Post your Tourney rules here!

[Nausicaa]

For a stage ELIMINATION list.
Stage 'selection' implies selecting. All current methods are about striking from a pre-selected list. That's not selection at all!

A selection phase before other phases is increasingly beneficial as the quantity of viable stages increases.

Sudden Death... play the match over again. It's a tie... leave it that way and go again! lol
Who cares if it takes longer, it's more entertainment, and it's not like it happens that often.

 

[leelue]

My rules
Yoshis, DL64 and FD are not starters.
Do whatever the hell you want after that.


EDIT
That last stagelist wasn't so bad to me. I'd swap the yoshis for skyworld (I think skyworld is great and not ballout stupid like yoshis)

EDIT2
At bubbakings last tournament, apparently, if you ban a stage you can't go there on your own. For the set. So, if bubbaking posts in this thread, ignore him.
At least, I think that's what was said.

 

[Kink-Link5]

It makes sense, depending on when bans take place. If bans happen before strikes, it would make clear sense that you couldn't safelock those stages for yourself, but if its bans after game 1 it's more that a little silly. But it's bubba louie so who knows what criteria things fall under.

 

[Zolom]

Here is my entire ruleset used for each tourney. This includes rules for Melee, Brawl, and Project: M. The stage list is for P:M only, however. I, personally, feel the game decides the winner, regardless of double suicides. If the game ends in a draw, it is taken to sudden death. Bowser is at 300%, 1 stock, enemy at 0%, 1 stock. It would be in Bowser's best interests to double suicide and take the game into Sudden Death, but doesn't earn a win, but that is just my opinion. Sorry for the weird spacing, it is listed that way on my Word Doc to keep it looking organized. Feel free to use this ruleset, with whatever modifications you wish, as your own.

Tournament Ruleset​

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General Rules:
· Sets between players are played best 2 out of 3 matches (using 3 out of 5 for semi-final sets, 4 out of 7 for single elimination finals, and 2 sets of 3 out of 5 for double elimination finals).
· Single Elimination for tournaments at or under 20 players. Double Elimination with a losers bracket when over 20 players. Subject to change upon tournament organizer’s final decision.
· Double elimination finals are 2 sets of best 3 out of 5 matches, the finalist from the winners bracket needs only win 1 set, while the finalist from the losers bracket must win both sets.
· Each match is played with timed stock. 4 stock, 8 minutes (3 stock, 8 minutes for Brawl).
1 vs 1: In the case that time runs out and both characters have an equal amount of lives, the character with less damage wins the match. If both characters have equal lives and damage, a tiebreaker will determine the winner. (For doubles matches refer to “doubles”).
· Items are turned off.
· The first match is played with a Neutral/Starter stage after the stage striking procedure has been completed.
· Players/teams always reserve the option to force a double-blind pick for the first match character select.
· The loser/losing team can pick either a neutral/starter stage or a counterpick stage.
· The loser/losing team cannot pick any banned stages.
· As with the first match, players/teams can strike 1 stage from the opponent's selection.
· Stalling techniques are banned.
· Dave’s Stupid Rule [Modified]: No player/team may choose the last stage they previously won on unless the other player/team agrees.
· Pausing, whether intentional or accidental, results in a restart of the match if the other player so wishes. It is important to note that players reserve a sense of decency when playing upon this rule. *Pausing is disabled altogether (Project: M).
· Controller ports are determined by Rock-Paper-Scissors if there is a dispute.
· All people are responsible for their own control scheme/name tag and must make sure it is set before the match begins. Both players/teams must agree to restart a match on account of a controller problem.
· Any action that prevents the game from continuing results in a forfeiture of the match for the offender.
· Some interactions (for example, interrupting a throw with a wind attack) can cause one character to become frozen until being hit. If this happens, the free character is expected to capitalize on this in a timely manner; a failure to do so is considered stalling.
· As a general rule, whoever the game deems the winner is the undisputed winner, regardless of any “Double Knockouts”. If the game ends in a draw, regardless of who initiated the “draw” attack, the game is taken to a Tie-Breaker.



