PM Arts and Alts Thread

[splat]

We'll try to cram as many alts as we can for 3.0, but they have to be of good quality. There's no guarantee that every character will get alts, nor is there any guarantee that a character that doesn't have an alt in 3.0 will not have one eventually. What I'm saying is: "Everything is possible".

[...]

- Costumes will be professionally-implemented: No Hatsune Miku on Zero-Suit Samus. Dr. Mario is basically Mario in another costume, hence alt costumes.

While the second part of this quote is quite relieving, the first part kind of worries me.

I feel that the Alt costume engine is awesome, of course, but it could turn into something very gimmicky really easily. I mean, Dr. Mario is awesome and I think Outset Toon Link will be too, but shoehorning in too many alts could potentially make the roster feel like a giant jumble of characters. I think it'd be even worse if we'd see Melee models - nostalgia is fine, but consciously lowering the quality of a model (especially since many Brawl models are updated designs from Melee - except Ganondorf, if I recall correctly)

Perhaps it's just me having some sort of OCD flaring up, but for many characters I'd rather have a bunch of recolors (or even nothing at all) rather than an alt that feels forced in; I'd rather have 6 or 12 Squirtle colors than Squirtle with a Wartortle alt. I'd rather have 6 or 12 Sonic colors than Sonic with a Knuckles/Tails/Shadow/Mighty alt.
Really, I like alts when we know the characters are the same person canonically. It's why I'm sort of against a redone Melee Ganondorf, though I can understand if he'd appear.

Of course, I too have some alts I'd like to see:
- Dr. Mario
- Outset Toon Link
- Radiant Dawn inspired Ike (as opposed to his normal Path of Radiance design)
- Pajama Ness (including messy bed-hair)
- Justin Bailey inspired ZSS
- Nana-lead ICs

 

[a vehicle]

please make an alt for ZZS based off J. Bieber

 

[Juushichi]

Lucina for Marth please.

 

[Vashimus]

That better come with upping the pitch on his voice to make it sound more feminine.

 

[Pwnz0rz Man]

I'm not really one to make requests, since usually the PMBR does damn good work and if there's something I want, I can find it online somewhere else. If I had to mention any alts I would like seeing officially implemented in Project M though, it would these. I don't care if any of these are really added, it's just fun to think of the possibilities.
Mario <-> Dr. Mario
Luigi <-> Mr. L
Peach <-> Shadow Queen
Bowser <-> Dry Bones Bowser
Yoshi <-> Boshi
Donkey Kong <-> Donkey Kong Jr. (I know that's technically Diddy, but official DKC story says that this is our own DK)
Twilight Link <-> Skyward Link (I suppose Melee Link would be nice too, but I prefer Skyward Sword's design)
Twilight Zelda <-> Skyward Zelda (Same as Link, Melee would be nice, but Skyward looks more interesting to me.)
Ganondorf <-> Melee Ganondorf
Toon Link <-> Outset Isle Link
Ness <-> Pajama Ness
Lucas <-> Masked Man
Marth <-> Awakening Marth
Roy <-> Awakening Roy
Ike <-> Vanguard/Lord Ike
Samus <-> Other M Samus
ZSS <-> Young Other M Samus
Dedede <-> Masked Dedede
Metaknight <-> Unmasked Metaknight
Mewtwo <-> Mega Mewtwo X (If Mewtwo gets added in the future)
Lucario <-> Mega Lucario
Snake <-> Big Boss/Naked Snake


Wow, that's more than I thought I'd write down, but the possibilities seem so limitless. Thanks for all the hype, again guys.

 

[Vashimus]

You forgot Mega Zard.

 

[SSS]

You guys. First off, the clone engine is extremely complicated, they said, and they only have 7 spots. They won't be coming out with somebody new for awhile.

Also, all of these "omg Naruto over snake Sora over Marth RAWR" requests are stupid. It completely breaks the concept of the game. Even the Midna over Zelda seems out of bounds; they need to be the same character (although. . .Shadow over Sonic is tempting. . .)

For you people who want these crazy textures, just download them off of Brawl Vault and put them in the fighter folder yourself. I guarantee you that's the only way you'll get Walter White placing a C4 on Sephiroth.

