Pikmin management and more! A SSB4 guide to Olimar.

Guide Pikmin management and more! A SSB4 guide to Olimar.

Myran

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#1
Oliwithoutwhitebackground.png

Before I begin the actual guide I want to say that since I do not have a good source for capturing 3DS game footage of Olimar I won't be putting any pictures up for now. When the Wii U version is out I plan on updating this guide with pictures or gifs to help understand how he works. Also since there isn't a reliable frame data guide for Olimar's moves yet I won't be saying exactly when a move will beat out another. Instead I will be giving a general idea of when to use the move. Furthermore because of the Rage Effect not all combos will be guaranteed for Olimar at every percent. All information in this guide is done with an Olimar at 0%. Lastly I will not be going into any of Olimar's custom moves at this point. This is to keep the guide more accessible to newer Olimar players.

UPDATE INFO HERE!
With the addition of new information I will make a list of updated information to make it easier to find. Anything new will be denoted with an * before hand to make it easier to spot as well.

Update 1
  • Added a new technique to the Advanced Techniques section.
Update 2
  • Changed damage percents of Pikmin Throw to coincide with patch 1.0.4.
  • Added info to Pikmin Attributes.
  • Added info to blue Pikmin section of Pikmin Attributes.
  • Added info to the Pikmin Throw section.
  • Edit to Zombie Pikmin glitch.

Let's get started!

Pros
  • Small size makes dodging easier.
  • Can wrack up damage fast without having to approach.
  • Has reliable kill options.
  • Strong recovery that is hard to gimp.
  • Can wall opponents out with projectiles.
Cons
  • Since he is light he dies earlier.
  • Pikmin can desync randomly from the line.
  • Fast characters give him a lot of trouble.

[collapse=Pikmin Attributes]
There are 5 different colored Pikmin in all red, yellow, blue, white, and purple. Each Pikmin excels at certain areas. Knowing which Pikmin is next in your line is huge when playing Olimar so that you can efficiently wrack up damage and KO. Reds, yellows, and blues also have elemental immunity so using these Pikmin against certain characters can give you an added benefit. The order of the Pikmin listed here is the order they naturally come in. They are also plucked in this order every time. Another interesting tidbit about Pikmin is that they can intercept projectiles like Pikachu's Thunder Jolt or Mario's Fireball when they are attached to them or when they are on the ground. This makes throwing Pikmin out a good way to wall out the opponents projectiles.

*This is a Wii U exclusive. Pikmin are able to pick up items on the ground when they're running back to Olimar. Olimar is able to pick them up once the Pikmin are in range, but while the Pikmin hold the item they can still hurt Olimar.
Ex. If a Pikmin brings Diddy Kong's Banana Peel back to Olimar he can trip on it even if the Pikmin is holding it.

Red: These Pikmin have the second highest knock back and damage on smash attacks as well as aerials. Due to their increased smash attack and aerial power they do the least amount of damage in grabs. They are also resistant to fire attacks. For example if a Ness PK Fires a red Pikmin it won't take any damage.

Yellow: They have a larger hitbox than normal Pikmin, and have longer hitstun due to electric properties. They along with blue have the most average knock back and damage from smash attacks and aerials. Similar to reds the yellow Pikmin have immunity to electric attacks. For example Pikachu's Thunder attack won't hurt a yellow Pikmin.

Blue: These Pikmin are for grabs. They are the only color that has a reliable kill throw, and share the same smash and aerial power as yellows. They do much more damage and knock back with throws so make sure to use these to their full potential. Blue Pikmin also are immune to water attacks. There aren't to many attacks to fit this category, but a good example is Greninja's Water Shuriken.
*Blue Pikmin are the only color that will not drown when in water. This is a Wii U exclusive as swimming is not present in the 3DS version.

White: White Pikmin are the weakest for smash attacks and aerials, but do the same amount of damage as yellows and purples in grabs. That being said they do the most from Pikmin Throw so that will be their main use. They do not have an elemental resistance.

Purple: These Pikmin are the hard hitters of the group. They have the strongest knock back and damage of from attacks and aerials. While they do have less range on some moves it's made up due to their increased health. They are also the only Pikmin that have an actual hitbox with knock back when used with Pikmin Throw. Purples make walling opponents out much easier, and can help scoring KOs at earlier percents. Purples also do not have an elemental resistance.
[/collapse]

[collapse=Jab, Tilts, and Dash Attack]
None of these moves require Pikmin to use.