Set Format:

1. A coin toss determines who gets to choose their controller port first.
2. Both players/teams choose their characters (as well as their sub-character [name] and costume) for the first game.
3. Players/teams start the stage striking procedure in order to select the first stage, starting with the player of the lowest port number (1 being lowest; 4 being highest). 1-2-2-1 (Melee) or 1-2-2-1-1-2 (Project: M)
4. The winner of the previous game picks their character.
5. The loser of the previous game picks their character.
6. The winner of the previous match bans a single stage from each tier and the neutral/starter stages.
7. Loser of the last match Counterpicks 2 stages. By Counterpicking 2 stages, Dave’s Stupid Rule [Modified] does not apply to the previous winner, but does for the loser.
8. Winner of the last match selects 1 of the 2 stages.
9. Steps 4-9 are repeated for each following match until the set is complete.



Doubles (Teams):

· Team attack is on.
· Sharing stocks is allowed.
· Controller ports are determined in a 1221 fashion, with 1 being the team that won the coin toss.
· If there is a dispute among team colors, it is decided by a Coin Toss.
· If the clock expires and the total number of stocks of each team is equal, use the sum of the final percentage of players on each team as the tiebreaker; whichever team has a lower sum wins. (A player who has been eliminated has 0 stocks and 0%). In the event of a same stock, same percentage match, a tiebreaker determines the winning team.
· Causing both characters of a team to become frozen (i.e. by interrupting a throw with a wind attack) is to be treated the same way as freezing the opponent in singles. Leaving only one of the opponents' characters frozen is legal since the teammate can work to undo the freeze.
· The Colorblind Rule can be enforced by any player.

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Terms and Definitions​

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· Banned Stage -A banned stage is any stage that is not allowed either in the initial random select or by choice in game two (and three and four [i.e. Temple]).
· Coin Toss – Tossing of coin to determine winner of certain events, the coin cannot be tossed by any player of the game at play.
· The Colorblind Rule -It may be requested that certain characters be assigned a specific team color in order to prevent any unnecessary confusion. For instance, Sonic, Lucario, or Falco may be requested to be assigned the blue team.
· Counterpick Stage - A Counterpick stage is any stage that can be chosen by a player in games two and three (or any subsequent games). These include all of the neutral stages, but exclude all banned stages. Therefore, all Neutral/Starter stages are Counterpick stages, but not all Counterpick stages are Neutral/Starter. For example, Pokemon Stadium 1 is a Counterpick stage that is not a Neutral stage.
· Double-Blind Pick -For the first game both/all players pick their characters at the same time, as to ensure all players don’t know what characters everyone will choose.
· Double Elimination - A tournament style in which 2 match losses results in being completely out of the remainder of the tournament. Usually associated with a losers bracket.
· Double Knockouts -An occasion where both/all players die simultaneously.
· Neutral/Starter Stage - A neutral/starter stage is any stage allowed in the initial select for the first game of a match (i.e. Battlefield).
· Single Elimination - A tournament style in which 1 match loss results in being completely out of the remainder of the tournament.
· Stage Striking -The procedure to pick the first stage in a match.
· Stalling Techniques -Any action that deliberately avoids all fighting conflict to make the game unplayable. It involves the player using a move or technique to waste time, usually done in time matches or timed stock matches.
· Tiebreaker -Tiebreaker matches are 1 stock, 3 minute matches played on the same stage with the same characters.