 

[Rikana]

They're alternative costumes. Not alternative characters. Like mentioned, if you want cloud strife over Ike or Gina over g&w, that's not for us to decide. We are only making costumes.

 

[Vashimus]

Also, all of these "omg Naruto over snake Sora over Marth RAWR" requests are stupid. It completely breaks the concept of the game. Even the Midna over Zelda seems out of bounds; they need to be the same character (although. . .Shadow over Sonic is tempting. . .)

For you people who want these crazy textures, just download them off of Brawl Vault and put them in the fighter folder yourself. I guarantee you that's the only way you'll get Walter White placing a C4 on Sephiroth.

By all means Triple S, mind showing us those posts in this thread where people made suggestions like adding Naruto or Sora? And Vigilante not already clearing these kinds of things up in his post? My eyesight must not be what it used to be.

 

[Juushichi]

Oh yeah, Other M Samus design is really cool and sleek.

Even if the game was not, lol.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

You guys. First off, the clone engine is extremely complicated, they said, and they only have 7 spots. They won't be coming out with somebody new for awhile.

Your completely correct, but this is the ALT. COSTUME ENGINE discussion.

 

[CardiganBoy]

These three, but "brawlified", like how they did with Roy:

I can imagine them with their respective voices, so beautiful.
And i think these dont violate any rule, because they are "incarnations" of the same character so they count as Alternate Costume, also these respect hitboxes and hurtboxes, right?

And maybe:

 

[Pwnz0rz Man]

These three, but "brawlified", like how they did with Roy:
I can imagine them with their respective voices, so beautiful. [Melee Triforce Trio]
And i think these dont violate any rule, because they are "incarnations" of the same character so they count as Alternate Costume, also these respect hitboxes and hurtboxes, right?
And maybe: [Melee Fox/Falco]

I can't believe I forgot about Melee Fox and Falco. So many options now.

You forgot Mega Zard.

I didn't exactly forget about Mega Zard, I just wasn't sure what to do with the other two Trainer Pokes, and I wasn't sure about the limitations put on them because they're all technically part of the same character. Because of that, I didn't put that Mega down.

You guys. First off, the clone engine is extremely complicated, they said, and they only have 7 spots. They won't be coming out with somebody new for awhile.

Also, all of these "omg Naruto over snake Sora over Marth RAWR" requests are stupid. It completely breaks the concept of the game. Even the Midna over Zelda seems out of bounds; they need to be the same character (although. . .Shadow over Sonic is tempting. . .)

For you people who want these crazy textures, just download them off of Brawl Vault and put them in the fighter folder yourself. I guarantee you that's the only way you'll get Walter White placing a C4 on Sephiroth.

That would be true, but no one mentioned any character like that. Did you click on the wrong thread by mistake?

 

[turtletank]

I don't understand why people want to bring back older models. As an outsider that never played Melee, I can safely say that Brawl looks better (although I can understand those that prefer Melee fox). There are far more interesting options available, nostalgia shouldn't take priority over quality.

 

[yogurtgun1245]

I don't understand why people want to bring back older models. As an outsider that never played Melee, I can safely say that Brawl looks better (although I can understand those that prefer Melee fox). There are far more interesting options available, nostalgia shouldn't take priority over quality.

I don't think they're suggesting direct ports of Melee models, but updated versions of the old look. Models like this coming from the PMBR if they were to bring these designs back, I'd be pretty assured of the quality.

 

[CardiganBoy]

I don't understand why people want to bring back older models. As an outsider that never played Melee, I can safely say that Brawl looks better (although I can understand those that prefer Melee fox). There are far more interesting options available, nostalgia shouldn't take priority over quality.

I have to say it again: look what they did with Roy, they improved his model, and model's quality at a point that looks like he truly belongs in Brawl, so they could do the same with the ones i suggested.

 

[Little Nemo]

I don't understand why people want to bring back older models. As an outsider that never played Melee, I can safely say that Brawl looks better (although I can understand those that prefer Melee fox). There are far more interesting options available, nostalgia shouldn't take priority over quality.

