Powershielding

[Bit-Bit]

I have an idea. Let's make it so that if you manage to input an attack command within 2 frames of your opponent inputting the same command, your opponent's attack will actually damage him/herself. I think this would be a great idea that adds depth to the game and can really be used well against people who let predictability creep into their fighting style. Who's with me?


Oh, don't make assumptions about how competitive or how demanding of myself I can be. I have put holes in walls over losing games. I fully appreciate the competitive aspects of these games, but that doesn't mean I have to dogmatically advocate depth for the sake of depth.

Are you ********? Marth says Hi! Just play as Marth then if you want to be able to do that. I believe the move is done with Down+B.

As for the argument of Powershielding, it adds a level of depth in the game that can be easily achieve if you practice enough. That's why people that pull this off easily is considered pros. I play as Link exclusively and my best friend plays as Samus. I use to just dodge his Fully Charge Power beam. Seeing as how it comes at you really effin fast, most people would just do what I use to do and jam into that shield button. However, as time went on, I accidentally discovered Powershielding one day while playing with him and has since then strive to do it almost everytime he uses his Charged Power Beam.

I can pull this off 7/10 times. With the first 4 or 5 times, he was not use to it and would get hit by his own Charge Beam and is sent flying. However, he's now ready for it and usually leaps into the air towards me after he shoots his beam. So there you go, just that simple situation has added a lot more layers of depth to Smash thanks to a simple move that can be executed if you would just stop whining and just play the game.

 

[Link he come to town...]

I agree with UndrDog, that would be a pretty **** cool addition. Everyone gets a counter, but a select few have a much better counter *ie roy and marth whos last long*, It's like the same as the power shield, everybody gets a reflector, some just have a much better reflector. I think the only advanced technique i could do without is the wavedashing, then again i main captain falcon so it's not like i really need it at all anyways, unlike ice climbers and luigi, or samus. On a side note i'm so happy moonwalking is back...

 

[Zek]

maxpower why the hell would you suggest removing a feature that's enjoyable for many players just so the AI won't use it? If they really wanted to they could just, you know, program the AI not to powershield.

 

[maxpower1227]

Are you ********? Marth says Hi! Just play as Marth then if you want to be able to do that. I believe the move is done with Down+B.

I think you misread what I typed.

 

[NRSm@sh]

PS is good. I think there should be no gripe with it. like Undr Dog, and Link said, its a good think so every1 can have a counter, and it brings more to the game as showing what dedication you have to playing it

 

[jupiter]

i love to powershield! It's almost like "Just Defending" from Capcom vs SNK 2 (originally from Fatal Fury: Mark of the Wolves), or like Parrying from Street Fighter III.

Parrying and Just Defending are things I've mastered from their respective games, and after figuring out what PowerShielding was several years back, I've practiced and practiced to get it down right.

It's fun to do, and really effective against characters like Falco who "short-hop-fast-fall-laser" towards you on Final Destination. Just PowerShield and that stops him in his tracks.

The timing is hard to do at first, but after a long while of practicing, it's pretty simple. There's a reasonable window time for powershielding. Anyone should be able to do it. Try it out in Melee!

 

[The Hypnotist]

It should be 2 oe 3 frames so people besides M2K can do it.

 

[shadowed_phoenix]

.

It should be 2 oe 3 frames so people besides M2K can do it.

Yeah, but if that happened, then it would be too easy and then there would be no need for reflector/cape/giant spinning crystal move.

 

[Undrdog]

...I can do it on a consistent basis. It's not just 1 frame. And if it is then I must be a lot better then I thought. lol But seriously it's just the time when the projectile is between your character and the proximity of your bubble shield.

 

[The Hypnotist]

Yeah, but if that happened, then it would be too easy and then there would be no need for reflector/cape/giant spinning crystal move.

2 Frames would still be pretty tough. SHLing is overpowered, if PSing was possible it would be better.

 

[Red Exodus]

If there was no PS Samus, Falco and anyone with a projectile that doesn't suck *** like G&W's would **** with no problem.

