Data Preferred Rules Discussion

J.I.L

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Its really not an issue for me. I just get super tilted if im trying to push GSP and i get cheese ****** by some BS rule set. but I've stopped playing since the game just isn't fun, even when i'm getting all 1v1s, which is 99% of the time anyway. Most people are incredibly gimmicky players and are just obnoxious to play against, and GSP is just a meaningless ranking that doesn't provide motivation to play more. There's no tournaments, nothing to unlock or work towards. You kind of just play to beat other players, and when 80% of them are unworthy of anything but my tea bag and "You're amazing", its kinda like wtf am i doing.

and yes you get timed penalties for disconnecting. Mine is usually maxed out at 2.5 hours or whatever it caps at. Well, used to be. its at zero now since i have taken a few days off.
Dang man, you're making me not want to play this game as much, anymore. Hm...... I think things could be better if they just flip the gsp system. Instead of it count up, it counts down. so lower gsp, the better. I think incentive would be better. And I agree, the online is just very barren. Nothing to do. Quickplay and BA....and that's it. Can get boring.

"unworthy of anything but teabagging" and passive agressive/sarcastic compliment taunt...lol wow. You seem to not like the playstyle of people on quickplay.... thought you said the mechanics of this game helped put to rest cheesy gimmicks? and what are these gimmicks you speak of?
 

Xquirtle

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Dang man, you're making me not want to play this game as much, anymore. Hm...... I think things could be better if they just flip the gsp system. Instead of it count up, it counts down. so lower gsp, the better. I think incentive would be better. And I agree, the online is just very barren. Nothing to do. Quickplay and BA....and that's it. Can get boring.

"unworthy of anything but teabagging" and passive agressive/sarcastic compliment taunt...lol wow. You seem to not like the playstyle of people on quickplay.... thought you said the mechanics of this game helped put to rest cheesy gimmicks? and what are these gimmicks you speak of?
Nah I don't think the game mechanics made gimmicks less viable. Maybe slightly worse if you consider projectile camping a gimmick, since that is nerfed on shields and the defensive options against the approaching player are slightly worse. I'm talking about 1 in 4 games being against a Ganon, somehow over 4 mil GSP and is probably 77k on his alts, that actually has no game plan outside of side B and down B and going for massive hard read smash attacks. and tbh, i practice against Ganon in training mode half the time just to farm them with my edge guards. It pays off for sure, but its just like damn... these guys actually can't play their character correctly, even remotely, and they somehow see success. The whole match is just baiting them into another stupid attack and punishing them, over and over. Feels kinda hurr durr. but like the game breeds these players. You take a new player that obviously will just suck, they lose a bunch, find out that character X has a really forgiving B ability, and they just become insanely overly reliant on that ability. Eventually their strategy is no longer viable, but the low GSP meta, where people have no defense, trains them to use these asinine play styles.

Like seriously, what is the first thing you think when you see an Ice Climber? Oh this guy is going to press side B every other button. Half the cast is like this. You see their splash art and can guess how this new guy is about to try and spam you out with some B ability.
 

J.I.L

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Nah I don't think the game mechanics made gimmicks less viable. Maybe slightly worse if you consider projectile camping a gimmick, since that is nerfed on shields and the defensive options against the approaching player are slightly worse. I'm talking about 1 in 4 games being against a Ganon, somehow over 4 mil GSP and is probably 77k on his alts, that actually has no game plan outside of side B and down B and going for massive hard read smash attacks. and tbh, i practice against Ganon in training mode half the time just to farm them with my edge guards. It pays off for sure, but its just like damn... these guys actually can't play their character correctly, even remotely, and they somehow see success. The whole match is just baiting them into another stupid attack and punishing them, over and over. Feels kinda hurr durr. but like the game breeds these players. You take a new player that obviously will just suck, they lose a bunch, find out that character X has a really forgiving B ability, and they just become insanely overly reliant on that ability. Eventually their strategy is no longer viable, but the low GSP meta, where people have no defense, trains them to use these asinine play styles.

Like seriously, what is the first thing you think when you see an Ice Climber? Oh this guy is going to press side B every other button. Half the cast is like this. You see their splash art and can guess how this new guy is about to try and spam you out with some B ability.
What's your main's gsp?
 
D

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The problem isn't that you have the option to opt in to playing those rules, its that other players that obviously do not want to play that rule set get forced to. It is dead *** obvious that a huge portion of the players only want to play competitive rules, and it is asinine of nintendo to combine "fun" rule sets with competitive. Everybody loses with this design.

and, if you're purposefully picking those rules to be a troll, then, well, you are a troll
But that isn’t the purpose of this thread is it? It’s to complain about the people who use non-competitive rules, rather then the system, and that’s what my comment is directed at. I do agree that the problem is the system, not the people as OP implies.

