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Rayman Revolution

Justin Little

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Messages
677
Despite that awful situation, I still feel pretty good about the franchise. The leaker PracticalBrush seems pretty confident about something happening and, so far, they haven't been wrong. Rayman Together seems to know... something, I think. Or I might be reading too much into their tweets lol.

That Last Stand leak had "Rabbids fan fiction" written all over it. I'm not the least bit surprised it turned out to be a fabrication.

Talk about hittin' a guy when he's down though. Thankfully we don't give up easy.

View attachment 319764
Beautiful work! 👍
 

NonSpecificGuy

V Has Come To
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You know...
View attachment 319769
We've yet to get a character from a new company in pass 2, we got one via Cloud in Smash 4 and two in pass 1 so it's a bit odd.

...It'll probably just be Hayabusa.
I’d be ok with Hayabusa or Rayman to be completely honest. I am curious whether Ray will show up in the new Rabbids game at the very least. Since it’s not releasing till 2022 there’s probably still some secrets in store for it.
 

JustASora/CrashSupporter

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Dec 11, 2020
Messages
177
Here’s an illustration from this…

Arms
View attachment 319673
Because of the Late Development of implementing Full Arms Content there was not enough time to get Music, Stage, Fighter, and additional Spirits. Rather instead it’s a Spring Man Assist Trophy, 2-Mii Costumes and 5-Spirits, than when Min Min became the First Spirit Upgraded Fighter in Volume 2 DLC she brought in with Spring Stadium, Arms Music, additional Arms Spirits and a Ninjara Mii Costume. Along with confirmation that the Arms Director requesting Min Min being the playable character of Arms, signifying that The 1st and 3rd-party Developer’s and Company’s who campaigned for a Spot.

Minecraft
View attachment 319674
Microsoft and Nintendo have built up their unprecedented relationship with Nintendo Exclusive content as the build up led to 2-DLC Packs in Super Smash Bros Ultimate in Banjo-Kazooie and Minecraft, thus which both have been in 5-Year Development dating back to 2014. With the release of Banjo-Kazooie Pack in Volume 1 than Minecraft Pack in Volume 2. With support from Phil Spencer of Microsoft we got 2-Xbox based characters in a Nintendo Exclusive

Final Fantasy 7
View attachment 319675
When Cloud arrived in Super Smash Bros 4 it was in a Small portion that have not been satisfying representation for its Fans, and when Ultimate came it remained unchanged for the FF7 Representation Fans were hoping for as the 2-Songs returned along with Midgar along with No Original Artwork Fighter Spirit for Cloud. We get to Volume 1 DLC with Dragon Quest Content of Akira Toriyama fame aswell as Square Enix involvement with the DLC Development confirmed, than Final Fantasy 7 fans finally got the Proper Representation of Content with the Sephiroth Pack as it came with a New FF7 Stage, 9-Additional Songs (which we would later find out was them getting past Copyright Regulations from All Party’s to acquire these Songs for 4-Years), Final Fantasy 7 Spirits finally getting added, 4-FF7 Mii Costumes, and Cloud Updated in his Advent Children skin to include a NEW Final Smash from his Advent Children fight.

Xenoblade Chronicles 2
View attachment 319676
Xenoblade Chronicles coming to Super Smash Bros 4 with Shulk was the beginning of the whole representation of that Game, we jump 4-Years Later with Ultimate and 2-New Entry’s of Xenoblade Chronicles Game’s with only one having an incomplete and Unfinished amount of Content in Xenoblade Chronicles 2. Because of the late development of XB2 it only had 3-Xenoblade 2 Songs and 8-Spirits in release, with the Release of Fighters Pass Volume 1 DLC came with a Rex Mii Costume. 2-Years later in Volume 2 we finally got an Updated Xenoblade Chronicles 2 Pack with Pyra/Mythra, Xenoblade 2 Stage, 13-Additional Music Tracks and 6-New Xenoblade 2 Spirits including an Upgraded Rex Spirit embedded in with the Base Game Rex Spirit. Thus Completing the Xenoblade Chronicles 2 representation

