PYP mafia! Game over!

[Sephiroths Masamune]

The way we are seeing it its differently. The combination of rolecop + roleblocker is strong because it would let them find someone and then just continuously block them. Your scenario has them being able to just fling about their roles and getting their best optimal results.

And while admittedly that could happen, the same could be said for having poisoner in the mix.

Like I don't see how assuming mafia has the best-case scenario in for them with both of those roles is worse than when the same scenario of the planets aligning for them happens, except they would have a role that can guarantee the kill on a problem player for them.

But the difference in the two scenarios is that the RB + Poisoner doesn't give any confirmation that a RC + RB does. I agree getting someone RC'd night one and then N2+ is the Worst case scenario for Town. But I doubt they'll have that much luck. I'm just saying a realistic best case scenario which may not even be best case, just the optimum play.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

I've pushed for Rolecop and Roleblock the entire time. I've been against poisoner the entire time. If you meant something else, than I didn't get it

I understand you were vocal about your opinion, but you didn't explore the possibility of the decision you were advocating. Hence my question.

 

[Fandangox]

But the difference in the two scenarios is that the RB + Poisoner doesn't give any confirmation that a RC + RB does. I agree getting someone RC'd night one and then N2+ is the Worst case scenario for Town. But I doubt they'll have that much luck. I'm just saying a realistic best case scenario which may not even be best case, just the optimum play.

You were the earlier pointing out how the RB + RC combination could be the worst for town.

Think of it this way. if things go best possible results for mafia. Day 1 miss lynch Night 1 kill someone, RB someone, Cop someone.

Which I pointed that it could be worse with poisoner. Which you seem to be in agreement now.

Now if you are talking about realistic scenarios, it just goes back to what I've been saying all this time. That combination will still lead their targeted roles scumhunt during the dayphase, which is why I think that while potentially dangerous, whether it is optimal results for mafia or not, I still think we are ultimately better off with that combo.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

You can't edit your posts can you?

It's supposed to read. RB N2+

 

[Maven89]

See as an Idea hider wouldn't be that bad. Like if the mafia killed someone who was adamant in their claim to trusted town at night, then we know what they had when hidden.

But that's very situational which is why I don't like hider as much. If the mafia lucks out or plays well enough to discover a power role, we can lose an important role and not even know it. There are too many possibilities and variables that could result from a hider imo. Not that any of the options are great but I'd rather poisoner cause at least we know for sure what we get with it.

Hider could lead to anything and has a better chance to make a town win hit or miss imo, because knowing if a power role died( especially if a vital one) is crucial to the town so they know what they lost and how to adjust.

Mafia could use the hide as a way to manipulate the game, and I'd rather not find out what they could do when the hide the details of s player whose role they could have fully figured out and then killed to mess with town.

I'm open to suggestions, but I thought I'd voice so of my concern over this and further back up my choices.

Real worst case scneario is they use is to hide one of their own after being lynched, or hiding a player we all think is scummy that's town. Then we're left not knowing what alignment that person was, and unable to follow through

 

[Z25]

Real worst case scneario is they use is to hide one of their own after being lynched, or hiding a player we all think is scummy that's town. Then we're left not knowing what alignment that person was, and unable to follow through

That's true using it on themselves would be likely. Plus I suppose that as long as town lives with only like 5 people left or smaller, it would be clear that the there's one mafia left and then the town can look back and probably piece together that the hidden person was likely scum, depending on what happens with scum before then.

Not knowing the skills could be a problem though. But again its situational and could be either a great help to mafia or do nothing really good at all.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

You were the earlier pointing out how the RB + RC combination could be the worst for town.



Which I pointed that it could be worse with poisoner. Which you seem to be in agreement now.

Now if you are talking about realistic scenarios, it just goes back to what I've been saying all this time. That combination will still lead their targeted roles scumhunt during the dayphase, which is why I think that while potentially dangerous, whether it is optimal results for mafia or not, I still think we are ultimately better off with that combo.

I don't know if I agree that it would be worse. I just think Poisoner is a situational role that may or may not be useful at best and completely useless at worst. Where RB + RC is a guaranteed combo regardless of what town gets.

 

[Maven89]

@HBC | Nabe vote please

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Reading up now, I had to give an impromptu chemistry lecture.

 

[Fandangox]

I don't know if I agree that it would be worse. I just think Poisoner is a situational role that may or may not be useful at best and completely useless at worst. Where RB + RC is a guaranteed combo regardless of what town gets.