Jab: Two punches enlarging Olimar's fist that do 4% at the sweet spot which is the end of the fist away from Olimar, and doing 3% when the hit is closest to Olimar. In total the jab can do either 6% or 8% depending on if the sweet spot is hit. This is move is vital for Olimar since it is fast, and can disrupt the opponents approach. It can also be followed up with a dash grab. The second punch also moves Olimar forward slightly.

Dash attack: A cartwheel that has two hitboxes. The first one does 7% and is on the first half of the animation, and the second does 4% while being on the latter half of the cartwheel. The first hit pops the enemy up slightly while the second hit sends them much further up. The move has a decent amount of ending lag so be smart when using the move. It is best to use it more as a mix up for the opponent's get up or if they are trying to land. Just don't get to set in the habit of it, or they may start punishing.

Forward-Tilt: A winded up punch that enlarges Olimar's fist. It does 11% no matter what part of his fist hits the opponent, and sending them at roughly a 30 degree angle. This move has a bit of a slower start up than the Jab, but can be used as a kill move. It's also a great option when recovery with no Pikmin, or when the Pikmin have desynced from the lineup.

Down-Tilt: Olimar slides head first across the ground then retracting back slightly into a standing position. Does 6% and pops the enemy upward. This move has a pretty quick start up as well as low ending lag. Because of this, the move can be used as a movement option in some cases. It can be great for moving just out of the opponents hitbox, and giving the Olimar ample time to punish. Since it returns Olimar to the neutral position this makes following up with a forward smash quite easy. I highly recommend that Olimar mains try to utilize this move to it's fullest.

Up-Tilt: Olimar hops a short distance while spinning. You cannot move during this move. It is a set distance, and Olimar returns to neutral once it finishes. This move has seven hits with the first six doing 3% in total, and the seventh hit doing 4%. The move comes out pretty fast with the hitboxes starting as soon as he jumps. This is a solid follow up to landing with a Neutral-Air, and it pops the opponent up allowing for Olimar to space himself or follow up.[/collapse]

Quick note: There will be charts with all the smashes, grabs, aerials, and Pikmin Throw damage for each Pikmin color as well as sweet and sour spots. Damage goes from sweet spot to the worst sour spot.

[collapse=Smash Attacks]
Forward-Smash: Olimar points forward sending a Pikmin flying horizontally in front of him. This move has a sweet spot when it first comes out, and two sour spots. The first sour spot is the second half of the animation when the Pikmin is going out, and the last and worst spot is right before the Pikmin falls at the end. A couple other things to note is that after the smash it takes time for the Pikmin to get back up into your line, and ghost smashes are still a thing. (I will go into the details of desynced Pikmin and ghost smashes later on in the guide.) This is a great move for walling the opponent out, because even if Olimar is hit, the Pikmin will still fly out. It can also be used to hit enemies recovering from the ledge. This is due to how long the Pikmin's hitbox stays out. Another important detail is that Pikmin do not fly off the edge unless Olimar is standing at the edge of the stage. This is a primary kill move. Lastly all Pikmin go the same distance except the purple which goes about 1/2 the distance.

Pikmin Uncharged Charged
Red 17/12/7 24/16/10
Yellow 14/10/6 20/14/8
Blue 14/10/6 20/14/8
White 11/8/4 16/11/6
Purple 20/14/8 28/19/11


Up-Smash: Olimar points up, and the Pikmin jumps above him. There is a hitbox on both sides of Olimar with a larger range in the direction Olimar is facing. This moves vertical range is much shorter compared to Brawl, and the ending lag is quite considerable. There is also a sour spot at the end of the smash when the Pikmin is at it's highest. This is not a move that can be spammed, or you will get punished. With that said it does have kill power, but is best used as more of a read.

Pikmin Uncharged Charged
Red 15/13 21/18
Yellow 13/11 18/15
Blue 13/11 18/15
White 10/8 14/11
Purple 18/15 25/21


Down-Smash: Two Pikmin slide out from Olimar's sides. The first Pikmin in the line will go the same direction Olimar is facing, and the second will go behind him. This can be performed with one Pikmin, but the backside of Olimar will have no attack there. This move is fast and powerful, and can be a great tool to hit opponents on the ledge after the invincibility wheres off. It can also be used after the opponent hits your shield or when reading a roll. All Pikmin go the same distance except the Purple which goes about 1/2 the distance. As with the other smashes there is a sweet spot that is closest to Olimar when the Pikmin first come out. The sour spot is when the Pikmin have reached the end of the slide. This a great move for Olimar since it is fast, hits both sides, and can be a kill move!