 

[2.72]

2 Frames would still be pretty tough. SHLing is overpowered, if PSing was possible it would be better.

Seeing that projectiles got an across-the-board nerf and it appears that no (or very few?) b moves cancel when you land, that argument is irrelevant to brawl.

 

[Undrdog]

Again I don't think it's that short of a time frame you guys...

 

[OnyxVulpine]

Do pros use it frequently? I can't see half of the things happening when I watch a match so I'm not sure. I never used it myself but I would like to when I get to play Brawl. I hope they keep it in but don't have the AI spam it like everyone says.

-Onyx

 

[Undrdog]

I don't see it used often. And I'm not entirely sure why. I use it whenever I can to be honest with ya.

 

[Kimosabae]

Because it truly isn't that easy, that's why. Some players have managed to get it down decently against predictable Falcos and Samuses, but Powershielding projectiles consistently in a tournament setting is a tricky concept. PWRSHDing attacks on the other hand....my guess is that no player offered a blueprint for its utility, so that generally went unexplored.

There's so much untreaded territory regarding Melee, at times I wish Brawl weren't coming out for another year.


-SynikaL

 

[jupiter]

it's not that easy, but it became easy for me. I can do it consistently. My smash buddies hate it when I PS their lasers and projectiles. Especially my Falco-playing buddy. He loves to short-hop-laser towards me, and I always tell him, "not a good idea to do that against me" but he does it anyway. PowerShielding does wonders against laser/projectile spammers. Especially if you can PowerShielding consistently.

 

[KosukeKGA]

after playing Yoshi for 3 days straight at E4A, I think Yoshi's random powershielding was removed.

For those that don't know, Yoshi's shield has a strange property to randomly powershield attacks while holding down the shield button. No timing or anything. I have no idea what causes it and apparently neither does the Yoshi SSBM forum here.


Also...


Your complaint is only still aimed toward CPUs, not players. The game is meant to be played with other people, not CPUs. Have you really tried designing a competent AI? It's harder than it looks.

Your complaint also completely disregards timing due to delayed or early shots/attacks being launched or just bad timing at said powershielding opponent.

Most likely a demo glitch.

 

[Nasanieru]

lol @ all those who think that powershield should be left out.
To me the ability to powershield is very important, as it can turn some characters' advantage around (eg>Falco's Blaster). I can consistently use this in matches, saying its too hard to do and that it should be easier is just you being too lazy to take the time to learn it yourself. Props to those dedicated to learning this underused tech. ^ ~

 

[Igneous42]

I hope to God it's been removed and replaced with better AI. It would be incredibly lame to see someone powershield something like Snake's Final Smash. It's a move that makes no sense and cheapens characters who actually have reflectors. If they want to discourage projectile spamming against CPUs, they need to program the CPUs to have an intelligent response to it: i.e., close the distance rather than standing back and power-shielding every other shot.

I can say with great confidence that you won't be able to sheild, much less powersheild ANY final smashes. The exception might be transforming characters, who's final smashes isn't actually one incredible attack. Even then though....

Power Sheilding will come back, in fact I wouldn't be surprised if it's easier then before. The only nerf that would make sense to me (which it already might do this in melee actually don't use it enough to know for sure) is things that are power sheilded shouldn't hit for as much as normal. Otherwise Pit and Fox's down B is almost useless especially with fox's shine being nerfed.

 

[PwnyRide]

maxpower seems to miss the point.

Powershielding adds depth to the game. The game is not all about facing CPUs all the time, and powershielding projectiles(the main use) isn't as twitch happy as you'd think.

spaceballs pretty much summed it up, though.

No, you're right, it isnt. It's about having FUN any way you want to in whichever way you want, and if that means playing against CPU's then so be it.

 

[Undrdog]

I hate to say this, but since we've see some FSes shielded, even though the shields were eaten through, I can see some FS attacks being PSed.

