thesage]

Gimpyfish explains it in his essay. I'll find the fortress section for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gimpyfish62
The Fortress
did it occur to anyone that i wrote that whole thing up there without even typing the word 'fortress'? bowser's up b is THE BEST up b in the game, as well as the 2nd best move in the game. it is the 2nd fastest move in the game next to a shine at only 4 frames. it has HUGE damage (30% in the air), gets low % kills, breaks combos, is highly mobile, has an INITIAL RANGE that is larger than the hitbox for link's upb IIRC. it also has invincibliity frames and high priority. htis move will 'ting' with a lot of other moves, and at 4 frames, you can get off anotehr one faster than they can get their move off again. this move, simply put, is amazing. nobody can deny shieldfortressing has got to be one of the best tactics there is. Now if we include the edge cancelled fortressing it gets EVEN BETTER. When you think of all of the positives of the fortress then add the words ZERO LAG to the end of it, its a whole new level of awesome. you can edge cancel a fortress on any stage, great for comboing, escape, edgehogs you name it, it does it pretty much. once you've edge canceled your open to do any number of things, ledgehopped arials, klaw, firebreath, you can do your <100% ledge attack to give yourself some space... its just unreal.

See above, B****. Don't hate on Bowser. Bowser just wants friends.

This is about recovery, not the versatility of the move.

 

[Diddy Kong]

my old one with doodah had ganon up in 4th, since he can recover from anywhere samus can but she's also much harder to edgegaurd, jiggs has the best recovery, she can recover from anywhere, peach can recover from almost anywhere since she does have pretty above average vertical recovery but it's not as good as jiggs or samus', pika and pichu are light so they don't get as many chances to recover, yes it's very good and hard to edgegaurd but once edgegaurded they are most likely not coming back, mewtwo is the same as the pika's

Wait...

So your saying that Pikachu, Mewtwo and Pichu's recovery shouldn't be as high because they're light? But Jiggly still has the best recovery? That doesn't makes sence. Only Pichu is lighter than Jiggz. But Jiggly is then again floatier... But that doesn't mather since both characters are very easy to KO.

I agree that Ganon has awesome recovery though.

 

[CDorrian]

This is about recovery, not the versatility of the move.

Good point, still it Does state that it has:

Great mobillity
Invincabillity Frames
High priority
Little Lagg
Large Hitbox

Meaning It is a highly mobile move, with High Priority and a large hitbox, comes out quickly, and has a few invincabillity frames at the Begining and End to screw up certain attacks, like for trying to Shine Spike Too early.

Not only that, You could say that it is one of the best moves for horisontal recovery.

 

[Wave⁂]

oh yeah, to add to the Pika/Pichu comparison, Pichu can walljump, Pika can't.

to quote NGCXX, "in your face, Daddy!"

ganon's recovery is....above average. his vB doesnt help agaisnt jiggz's dsmash, or other attacks like that, but samus can usually recover from it. still good, though.

 

[arrowhead]

Good point, still it Does state that it has:

Great mobillity
Invincabillity Frames
High priority
Little Lagg
Large Hitbox

Meaning It is a highly mobile move, with High Priority and a large hitbox, comes out quickly, and has a few invincabillity frames at the Begining and End to screw up certain attacks, like for trying to Shine Spike Too early.

Not only that, You could say that it is one of the best moves for horisontal recovery.

little vertical recovery and no protection when coming down. and it's by far not one of the best horizontal recoveries. it's invincibility frames and large hitbox only apply to the first few frames of the move, not really enough to protect him well. bowser is easily edgeguarded

 

[mood4food77]

recovery is the ability a character has to survive, so all factors come in place, if character a and character b were hit by the same exact move, in the same exact place, at the same exact percent, whichever character is heavier has an easier chance of making it back to the stage but if the other character has much better recovery, he can make it back easier, so every factor comes into place, and also weight takes into the effect of getting edgegaurded, since one character is heavier, he has a better shot of coming back after being edgegaurded since he is not knocked back as far

 

[Wilhelmsan]

Should we define the character with the best recovery as the one who can make it back to the stage from the most places?

 

[-__-]

OMFG ok people i just wana mak 1 thing clear u cant rank people by tier omg theres no such thing as top tier or ne of that cr*p people its how u use dem if ur telling me falco is low tier mean while he be owning in tournys den da tier list is just ret*rded and stop making up stupid list lik that plz its annoying and thers no point