Pikmin Uncharged Charged
Red 13/10 18/15
Yellow 11/9 15/12
Blue 11/9 15/12
White 8/7 12/10
Purple 15/12 21/17
[/collapse]

[collapse=Aerials]
Neutral-Air: This is the only one of Olimar's aerials that does not require a Pikmin to use. Olimar spins in the air in a similar fashion to his Up-Tilt except he can move while doing so. It has five hits. The first four do 6% in total, and the last hit adds 2% for a total of 8%. It can be a solid landing option, and is a great move for when you have no Pikmin in the air.

Forward-Air: Olimar swings the first Pikmin in his line forward like a club. This is one of Olimar's best follow ups from his grab, and can be used as a landing option when retreating in the air with it. Just don't get to aggressive with it as if it's shielded the opponent can punish if you aren't careful.

Back-Air: Olimar swings the Pikmin behind him starting from the bottom and going up. What is different is that this move can kill. You can also use this to land since it has the same landing lag as Forward-Air. This move isn't used as frequently, but it is definitely a good move. Most opponents won't think of this as one of Olimar's kill moves so keep it in mind.

Up-Air: Olimar swings the Pikmin upward in a circular motion. This has a single hitbox and sends the enemy upward. This is a bit of a multipurpose move, because depending on the enemies percent and what Pikmin is used it can be a kill move or a juggling tool. You usually won't get to many hits with consecutive Up-Airs, but it is possible. The kill power on this move is pretty good when used with a purple or red. Don't be afraid to go for the Up-Air follow up, but don't get to over aggressive either. A fine balance of when to go for it is key to use this move to it's fullest. One final thing is that this move has much more ending lag than the previous aerials. It is not advised to use this as a landing option.

Down-Air: Olimar swings a Pikmin downward. It can send the opponent in a variety of directions depending on what part of the Pikmin hits the opponent. At the tip of the Pikmin's head there is a sweet spot that will meteor smash the opponent. It can be a little hard to hit, but is still a good move even without the sweet spot. Like Up-Air this move has a considerable amount of landing lag so be careful when landing with it. It can be an option to land with, but is best used to catch someone trying to recover onto the stage.

Here is a chart of all the aerials damage amounts for each Pikmin.
Pikmin Fair Bair Uair Dair
Red 10 12 10 10
Yellow 8 10 9 9
Blue 8 10 9 9
White 6 8 7 7
Purple 11 15 12 12
[/collapse]

Quick note: The pummel (Just hitting A when the opponent is grabbed.) does 2% with all Pikmin except white which does 4%. Also all Pikmin have the same grab range except purples which go slightly less and whites which go slightly farther.

[collapse=Throws]
Forward-Throw: The Pikmin tosses the opponent forward with a slight upward diagonal angle. This is solid choice for getting the opponent offstage when they're near the edge. Probably will be the least used throw due to lack of actual follow ups, kill potential, and less damage than back throw.

Back-Throw: The Pikmin slams the enemy into the ground behind Olimar. Sending them at a diagonally upward angle. This move does the most damage out of all throws, and is a solid choice to wrack up damage when the opponent is at a higher percent. It can also be a good way to get the opponent offstage when they're at higher percents.

Up-Throw: The Pikmin picks the enemy up and slams them directly down. Has pretty close to a 90 degree angle in terms of knock back. This is the only throw that can reliably KO, and it has to be done with a blue. Not to much more to say about this throw. It is really only for KOing.

Down-Throw: The enemy is thrown on the ground while the Pikmin jumps into the air to slam into them. This throw is Olimar's bread and butter combo starter at low percents. The knock back is much less than other throws so it allows for a variety of follow ups depending on the opponent's percent and weight. It can be followed up with Forward-Air, Forward-Smash, or Up-Air depending on the circumstances. If the opponent vectors the Forward-Air followup wrong it is even possible to occasionally get a regrab. The chances of this are better on heavier characters.


