Possibilities of Competitive Play with the Nintendo Switch

[Lozjam]

Why hello, it sure has been a long time since I posted here.

I have been around, and I'm still playing Smash to this day. I have gotten back with my universities competitive smash scene. I notice we have an underlying issue though. We are always extremely low on set ups. Whenever custom moves are used, it takes an extremely long time to set up. It is even often times confusing.

Enter the Nintendo Switch.
The Nintendo Switch itself lends itself perfectly for competitive play for Smash 4.

The Nintendo Switch as a console, allows for many possibilities that were otherwise hindered by traditional set ups of the Wii U. First of which, is that, TV's are not necessary for high level play. Now, of course, in your big tournaments that are going to be streamed, TVs will be used for everything, and they obviously have no shortage. However, for smaller scale tournaments, many TO's may not even need to worry about TV's. The Switch provides a 60fps, HD screen right for use with the kickstand. Many players will just need to bring their Switch, and they will be easily be able to take their controller. And go. Matches will be quick and easy to set up, and no one will actually have to worry about their console getting ruined during a tournament, since everyone will have their own console.

Even disregarding that, and for tournaments that will only use TV's. The Switch still provides many conveniences and mechanics that the Wii U could not provide. Whenever a match is starting, traditionally, players need to stop and make a player tag, change the controls, change their setup, ect. Now, this is no longer the case. People will be able to just bring their console, that has their custom control setup, their name already on it, and just slip it into the Nintendo Switch dock. This may seem like it may not take much time, but that extra minute saved from not having to deal with any preferences will stack up, especially in larger tournaments. It could even be possible that this can save a whole half hour within large scale tournaments. Also, the Nintendo Switch will make friendlies and training extremely easy between matches. We will no longer have to worry about having TV's set for friendlies and training as well. Players can simply use their Nintendo Switch. We have seen this to some extent with Smash 3DS, however that is a far inferior version of the game, with not a very good controller and other performance issues.

One other huge benefit for TO's as well, is that they no longer need to worry about unlocking characters in every single console, and they do not need to make sure that every single console has bought all of the DLC characters. With the Nintendo Switch, players only need to bring their version of the game with the Switch. They can have whatever characters they feel like unlocked, and they won't even have to have to buy the DLC characters. This provides many opportunities for set ups, even if somebody is financially strained.

Speaking of characters however, let's talk about something that frankly, failed with Smash 4. Custom moves. Custom moves in the competitive Smash scene are very poorly utilized, partly because of balance, but more importantly because of inconvenience. With the Wii U version of the game, there was not an efficient way of unlocking custom moves, and the sheer dumb luck of it makes it nearly impossible to have all custom moves unlocked. Not only that, but setting the custom moves to the character also wastes a lot of time. The 3DS trick of supplying custom moves to the Wii U version of the game also equally is inconvenient. However, with Nintendo Switch, custom moves will be a lot easier to maintain. Players need only the custom move sets they want on their characters. This is already set up before each and every match, making custom moves very quick and efficient, with no set up on the TO's part. With the Nintendo Switch, perhaps the community can reconsider its place in the competitive scene, especially if there are tweaks to the balance of custom moves.

Overall, I think the Nintendo Switch is looking very good for the competitive scene of Smash 4. A Smash 4 port/remaster is almost certainly coming to the switch, especially since Emily Roger's had sources it was happening(she has gotten everything right about the Swith so far). I do think there could potentially be problems though.

First, is whether we can use GameCube controllers, or whether the community is ready to move on the Switch Pro Controllers.

The Switch may be a big investment for competitive players, and it may be hard to decide whether to have Wii U, or Switch tournaments.

Finally, is whether or not the community will accept the switch as their main Smash machine.


However, what do you guys think? Do you guys see the potential that the Switch has for Smash 4? Would you guys consider getting the Switch for this purpose?

 

[Big-Cat]

As a broad man, hunching up on that screen is going to be hard as hell with another person, even if said person is a child. The arguments you're making for the Switch is the same things the WiiU should've provided but it did not. You're not accounting also for the possible input delays or, worse, framerate reductions on the Switch monitor.