“It is dead *** obvious that a huge portion of the players only want to play competitive rules”

I disagree, Smash is a party game, not a competitive fighting game, and that’s what most people come to this game for, having fun on Hanenbow with items on.

Yes GSP grinders (or “trolls”) do exist, but they are a minority compared to people using those rules to have a bit of fun.
 
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J.I.L

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But that isn’t the purpose of this thread is it? It’s to complain about the people who use non-competitive rules, rather then the system, and that’s what my comment is directed at. I do agree that the problem is the system, not the people as OP implies.

“It is dead *** obvious that a huge portion of the players only want to play competitive rules”

I disagree, Smash is a party game, not a competitive fighting game, and that’s what most people come to this game for, having fun on Hanenbow with items on.

Yes GSP grinders (or “trolls”) do exist, but they are a minority compared to people using those rules to have a bit of fun.
Gsp grinders are not trolls. Hanebow is a terrible stage, regardless of playing casually or not. Lol
 

Coolboy

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my opinion is..stop complaining about non competitive rules!

ok so yeah it sucks you get rulesets you don't want..we all hate that and that part should be fixed period, but if you are going to whine how much non competitive rules exists then plz just stop there...

what bothers me greatly is that there are harcore pro competitive people that really are capable of looking down on casual players and players who do not take it to seriously, like really are they for real? since when are videogames not allowed to be used for fun anymore? not all of us practice 24/7 to go to tournaments to win money for it

even on this forum..if someone admitted to being a casual or saying they aren't that serious about that game i saw people saying ''then why are you here?'' in all honesty that's just makes me want to smack those people for real..so rude for no reason
 
D

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Gsp grinders are not trolls. Hanebow is a terrible stage, regardless of playing casually or not. Lol
I think my definition of GSP grinder is different from yours. I’m referring to people who use non-competitive rulesets just to gain GSP, and what I assume Xquirtle was referring to when they complained about “trolls”.

That’s rather subjective honestly, Hanenbow is one of my favourite stages due it being simple, but the tilting of the platforms adds a bit of variety that’s not too chaotic. Hanenbow being a bad stage seems to be a rather popular opinion, so tell me, what makes you dislike Hanenbow?
 

Xquirtle

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But that isn’t the purpose of this thread is it? It’s to complain about the people who use non-competitive rules, rather then the system, and that’s what my comment is directed at. I do agree that the problem is the system, not the people as OP implies.

“It is dead *** obvious that a huge portion of the players only want to play competitive rules”

I disagree, Smash is a party game, not a competitive fighting game, and that’s what most people come to this game for, having fun on Hanenbow with items on.

Yes GSP grinders (or “trolls”) do exist, but they are a minority compared to people using those rules to have a bit of fun.
I said that a huge portion of the player base only wants to play competitive rules. How can you possibly disagree with that? I didn't say everybody, or even a majority. While it is almost certainly a majority, and that percentage only increases as casual players play less and less, it is clearly an important part of the player base. Anyway, i'm not sure what your point is other than that you fundamentally disagree on what the game is, and thus there is no point in even debating it.

Yes, the system is asinine, and yes, it is also asinine to pick rule sets just to pill people off. Within the realm of player intent, the OPs question is subjective. Personally, i believe that if you are in elite smash and purposefully picking abusive rule sets, basically anything other than 7 minute 3 stock, to advantage yourself (using HP or weird time settings to cause time outs) , or just picking ridiculous settings to piss people off, then that is "unsportsmanlike" by definition. If you are for some reason genuinely playing weird rule sets for fun on your elite smash character, then sure.
 

J.I.L

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I said that a huge portion of the player base only wants to play competitive rules. How can you possibly disagree with that? I didn't say everybody, or even a majority. While it is almost certainly a majority, and that percentage only increases as casual players play less and less, it is clearly an important part of the player base. Anyway, i'm not sure what your point is other than that you fundamentally disagree on what the game is, and thus there is no point in even debating it.

Yes, the system is asinine, and yes, it is also asinine to pick rule sets just to pill people off. Within the realm of player intent, the OPs question is subjective. Personally, i believe that if you are in elite smash and purposefully picking abusive rule sets, basically anything other than 7 minute 3 stock, to advantage yourself (using HP or weird time settings to cause time outs) , or just picking ridiculous settings to piss people off, then that is "unsportsmanlike" by definition. If you are for some reason genuinely playing weird rule sets for fun on your elite smash character, then sure.
You're always complianing about quick play player base yet avoid showcasing your gsp. Hm........could it be your gsp isn't that impressive which would make your haughty critiques of quickplay players lose sway? Point is, I don't think you have the room to critize quickplay players and saying what they are deserving if your gsp isn't in the top threshold of not just online, but ELITE SMASH. So basically.....your gsp should AT LEAST BE at 4.9 million by now if you want to say players are "unworthy" of your respect.