Tekken
View attachment 319677
Sakurai has stated in the Past that Tekken’s Control Gameplay is very Complex to integrate for Smash Bros 4 which left out Heihachi as a possible Playable Character, as a result Sakurai instead opted to make a Heihachi Mii Costume for DLC and leaving out any possibility’s for Tekken Content. Fast forward to Super Smash Bros Ultimate Release the only Nod Tekken ever got was PAC-MAN’s Namco Roulette of the Galaga Sprite of Heihachi, which would once again leave Tekken out of the Running of Base Game content. At the Beginning of Volume 2 DLC the Smash Bros 4 Namco Mii Costumes returned starting with Heihachi Mii Costume with Min Min, than the Gil Mii Costume returned with Minecraft, At E3 2-Days ago we finally got a New Namco Rep in Tekken’s own Kazuya Mishima. This pattern of Unfinished Representation Content has been 100% consistent with every Volume 2 Release, I would even dare say that Byleth Pack would also be apart of this pattern of Missing Content of Fire Emblem series.

Which brings us to one other Unfinished Content.



Rayman
View attachment 319678
Rayman is by FAR the One IP from a Worldwide Triple AAA Western Gaming Distribution Company that has been Demanded by Ubisoft and Everyone to be Added into Super Smash Bros all the way back to the Smash Bros 4 yet has Not been fully Represented properly, for Sakurai to persistently Shine Rayman in both Super Smash Bros 4 and Ultimate as both a Trophy and an Image (aka/ Spirit) is a more clearer example of Sakurai trying to compose the book of Representations in Ultimate. When the Ubisoft Mii Costumes were added with Byleth the Writing is now on the Wall that Ubisoft has an involvement with the Smash Bros Ultimate DLC Development, thus became the Start of what would be called The Loose End Theory
Maybe it's just my bias for wanting Rayman to get in, but man, this theory has just SO much going for it. Literally the only reason I'm not fully counting on it is because the last Smash characters to be revealed aren't really hype, and chances are that the last character could probably be a Gen 8 Pokemon.

But who's to say that this "last Smash character reveals aren't hype" argument isn't just another one of those so called "rules" made up by Smash fans? What if Sakurai proves us wrong and closes the Ultimate life cycle with a character pick as awesome as Rayman?
 

AnAmusingFellow

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jun 15, 2021
Messages
21
But who's to say that this "last Smash character reveals aren't hype" argument isn't just another one of those so called "rules" made up by Smash fans? What if Sakurai proves us wrong and closes the Ultimate life cycle with a character pick as awesome as Rayman?
I mean, Rayman would fit the whole "Last Smash reveals aren't hype" thing for Japanese audiences lol, would make sense to leave a character who ain't popular in Japan for last to Nintendo I suppose.

That said I do think it's most likely gonna be someone like a BOTW character or a Gen 8 Pokémon, but I won't fully count out Rayman just yet.
 

MattX20

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
Messages
6,325
I mean, Rayman would fit the whole "Last Smash reveals aren't hype" thing for Japanese audiences lol, would make sense to leave a character who ain't popular in Japan for last to Nintendo I suppose.

That said I do think it's most likely gonna be someone like a BOTW character or a Gen 8 Pokémon, but I won't fully count out Rayman just yet.
I highly doubt a Gen 8 Pokemon or a BOTW rep is happening. If you look at the music test menu, there's an empty spot left after Tekken takes one of the remaining 2 spots. It implies effectively either a brand new IP that never got into Smash before or a series that never had a playable rep in Smash before gets a rep like Rayman, Shantae etc.
 

JustASora/CrashSupporter

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Dec 11, 2020
Messages
177
I highly doubt a Gen 8 Pokemon or a BOTW rep is happening. If you look at the music test menu, there's an empty spot left after Tekken takes one of the remaining 2 spots. It implies effectively either a brand new IP that never got into Smash before or a series that never had a playable rep in Smash before gets a rep like Rayman, Shantae etc.
Please elaborate on this because I don't understand.
 