First and foremost... Because Melee.
Secondly I prefer Melee's art style and, when properly imported, Melee's models actually look just as good if not better than Brawl. I'd even say the textures are just as good. But I'm sure the PMBR would update them somehow. Like, I believe, Apple's Melee Ganondorf. Same model but looks better than Brawl even because of the textures.

 

[turtletank]

I don't think they're suggesting direct ports of Melee models, but updated versions of the old look. Models like this coming from the PMBR if they were to bring these designs back, I'd be pretty assured of the quality.

I guess, but it should really only apply to characters with noticeable differences. I was mainly referring to requests such as Melee link, pointless when he has a selection of entirely new costumes to choose from.

EDIT: And Faceman, retextures are more deserving of retextures rather than an alt costume. That defeats the purpose of an alt costume, to add diversity.
On that note, I quite like Apple's Ganon and see potential for a few other characters. I'm just saying we should recognize what's more suited to the game and what's subjective, because that's where customization comes in. I recommend you follow the Smash3 project if you're looking for Melee-esque textures.

 

[yogurtgun1245]

I guess, but it should really only apply to characters with noticeable differences. I was mainly referring to requests such as Melee link, pointless when he has a selection of entirely new costumes to choose from.

I think Link is a bit redundant, but I'm sure there are Legend of Zelda fans that would absolutely love the remodel, even if minor. And I suppose a greater selection is good for everyone.

 

[CardiganBoy]

I guess, but it should really only apply to characters with noticeable differences. I was mainly referring to requests such as Melee link, pointless when he has a selection of entirely new costumes to choose from.

Melee/OoT Link has noticeable differences, not as much a Ganondorf, but he has.

 

[Piks]

If a design from Melee came back as an alt, chances are the model's gonna be redone.

For the record: Melee textures are lower res than Brawl's, and tend to be less detailed.

 

[Chzrm3]

Oh man, the idea of OoT Link done by the PMBR artists, in the same way they updated Roy... that's too good!

I'm really looking forward to seeing what they've got for us as far as alt costumes. This is so exciting, man!!!! PM just keeps getting better, and every time I say to myself "okay, this is definitely as much as it's fair for me to expect from them", they go and prove me wrong by topping themselves again.

<3333333

I love the TL silhouette! =) Looks like pajamas Link. TL has such amazing costumes already, if they're actually adding pajamas Link he's definitely gonna be impossible to not pick every match.

 

[Vigilante]

For your worries, let me just reiterate that we're not going to rush alternate costumes, and we won't settle for less when adding them in the game. I can promise you that we're taking our time with them, making sure they make sense, are well-done, and not gimmicky.

We have most of the best model designers the community has to offer, and we have incredible artists with magnificent design sense. They can blow my mind.

 

[turtletank]

I NEVER DOUBTED YOU GUYS

 

[CardiganBoy]

For your worries, let me just reiterate that we're not going to rush alternate costumes, and we won't settle for less when adding them in the game. I can promise you that we're taking our time with them, making sure they make sense, are well-done, and not gimmicky.

We have most of the best model designers the community has to offer, and we have incredible artists with magnificent design sense. They can blow my mind.

Of course, something, made with dedication and patience, is always better, and knowing how awesome are the people of Project M, i know they will always come with amazing things.

 

[Pwnz0rz Man]

I guess, but it should really only apply to characters with noticeable differences. I was mainly referring to requests such as Melee link, pointless when he has a selection of entirely new costumes to choose from.

EDIT: And Faceman, retextures are more deserving of retextures rather than an alt costume. That defeats the purpose of an alt costume, to add diversity.
On that note, I quite like Apple's Ganon and see potential for a few other characters. I'm just saying we should recognize what's more suited to the game and what's subjective, because that's where customization comes in. I recommend you follow the Smash3 project if you're looking for Melee-esque textures.

I prefer Skyward Sword Link myself, though every post N64 Link looks very similar, so it's really anyone's guess what they do. I guess they could always do Skeleton Hero from Twilight Princess.

 

[Sanity's_Theif]

We'll try to cram as many alts as we can for 3.0, but they have to be of good quality. There's no guarantee that every character will get alts, nor is there any guarantee that a character that doesn't have an alt in 3.0 will not have one eventually. What I'm saying is: "Everything is possible".