@LusterofLeo I need some type of long flat plain to move. Hanebow just sucks because it's easy to die,espcially if you have bad recovery and it's just hard to hit people and move around. And this isn't up for debate, either. Hanebow is a bad stage to me, and nothing you say will change that.
 

Xquirtle

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You're always complianing about quick play player base yet avoid showcasing your gsp. Hm........could it be your gsp isn't that impressive which would make your haughty critiques of quickplay players lose sway? Point is, I don't think you have the room to critize quickplay players and saying what they are deserving if your gsp isn't in the top threshold of not just online, but ELITE SMASH. So basically.....your gsp should AT LEAST BE at 4.9 million by now if you want to say players are "unworthy" of your respect.

@LusterofLeo I need some type of long flat plain to move. Hanebow just sucks because it's easy to die,espcially if you have bad recovery and it's just hard to hit people and move around. And this isn't up for debate, either. Hanebow is a bad stage to me, and nothing you say will change that.
Oh please. The only person, out of the like 30 people that post on this dead forum, that feels the need to parade their GSP around is you. Why don't you just add it to your signature? It is ridiculous to try and qualify your arguments with the size of your "epeen" rather than the content of the post. I just assume that a majority of people posting here understand the game well enough to talk about it because, in general, they do. and regardless, do you really think that people are going to be honest about their GSP anyway? Its just moronic to even talk about it unless you're trying to help somebody and understand the meta that they are playing in.

Anyway, that was obviously hyperbolic statement (about who is "worthy"), and there is a difference between criticizing people and telling you why they annoy me. I've said multiple times that I don't blame people for playing that way since the game promotes it. You're taking my explanation for why i'm not really playing the game anymore and conflating that with me telling other people to be a certain way. I provided an honest answer as to why I don't enjoy the game anymore. QP has no depth, and most players use annoying strategies, which you have also complained about many times over. In fact, you go on massive rants that are far more directed at other players than anything that I ever say (how many warnings now?), so I'm really not too keen on your sudden high horse stance against my comments.
 

J.I.L

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Oh please. The only person, out of the like 30 people that post on this dead forum, that feels the need to parade their GSP around is you. Why don't you just add it to your signature? It is ridiculous to try and qualify your arguments with the size of your "epeen" rather than the content of the post. I just assume that a majority of people posting here understand the game well enough to talk about it because, in general, they do. and regardless, do you really think that people are going to be honest about their GSP anyway? Its just moronic to even talk about it unless you're trying to help somebody and understand the meta that they are playing in.

Anyway, that was obviously hyperbolic statement (about who is "worthy"), and there is a difference between criticizing people and telling you why they annoy me. I've said multiple times that I don't blame people for playing that way since the game promotes it. You're taking my explanation for why i'm not really playing the game anymore and conflating that with me telling other people to be a certain way. I provided an honest answer as to why I don't enjoy the game anymore. QP has no depth, and most players use annoying strategies, which you have also complained about many times over. In fact, you go on massive rants that are far more directed at other players than anything that I ever say (how many warnings now?), so I'm really not too keen on your sudden high horse stance against my comments.
i'm just saying, you lack clout if you critize people on quickplay but cant be them. It just makes you look like a guy who cant win against juvenile trick which exposes you more then anything mr. Squirrtle.
Why wouldn't you be honest about your gsp? you guys all parrot that "epeening" is useless and meaningless so therefore incentive to lie about it should be low. Yeah, you did complain about the game allowing that "meta' f players? lol, how'd you even combat aginst projectiles. it's apart of the game. If I could, I just need buff to my mains.
Falco - Down A has to be stronger, I'd readjust his up A so it can have a slighty strong knock back and vastly improve it's putrid hit box, I'd make his side A a little more smoother and rigid...it's too wabally... and his laser NEEDS BUFF. I'd make it a CONSITENT 3% damage. So if you spam it, it constantly gives 3% damage, as it should. Don't even understand why they'd do it anyother way. It's the same plamsa laser. lol. Also make his side B go THROUGH SHIELDS. In mash 4, if people approcach me. I had the option of using side B through them, so if they block I had many options of turning back to grab or hit them. Or just continue running to the other side of the stage to continue camp.
Ness - Increase length of his up A roller, and make his up A grab also a kill option as potent as his back A. No nerf to PK scam.
Lemmy - Have it UP B bomb be unavoidable. To many people are able to wiggle out of his UP B bomb explosion. It's annoying. Make his go kart even faster. Increae hit box for UP A. Make his side A longer. And allow me koopa bots to go through people shield. Don't know why they stopped that in ultimate, but it needs to restart agaian.

Zelda, richter, inkling, snake, ken, gannadorf, bowser, bayoneta, all of fire emblem swordsmen, incenroar, ivsoaur, king deddee, rob, pulutaina, warioo, rosalina and joker ALL GET NERFED (and their echos).
Anyway, the only annoying stragies there are to complain about are the people online who use cheap character like these ^ online and jsutcheese with them. I mean, you just talk about people with little skill.