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Stage List:​

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*Neutral/Starter Stages:

· Battlefield
· Dreamland
· Final Destination
· Fountain of Dreams
· Pokemon Stadium 2
· Smashville
· Yoshi’s Story

*Counterpick/Available Stages:
Tier 1:
· Dracula’s Castle
· Green Hill Zone
· Metal Cavern
· Skyworld
· WarioWare Inc.
· Yoshi’s Island

Tier 2:
· Hyrule Castle
· Kongo Jungle
· Norfair
· Pokemon Stadium 1
· Rumble Falls
· Skyloft











Tier 3:
· Castle Siege
· Delfino Plaza
· Halberd
· Lylat Cruise
· SSE: Jungle



*Banned Stages:
· Big Blue
· Brinstar
· Mario Circuit
· Corneria
· Flat Zone 2
· Fourside
· Frigate Orpheon
· Jungle Japes
· Onett
· Pictochat
· Pirate Ship
· Port Town Aero Dive
· Rainbow Cruise
· Saffron City
· Shadow Moses Island
· Summit
· Temple

Doubles
- Remove Metal Cavern, Green Hill Zone, and Yoshi's Story from available/neutral stages.
- SSE: Jungle is moved as a starter/neutral stage.

The majority of these rules were taken from the Tournament Legal (SSBM) and Tournament Legal (SSBB) Smashwiki as derived from the Smash World Forums. Version: Zolom 1.5.0 [5/5/2013]


[EDIT]: Made several revisions, updates, and clarifications to the overall ruleset. Some inspired by others here!

 

[leelue]

· Dave’s Stupid Rule [Modified]: No player/team may choose the last stage they previously won on unless the other player/team agrees.
It's 2013 and we have like 15 good stages. This isn't melee where if you couldn't go back in a Bo5 you had a problem. There's no reason to do this anymore.

· As a general rule, whoever the game deems the winner is the undisputed winner, regardless of any “Double Knockouts”. If the game ends in a draw, regardless of who initiated the “draw” attack, the game is taken to a Tie-Breaker.
You don't play ganon, do you...

Starter
· Yoshi’s Story!
Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

rage

 

[Zolom]

rage

It's 2013 and we have like 15 good stages. This isn't melee where if you couldn't go back in a Bo5 you had a problem. There's no reason to do this anymore.
Dave’s Stupid Rule [Modified] remains in play regardless of the year and mass number of stages. There are 2 reasons for this. 1: This ruleset is not just for P:M, but for Melee and Brawl (though I'll probably never host a Brawl tourney) as well. 2: I would like to see people play on more stages since we have "like 15 good stages." No reason in my mind why people should be returning to the same stage they won on just because they won, lets get some variance in there. There is no reason not to do this anymore.

You don't play ganon, do you...
No, I do not play Ganon. It might be naive to ask, but what are you going for here?

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
What? I don't even...

 

[The_NZA]

The game decides that ganon ties at best or loses at worst when he forward b's you off the edge. Most of hte agreement in this topic is that the win should be awarded to ganon.

 

[Zolom]

The game decides that ganon ties at best or loses at worst when he forward b's you off the edge. Most of hte agreement in this topic is that the win should be awarded to ganon.

I don't agree that he should lose, as its a "chance" that he either ties or loses. I dont like the idea of chance or luck in this game. However, I wouldnt give him a win either. Id say take it to a tiebreaker. Other characters have suicides or fancy way of finishing people before plummeting to death, its just a matter of who dies first. If a DK grabs someone and jumps off the edge, but the enemy releases before the floor and DK dies first, should he win? If a Wolf side-b's an enemy off stage, and dies first under the stage, while his enemy didnt die to the side-wall initially, but will die to the floor as well since he cant make the recovery, does Wolf win too? Its all the same thing, except Ganon's move ties the two players deaths closer together. The move is implemented as it is for a reason, that reason I'm sure the Devs has discussed or will address in the future. As it currently stands, it is meant to be this way, so that is how I choose to regulate my rules. I am no game balance developer, and judging by how well the devs are doing now, I trust they will do right by this game. If they changed it to a Ganon insta-win, then I will accept it, as I'm sure they have their good reasons for doing so. Ganon shouldnt lose the match, but he also shouldnt win. Take it to a tie-breaker (1-stock match, same characters, same level).

Keep in consideration, this is all just my opinion. I dont believe anything anyone says here as fact of being true or false, including me, its all just speculation.