For Dr. Mario:

- The alts are a separate set of costumes working like Wario's.
- It allows for say... one Mario and one Dr. Mario on one team for instances.
- They play exactly the same, however, Dr. Mario has aesthetic-only differences such as lightning F-smash and the pill.
- Costumes will not confer any advantages or any disadvantages.
- Costumes will not drastically change a character's body type. We have to respect hitboxes and hurtboxes.
- Costumes will be professionally-implemented: No Hatsune Miku on Zero-Suit Samus. Dr. Mario is basically Mario in another costume, hence alt costumes.

the rest, I will let someone else answer that.

smells like no melee versions of characters, ah well it's understandable I guess

At least Magic Armor Link still seems feasible

 

[Piks]

I don't get that impression from his post, actually. He said everything was possible, minus silly ideas like Hatsune Miku on Samus.

 

[Rikana]

When our artists try add new alternate costumes to PM, we take Brawl's palette into consideration. So you can definitely expect us to have "updated" models and textures if we were ever to bring back an "old" reference.

 

[CyberZixx]

. I guarantee you that's the only way you'll get Walter White placing a C4 on Sephiroth.

I was not thinking along those lines at all but now I want nothing more than to see this.

 

[trash?]

Any chance for this: http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=30821 as an alt.

thinking from the "no gimmicks" perspective: I want less things like shadow over sonic, and more stuff like this. for context, I want stuff like SF4 alt costumes:

they're all very unlike their normal costumes, ESPECIALLY mecha gief up there, but at the same time, they're still them. gief still looks like gief, cody still looks like cody, and adon still looks like adon, despite being completely different from their normal attire.

 

[uCooL]

I can imagine them with their respective voices, so beautiful.
And i think these dont violate any rule, because they are "incarnations" of the same character so they count as Alternate Costume, also these respect hitboxes and hurtboxes, right?

And maybe:

[/quote]

I never realized how in love these two are...it's taboo...but love knows no bounds.

 

[Burnsy]

I'd be happy if they made a OoT Link with a brand new model+textures compared to the one in melee. Kind of how the OoT 3D player models were faithfully recreated to better match the OoT concept art. Something like that could be awesome and nostalgic while still being different enough to be justified.

 

[yogurtgun1245]

Does this system require you to split the characters into two groups of 6? Or could someone like Yoshi or Kirby just have a grouping of all their canon colors without any additional team colors? Gotta keep my fingers crossed for Brown Kirby and Yoshi.

 

[trash?]

new alt. costume kirby to be called "american kirby"

it's just normal kirby but he's angry all the time

 

[CyberZixx]

Yes please.

 

[batistabus]

Also, as much as I prefer the way Melee Fox/Falco look, I don't think their full models (even if Brawlified) should be alternate costumes. Even though they're the same people technically, there's just something jarring about seeing different models in the same game. Really gives it that hack feeling. Giving them the outfits from Melee would be totally cool (the jackets, boots, etc.), but changing the shape of their faces would be too much IMO. Same goes for "Other M" ZSS or other versions of Zelda characters. That's just how Sakurai decided they should look in this version, and I think that's something that should be respected.

 

[DMG]

Sakurai also eats Bananas, and throws the peels in front of where he is walking on purpose, as if it's normal

 

[Veishi336]

Man id love to see OoT Link. That would just complete my life. Maybe and just maybe they can add idk (when kirby is added in) different colors and hats for kirby in representation of his different forms. Like the sword kirby hat or maybe the headband from fighter kirby or something of the sort.

 

[Amazerommu]

For your worries, let me just reiterate that we're not going to rush alternate costumes, and we won't settle for less when adding them in the game. I can promise you that we're taking our time with them, making sure they make sense, are well-done, and not gimmicky.

We have most of the best model designers the community has to offer, and we have incredible artists with magnificent design sense. They can blow my mind.

This is exactly what I'm expecting. ACE will be quite delicious when 3.0 comes out. For those that don't get alternate costumes, will they get additional recolors? Or will we ourselves be able to fill in these spots? Or are these things that cannot be answered right now? Lol

I just reeeeeeaally like the idea of being able to have two of the same character on a team without that silly white-out effect.

Also. I love you all!