And the only way PS can be made easier is if the size of the shield becomes larger in relation to the body. THE ONLY WAY! Don't start suggesting it will simply "be easier". If it is it won't be intentionally, but by a byproduct of larger shields.

 

[Kimosabae]

UndrDog:

PWRSHDing ease also has a lot to do with the frame of the character -- i.e. slender Marth and Samus had an easier time PWRSHDing in Melee than Bowser. They could also increase the amount of active frames between your character and its shield that would produce a PWRSHD. Personally, I feel Parry and PWRSHD timing need to switched.

it's not that easy, but it became easy for me. I can do it consistently. My smash buddies hate it when I PS their lasers and projectiles. Especially my Falco-playing buddy. He loves to short-hop-laser towards me, and I always tell him, "not a good idea to do that against me" but he does it anyway. PowerShielding does wonders against laser/projectile spammers. Especially if you can PowerShielding consistently.

That's the thing. Many people are tricked into thinking they're good at PWRSHDing because they play with their inexperienced friends that don't know how to mix-up their projectile spam -- then they end up playing someone decent and realize they're no better at PWRSHDing than most.

You've already made a case-in-point: A newbie Falco that uses the traditional SHL approach to get inside. His lasers have a more predictable stream, so it's more akin to practicing PWRSHDing against a Lvl 9 cpu Falco that continuously walks towards you while shooting a laser every few steps.

I can assure you that most players can generally do it well (I'm confident enough in my own PWRSHDing to say that you're definitely not as good at it as I am since I'm a more experienced player and I know more about the system.). They simply realize how difficult it truly is to PWRSHD an experienced opponents projectiles in a serious match, so they choose to shift their focus elsewhere.

No, you're right, it isnt. It's about having FUN any way you want to in whichever way you want, and if that means playing against CPU's then so be it.

You'd actually be on to something if that was actually his argument. Nice try though. As it stands, he's just another casual bigot with no actual knowledge of the competitive scene or Melee itself, projecting his stupidness into cyberspace.


-SynikaL

 

[Undrdog]

Some characters it just isn't possible with. However I would hardly say it's difficult once you gain an understanding of how the move works.

 

[Kimosabae]

People just don't seem to understand me.

PSing generally is not difficult after a certain amount of practice. Doing it consistently against good opponents, in pressure situations, on a whim, is. There's a reason why you hardly see it employed -- it's not because it's easy to do. It's not because high-level players can't see the obvious benefits. It's not because players can't do it.

Let's use a little common sense.

-SynikaL

 

[Undrdog]

I don't buy that at all though. If I'm beginning to border this feat then many others that are better then me must've already surpassed this and decided to dismiss it. I simply believe that it just conflicts with most play-styles that are being implemented.

I know it's not too hard to use in competitive play against really good opponents. And I know that high-level players see the benefits.

 

[Kimosabae]

I don't buy that at all though. If I'm beginning to border this feat then many others that are better then me must've already surpassed this and decided to dismiss it.

Who do you play against?


-SynikaL

 

[courte]

man those first like five post after the op had me rofling, nice one guys!! just all around

 

[PK Starstorm]

Thank god it's still in. I got pretty good at it in melee.

 

[Undrdog]

Jasona mostly. I've often heard him referred to as a major pioneer in Samus' projectiles though I doubt he'd ever admit to it.

Apart from him I have been hanging low lately in anticipation for Brawl. The best competition was actually whatever I can find in Baltimore. Though I admit I really only get melee powershielding experience from them.

 

[Undrdog]

Jasona mostly. I've often heard him referred to as a major pioneer in Samus' projectiles though I doubt he'd ever admit to it.

Apart from him I have been hanging low lately in anticipation for Brawl. The best competition was actually whatever I can find in Baltimore. Though I admit I really only get melee powershielding experience from them.

 

[maxpower1227]

There's so much untreaded territory regarding Melee, at times I wish Brawl weren't coming out for another year.

NO
.