Here is the chart that displays the damages for each throw for each corresponding Pikmin. White Down-Throw seems to do around somewhere in between 7%-8% for the sake of simplicity it is put as 8% in the chart.
Pikmin Fthrow Bthrow Uthrow Dthrow
Red 5 7 6 6
Yellow 7 9 8 8
Blue 11 14 12 12
White 7 9 8 8
Purple 7 9 8 8
[/collapse]

[collapse=Specials]
Neutral-Special: The Pikmin Pluck- Olimar plucks Pikmin out of the ground. Maximum amount of Pikmin allowed in Olimar's line is 3. If the move is used after he has 3 he will pluck, but nothing will come out. There is a short delay in use of Pikmin if no reaction is done immediately after they are pulled. This means that you can pull three Pikmin consecutively and be able to act right after they are plucked. Pikmin can only be plucked on the ground, and if used in the air Olimar will do a plucking animation with no results. You can also shield after the pluck. This is important when landing with no Pikmin as you can pluck one, and shield, attack, or roll away to escape.

Side-Special: Pikmin Throw- Olimar throws the Pikmin in the direction he is facing. Each Pikmin have a set air speed and arc when thrown. Red and blue have a mid level arc and speed. Yellow has a higher arc, slightly slower speed, and slightly less distance then red and blue. White has the the fastest air speed, and the same arc as red and blue. White also flies the farthest distance of all the Pikmin. Purple keeps the standard arc, but goes about half the distance of the red and blues. This is Olimar's premiere camping tool. He will keep opponents out while using Pikmin Throw to wrack up damage quick. Purple Pikmin are also the best way to keep approaching enemies out when you're recovering from offstage, or when they approach onstage. To maximize the distance of the throw, jumping is the optimal method when throwing them. Don't be afraid to use them on the ground though. There is little to no lag when thrown on the ground, and can be a good choice when running away. Another thing to keep in mind is that Pikmin can be hit when on the opponent. They can either be knocked off and run back to you ,or killed if they take to much damage. The duration of Pikmin attached to the opponent is highest at 0%, and will decrease as their percent increases. This makes camping with Pikmin Throw at higher percents much less rewarding.

*With patch 1.0.4 all Pikmin now stay attached to the opponent longer. This is a strong buff, and will allow Olimar to wrack up damage considerably faster.

*With the patch there were changes to the damage percents of Pikmin when they are attached. Now red, yellow, and blue do 1.1% per tic instead of 1.3%. White Pikmin now do 3.7% per tic instead of 2.7%. Purples remain unchanged.

Here is a chart of how much each Pikmin does per tic on the opponent, and how much the Purple Pikmin do per hit.
Red Yellow Blue White Purple
1.1% 1.1% 1.1% 3.7% 6%


Up-Special: Winged Pikmin- Two winged Pikmin spawn and carry Olimar. You have full control over the movement of these Pikmin. The distance/air speed that the Pikmin carry you is dependent of how many Pikmin are in your line. Three is the least amount of distance/slowest, and no Pikmin is the most distance/fastest. Once the move ends the winged Pikmin despawn and drop Olimar. Once dropped Olimar is in the helplessness state until he is hit or lands. The move can also be canceled early by throwing out an aerial. After the aerial ends it returns to how it would normally be, and Olimar is helpless. What's nice about this move is that if you throw your Pikmin onstage before you use the Up-Special the Pikmin can rejoin your line if you land fast enough. It is advised to end with an aerial when landing back on stage. It can also be used to follow up a string. Try using Up-Special after an Up-Air, and canceling it with a fast fallen Neutral-Air on the opponent. You can usually get some extra damage when they're coming down. Also don't be afraid to go offstage anymore, with this new recovery it makes gimping Olimar very hard. There is one drawback to this move though. If used consecutively without touching the ground or ledge the winged Pikmin will get tired. Try to mix up how you recover by going all the way from very low to very high!

Down-Special: Pikmin Order- Olimar whistles calling all Pikmin to him, and arranging them in a set order. For the first whistle it will put the Pikmin in the standard order of red, yellow, blue, white, and purple. Each subsequent whistle will put the next color in front, and push the current lead color to the back. This move also grants Olimar super armor in the beginning frames of the move. It can be a bit hard to time, but every Olimar main should master this move to increase the lifespan of each stock and help recover. The whistle will not call back Pikmin that are in the Pikmin throw animation until they land. It can call them back even when they desync from your line and fall off the stage, or when they are attached to the opponent. This is a crucial move in Olimar's repertoire and should be used frequently to keep Pikmin with you.
[/collapse]

[collapse=Advanced Techniques]
Since I talked about most of Olimar's ATs early on this will be more general techniques. There aren't really a lot that have proven useful to Olimar currently, but I will update them as more are found.