Its just a risk Im not too willing to make.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I see the game you're playing and I'll entertain it, for now, but, you better have a vote in the next two hours.

I'm thinking you're thinking Poisoner and Blocker.

There's no game. I was interested as to why you'd think I was "onto" something, which sounds like you think that I've made a catch of some sort. I prompted you to continue, because you thinking I've made a catch at this juncture is both odd and specific. But you ended up at "I think that you're thinking of a specific set of roles." Since that's pretty different, I'm wondering how it could be possible that I've misunderstood you somewhere.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

vote poisoner

rb and poisoner makes it so that mafia only performs two actions a night instead of three. We are also not guarenteed a jailer, and the rolecop still has a chance of finding our PRs earlier than we would want.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I started this Day thinking that early suspects were leading away from Poisoner to Role Cop (presumably because Jailer was not picked, then) while simultaneously dumping on it as an obvscum option. But I brought up a potential merit of Poisoner and asked around, and those aren't really the sorts of responses I got. I'm more inclined now to believe that it's not Poisoner that's been dumped on by Scum, but Hider for the same purpose, and that scum (at least, early suspects) would happily accept Poisoner.

I still may want to play roles in a different direction, I'm reading and considering. I think it's important to acknowledge that, despite saying the previous sentence, I don't actually expect to sway town if I want to go in a different direction, because it is very close to time up at this point.

 

[Maven89]

I started this Day thinking that early suspects were leading away from Poisoner to Role Cop (presumably because Jailer was not picked, then) while simultaneously dumping on it as an obvscum option. But I brought up a potential merit of Poisoner and asked around, and those aren't really the sorts of responses I got. I'm more inclined now to believe that it's not Poisoner that's been dumped on by Scum, but Hider for the same purpose, and that scum (at least, early suspects) would happily accept Poisoner.

I still may want to play roles in a different direction, I'm reading and considering. I think it's important to acknowledge that, despite saying the previous sentence, I don't actually expect to sway town if I want to go in a different direction, because it is very close to time up at this point.

Time is running out

Vote

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

How about you vote for what roles we should have?

Nabe needs to vote for roles now,

Don't worry, I'm not a doublevoter this time around. Whether or not I'm content with the status quo is irrelevant.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I would vote Poisoner if my vote would make the difference, but Role Cop otherwise.

I'm more interested in seeing where votes end up than in what roles scum gets, of those two. Poisoner versus Role Cop isn't going to change how I scumhunt, but which one we land on is information that can help lead to scum, and if they need to work a step harder to get the role they want, that's much more relevant.

 

[Maven89]

Don't worry, I'm not a doublevoter this time around. Whether or not I'm content with the status quo is irrelevant.

I’m not concerned with your vote for it’s ability to sway the roles, I’m concerned about your vote so we have your opinion on roles pinned down

 

[giraffelasergun]

Poisoner: Z25 tk seph fire (4)
Flip Hider:
Disguiser:
Role Blocker: Thirdkoopa, Fire Emblemier, Maven, Pokechu, Fandangox, Shishœ moydow kant z25 (9)
Role Cop: Pokechu, Maven, Shishœ, Fandangox kant (5)

With 9 votes and 5 votes, Mafia will receive a role blocker and a role cop.

Day 0 is over, Day 1 has begun! Role pms for those who need them will be going out momentarily.

 

[Vult Redux]

I'm online now (just in not-time... sorry everyone) and I'm unhappy with the combination of these choices.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

Welp, guess we got a Roleblocker and a role cop to deal with. Now, I am suspicious of Nabe's absence of votes. He may say that it doesn't matter to him, but it is important in knowing more about his overall stances on the setup.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Vote: Fire

ha I got there first

 

[Thirdkoopa]

...I thought it ended at 6 PST and I'm bad.

Let's get this started. Vote: Kantrip

Vult Redux what choices? What would you have gone with instead?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

If I had a gun:

• Koops
• Shish

If I were a cop:

• Maven
• Fanny

If I were a jailer:

• Fanny
• Shish

If I were a tracker:

• Koops
• Fire

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Much more relevant:

I'm at a wedding today and haven't caught up on the new roles or votes or anything. If any of you demons kick in a role before I can read them you are being deliberately anti-town and I'm voting you out.

#HBC | J Kantrip with a side order of Thirdkoopa
I bet you can't see what's cool in this post...

 

[Thirdkoopa]

If someone shoots, do it halfway in the day, preferably.

I don't mind being shot.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

 

[Vult Redux]

...I thought it ended at 6 PST and I'm bad.