 

[Lozjam]

As a broad man, hunching up on that screen is going to be hard as hell with another person, even if said person is a child. The arguments you're making for the Switch is the same things the WiiU should've provided but it did not. You're not accounting also for the possible input delays or, worse, framerate reductions on the Switch monitor.

No no no. 2 people playing on one screen is not going to happen. Each person will be able to have their own screen for a set with the Nintendo Switch.
It will look a lot like this(obviously with Smash instead of Splatoon):

But with Smash instead of Splatoon.
As for input delays, I do not see that being a problem nor do I see why that would be.

Frame rate reductions also will not happen, considering that the Tegra, the chipset that the switch uses, is quite a deal more powerful than the Wii U, and the tablet portion is the actual console. Meaning, that it does not have to stream video like the Gamepad does.

Even ignoring the using a Switch instead of TVs for some setups, the Switch will make set ups a lot easier and a lot faster as well, even when TV's are used. You no longer have to worry about setting up custom controls, custom names, or anything of the sort. Both players will just be able to put their Switch in the dock, and be ready to play.

 

[Big-Cat]

There's already slight latency on the gamepad for the WiiU. Try playing N64 VC games and you'll see what I mean. Smash 4 has this issue to a lesser degree, but it's still there. It MIGHT still be there on the Switch, but we won't know until it's in our hands.

What you're suggesting for people to do won't happen. Not everyone brings a Switch to a tournament. What are you going to do about battery life? The thing's rumored to last three hours. Then, of course you better have your name on it or you could lose it in a mixup. Oh, and don't forget controls. You wanted to use a GC controller? Too bad, the actual consoles aren't here!

 

[Crystanium]

This all sounds good, but I don't think Switch is going to replace television sets in tournaments just like computers didn't replace paper.

Also, I think it's time to move on from GameCube controllers. People are still holding onto that like they're holding onto Melee. It's time to move on. The new controllers aren't bad.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

No Gamecuber controller would mean doa as far as being the next competitive platform. Nobody is going to want to try to undo at a minimum over a year of muscle memory (years if they started in Brawl, over a decade if they started in Melee) just for the sake of playing on a new system with prettier graphics.

Not even adding the 3DS stages to the Wii U version would convince them to make the switch. Highly doubt there will be any new characters either, and if there were any they would most likely keep their desire to make sure all versions have the same characters.

 

[Triggerpig]

I think there will be more characters for the switch version, they are probably gonna try really hard to get people to switch(hur hur) over to the new versions and you can already see that with mario kart, plus a smash 4 on the switch is more of a case of when then if, i'm assumign they'd be merging the 3ds content with wii u hopefully adding in some scrapped characters like good old wolf and ice climbers.

I admittedly don't go to tournaments but I do see it being used to some extent especially for friendly play, plus this is almost certainly the direction Nintendo will be going with in the future, consolidating their handhelds and consoles into one system so eventually people will probably have to go over to it.
I think how fast it's adopted though depends as said on the battery life(Which I doubt will be that short) and the latency issue but I think what Lozjam is saying is right in theory anyway assuming Nintendo doesn't botch this up(and I hope they don't because the switch is the best idea the industry has had in years.)

I also doubt playing smash on the handheld will be any worse then on tv barring graphical quality and latency, given the 3ds(Atleast to my knowledge anyway) runs it fine.

Also I doubt there wouldn't be a gamecube controller for it at some point assuming the ones we have now won't work with it, there's apparently usb slots on the main system and it apparently has analogue triggers again so gamecube games are probably gonna be on the vc. Plus given how customizable the controllers look, a version just rearranged to be like the gamecube is also another possibility.

 

[firedude953]

This all sounds good, but I don't think Switch is going to replace television sets in tournaments just like computers didn't replace paper.

Also, I think it's time to move on from GameCube controllers. People are still holding onto that like they're holding onto Melee. It's time to move on. The new controllers aren't bad.

One of the main reasons GameCube controllers are commonly used is because too many wireless controllers in one area can cause wireless interference. Some major tournaments even only allow GameCube controllers because of the interference.