Dodge Cancelling: This is a general AT, but it applies to Olimar nonetheless. Dodging into the ground has 22 frames of ending lag, but the lag can be canceled. By using a move that auto cancels (The animation and lag of the move cancel if you hit the ground within a set frame window) after the air dodge you can cancel the landing lag of the air dodge and the move. A few examples of moves that can be used to Dodge Cancel are the Pikmin Pluck, Forward-Air, and Back-Air.

Pivot-Grabbing/Tilting/Smashing: By turning the Circle Pad in the other direction during a run your character will do a Pivot. By inputting a Grab/Tilt/Smash while doing so it can do the attack once your character turns around. Olimar takes advantage of these techniques quite a bit. Baiting an opponent into a Pivot Grab/Smash is a great way to stop their running approach or punish a landing. Pivot attacking is quite important for Olimar since a lot of his moves have a long range. This makes pivoting a nice way for him to space and attack.

*Desync Down-Smash: When Olimar is on a platform he can desync his Pikmin in a way where one of the Pikmin's location will store itself there for a time. (I will be referring to this stored position as Ghostbox) This allows Olimar to drop down from the platform, and perform a Down-Smash with one Pikmin on the ground like normal. The other Pikmin will slide across the Platform above Olimar instead of the ground like normal. The easiest way to desync the Pikmin is to Down-Smash on the platform, and drop down right after. The Pikmin can also desync from movement or dash dancing, but this method can be a bit less reliable. Olimar cannot use any move that requires Pikmin, or the Ghostbox will disappear. This means you can come down from the platform with a Neutral-Air or use your Jab when you land. Most importantly you must stay under the platform after you have dropped down, or the Ghostbox will disappear. You can also transfer the Ghostbox to another platform. For instance if you do it on the left platform of Battlefield you can jump to the right one, and still perform the Desync Down-Smash on the ground below the right platform. One last thing to note is that random desyncs can disrupt the Desync Down-Smash, essentially using up the Ghostbox on the platform. [/collapse]

[collapse=Miscellaneous Facts/Quirks about Olimar & Pikmin]
Olimar is a bit of interesting character when compared to the rest of the cast. He has to have Pikmin for most of his attacks, but can still attempt to attack even without Pikmin. This means knowing when the Pikmin in your line aren't usable is important. There are a few ways that this can happen.

Pikmin Desync- Pikmin are able to desync themselves from your line. This means that they will not be usable until they either run back naturally or are called back by Pikmin Order. Pikmin can desync for various reasons. It seems that any form of movement can cause them to run across the stage randomly. Also when Olimar is in the air or on the ledge Pikmin can randomly drop from his line. This makes keep track of your Pikmin and using Pikmin Order crucial to maintain your lineup.

Ghost Attacks: When Olimar uses a move that requires a Pikmin, but one is not there to use. It shows the move animation from Olimar, but nothing else happens.

Zombie Pikmin (Name not final): When Olimar uses his Down-Throw if it is immediately followed up with a Down-Smash the two Pikmin used will glitch out. They cannot be used in any move. The only way to get rid of them is to either die, or have them desync and fall off the stage (It is very hard to get the glitched Pikmin to consistently desync). You can use your Down-Special to rearrange the third Pikmin to the front to use, but it is best just not to Down-Smash after a Down-Throw.

*The glitch causing Zombie Pikmin has been patched out. I will leave it here in case it does arise again.
[/collapse]


[collapse=General Play Style and Strategies]
This section may seem a bit short, but I think I did a good job of covering the uses of Olimar's moves previously. Here I am trying to tie together a coherent play style for you to understand.

Olimar's main strategies when fighting are to camp the opponent out using Pikmin Throw and punish their approach. There are times when going in is needed, but you should not be the one starting the fight. Let the opponent come to you, and beat out his attacks with Pivot Grabs/Smashes or a Purple Pikmin toss. Jab is a great tool for fighting up close. It is fast and knocks the opponent away, allowing Olimar to push in for some damage. Following up with a grab or smash attack is a great way to start the offensive pressure, but don't get to over zealous. Knowing when to pull back and start wracking up damage with Pikmin Throw again is crucial. It takes a fine balance to play Olimar properly since he can be easily punished if he throws out moves to freely.