Megadoomer

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Please elaborate on this because I don't understand.
People are thinking that the sound test menu needs to form a perfect rectangle, though I'm not sure how often that's worked out for anything in-game beyond the first Smash Bros. (character select screens, stage select screens, etc. - even going back to Melee, the character select screen had conspicuous blank spots on either side. Perfect for two more characters, but they were never filled in)
 
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mariofan48

Smash Journeyman
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378
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I dunno if its just me but having a fourth anime style character after getting 2 of them in a row (Kazuya isn't really 'anime style' as much as someone like Terry or Ryu, because of Tekken's more gritty nature) would be the most disappointing end that Smash has ever had. Even if it isn't Rayman, which I hope it is him, that we at least get a big bombshell character that may not be the most popular pick, but one that will please a lot of people, like us Rayman fans, for example.
 

Justin Little

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Messages
677
Would prefer Doom Guy or Gordon Freeman as our FPS representative, tbh. I certainly won't say no to Master Chief though.

What's bothering me about this pass is that we still don't have a platformer character like Banjo from the last pass. Rayman, Crash, Dixie, Spyro, etc. I just need my scrimblo bimblo cereal mascots, Sakurai!
 

JustASora/CrashSupporter

Smash Apprentice
Joined
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Messages
177
I dunno if its just me but having a fourth anime style character after getting 2 of them in a row (Kazuya isn't really 'anime style' as much as someone like Terry or Ryu, because of Tekken's more gritty nature) would be the most disappointing end that Smash has ever had. Even if it isn't Rayman, which I hope it is him, that we at least get a big bombshell character that may not be the most popular pick, but one that will please a lot of people, like us Rayman fans, for example.
If you were saying this in Twitter you'd probably be spammed with a lot of those unfunny "Scrimblo Bimblo" memes.
 

mariofan48

Smash Journeyman
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LETS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! WE SURVIVED ANOTHER SPIRIT EVENT!!!!
There was a problem fetching the tweet

I have to ask how would you guys feel if Master Chief wounds up being the last character in smash?
I've never mentioned this here cuz it's not related, but behind Rayman, Master Chief is #2 in my top 5 of Most Wanted characters to join Smash, because Halo is another one of those franchises that I grew up playing, so Chief is the one I have the most attachment to.
Compared to Doomguy or Gordon Freeman who I don't... really care about, at least not as much as the Chief. I mean I played Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal and really enjoyed them, but Halo was a part of my early teenage years growing up. Never played Half Life, more of a Portal guy, but getting back on track.

Needless to say, I would be extremely disappointed that Rayman isn't in, because frankly, he deserves it. But I would also be very happy that my second most wanted character actually ended up making the cut, not to mention the fact that... Master Chief is that 'bombshell' character. The "HOLY **** THAT'S ACTUALLY HAPPENING" character. Master Chief is that character that would follow in Steve's footsteps, basically setting the entire internet on fire again like what happened with Steve.

No one expects Master Chief to actually show up. A mascot character for a rival console that... is actually possible at this point, even though people will say that he can't make it because the Halo franchise has never appeared on Nintendo, but who knows. All I'm saying is that I'll be happy with it because even if you aren't into the franchise, it will be a BIG ******* deal.

If you were saying this in Twitter you'd probably be spammed with a lot of those unfunny "Scrimblo Bimblo" memes.
Yeah, sadly.
 
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mariofan48

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That's the spirit! It ain't over until it's over!
I'm not giving up until that last fighter is revealed!

If the final fighter isn't Ray, I suppose I will hope for the next best thing at that point, being a deluxe Mii Costume. It would really pain me if that were to happen, beforehand, though. (unless of course a 3rd fighter pass is revealed then I will just hope for Rayman to be in that and not be a costume)
 

AnAmusingFellow

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jun 15, 2021
Messages
21
I'll be real, if these trademark renewals weren't for Smash then I really don't know what's actually in store for Rayman.

What if Rayman is actually gonna be in Mario + Rabbids: Sparks of Hope but they decided not to show him off right away? Like he's a character you meet later in the game or something, IIRC they did say there was gonna be some surprises with the game during Ubisoft's E3 show.
 

MrMcNuts

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Messages
830
I'll be real, if these trademark renewals weren't for Smash then I really don't know what's actually in store for Rayman.