Lol, I feel bad. I got likes on my comment from coolboy and the other guy because they probably thought I was taking into account people who use items as people you deem unworthy. Truth is, I could give a dam about item setting casuals (Sorry coolboy, I like you....but jank stage with items all in the name of "fun"......I don't like that. Honestly, that isn't even "fun" to me, anyway. What's fun is sitting on team battle, playing when my partner is gandodorf and im in the back shooting laser as he takes them 2 on 1. As they try to take him two on one, they keep getting stunned by my laser which results in a ton of DOORYAHs to the face. LOOOOOOOOL. Then after they get eliminated, watching them the screen freeze as you know people are ragequtting after getting elimated in the first 1 min 30 seconds of the game LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL.) As a matter of fact, I get extremly annoyed when people at the 4+ million GSP still using such juvenile rulesets and I have to play amongst them espcially if my falco and ness got thrown out of elite smash and I try to enjoy normal Team Battle on non elite smash. And they usually come on FFA. I just simply don't fight. Pick up all the items, then run away. Then when the last person standing, I just fight to push him off the arena so I can collect the items. And I throw them all with no mercy. That's what they get for putting such a dumb ruleset at our level of GSP.
The only reason I'm on "high horse" is because I was alittle dissapointed you didn't tell your gsp. I was interested in what it was.
 
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Xquirtle

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i'm just saying, you lack clout if you critize people on quickplay but cant be them. It just makes you look like a guy who cant win against juvenile trick which exposes you more then anything mr. Squirrtle.
Why wouldn't you be honest about your gsp? you guys all parrot that "epeening" is useless and meaningless so therefore incentive to lie about it should be low. Yeah, you did complain about the game allowing that "meta' f players? lol, how'd you even combat aginst projectiles. it's apart of the game. If I could, I just need buff to my mains.
Falco - Down A has to be stronger, I'd readjust his up A so it can have a slighty strong knock back and vastly improve it's putrid hit box, I'd make his side A a little more smoother and rigid...it's too wabally... and his laser NEEDS BUFF. I'd make it a CONSITENT 3% damage. So if you spam it, it constantly gives 3% damage, as it should. Don't even understand why they'd do it anyother way. It's the same plamsa laser. lol. Also make his side B go THROUGH SHIELDS. In mash 4, if people approcach me. I had the option of using side B through them, so if they block I had many options of turning back to grab or hit them. Or just continue running to the other side of the stage to continue camp.
Ness - Increase length of his up A roller, and make his up A grab also a kill option as potent as his back A. No nerf to PK scam.
Lemmy - Have it UP B bomb be unavoidable. To many people are able to wiggle out of his UP B bomb explosion. It's annoying. Make his go kart even faster. Increae hit box for UP A. Make his side A longer. And allow me koopa bots to go through people shield. Don't know why they stopped that in ultimate, but it needs to restart agaian.

Zelda, richter, inkling, snake, ken, gannadorf, bowser, bayoneta, all of fire emblem swordsmen, incenroar, ivsoaur, king deddee, rob, pulutaina, warioo, rosalina and joker ALL GET NERFED (and their echos).
Anyway, the only annoying stragies there are to complain about are the people online who use cheap character like these ^ online and jsutcheese with them. I mean, you just talk about people with little skill.

Lol, I feel bad. I got likes on my comment from coolboy and the other guy because they probably thought I was taking into account people who use items as people you deem unworthy. Truth is, I could give a dam about item setting casuals (Sorry coolboy, I like you....but jank stage with items all in the name of "fun"......I don't like that. Honestly, that isn't even "fun" to me, anyway. What's fun is sitting on team battle, playing when my partner is gandodorf and im in the back shooting laser as he takes them 2 on 1. As they try to take him two on one, they keep getting stunned by my laser which results in a ton of DOORYAHs to the face. LOOOOOOOOL. Then after they get eliminated, watching them the screen freeze as you know people are ragequtting after getting elimated in the first 1 min 30 seconds of the game LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL.) As a matter of fact, I get extremly annoyed when people at the 4+ million GSP still using such juvenile rulesets and I have to play amongst them espcially if my falco and ness got thrown out of elite smash and I try to enjoy normal Team Battle on non elite smash. And they usually come on FFA. I just simply don't fight. Pick up all the items, then run away. Then when the last person standing, I just fight to push him off the arena so I can collect the items. And I throw them all with no mercy. That's what they get for putting such a dumb ruleset at our level of GSP.
The only reason I'm on "high horse" is because I was alittle dissapointed you didn't tell your gsp. I was interested in what it was.
I think its obvious that I'm not going for "clout" here. All I do on here is complain about QP, which we basically always agree on, and participate in some character specific threads about my mains or characters that I'm trying to learn. Complaining about obnoxious strategies is completely ubiquitous across basically any game with any sort of pvp and from players of any skill level... I don't generally lose to down B spamming Ganons since its just such a bad strat, but I do lose to projectile camps. Virtually everybody gets beaten by that. and you should know by now that I'm careful with my word choice. Just because I complain about something doesn't mean that I'm getting farmed by it. I can still win and think that my opponent was using an annoying tactic.