Edge guarding with Olimar can be done in a few ways. You can read how they get up from the ledge and punish accordingly. If they are stalling on the ledge a Down-Smash will hit them if their invincibility runs out. You can also go offstage and try to hit them with an aerial or Pikmin Throw. Just don't get to greedy for the kill. If they get back before you it could put you in a bad position.[/collapse]

This concludes my Olimar guide. I hope it gave a good look at the character, and what he can do. I will be updating this with new information when it becomes available as well. I want to thank Hilt and Blue Banana for getting these damage numbers for me too. It made writing up this guide much easier.
 
Last edited:

Overmaster

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#2
A friend just dominated me using red Pikmin aerials. It was pretty amazing the juggles he got going and the amount of *** kicking it does. What do you think about a more aggressive Olimar that uses all red Pikmin as a shorthopping aerial fighter? His new recovery also lets him go deep for gimps when has only one Pikmin out.
 

Myran

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#3
A friend just dominated me using red Pikmin aerials. It was pretty amazing the juggles he got going and the amount of *** kicking it does. What do you think about a more aggressive Olimar that uses all red Pikmin as a shorthopping aerial fighter? His new recovery also lets him go deep for gimps when has only one Pikmin out.
Well red Pikmin are the best best for aerials and smashes. (Not counting Purples) I do think he can get some decent aerial strings going, but all of his aerials can be punished if they're shielded. It's cool to go for some stuff like that, but if it's done consistently the opponent will most likely catch on, and begin punishing most of them. That said I do occasionally go offstage with an aerial as well.
 

Dekrem

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#6
Thanks for this info. I'm trying to get the hang of dodge cancelling, but I don't really understand the timing. Can you take me through the sequence of dodge cancelling?

You dodge in the air, close to the ground, and then you input, say, pikmin pluck when exactly? Right before you hit the ground? Right after? I keep experimenting with timing but I'm really stumped on the when.
 

RAzul

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#7
I didn't even know you could do this. I need to try it for myself as well. What's it good for? Just cutting lag/recovery time short?
 

Myran

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#8
I don't believe dodge cancelling was taken out with the most recent patch so that's why I left it in. Now for using it that steps are pretty simple just air dodge toward the ground, but right before you hit the ground you use Pikmin Pluck which will auto cancel. Once that happens you land like you would normally. I'll try to do some testing to see if it's still in the game.
 

Dekrem

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#9
I don't believe dodge cancelling was taken out with the most recent patch so that's why I left it in. Now for using it that steps are pretty simple just air dodge toward the ground, but right before you hit the ground you use Pikmin Pluck which will auto cancel. Once that happens you land like you would normally. I'll try to do some testing to see if it's still in the game.
So am I supposed to be waiting for the air dodge to finish before using Pikmin Pluck? If so, I'm not sure why it seems necessary. When I try this in training mode a 1/4 speed, the time at which you can actually use pikmin pluck after air dodging seems like the same time landing stops causing lag.
 

Myran

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#10
So am I supposed to be waiting for the air dodge to finish before using Pikmin Pluck? If so, I'm not sure why it seems necessary. When I try this in training mode a 1/4 speed, the time at which you can actually use pikmin pluck after air dodging seems like the same time landing stops causing lag.
Hmm, I can't think of the actual sequence of events for it off the top of my head right now. I'm about to leave to a tournament too, but when I get back tomorrow I'll test it. Hopefully I'll be able to answer the question then.
 

RAzul

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#11
Hmm, I can't think of the actual sequence of events for it off the top of my head right now. I'm about to leave to a tournament too, but when I get back tomorrow I'll test it. Hopefully I'll be able to answer the question then.
Please do!! I'm so curious. Good luck btw!
 

KokiriKory

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#12
Good stuff. I had no idea the Patch increased their grab time, I think that's great.

I think Olimar's strongest benefit is his ability to disrupt so many special attacks, especially approach.

Moves like Villager's Lloid or Ike's side special cancel out as soon as they hit a pikmin. This is great to protect yourself on the ground, and even better to keep them from recovering. Like Luma, they can be used as a living shield, forcing your opponent to rethink their common strategies on the fly. If they're not in their comfort zone, if they're second guessing what will work, you automatically have the advantage.