I do thank you both for pointing that out, that scenario wasnt what I had imagined when I said "double knockouts," what I was referring to was the examples I gave, i.e DK grab jump, a super low falcon punch off-ledge that somehow ended in falcons death first, two players smashing each other one stage in which both die almost simultaneously, yet one just before the other, stuff like that. Whatever the case, I'll definitely have to re-word the rules for those special scenarios. =)

 

[Arcalyth]

If a DK grabs someone and jumps off the edge, but the enemy releases before the floor and DK dies first, should he win? If a Wolf side-b's an enemy off stage, and dies first under the stage, while his enemy didnt die to the side-wall initially, but will die to the floor as well since he cant make the recovery, does Wolf win too? Its all the same thing.

The answer to both of those questions is "no." They're not the same thing, because Ganon's grab is a guaranteed death. DK's cargo hold, DDD's swallowcide, etc aren't. It's also appallingly obvious when your opponent breaks out of the throw. In that situation, the only question that needs to be asked is "did the opponent break out?" and if the answer is yes then the win goes to the opponent because they successfully beat the suicide move. Your hypothetical situation with Wolf is analogous to someone scoring a Star KO but dying before the Star KO animation finishes. In that case, the person who scored the KO loses because they died first. They didn't safely kill... SDs still count.

 

[Zolom]

The answer to both of those questions is "no." They're not the same thing, because Ganon's grab is a guaranteed death. DK's cargo hold, DDD's swallowcide, etc aren't.

I see where you are coming from, and I now completely agree. In those hypothetical scenarios, I was referring to the inescapable, right on the ledge, right off the ledge kind of suicide, where the kill is guaranteed, no matter how good a characters recovery is. In my mind, a properly executed guaranteed suicide kill, and Ganon's suicide kill were the same, but I suppose that simply isnt entirely the case. However, my other reasoning still stands in my mind as good enough to not hand the win over so quickly. Again, if the devs change it, so be it. But they havent, and as far as I can tell, it is supposed to end the game in either a draw or a loss. Since neither can be absolute at the moment, I leave it to a tie.

 

[The_NZA]

BUMPING this thread.

I want to hear about stagelists for Low Tier City and other bigger name tournaments.

Also, can we do polls on smashboards? I wanted to poll to see if people think the following are neutrals, counterpicks or bans.

Norfair
Castle Seige
Halberd
Skyworld
Metal Caverns
SSE Jungle

 

[Paradoxium]

No items, Fox only, Final Destination.

 

[Scythe]

I don't agree that he should lose, as its a "chance" that he either ties or loses. I dont like the idea of chance or luck in this game. However, I wouldnt give him a win either. I)

It's not a chance bro, it's based on port priority, ganon should get the win.

 

[Zolom]

It's not a chance bro, it's based on port priority, ganon should get the win.

Its been a while, but I now understand. I didnt take into account of priority. With that in mind, I still would set it to sudden death. Until the day that the PMBR gives Ganon the undisputed win, I see it as a "draw", requiring a sudden death match to take place. I'm now thinking of Meta Knight's down air. He takes his opponent down with him (as long as there is decent % and taking into consideration proper DI) yet he always is the first KO, unless the opponent DI's down... I honestly dont know what happens with that stupid decision. I consider that a loss. If you want an easy down air final stock gimp as MK, youre gonna need 2 stocks to win, because you will die first. Im not assuming this is intentional, nor with Ganon, but the game currently is as it is. That said, I still stand by what I believe. Ganon doesnt get to win, though, taking into what I mentioned with MK, I'm not sure if he should lose either. The question really is should a gimp ability be able to take precedence over who really dies first? Who should decide? Is Ganon's gimp a loss or win? Is MK's gimp a loss or win? They are both relatively similiar, are they not the same thing?

As it stands, it will probably be a TO decision at their respective tournaments, but I would like to see a community consensus on the matter in the future, as PM seems to have more of these issues than Melee.