Let's get this started. Vote: Kantrip

Vult Redux what choices? What would you have gone with instead?

I would have chosen Poisoner and Roleblocker probably but after reading the arguments (i.e. town probably got a Jailer) more I'm not as angry with the outcome as I could be. I haven't read the Disguiser description but I'm assuming it's bad like everyone thinks it is.

Also just so everyone knows I assumed there was a vote threshold to lynch rather than a deadline in case anyone was confused about my earlier post...

 

[Maven89]

Scum tier list, top to bottom.

1. Nabe, Z25

2. Koopa, Shishoe, Sepiroth maginsihsdkfjalsdjfklajsdf

3. J, Kantrip

Vote: Nabe

 

[Vult Redux]

vote poisoner

rb and poisoner makes it so that mafia only performs two actions a night instead of three. We are also not guarenteed a jailer, and the rolecop still has a chance of finding our PRs earlier than we would want.

This is a quality obv-town post and I trust you. Fire Emblemier Where's your head at?

 

[Fire Emblemier]

I would have chosen Poisoner and Roleblocker probably but after reading the arguments (i.e. town probably got a Jailer) more I'm not as angry with the outcome as I could be. I haven't read the Disguiser description but I'm assuming it's bad like everyone thinks it is.

Also just so everyone knows I assumed there was a vote threshold to lynch rather than a deadline in case anyone was confused about my earlier post...

Disguiser is basically an anti cop and tracker as it makes fake results.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

This is a quality obv-town post and I trust you. Fire Emblemier Where's your head at?

Slight suspicion on Nabe for choosing not to vote. Though, I mostly skimmed the thread for what was posted today. I'll probably have better thoughts in the morning, as right now I'm about to eat dinner.

 

[Maven89]

I don't mind being shot.

You should

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I’d rather let them continue tightening the noose instead of being scared off

Is this just a Murphy or did it mean something?

Nabe, you seem to know what's going on with Z25. Is this a scum tell or a grudge over a past game?

The latter. I don't think he's deflecting there; as scum last game I rode him as town in similar conversations based on similar misunderstandings.

Nah. If you find something odd come out and say what it is. That's town's job.

You already brought it up, so if you were trying to be coy so they could continue to mess themselves up you probably already ****ed that up.

So what's weird then?

It doesn't have as much to do with the solo player as it does the herd, though. Your comment is noted on this one, and welcome back, but being mystified and totalitarian isn't a response. You're well aware that I don't mean 'never', I mean 'after', so you should have something to say regarding the content of what I said rather than the form, even if that 'something' is an audible nothing.

 

[Maven89]

Is this just a Murphy or did it mean something?.

I found Z25 pushing for a poisoner and hider to be extremely scummy. Instead of calling him out, I wanted to see if anyone else would push the same. I figured your post was you pointing out that Z25 backed down from hider as soon as someone called him out on it, but apparently you've been saying your post meant nothing.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Maven89 Why is J on your scum radar?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I think most likely we have the Day Vig because chaos is fun for town and scum alike.
The tracker, it's pretty standard, and produces WIFOM for scum.
I would say 50/50 on Jailer and Busdriver
I doubt we will have role cop, but would be happy if we do. If we do have a role cop somehow I doubt we will have a tracker. If we do have a role cop we likely have a busdriver.

I bet you would.

 

[Maven89]

Maven89 Why is J on your scum radar?

Because he's the only one who hasn't posted

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I found Z25 pushing for a poisoner and hider to be extremely scummy. Instead of calling him out, I wanted to see if anyone else would push the same. I figured your post was you pointing out that Z25 backed down from hider as soon as someone called him out on it, but apparently you've been saying your post meant nothing.

Oh. It didn't mean nothing, the opposite. I'm talking about what people said about Z25, not what Z25 said, which I think is innocuous.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

innocuous

IS that you saying what you think others said is innocuous or what Z25 said?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Slight suspicion on Nabe for choosing not to vote.

Scum wants to have a say, not a lack of one. As Maven said, what's relevant regarding voting is holding someone to an opinion, and I did give an opinion; what we gave out was fine. If you think that opinion was given too late into the Day, that's a slightly separate issue that you're welcome to untangle on your own, but "he didn't vote" is as non-specific as it is a non-issue.

IS that you saying what you think others said is innocuous or what Z25 said?

Z25. It was his first post of the game, and when others told him otherwise, he changed the vote to suit. It's something in the response of others that seems anything but innocuous, and that's the question I posed to others.