What if Rayman is actually gonna be in Mario + Rabbids: Sparks of Hope but they decided not to show him off right away? Like he's a character you meet later in the game or something, IIRC they did say there was gonna be some surprises with the game during Ubisoft's E3 show.
It would get me to finally try the Mario + Rabbids games lol
 

pupNapoleon

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All things considered, I think Rayman may be my most wanted character for the next (potentially final) slot.

  • We have only gotten 1/11 DLC character packs that are cartoonish. Blasphemy, considering Nintendo's roots.
  • In Brawl, Rayman was one of 6 third party characters I wanted, when Snake was announced. They were: Sonic, Megaman, Pacman, Banjo and Kazooie, Bomberman, and Rayman. Bomberman seems highly unlikely now, so...
  • I love new universes being added. New companies are even more epic.
  • I love Rayman.
 

Phoenix Douchebag

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While im not expecting Rayman, Kazuya's reveal is in our benefit. He was revealed AFTER the Heihachi Mii Costume. The Ubisoft costumes came in FP1, as opposed to Heihachi who literally could have been saved for Kazuya, but i guess he felt like throwing his father off his pack.

So the Costumes can't really be used as a counterargument anymore. It's too bad this revelation came in too late for me to care that much.

You know...
View attachment 319769
We've yet to get a character from a new company in pass 2, we got one via Cloud in Smash 4 and two in pass 1 so it's a bit odd.

...It'll probably just be Hayabusa.
I don't see Hayabusa after that interview.

If im honest the only new company i can think of is Falcom (Adol, Estelle and Rean Schwarzenegger) and maybe an indie if im feeling extra ballsy.

Outside of that, i think it's more likely that we could just get another Nintendo character, or some underspeculated Third Party.
 

mariofan48

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While im not expecting Rayman, Kazuya's reveal is in our benefit. He was revealed AFTER the Heihachi Mii Costume. The Ubisoft costumes came in FP1, as opposed to Heihachi who literally could have been saved for Kazuya, but i guess he felt like throwing his father off his pack.

So the Costumes can't really be used as a counterargument anymore. It's too bad this revelation came in too late for me to care that much.


I don't see Hayabusa after that interview.

If im honest the only new company i can think of is Falcom (Adol, Estelle and Rean Schwarzenegger) and maybe an indie if im feeling extra ballsy.

Outside of that, i think it's more likely that we could just get another Nintendo character, or some underspeculated Third Party.
I still think Rayman has a very good chance of showing up, we'll just have to wait and see.
 

DutchPichu

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Dec 24, 2013
Messages
453
The longer I think about it, the more I think it’s weird that Ubisoft got the Mii costumes for Rabbids and Assassin’s Creed, but not for THE most popular character of their company, at least in regards to Smash speculation. Now with Kazuya getting in, regardless of getting the Tekken costume with Min Min, this could bring the solution. Ubisoft, being the only big 3rd party company to get Mii costumes and no character, just makes little sense considering their ties to Nintendo. And since their Smash frontrunner didn’t even show up as a Mii... It is just weird. If I had to guess right now, my guess would actually go to Rayman. He has to most going for him.
 

mariofan48

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The longer I think about it, the more I think it’s weird that Ubisoft got the Mii costumes for Rabbids and Assassin’s Creed, but not for THE most popular character of their company, at least in regards to Smash speculation. Now with Kazuya getting in, regardless of getting the Tekken costume with Min Min, this could bring the solution. Ubisoft, being the only big 3rd party company to get Mii costumes and no character, just makes little sense considering their ties to Nintendo. And since their Smash frontrunner didn’t even show up as a Mii... It is just weird. If I had to guess right now, my guess would actually go to Rayman. He has to most going for him.
I too believe that Rayman has a lot going for him, not a lock by any means, but he's one that I think it has a very good chance of being!

And if it isn't him, at that point I will hope for the next best thing, which is (sadly) getting a costume, but only if he's not the final fighter, which I hope he is.
 