 

[Crystanium]

One of the main reasons GameCube controllers are commonly used is because too many wireless controllers in one area can cause wireless interference. Some major tournaments even only allow GameCube controllers because of the interference.

So wait, wires actually are rarely a good thing?

I don't own a GameCube controller. My nephew broke mine. Well, it's not really broken. It still works, it's just that I'd be at a disadvantage if I used it competitively. I use the classic controller, which before SSB4 was released, I figured it would be a good idea to learn to use because I didn't think GameCube controllers would still be used by that time.

Anyway, I think some major tournaments should find a way to prevent interference through propagation. Not everyone has a GameCube controller.

 

[WinterShorts]

1. If we have access to gamecube controllers on the switch, then competitive potential is an automatic plus.

2. Will people deal with how small the screen is on the Switch? I mean if they were able to in the first place, then we wouldn't need to bring $500 big HGTVs and just use the Wii U gamepad instead.

Hopefully i'm not missing anything for this discussion but those are my thoughts.

 

[Big-Cat]

1. If we have access to gamecube controllers on the switch, then competitive potential is an automatic plus.

2. Will people deal with how small the screen is on the Switch? I mean if they were able to in the first place, then we wouldn't need to bring $500 big HGTVs and just use the Wii U gamepad instead.

Hopefully i'm not missing anything for this discussion but those are my thoughts.

>$500
You can get a quality monitor with no little to no input delay (as in it's less than a frame) for 200.

 

[WinterShorts]

>$500
You can get a quality monitor with no little to no input delay (as in it's less than a frame) for 200.

eh, still a little bit expensive.

 

[Matt11111]

1. If we have access to gamecube controllers on the switch, then competitive potential is an automatic plus.

2. Will people deal with how small the screen is on the Switch? I mean if they were able to in the first place, then we wouldn't need to bring $500 big HGTVs and just use the Wii U gamepad instead.

Hopefully i'm not missing anything for this discussion but those are my thoughts.

I'm fine with using the new Pro Controller. I've been using the Wii U Pro Controller forever.

 

[Jexulus]

The Switch has been reported to have 2 USB ports accessible even when docked, so at this point, the question isn't whether or not the Switch can physically plug in the Gamecube Adaptor, but rather, will the Smash Switch recognize the Adaptor in the first place. Since this is a port, the code that recognizes that the GA is plugged in already exists, so it would only need a bit of tweaking and firmware support on the Switch itself. Gamecube controller support is more or less assured at this point; hell, they might even re-release the adaptor with Switch branding to sweeten the deal.

Also, because an entire controller doesn't have to be tethered to the console for it to actually work properly, set-up for the Switch version will likely be less clunky than the Wii U version, especially if the Sensor Bar is built into the top of the Switch screen and not separate like the Wii and Wii U before it. And it might be around the same price.

All this to say that the Switch version will almost assuredly be the competitive standard once it's released, especially if it features a streamlined menu system.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

The Switch has been reported to have 2 USB ports accessible even when docked, so at this point, the question isn't whether or not the Switch can physically plug in the Gamecube Adaptor, but rather, will the Smash Switch recognize the Adaptor in the first place. Since this is a port, the code that recognizes that the GA is plugged in already exists, so it would only need a bit of tweaking and firmware support on the Switch itself. Gamecube controller support is more or less assured at this point; hell, they might even re-release the adaptor with Switch branding to sweeten the deal.

Also, because an entire controller doesn't have to be tethered to the console for it to actually work properly, set-up for the Switch version will likely be less clunky than the Wii U version, especially if the Sensor Bar is built into the top of the Switch screen and not separate like the Wii and Wii U before it. And it might be around the same price.

All this to say that the Switch version will almost assuredly be the competitive standard once it's released, especially if it features a streamlined menu system.

This is Nintendo.

Never assume they're do something that seems obvious. Or smart. Like ya know, patch notes for example.

 

[Jexulus]

This is Nintendo.

Never assume they're do something that seems obvious. Or smart. Like ya know, patch notes for example.

At this point, the only way Smash Switch wouldn't support GC controllers is if the port was literally programmed not to recognize it. Everything else is already in place.

Point taken about the rebranded GA and the streamlined menu, though.