Speaking of getting in their head, if a player has Pikmin attached to them, they're more likely to focus on removing that problem instead of keeping up their attacks on you. It's a great window of opportunity, and a trap that most common players fall right into.
 
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#13
Also olimar can grab opponents that grab the ledge a second time
The reason I think it's useful is because if you have a ledge camper on high damage
You can grab them with a blue for a kill throw
I've done it to a few people already because they try to run and lure me to the corner but I just grab them from a distance
I mean olimar had it in brawl
And it was super useful in pm
But it's good in smash 4 since some characters don't auto grab ledge like little Mac Marth/lucina when they don't sweet spot
And Ect
 

Seleir

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#14
yeah i think olimare in wii u version is strong. as you said now grab is a potential because you can grab on the ledge.
also camping is really god with white pikmin and purple.

Think really good now in SMASH 4 but the best was in Brawl
 
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Dekrem

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#15
Hmm, I can't think of the actual sequence of events for it off the top of my head right now. I'm about to leave to a tournament too, but when I get back tomorrow I'll test it. Hopefully I'll be able to answer the question then.
Any chance you've tested it recently?

I'm also having trouble seeing this:

View attachment 29768
Neutral-Air: ... The move will also auto cancel if you land before the final hit comes out.
When I land before the final hit of neutral-air comes out, I'm still seeing extra landing lag. Or is that not what "auto cancel" means?
 

Myran

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#16
Any chance you've tested it recently?
Okay so you're pretty much just using Pikmin Pluck right before you hit the ground after the Air dodge ends, it will auto cancel the move allowing you to act immediately out of it.

When I land before the final hit of neutral-air comes out, I'm still seeing extra landing lag. Or is that not what "auto cancel" means?
Now for the Nair auto cancelling you're actually right. It does not auto cancel, I apologize for the false information. Information sometimes gets mixed up when pooling it all together like this. Will change it now.
 
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Dekrem

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#17
But if I don't use pikmin pluck, I can still act immediately if I land right after the air dodge ends. I'm not sure what difference the pluck is making.

Let me put it this way: Let's say the first time you can pikmin pluck after the air dodge is frame, I dunno, 75. If I choose to pikmin pluck at frame 75, I can act immediately when I land.

If I choose not to pikmin pluck, and just land on frame 75 of the air dodge, I can still act immediately.

(of course if I land before that frame, I get the landing lag and can't act immediately)

If I dunno if I'm being too nitpicky here, I just don't know if there's something I'm missing about the use of that extra input.
 

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#18
But if I don't use pikmin pluck, I can still act immediately if I land right after the air dodge ends. I'm not sure what difference the pluck is making.

Let me put it this way: Let's say the first time you can pikmin pluck after the air dodge is frame, I dunno, 75. If I choose to pikmin pluck at frame 75, I can act immediately when I land.

If I choose not to pikmin pluck, and just land on frame 75 of the air dodge, I can still act immediately.

(of course if I land before that frame, I get the landing lag and can't act immediately)

If I dunno if I'm being too nitpicky here, I just don't know if there's something I'm missing about the use of that extra input.
Hmm, there was a thread out there about it explaining it much better than I can. At this point I'd say try to find the OP on it or just stop worrying about it. I'll probably look more into it in the future to potentially make it clearer.
 

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#20
It's also good to note that short hop D-Air auto-cancels so it can be used as a good OoS option.
 

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#22
Didn't add that in there, because dair can be a little harder to cancel. If it isn't cancelled your sitting in a lot of ending lag.
Yeah that's true, though I have been able to do it consistently even without a c-stick. The cancel frames seem to be very lenient, as even when it's mistimed slightly it still works. DHD can do it as well but since his has actual start-up it's not as useful.
 
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Drippy

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#23
Just can't tell you how thankful I am for this guide! I am looking to main Olimar (he looks really awesome and I love playing unpopular characters!) and this guide is extremely informative. Thanks a lot! I've already got around to memorizing the Pikmin attributes and the situations his normal attacks are best for! Loving this guide man, keep it up!
 