AnAmusingFellow

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Joined
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21
The longer I think about it, the more I think it’s weird that Ubisoft got the Mii costumes for Rabbids and Assassin’s Creed, but not for THE most popular character of their company, at least in regards to Smash speculation. Now with Kazuya getting in, regardless of getting the Tekken costume with Min Min, this could bring the solution. Ubisoft, being the only big 3rd party company to get Mii costumes and no character, just makes little sense considering their ties to Nintendo. And since their Smash frontrunner didn’t even show up as a Mii... It is just weird. If I had to guess right now, my guess would actually go to Rayman. He has to most going for him.
I mean Bethesda's another AAA company and they only have a single Mii costume with Vault Boy (that happened and would've been decided on before Microsoft bought out Bethesda)

That said it still is strange to see these major companies get Mii costumes but no fully playable characters, makes ya really wonder what went on behind the scenes lol
 

mariofan48

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I mean Bethesda's another AAA company and they only have a single Mii costume with Vault Boy (that happened and would've been decided on before Microsoft bought out Bethesda)

That said it still is strange to see these major companies get Mii costumes but no fully playable characters, makes ya really wonder what went on behind the scenes lol
Difference is that Bethesda doesn't have the history with Nintendo that Ubisoft does.
 

AnAmusingFellow

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Difference is that Bethesda doesn't have the history with Nintendo that Ubisoft does.
True, Ubisoft was the only big AAA company in Smash 4 to have representation but not any playable characters IIRC

I'll agree that if the last fighter turns out to not be Rayman then a Mii costume would be nice, by that point I'd just be hoping he at least got something.
 

mariofan48

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We should be able to survive another Mii Wave no problem, right?
It's going to be Lloyd, maybe Jin, maybe Nightmare... I HOPE we get a King costume cause that'd be amazing. But otherwise this is not really the character I'd expect Rayman on.
Hopefully we will survive the next Mii Wave, yeah!
 

TAnimal

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Aug 14, 2018
Messages
311
We should be able to survive another Mii Wave no problem, right?
It's going to be Lloyd, maybe Jin, maybe Nightmare... I HOPE we get a King costume cause that'd be amazing. But otherwise this is not really the character I'd expect Rayman on.
It’s a 12.6% chance a Rayman Mii Costume would happen, as the Lloyd Costume will be back, 3-Tekken Costumes are definitely going to be added which I’m confident is Jin, Mokujin and Yoshimitsu, and if by chance a 5th Mii Costume does get brought in it is more likely an Assist Trophy Mii like Shovel Knight
 

EternalFlameGuy

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 29, 2020
Messages
69
Been thinking about Loose End Theory some more, and a thought occurred to me: Isn't Ubisoft the only major 3rd Party that's been involved in Smash Ultimate from the beginning that doesn't have a character yet? With the Rayman and Mario + Rabbids spirits in base game, then the mii costumes in DLC? Heck you could take it a step further and say they've been involved, continuously, since Smash 4 with the 3 Rayman trophies. My point with this being that you would really think they'd have a character in by now.
 
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ZoroCarlos

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
1,037
Been thinking about Loose End Theory some more, and a thought occurred to me: Isn't Ubisoft the only major 3rd Party that's been involved in Smash Ultimate from the beginning that doesn't have a character yet? With the Rayman and Mario + Rabbids spirits in base game, then the mii costumes in DLC? Heck you could take it a step further and say they've been involved, continuously, since Smash 4 with the 3 Rayman trophies. My point with this being that you would really think they'd have a character in by now.
Well, you have Yacht Club, Wayforward and Koei Tecmo also having some content at launch, so not exactly. Then again Koei Tecmo's is just Fatal Frame which is a co-owned IP. I always assumed Koei Tecmo benefited from loose end, but with the last character on the horizon I have trouble picturing someone like Hayabusa as last, even though I would like him in.
 

EternalFlameGuy

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Oct 29, 2020
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Well, you have Yacht Club, Wayforward and Koei Tecmo also having some content at launch, so not exactly. Then again Koei Tecmo's is just Fatal Frame which is a co-owned IP. I always assumed Koei Tecmo benefited from loose end, but with the last character on the horizon I have trouble picturing someone like Hayabusa as last, even though I would like him in.
To be fair though, Ubisoft, as a company, is a great deal bigger than those 3, no? And while Nintendo is in good graces with all of them, Ubisoft definitely seems to be their biggest collaborative partner, being the only one that's gotten to use the Mario IP, as well as Star Fox and Donkey Kong.
 