My characters bounce around the 4 millions and usually are not in ES for long if i do accomplish that, but I did it a few times back when GSPs were a lot lower. I don't really know how far i could go since i haven't touched Pichu since the nerf, and he is by far my best character. I also can't drink merlot and play Pichu, which is basically the only way that I can suffer through QP anymore, so thats a huge downside.
 

J.I.L

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I think its obvious that I'm not going for "clout" here. All I do on here is complain about QP, which we basically always agree on, and participate in some character specific threads about my mains or characters that I'm trying to learn. Complaining about obnoxious strategies is completely ubiquitous across basically any game with any sort of pvp and from players of any skill level... I don't generally lose to down B spamming Ganons since its just such a bad strat, but I do lose to projectile camps. Virtually everybody gets beaten by that. and you should know by now that I'm careful with my word choice. Just because I complain about something doesn't mean that I'm getting farmed by it. I can still win and think that my opponent was using an annoying tactic.

My characters bounce around the 4 millions and usually are not in ES for long if i do accomplish that, but I did it a few times back when GSPs were a lot lower. I don't really know how far i could go since i haven't touched Pichu since the nerf, and he is by far my best character. I also can't drink merlot and play Pichu, which is basically the only way that I can suffer through QP anymore, so thats a huge downside.
Eh...... around the mid tier 4 millions? not bad.... though there is a lot of room to improve. I know you're going to hate to hear this.....but you are most probably not near any of my 3 main's level.... and i'm the king of projectile camp/spam. If you can master philopshpy of dealing with someone like me, your gsp will boost increibly and maybe you won't feel so...... dissapointed with this online and its player base. Plus I could use someone to post my gameplay. lol.
 

Xquirtle

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Eh...... around the mid tier 4 millions? not bad.... though there is a lot of room to improve. I know you're going to hate to hear this.....but you are most probably not near any of my 3 main's level.... and i'm the king of projectile camp/spam. If you can master philopshpy of dealing with someone like me, your gsp will boost increibly and maybe you won't feel so...... dissapointed with this online and its player base. Plus I could use someone to post my gameplay. lol.
I don't care to be honest. At no point in time have i tried to make any point that I am better or worse than anybody else on this forum.
 

Sean²

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OP, your solution:

Don't play Quickplay.

Play battle arenas for your competitive fix. Quickplay is for trolling around and maybe testing out new characters at this point, it's useless to take it seriously. Nintendo couldn't have made a worse ranked mode, because it actually makes you want to avoid playing after you've hit a certain rank, in fear of losing that rank if you try to be serious. They're actually pushing people away with this mode. The best way to go about it is to not play it, or just play it for goofing off and doing dumb stuff.
 

J.I.L

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OP, your solution:

Don't play Quickplay.

Play battle arenas for your competitive fix. Quickplay is for trolling around and maybe testing out new characters at this point, it's useless to take it seriously. Nintendo couldn't have made a worse ranked mode, because it actually makes you want to avoid playing after you've hit a certain rank, in fear of losing that rank if you try to be serious. They're actually pushing people away with this mode. The best way to go about it is to not play it, or just play it for goofing off and doing dumb stuff.
Nonsense. The only thing that expose is your lack maturity of dealing with a ranked mode. Battle arenas are full of more noobs and are generally less competitive plus you have to weight in those dumb lines. BA 1v1 are ironically good for just light heart training while quickplay 1v1 is actually to put your skill to test.
 

Sean²

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Nonsense. The only thing that expose is your lack maturity of dealing with a ranked mode. Battle arenas are full of more noobs and are generally less competitive plus you have to weight in those dumb lines. BA 1v1 are ironically good for just light heart training while quickplay 1v1 is actually to put your skill to test.
Yeah, you're wrong. Quickplay will mainly make you get good at dealing with boring, campy strategies and players intentionally trying to frustrate you, with the occasional good player or two. It's generally not a fun experience, because they match you up with people on WiFi who lag and people with garbage rules. The point of the game is to enjoy it as recreation. Do you like looking for that needle in a haystack of a good match? Or are you just a sadist and enjoy the pain? Then again, you have said you go into quickplay with goofy stamina rules in the past to troll people. You say you don't need to combo because you only projectile camp. But then you go and lambast the online in other ways, at the same time. So I'm not buying that there's a shred of genuinity in this post, man.

The best online competitive practice you'll get is in arenas, preferably with a group specifically looking for competitive matches, like a discord group specifically aiming toward player improvement. Mostly because you can actually talk to them and work together on improving, over the crapshoot on whether the really good player is gonna rematch you or not so you can get another shot at them. In said discords, there's a large chance you will get that 2nd shot at them at some point, and be able to leave the set having learned something from them. You're free to disagree.