 

[MonkUnit]

As far as I know, most, if not all tournament rulesets have the KO awarded to whoever did the suicide KO. e.g., Ganon drags someone down and the Ganon player gets the KO regardless of what the game shows.

 

[The_NZA]

Inspired by InternetExplorer's stagelist, I propose this stagelist (which I'm now using in my rootfest ruleset)

Spoiler

Project: M Stages
Starter
- Battlefield
- Final Destination
- WarioWare
- Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
- Green Hill Zone
- Pokemon Stadium 2
- Smashville

Counterpick
- Dracula's Castle
- Fountain of Dreams
- Yoshi's Story
- Halberd
- Metal Cavern
- Pokemon Stadium 1
- Dreamland
- Rumble Falls
- Skyloft
- Skyworld
- Norfair

Doubles
- Remove WarioWare, Metal Cavern, Fountain of Dreams, and Yoshi's Story from available stages.
- Add Kongo Jungle 64 and SSE: Jungle.
- SSE: Jungle replaces WarioWare as a starter.

Playing a Set
1. Best of one Rock Paper Scissors for port priority if requested.
2. Double Blind character selection if requested.
3. Highest port priority strikes first.
4. Strike order: 1-2-2-1 (Melee) or 1-2-2-1-1-2 (Project: M)
[Play Game]
5. Winner bans 1 (Melee) or 4 (Project: M) stages. Bans apply for only one game.
6. Winner selects character.
7. Loser selects character and stage.
8. Repeat steps 5-8 until set is complete.

Thoughts?

I actually really like this stage list. Except for DK 64...not sure how i feel about it.

 

[trash?]

SIMPLE-AS-BALLS STAGELIST:
starters are PS2, smashville and battlefield (mayyyybe lylat cruise so we can do a more proper 1-2-2 stage striking). everything else is a counterpick using standard CP procedure.

this sits neutral as proper-as-hell Neutral stages with a capital N, but you still get stages like FD to work with if you feel like (FD is mostly good as a CP and iunno why people still think it's a good starter). you get huge choice in the long run, but you're still starting off without obvious matchup-bending advantages/disadvantages

 

[The_NZA]

SIMPLE-AS-BALLS STAGELIST:
starters are PS2, smashville and battlefield (mayyyybe lylat cruise so we can do a more proper 1-2-2 stage striking). everything else is a counterpick using standard CP procedure.

this sits neutral as proper-as-hell Neutral stages with a capital N, but you still get stages like FD to work with if you feel like (FD is mostly good as a CP and iunno why people still think it's a good starter). you get huge choice in the long run, but you're still starting off without obvious matchup-bending advantages/disadvantages

I don't really know why people think battlefield is more balanced than FD. In some matchups, platforms are a huge advantage to one side. Link v. Ness for instance, platforms are pretty good for Link. I think FD is just as far as battlefield because of this discrepancy.

 

[trash?]

...not really, no. unless you're trying to tell me that comes close to ganon v. anyone who hates platforms on FD

 

[The_NZA]

...not really, no. unless you're trying to tell me that comes close to ganon v. anyone who hates platforms on FD

Sorry, can you respost this. I'm not really following.

 

[trash?]

there's a match between kage and a lucario player back in 2.1 that comes to mind when I think of FD

ganon, a character that absolutely needs platforms to have any mobility, vs lucario, a character that can thrive off of the lack of platforms to his absolute advantage

I can't think of a worse stage-specific MU than that. FD is one of the most polarizing stages out there, and the only reason it was used so widely was because of a beginner's mentality of "well it's just a single flat stage, meaning it's the purest stage of all!" when melee first started, a mentality that didn't take into account that matchups get mighty odd when you remove the platforms from a platformer-fighter hybrid

 

[Minor Pandemic]

Sorry, can you respost this. I'm not really following.

I think what he's saying is that, while Link may have an advantage over news of BF, that (dis)advantage is nowhere near as large as the disadvantage a character like Ganon suffers against projectile campers on FD, making FD an overall less balances stage.

