Power to The Princess: Peach Topics. This week: SECONDARIES

[Angrycuban]

Thy Cuban threw me off

If you don't understand the bbcode check Team Liquid

:ws: Angry :ws:

What?

 

[Angrycuban]

About the Peach shield pressure, what I've found is that after landing a float cancelled fair on an opponent's shield, they just proceed to grab me. I feel like I should have an upperhand, but I don't. Does anyone know if this is right? By the way, most of the time I have been grabbing after the fair, and their grab gets me before mine gets them.

fast fall after you float cancel and jab ilmmedeatly upon landing

Also sorry for double post

 

[JackDarkStone]

I'm sure others know this, but a float trick that carried over from brawl is, when on the ledge, you press the jump button so she does the ledge jump and then hold down while holding jump and the ledge jump animation is ignored and you just stay right above the edge floating. Not sure if I explained myself correctly. I say this because I've yet to see a single peach player do this and it's a pretty useful technique to use, since it helps her get back on the ledge, which was a problem for her on melee.

Edit: I forgot to mention, you can obviously attack out of it, I find Nair to be the best choice for this because of how good and fast the move is.

 

[Jam]

Thanks, that should be quite useful. In melee she didn't have the luxury of going down off the ledge and quickly double jumping onto the stage due to her slow double jump that has that dip at the beginning.

 

[JackDarkStone]

Yeah, the only issue with this though is that you need to keep in mind to save your float before getting to the ledge, because grabbing the ledge doesn't refresh it. What you can do to remedy this, in situations where ledge jump nai isn't an option, you can press the jump button twice and then do Nair, the result should be a double jump canceled nair that starts and ends right above the edge.

 

[TimeSmash]

About the Peach shield pressure, what I've found is that after landing a float cancelled fair on an opponent's shield, they just proceed to grab me. I feel like I should have an upperhand, but I don't. Does anyone know if this is right? By the way, most of the time I have been grabbing after the fair, and their grab gets me before mine gets them.

Some of this might also be due to controller port priority if you were both actually grabbing at the same time. The character with the higher controller port (P1>P2>P3>P4) will outprioritze your grab. However, like others said you should have frame advantage, and be able to do myriad things from that. Jabbing like AC said is nice because it's a really fast jab for both hits. So fast that you might be able to hit their shield a third time as a mixup/unxpected action

 

[Alakaslam]

What?

I am praising you in the way I know how

And with shame that I knew not who you were

 

[TimeSmash]

Changing this topic soon, to talk about something else. Any suggestions? If not the default topic will be about Fair

 

[JackDarkStone]

I've been messing around ways to use peach bomber effectively, haven't had much success except using it to surprise unexpecting players by hitting the ledge, which would hit them too due to the explosion. Oh and the occasional tech chase. That could be a topic, but I don't think there's much to say really.

 

[Darknut]

I've been messing around ways to use peach bomber effectively, haven't had much success except using it to surprise unexpecting players by hitting the ledge, which would hit them too due to the explosion. Oh and the occasional tech chase. That could be a topic, but I don't think there's much to say really.

I use it sometimes off the edge, to edgeguard. Risky though, if you miss your out below the ledge and the tables have turned completely. Umbrella can hit someone on the ledge but using it in that way can completely lose you an advantage you were holding.

 

[Alakaslam]

Changing this topic soon, to talk about something else. Any suggestions? If not the default topic will be about Fair

TURNIPS!!!!

Spoiler

I tend to try and put distance between my target and I- is this foolish?

... Or fair. Is this not pretty straight forward though?

Shff

@ Angrycuban moar xplain is in order from me

On team liquid . Net the bbcode :ws: puts a little worshiper in your post

 

[JackDarkStone]

Actually, yeah. Turnips is a way better subject.

 

[TopKek.GG]

As someone trying out Peach main, I learned a lot from this topic. I would love to see a discussion about Turnips. :D

 

[TimeSmash]

Yes let us all start talking about turnips!

First off, here are the Melee probabilities of Peach's turnips (hopefully Project M matches these)

 

[Alakaslam]

Seems about right to me

Now what do I do with it?

When do I pull it?

When do I throw it?

How do I throw it downward?

How do I do that bamcis thing where you throw one turnip so much at your target and catch it and throw it again and catch it again and it takes too long to say this? Basically do a throw combo?

 

[TimeSmash]

Having a turnip in neutral gives you a much better position than not having one. Mainly because the enemy has to focus on when you are going to throw it/ whatever you are going to do with it. I don't really ever pull near opponents, but sometimes it is thrown point blank at their face.