Quickplay might be okay for super-beginners to start learning the basics and see a variety of different matchups, but after a certain point, the usefulness wears off. It's basically the antithesis of what a quality ranked mode should be. A lot of people grind until they hit Elite Smash, then just never play it again. Because for some god forsaken reason, they chose to have a game mode that's only unlockable by hitting an ever-rising number that you can fall below at any given time, because someone took their Switch onto hotel WiFi and decided to queue up in ranked with 200+ms ping. Then because they're in the hotel up the road from your house, regional matchmaking sees that as a good match to queue you into. All that does is trigger salt, and sometimes loss-avoidance if you're trying to play to improve.

Good ranked modes pull you in and make you want to keep playing. I've played a lot of ranked in different games that are loads of fun, even on cold streaks. Usually because when you pick a playlist, you're guaranteed to be playing the rules you want, and generally have ways to get rid of laggy players that don't lower your own rank or get you temp-banned for SDing out. Ultimate's isn't reliable. There were games released 10+ years ago that had better ranked systems on launch day, but in normal Nintendo fashion, they couldn't follow an example. They had to create their own, and they botched it.
 

Xquirtle

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Yeah, you're wrong. Quickplay will mainly make you get good at dealing with boring, campy strategies and players intentionally trying to frustrate you, with the occasional good player or two. It's generally not a fun experience, because they match you up with people on WiFi who lag and people with garbage rules. The point of the game is to enjoy it as recreation. Do you like looking for that needle in a haystack of a good match? Or are you just a sadist and enjoy the pain? Then again, you have said you go into quickplay with goofy stamina rules in the past to troll people. You say you don't need to combo because you only projectile camp. But then you go and lambast the online in other ways, at the same time. So I'm not buying that there's a shred of genuinity in this post, man.

The best online competitive practice you'll get is in arenas, preferably with a group specifically looking for competitive matches, like a discord group specifically aiming toward player improvement. Mostly because you can actually talk to them and work together on improving, over the crapshoot on whether the really good player is gonna rematch you or not so you can get another shot at them. In said discords, there's a large chance you will get that 2nd shot at them at some point, and be able to leave the set having learned something from them. You're free to disagree.

Quickplay might be okay for super-beginners to start learning the basics and see a variety of different matchups, but after a certain point, the usefulness wears off. It's basically the antithesis of what a quality ranked mode should be. A lot of people grind until they hit Elite Smash, then just never play it again. Because for some god forsaken reason, they chose to have a game mode that's only unlockable by hitting an ever-rising number that you can fall below at any given time, because someone took their Switch onto hotel WiFi and decided to queue up in ranked with 200+ms ping. Then because they're in the hotel up the road from your house, regional matchmaking sees that as a good match to queue you into. All that does is trigger salt, and sometimes loss-avoidance if you're trying to play to improve.

Good ranked modes pull you in and make you want to keep playing. I've played a lot of ranked in different games that are loads of fun, even on cold streaks. Usually because when you pick a playlist, you're guaranteed to be playing the rules you want, and generally have ways to get rid of laggy players that don't lower your own rank or get you temp-banned for SDing out. Ultimate's isn't reliable. There were games released 10+ years ago that had better ranked systems on launch day, but in normal Nintendo fashion, they couldn't follow an example. They had to create their own, and they botched it.
I agree with basically all of this. but I do think QP is your best practice tool outside of taking that extra step to set up genuinely good battle arenas. I'd say random BA<QP<formal BA.

I most definitely share your sentiment on QP play styles being generally boring and annoying. It feels like it takes 10 matches to find one opponent that you can appreciate as a player with strong offense that actually wants to play the game. Probably 60-70% of my games, the player is fully committed to camping at an edge and attempting to reset said camp every time I close on them. Personally, I don't see how that is fun or rewarding. Like my goal is to go in and beat the f*** out of them in an absolutely humiliating fashion. but... it is what it is. The only way that QP will speed up is if the punish game was closer to melee
 
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Sean²

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I agree with basically all of this. but I do think QP is your best practice tool outside of taking that extra step to set up genuinely good battle arenas. I'd say random BA<QP<formal BA.

I most definitely share your sentiment on QP play styles being generally boring and annoying. It feels like it takes 10 matches to find one opponent that you can appreciate as a player with strong offense that actually wants to play the game. Probably 60-70% of my games, the player is fully committed to camping at an edge and attempted to reset said camp every time I close on them. Personally, I don't see how that is fun or rewarding. Like my goal is to go in and beat the f*** out of them in an absolutely humiliating fashion. but... it is what it is. The only way that QP will speed up is if the punish game was closer to melee
When I go into QP and try to be serious, it gets frustrating. When I go in just to goof off, or play random 2v2 QPs with a friend locally, I have a blast and play out of my mind. But if I try to switch over to tryhard mode with my tryhard characters, and I just get salty when there's lag and my rules get ignored for 20 games in a row.