ZoroCarlos

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To be fair though, Ubisoft, as a company, is a great deal bigger than those 3, no? And while Nintendo is in good graces with all of them, Ubisoft definitely seems to be their biggest collaborative partner, being the only one that's gotten to use the Mario IP, as well as Star Fox and Donkey Kong.
Koei Tecmo's also done their handful as collaborators, to be fair. A lot of Warriors games, Metroid Other M, Fire Emblem Three Houses. So they've also gotten their fill of using Nintendo's important IPs. This is why I feel a Koei Tecmo rep like Hayabusa would definitely warrant their slot in the roster.

Ubisoft is definitely the bigger company overall, but I'd say KT is nearly as important as Ubi to them. Not to mention that Wayforward is starting to build their way up by working on the new Advanced Wars, so we could be anticipating someone like Shantae in the next game.
 
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pupNapoleon

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Koei Tecmo's also done their handful as collaborators, to be fair. A lot of Warriors games, Metroid Other M, Fire Emblem Three Houses. So they've also gotten their fill of using Nintendo's important IPs. This is why I feel a Koei Tecmo rep like Hayabusa would definitely warrant their slot in the roster.

Ubisoft is definitely the bigger company overall, but I'd say KT is nearly as important as Ubi to them. Not to mention that Wayforward is starting to build their way up by working on the new Advanced Wars, so we could be anticipating someone like Shantae in the next game.
I cannot help but laugh when people start talking about the next game... as if we are, in any way, going to just continue to build upon the current roster (or even have it anywhere similar, with just a few cuts). The next game either needs to continue with 'everyone is here,' (which seems unlikely to me), or just reset.
 

TAnimal

Smash Journeyman
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Aug 14, 2018
Messages
311
To be fair though, Ubisoft, as a company, is a great deal bigger than those 3, no? And while Nintendo is in good graces with all of them, Ubisoft definitely seems to be their biggest collaborative partner, being the only one that's gotten to use the Mario IP, as well as Star Fox and Donkey Kong.
Koei Tecmo's also done their handful as collaborators, to be fair. A lot of Warriors games, Metroid Other M, Fire Emblem Three Houses. So they've also gotten their fill of using Nintendo's important IPs. This is why I feel a Koei Tecmo rep like Hayabusa would definitely warrant their slot in the roster.

Ubisoft is definitely the bigger company overall, but I'd say KT is nearly as important as Ubi to them. Not to mention that Wayforward is starting to build their way up by working on the new Advanced Wars, so we could be anticipating someone like Shantae in the next game.
Let’s remember that the consistency of Loose End Theory is that the Content of the Represented Company is focused on Unfinished Representation that is added later on as proven by

  • Kazuya with Tekken
  • Sephiroth with Final Fantasy 7
  • Pyra/Mythra with Xenoblade 2
  • Min Min with Arms
  • Byleth with Fire Emblem
  • Minecraft with Microsoft

and to top it off Ubisoft has been strongly campaigning for Rayman to the point of having Rayman and Globox and Barbara being Trophy’s in Smash 4 yet in Smash Ultimate has only a Spirit. Koei hasn’t been campaigning for anything regarding Koei-Tecmo ip, so it’s basically a matter of who requested for what. Of course it’s possible that we could still have Hayabusa as the Final Fighter, but it’s more likely that because of the limited amount of Content we have of Ubisoft with 1-Fully owned Ubisoft Spirit and 3-Nintendo/Ubisoft Spirits (ie. Mario + Rabbids) that favors Ubisoft with Loose End Theory whereas mentioned before that Koei has 2-Spirits and an Assist Trophy which if we measure the amount between the 2 we’d be over saturated with Koei content (which granted wouldn’t be bad as Ninja Gaiden has a Special History with Nintendo just like Rayman), you could also say that having 2-Ubisoft Mii Costumes is as big of over saturation of content as Koei’s however let’s also remember that Fire Emblem Three Houses is technically a Koei-Tecmo representation as the Music is a Very Key point of measurement for DLC Content.

However with all of that being said let’s wait till the Kazuya Presentation and find out what the Outcome brings for possibilities
 
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