To throw a turnip you can hit A, or tilt forward and hit A for a decent throw, and Smash forward and press A, or hit the C Stick to throw it forward to throw it strongly. If you hit someone at point blank range, it does more damage, but it's still a great projectile overall.

Aerial glide toss is still a thing, so you can turnip throw both offensively and defensively at the same time. Offensively, it will [try] to hit your opponent and then you can either use the AGT to move closer or away from the enemy. Potentially, if you glide tossed upwards you could add a little to your vertical recovery. Intensely situation but still.

An aerial glide toss is when you airdodge right before you throw a turnip.

Also don't forget Z-dropping. Vidjo-dropping is still a thing in PM too.

Beam Sword is an AMAZING item to get, as it is a good projectile and has immense range in both tilted and Smash forms. I don't get it enough, so I'm not sure how to use it that well.

Mr. Saturn eats shields, and is easy to recatch when shielded, but will wander across the stage if left alone, so be careful of that.

Bob-ombs are freaking amazing, but can be reflected like any other projectile. I don't think you can airdodge to survive the explosion anymore if you're just holding it, but I don't remember.

 

[TopKek.GG]

Wow. Thanks for such an in depth reply TimeSmash.

Time to go into training mode and spend hours throwing vegetables.

 

[Alakaslam]

Wow. Thanks for such an in depth reply TimeSmash.

Time to go into training mode and spend hours throwing vegetables.

 

[TimeSmash]

So can you still airdodge the explosion when you have a Bob-omb?

Not for nothing, but Stitchface does take a huge hunk out of shields too. Not its primary use but worth knowing.

Z-dropping during fastfalled or float cancelled aerials is nice too

 

[Flash1Lucky]

I just recently decided to main Peach and I'm glad I did because she is really good, fun, and unique. I'm relatively new to pm but I'm getting comfortable with the game. I was wondering if there was anything you guys specifically did to get better at peach? Unless I have a friend over which is uncommon then I can only train with the CPU.

 

[JackDarkStone]

I'm by no means a good player really, but what I did to get better was firstly practice a lot of the tech skill for my character, then I watched a lot of tournaments. I still suck, I just now know a few tricks.

A basic technique that I don't see people use against tether characters is, you jump of the ledge, z drop it ( or down throw it if the opponent is close enough, up throw if he's far from the ledge), double jump backwards, quickly float and then just as quickly cancel the float so that you fall in front of the ledge. Basic stuff, but it's a good way to both edge guard and maintain the advantageous position on the stage.

 

[Alakaslam]

Beam Sword is an AMAZING item to get, as it is a good projectile and has immense range in both tilted and Smash forms. I don't get it enough, so I'm not sure how to use it that well.

So trying to be really turnip heavy in training mode I got this and decided to check it out.

The amazing Jedi skills of her tilt cause her to be almost completely surrounded by pure epic hitbox. Her smash is kind of slow by comparison and has less range than the animation would imply, but it still has impressive range.

The neutral jab is fast and potent, not sure if it would be useful against a person though

 

[Angrycuban]

beam sword is super nasty if you pull one. I love when im playing marths who just try and out space me and i pull a beam sword lol. On the topic of turnips though learn how to aieral glide toss & use it all the time cause its god like. AGT up can get you to the top platform on battlefield and dreamland MUCH quicker than her double jump can and it protects you by having a turnip up there. Very good approach if the opponent is a more mobile character like fox who can just camp you out on the top platform. AGT down is great because it allows you to mix up the angle you throw the turnip and the angle of your approach. Her forward and backward AGTs are mediocre but theyre still better than just throwing the tunip in the air normally most of the time. Grounded glide tossing is super god like with peach too. Glide toss forward, wait for the shield, and grab is extremely free. Glide toss forawrd and dash dance to bait something out then punish with dash attack is also amazing. Glide toss forward also puts you in a good position usually to run up and catch the turnip if hit the other players shield or face which is also a great option. Throwing the turnip from above onto someone or z-dropping is also a god like option, although the situation for it doesn't come up extremely often its good to use it when possible. Basically jump over someones shield and throw the turnip down at them then come down on the other side with an aieral or a grab. Or the classic float down air into z drop which is god like. One last thing is Floating with a turnip in hand is amazing if your confident in using float cancels, because you can hold a turnip and still have access to most of your best normals which is amazing. Float forward air while holding a turnip is too good for exerting general pressure and you can easily catch a roll by tossing the turnip their way and convert that into some serious damage. I this game more so than melee turinps are so extremely vital to your gameplay because there are so many good zoning options that peach needs a turnip to get in on characters like mewtwo ZSS and link etc.