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#24
Just can't tell you how thankful I am for this guide! I am looking to main Olimar (he looks really awesome and I love playing unpopular characters!) and this guide is extremely informative. Thanks a lot! I've already got around to memorizing the Pikmin attributes and the situations his normal attacks are best for! Loving this guide man, keep it up!
I'm glad to hear it helped you. Olimar is a really fun character, and gets even better once you learn all his intricacies.
 

Drippy

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#25
I'm glad to hear it helped you. Olimar is a really fun character, and gets even better once you learn all his intricacies.
Yeah I've learned all his attributes but I don't know how to effectively shuffle them (because I just realized they change order after using an attack sometimes D:) but he definitely seems like my type of characters! I haven't gotten around to finishing your guide yet so he's been kind of difficult to play but damn is he fun!
 

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#26
Yeah I've learned all his attributes but I don't know how to effectively shuffle them (because I just realized they change order after using an attack sometimes D:) but he definitely seems like my type of characters! I haven't gotten around to finishing your guide yet so he's been kind of difficult to play but damn is he fun!
Well since you already know what all the Pikmin are best for the rest will come with practice. Soon enough you'll subconsciously arrange your line for optimal follow ups.
 

Drippy

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#27
Well since you already know what all the Pikmin are best for the rest will come with practice. Soon enough you'll subconsciously arrange your line for optimal follow ups.
Yeah right now I'm kind of a disorganized leader haha, but sucking at something is the first step at becoming sorta good at something. :)
 

Drippy

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#29
I appreciate the help! I actually haven't considered going to any of the character discussion boards on Sm4sh yet because I feel like I won't have much to contribute but I'll check it out.
 
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koken

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#30
Thank you very much for this guide, it helped me a lot.
I'm training for using it as my main, getting used to him and pulling some movements. I have problems using the Pikmin correctly, but now I'm a little bit more aware about what pikmin I will use.
Several times I don't get the KO because of this.
Being that said, I have some kind of "mental lag" when I grab someone, because I have to look what pikmin went jajajaj. I really hope to work that soon :p.
 
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#31
Good stuff. I had no idea the Patch increased their grab time, I think that's great.

I think Olimar's strongest benefit is his ability to disrupt so many special attacks, especially approach.

Moves like Villager's Lloid or Ike's side special cancel out as soon as they hit a pikmin. This is great to protect yourself on the ground, and even better to keep them from recovering. Like Luma, they can be used as a living shield, forcing your opponent to rethink their common strategies on the fly. If they're not in their comfort zone, if they're second guessing what will work, you automatically have the advantage.

Speaking of getting in their head, if a player has Pikmin attached to them, they're more likely to focus on removing that problem instead of keeping up their attacks on you. It's a great window of opportunity, and a trap that most common players fall right into.
Right. I beat a Bowser by side, smashing a Red Pikmin through his Standard-Special Fire-breath. It was even funnier after his assumption Olimar was weak.
 

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#33
Quick question guys. When the Pikmin stay alive for a while and grow a flower or bud, are their attributes effected or nah?
 

Myran

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#36
Meh, it'd be dope if if was more than that. :/ thanks for the answer though.
PM implemented that mechanic into Olimar's game play. I personally hated it, because with how Olimar works keeping the same Pikmin all the time is extremely hard. It also made them very weak when they first came out. This meant you couldn't kill as easily with fresh Pikmin. I like the equal power throughout the lifespan of the Pikmin.
 
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RAzul

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#37
PM implemented that mechanic into Olimar's game play. I personally hated it, because with how Olimar works keeping the same Pikmin all the time is extremely hard. It also made them very weak when they first came out. This meant you couldn't kill as easily with fresh Pikmin. I like the equal power throughout the lifespan of the Pikmin.
I didn't know that. Excellent point. Perhaps it's for the better then.
 

Dr.M44

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#38
This guide is really good but one thing that bothered me was u didn't mention that the white pikmin fly farther than the rest for pikmin throw, f-smash and have the longest grab range in addition they do the most pummel damage but overall great guide
 

Myran

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#39
This guide is really good but one thing that bothered me was u didn't mention that the white pikmin fly farther than the rest for pikmin throw, f-smash and have the longest grab range in addition they do the most pummel damage but overall great guide
In a short paragraph above the throws spoiler tag I talk about increased grab range, and pummel damage for whites. As for smashes I didn't think whites have more range, unless I'm just drawing a blank. As for the side-b I mention it in the side specials section in one of the sentences. Maybe you just glanced over it.
 
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