I'll happily get destroyed all day in a random 2-man arena by someone lightyears better than me if I knew there'd be some stability in the connection and what kind of game I'd be playing every time.
 

Xquirtle

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When I go into QP and try to be serious, it gets frustrating. When I go in just to goof off, or play random 2v2 QPs with a friend locally, I have a blast and play out of my mind. But if I try to switch over to tryhard mode with my tryhard characters, and I just get salty when there's lag and my rules get ignored for 20 games in a row.

I'll happily get destroyed all day in a random 2-man arena by someone lightyears better than me if I knew there'd be some stability in the connection and what kind of game I'd be playing every time.
Yeah, QP is literally a joke, so taking it serious always has a bad ending. Especially with the damn nintendo GCCs costing like $100 now on Amazon.
 

Dabble Dot

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Is there some rule that we can't mention anthers ladder? Definately the way to go. I play for fun elite smash just will never happen to me. BUt if fun is what i want items is what I don't . It literally nintendonts the hells out of me.
 

Sean²

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Is there some rule that we can't mention anthers ladder? Definately the way to go. I play for fun elite smash just will never happen to me. BUt if fun is what i want items is what I don't . It literally nintendonts the hells out of me.
No but Anther's is kinda dead now. A lot of people chatting but very little actually looking for a match.
 

Silask20

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You can't just assume everyone is a super serious competitive player, if I enjoy playing a 20:00 minute match on PAC-LAND with Items on, then why shouldn't I be allowed to play this way? Nintendo has given me the option and it's how I enjoy playing the game.
Then by all means play your way but play your way with others who want to play the same way. If you have to wait 1 hour for a lobby then clearly your way of playing is in very low demand and should not he forced on the majority
 

Lamperouge

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Nah...

It's their game and they're allowed to play however they want. Doesn't mean I'm sticking around after one match with a ruleset like that, though.
 
D

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Then by all means play your way but play your way with others who want to play the same way. If you have to wait 1 hour for a lobby then clearly your way of playing is in very low demand and should not he forced on the majority
Then it's not the players fault, it's the systems fault, and as such the player should not be blamed.
 

Silask20

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Then it's not the players fault, it's the systems fault, and as such the player should not be blamed.
Personally I dont blame the player at all for this. I blame players for camping and spamming something cheesey but above all else for stalling.

I blame the devs for this horrid design that matches us into rounds we did not sign up for nor have fun in
 

GhostM

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No, I don’t think that a player with a ruleset of time with items on show poor sportsmanship. Some players out there are casual players instead of competitive players. Not everyone that plays Ultimate will play the game competitively like the pro players out there, and would rather just hop in the match and duke it out for fun instead of putting hours on end of practice to play the game. Some of these casuals are complete beginners at the game, and some who are better than the average players, but aren’t competitive players.

Because there are no modes separating the casual and competitive players like Smash 4 did, they are slapped together. I feel like Nintendo couldn’t grasp how people were going to play the game because of the amount of options available, and instead left it for the players to decide, only for a system to match players based on preferred rule choice. It’s definitely not perfect, as I am sometimes paired up with casual players with casual rulesets, but will still play the game out for GSP. I honestly feel bad for casual players out there who are force matched into a competitive environment when they only want to play for fun. GSP is also another bad factor for them, since casual players wouldn’t want to to be ranked, and the higher ranks will get more competitive, which they don’t want.
 
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Zawaz132

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Is it just me, or is everyone's quickplay preferred rules set to 5 minutes, final destination?
I have 7 minutes, battlefield, personally, and wouldn't mind having more stages, but since you can't actually choose, I stick with BF to stay the most well rounded.

But 2/3 games I play are on FD. My preferred rules don't matter apparently. And the 1/3 people I rematch with, end up on FD anyways! Which means even when I get my stage, I'm still paired with people who want FD. (often times with 3 minutes, 2 stocks, and campy projectile uses all around.)
Am I missing something? Why is nobody wanting BF online?

I'm not trying to rant/vent. But I've become seriously confused why it's so popular.
 

GhostM

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Yeah the online system is wacky and it won’t always match you up based upon your preferred rules. Sometimes I’m thrown into games that have items enabled but I still play them out for GSP. I guess FD is popular since platforms in this game can be useful to string combos, but it also allows players who are zoners to camp with them. I assume that normal flat ground is chosen more often because it’s more open and punishes must be aggressive, where as in BF you can space out your attacks by utilizing the platforms to mixup your movements. I prefer both stages, but I can see why people would sometimes want flat stages only.
 