Yeah, the only issue with this though is that you need to keep in mind to save your float before getting to the ledge, because grabbing the ledge doesn't refresh it. What you can do to remedy this, in situations where ledge jump nai isn't an option, you can press the jump button twice and then do Nair, the result should be a double jump canceled nair that starts and ends right above the edge.

I know this was from little bit ago but i just wanna say this option can work but i wouldnt recommend always going for it because you usually wont have any invincibility, peaches nair isn't exactly safe without a float cancel and it wastes your double jump so if you get stuffed your off stage without a double jump and unless your DI is good your probably dead. I'd recommend never going to the ledge unless you need it and if you do then use drop down Up B to stall and get up with either a regular get up or a full jump from the ledge with some invincibility. Peaches options from the ledge are abysmal without a float.

Also if the next topic is about Fair, im gonna be writting essays lmao cause that move is the truth

 

[Alakaslam]

beam sword is super nasty if you pull one. I love when im playing marths who just try and out space me and i pull a beam sword lol. On the topic of turnips though learn how to aieral glide toss & use it all the time cause its god like. AGT up can get you to the top platform on battlefield and dreamland MUCH quicker than her double jump can and it protects you by having a turnip up there. Very good approach if the opponent is a more mobile character like fox who can just camp you out on the top platform. AGT down is great because it allows you to mix up the angle you throw the turnip and the angle of your approach. Her forward and backward AGTs are mediocre but theyre still better than just throwing the tunip in the air normally most of the time. Grounded glide tossing is super god like with peach too. Glide toss forward, wait for the shield, and grab is extremely free. Glide toss forawrd and dash dance to bait something out then punish with dash attack is also amazing. Glide toss forward also puts you in a good position usually to run up and catch the turnip if hit the other players shield or face which is also a great option. Throwing the turnip from above onto someone or z-dropping is also a god like option, although the situation for it doesn't come up extremely often its good to use it when possible. Basically jump over someones shield and throw the turnip down at them then come down on the other side with an aieral or a grab. Or the classic float down air into z drop which is god like. One last thing is Floating with a turnip in hand is amazing if your confident in using float cancels, because you can hold a turnip and still have access to most of your best normals which is amazing. Float forward air while holding a turnip is too good for exerting general pressure and you can easily catch a roll by tossing the turnip their way and convert that into some serious damage. I this game more so than melee turinps are so extremely vital to your gameplay because there are so many good zoning options that peach needs a turnip to get in on characters like mewtwo ZSS and link etc.



I know this was from little bit ago but i just wanna say this option can work but i wouldnt recommend always going for it because you usually wont have any invincibility, peaches nair isn't exactly safe without a float cancel and it wastes your double jump so if you get stuffed your off stage without a double jump and unless your DI is good your probably dead. I'd recommend never going to the ledge unless you need it and if you do then use drop down Up B to stall and get up with either a regular get up or a full jump from the ledge with some invincibility. Peaches options from the ledge are abysmal without a float.

Also if the next topic is about Fair, im gonna be writting essays lmao cause that move is the truth

Wait I am not ready lol

So much necessary turnip learning

Hijole

But nonetheless I cannot wait to read thy essays

 

[Angrycuban]

One thing that i just wanted to say about turnip play in general is the importance of dash dancing after a turnip throw. Theres a lot of silly characters like link who can get a guaranteed conversion into a combo from a projectile, peach is not one of these characters. IF spaced properly you can combo turnip into fair but most of the time your going to want to throw the turnip and dash dance forward then react. If the other player preforms some sort of punishable counter measure (like ann attack) then, naturally you should move in and punish probably with dash attack or grab. If they shield you'll want to Fair their shield and start some shield pressure or scoop em up with the ole Z button. Spot dodges and rolls are also easily punished by dash attack grab, d-smash, nair etc. I see lots of new peach mains just toss turnips willy nilly and as soon as one hits they fly in with a reckless dash attack but the other player easily gets their shield up and punishes. All this is remedied by a simple dash dance grab :]

A basic technique that I don't see people use against tether characters is, you jump of the ledge, z drop it ( or down throw it if the opponent is close enough, up throw if he's far from the ledge), double jump backwards, quickly float and then just as quickly cancel the float so that you fall in front of the ledge. Basic stuff, but it's a good way to both edge guard and maintain the advantageous position on the stage.