Edit: he beat me to it. Ah well

 

[The_NZA]

Isn't that what the stage striking process is supposed to support? No map is generically neutral in all matchups––every stage is different for every matchup. By having FD within the starter list, you give a viable option for certain matchups that aren't as platform sensitive, while giving ganon players the option to strike it.

 

[Wrestlemania]

I have been using InternetExplorer's Counter Pick method and it works amazing.
Winner bans 3
Loser Picks 2 he wants to go to
Winner picks 1 of those.
3-2-1
I agree that Battlefield, Smashville, and PS2 are the most neutral of stages, but I would never reduce it down to only 3 neutrals especially with how striking works. Although if you have a new person to stage striking it is easy mode to say pick between those 3.

 

[The_NZA]

I have been using InternetExplorer's Counter Pick method and it works amazing.
Winner bans 3
Loser Picks 2 he wants to go to
Winner picks 1 of those.
3-2-1
I agree that Battlefield, Smashville, and PS2 are the most neutral of stages, but I would never reduce it down to only 3 neutrals especially with how striking works. Although if you have a new person to stage striking it is easy mode to say pick between those 3.

Thats the counterpick method? I like it.

 

[The_NZA]

I hold Project M monthlies and this is our starter stage list:

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium 2
Skyloft
Green Hill Zone
WarioWare

My philosophy is this: Some characters have sheer advantage on the three-platform layout, and adding many of them to the starters makes it really easy to strike to one of them. Instead, offer a variety of different stage sizes and layouts and let the players strike the ones they don't like. You'll wind up on a stage you're both comfortable with.

This list covers:
No platforms
One platform
Two platforms
Three platforms
Four platforms
Small size
Medium size
Large size
Vertically-oriented stage
Terrained stage

This gives players a MUCH wider selection on the type of stage, and they can still strike all the layouts they don't like. Everyone at my tournaments has been happy with this so far.

I've been looking at this stagelist a lot, and one thing about it that I see as a flaw is that 5 of the stages have low ceilings (GHZ, WW, SL, PS2, Smashville). Maybe, now that we have a perfectly workable Lylat, having that in the mix is a good idea. I think if I had to replace one, it would be Skyloft, GHZ, or WW. Maybe WW or GHZ since they serve very similar functions. I'd probably take out GHZ.

 

[Scythe]

you just stumbled upon the dirty secret about PM Stages. Low ceilings pretty much everywhere except for some old melee stages.

 

[trash?]

lylat cruise is my fav new stage + is also a better starter than most of the starter stages. functions less like a BF, and more like a PS2 with an extra platform.

take out tiny green FD with extremely-situational single platform, add lylat cruise, problem solved

 

[The_NZA]

Here are J Ceaser's rules:

I was curious about two things.
1. Why is Dracula's castle not allowed in singles or doubles?
2. Why is Skyworld legal in singles (it seems to be relatively unpopular)?
3. Why is Jungle Japes not allowed in doubles?

If I could change anything about this list, I would:
Replace Skyworld in Singles and Doubles with Dracula's Castle
Replace Pokemon Stadium 1 in Doubles with Jungle Japes



Stagelist:
For the 1st match, stage strike the starter list in 1-2-2-1 fashion. After each match, the winner of the previous match bans 3 stages (Players may counterpick a stage that they previously banned in the set, but may not counterpick a stage on which they won). The player who lost the previous match chooses a stage, then the player who won chooses their character, then the player who lost chooses their character.

Starters:
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium 2
Dreamland (64)
Fountain of Dreams
Yoshi's Story (Melee) (singles only)
SSE: Jungle (doubles only)

Counterpicks:
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Pokemon Stadium 2
Dreamland (64)
Fountain of Dreams
Yoshi's Story (Melee) (singles only)
SSE: Jungle (doubles only)
Yoshi’s Island (Brawl)
Pokemon Stadium 1
Lylat Cruise
Wario Ware
Green Hill Zone
Skyloft
Skyworld