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link2702

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Mine is the opposite, I’m getting nothing but bf all the time and it’s annoying as hell. My playstyle and my character actually does better on fd imo. Yet I frequently get matched up with people who have bf as their stage. I literally got matched up 6 times in a row without getting my ruleset and only bf as the stage. It got annoying enough to the point where I just started deliberately either suiciding, or disconnecting that day if I got a match on bf. I of course got banned for it, which is ridiculous itself because of course people are gonna get frustrated when their rules aren’t getting picked multiple times in a row, especially when you tie a ranking setup to it.

Nintendo needs to update quick play to where it either more strictly searches for players with your exact rules(at least stage choice and items/no items) even if it means waiting longer to find a match, or they need to update it where quick play always cycles between each players rules each match, or something else.

Regardless it needs to stop this crap about screwing over one player by picking their opponents ruleset multiple times in a row. Yes, even if I’m the one getting mine picked constantly and benefiting me over my opponent.
 

J.I.L

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Mine is the opposite, I’m getting nothing but bf all the time and it’s annoying as hell. My playstyle and my character actually does better on fd imo. Yet I frequently get matched up with people who have bf as their stage. I literally got matched up 6 times in a row without getting my ruleset and only bf as the stage. It got annoying enough to the point where I just started deliberately either suiciding, or disconnecting that day if I got a match on bf. I of course got banned for it, which is ridiculous itself because of course people are gonna get frustrated when their rules aren’t getting picked multiple times in a row, especially when you tie a ranking setup to it.

Nintendo needs to update quick play to where it either more strictly searches for players with your exact rules(at least stage choice and items/no items) even if it means waiting longer to find a match, or they need to update it where quick play always cycles between each players rules each match, or something else.

Regardless it needs to stop this crap about screwing over one player by picking their opponents ruleset multiple times in a row. Yes, even if I’m the one getting mine picked constantly and benefiting me over my opponent.
100% facts. It’s because they put it on random of who get rulesets instead of making it by turns (so I get my ruleset, then you get yours). I mean, these people who worked on this game went out of there way to make the most infuriating online system for their players. I just ask... why? Why did you make this online system so terrible and why is the character roster so unbalanced? Why are certain characters OP and others just really bad? I just don’t get it.
 

Alicorn

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Is it just me, or is everyone's quickplay preferred rules set to 5 minutes, final destination?
I have 7 minutes, battlefield, personally, and wouldn't mind having more stages, but since you can't actually choose, I stick with BF to stay the most well rounded.

But 2/3 games I play are on FD. My preferred rules don't matter apparently. And the 1/3 people I rematch with, end up on FD anyways! Which means even when I get my stage, I'm still paired with people who want FD. (often times with 3 minutes, 2 stocks, and campy projectile uses all around.)
Am I missing something? Why is nobody wanting BF online?

I'm not trying to rant/vent. But I've become seriously confused why it's so popular.
I like FD because of For Glory. Omega stages make it easier to read your opponents movements. I hate Battlefield because the platforms screw with my combo strings and it forces you to approach because your opponent can just hide under a platform making it difficult to regain stage control. I believe people pick battlefield because they know people who played For Glory a lot aren't use to platforms like me. The platforms are another variable I have to think about so I just snarl whenever I fight on them.
 

Mental Surge

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I am so ****ing sick of battlefield. I HATE that map with a passion and it's practically the only map I ever get. If they are letting you choose maps you want why not let you choose a few maps you won't get like in a tournament setting? At least in elite 1v1s?
 

J.I.L

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I am so ****ing sick of battlefield. I HATE that map with a passion and it's practically the only map I ever get. If they are letting you choose maps you want why not let you choose a few maps you won't get like in a tournament setting? At least in elite 1v1s?
That’s 100% facts, majin buu. BattleField is A STUPID STAGE. And the whole preferred rule system is bad. “My rules shouldn’t be “preferred”. BUT GURANTEED.
 

Kuragari

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Joined
Mar 21, 2014
Messages
152
Yeah. Im sick of getting that stupid train map with the moving floor that should be no where near online.
I would rather have a longer queue time waiting for the rules I actually want (duos or singles, no items) than get stuffed into a match that's yet another FFA with items and smash gauges. If I wanted matches like that I would play locally with the mates. I think I get matches with the preferred rules maybe 25% of the time.

The only good thing I can say about the online is that the lag is a lot less frequent than it used to be.
 

SteadyDisciple

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Yeah. Im sick of getting that stupid train map with the moving floor that should be no where near online.
I would rather have a longer queue time waiting for the rules I actually want (duos or singles, no items) than get stuffed into a match that's yet another FFA with items and smash gauges. If I wanted matches like that I would play locally with the mates. I think I get matches with the preferred rules maybe 25% of the time.

The only good thing I can say about the online is that the lag is a lot less frequent than it used to be.
If you don't mind waiting longer to get your preferred rules, why not try the Arenas mode? Make an arena, select your ruleset for it, and play with those rules as much as you like. That's what I do at least.
 
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