this is such a good tech to cover options if you have the time to do it, takes a little preparation but its soooo good. You can drop the turnip and then grab ledge forcing them to take the turnip and you can back air them or they have to use their Up B back on stage (if they have one that isnt the tether). God like stuff right there. Works on Fire emblem characters too

 

[Babatunde]

Gawd it's been forever, (Sees all the new action in the Peach boards) We. In. There. :D

 

[Captain Zack]

I heard Turnips. Hi

 

[Angrycuban]

I heard Turnips. Hi

hello

 

[Captain Zack]

Just to throw out there, I haven't seen many Peaches on P:M that use her aerial glide toss very efficiently. It's great for mind games for instance, you can Up throw glide toss, grab the turnip, down throw glide toss, grab the turnip again, and then glide toss towards the opponent. You can also get basically a free recovery using it too.

 

[Alakaslam]

!!! I must not actually be glide tossing when I think I am

how far can one go?

 

[Angrycuban]

!!! I must not actually be glide tossing when I think I am

how far can one go?

her side ways aeiral glide tosses dont go very far but her up and down ones are amaazzzing (you can short hop then AGT to the top blatform on battlefield no problem). Her grounded ones are decent as well

 

[Babatunde]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUCchMCqWvs
sooooooo, (@ The Gannon and Peach team of course) can someone confirm who was carrying who for me?

 

[TimeSmash]

I think I'm doing the timing for AGTs wrong. Can someone inform me of how they perform it in layman's terms?

We'll probably switch topics sometime soon, but I am loving this turnip talk so maybe not haha. Thanks everyone fro contributing so far, especially @ Angrycuban . Puttin in work

 

[LordShade67]

If I may make a suggestion for the next topic, SECONDARIES! :D
You know, since let's be honest. Peach has her fair share of bad matchups and the like.

 

[TopKek.GG]

I think I'm doing the timing for AGTs wrong. Can someone inform me of how they perform it in layman's terms?

We'll probably switch topics sometime soon, but I am loving this turnip talk so maybe not haha. Thanks everyone fro contributing so far, especially @ Angrycuban . Puttin in work

it took me a long time to get vertical AGTs, and i still can't do it 100% of the time.

I feel that the timing for a proper AGT is similar to the wavedash timing. I use the C-Stick to throw and Z-button to air dodge.

It's hard to explain, but it seems that the C-Stick must reach its full tilt like a millisecond after the airdodge.

What I am having the most trouble with RE: AGT is how not to float instead of airdodging especially in recovery situations.

 

[Babatunde]

The timing dosen't seem that tight when i practice it, I luv it as a situational recovery option. You gotta make certain of two things in the situation though:
1) You are out of not only hitstun, but the tumbling animation as well, or else you'll end up just throwing the turnip up.

and 2) Make sure your float is exhausted or you may end up floating when trying to AGT up.

 

[Angrycuban]

If I may make a suggestion for the next topic, SECONDARIES! :D
You know, since let's be honest. Peach has her fair share of bad matchups and the like.

This is a point im very interested in, I dont think this is the place for it but it is very true that peach has a lot of bad match ups, i think everyone should pick their own secondaries if they need one though, instead of purposefully trying to pick one that covers the bad match ups. Personally I play a lot of Pit in PM so that I can keep my melee peach sharp but i dont think theres anything wrong with purely maining peach if your good enough.

 

[deadjames]

If I may make a suggestion for the next topic, SECONDARIES! :D
You know, since let's be honest. Peach has her fair share of bad matchups and the like.

Peach doesn't have any MUs bad enough to warrant a character switch imo.

 

[TimeSmash]

I play all girls haha, but primarily main Peach and Zelda, seconding Ivy and ZSS. They all play differently enough I have my bases covered for the most part, though I still have problems against spacies.

Zelda isn't really that similar to Peach, but both of them have short wavedashes, Nairs in which they spin (although Zelda's is multihit), Neutral B's that work great as a surprise counter (Zelda's isn't technically, but is crazy fast in this build during startup, and but has a lot of endlag). Zelda also has decent horizontal recovery , and captializes on punishing people's mistakes, often using Din's to make an opening. Peach can use turnips to create an opening, but they're not too similar in that regard haha. Both Peach and Zelda have a kill throw, and powerful Fairs.

 

[deadjames]

I play all girls haha, but primarily main Peach and Zelda, seconding Ivy and ZSS. They all play differently enough I have my bases covered for the most part, though I still have problems against spacies.

Everyone in the game has problems against spacies lol.