Pika Q&A/FAQ Thread: Ask a Quick Question, Get a Quick Answer!

[Deleted member 189823]

Yah, I pretty much just want to use Pikachu now.

I love the way you guys hype him.
On topic:


How do you guys deal with Olimer, assuming you're going solo Pikachu? What makes that MU so bad, if it really is -2?

 

[Player -0]

Olimar can outcamp Pikachu while it's hard for Pika to get in thanks to Pivot grabs, F-Smash, and Fair. He racks up damage pretty well thanks to his Down Throw combos and camping and has great kill moves (unless he hits with a white pikmin) with Up-Smash (Purples kill at like, 80-90?), blue pikmin back throw and purple pikmin up throw (There's more I think. Like F-Smash and D-Smash. Dair is a pretty good meteor too).


Soooo:

Olimar Pros:
- He outcamps us (pikmin toss eats TJolts and are much more spammable + they latch)
- We can't get in (Pivot grab, Fair, F-Smash)
- He kills well
- Racks up damage pretty decently
- We can't CG him (I think F-throw -> Up Smash still works at low percents?)

Olimar Cons:
- Juggled
- Killed early (Up-Smash ftw)
- Bad recovery
- Reliant on Pikmin


I'm probably missing a lot. I was only giving a brief summary anyway.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I go ICs so I can't really help you with that..

 

[PZ]

Nah I think you summed it up pretty well. Pikachu has to play the risks and get good reads in order to get anything going vs olimar. But once we get him offstage, be wary of whistle and go in...
Olimar is pretty well rounded and overpowered on the ground.
Although he gets juggled we do have to keep the pikmin whistle in mind.
Yellow pikmin ignore the electrical part of our moveset.
O yea you could always dthrow>buffer dash>FH nair if Fthrow>usmash doesn't work.

 

[Ookami Hajime]

@Oz: I love the Pikachu community.

Pikachu also has very little options for shaking Pikmin off considering you don't really want to stale your n-air to get them all off at once. F-air won't knock off yellow pikmin and neither will d-air. Sometimes u-air has to be used a few times to get multiple of them off of you too.

 

[Thor]

Just full-hop bair them off or hold jab if you're a little ways away - jab is really good for it, bair is fine, and you can also try skull-bashing away from your opponent (that may be electric-type though, I'm not sure). Fair is good if they have no yellows in the lineup, as is dair, and it's still better to knock one or two off than not fair because you're worried you don't remove them all. Uair is fine too, it just takes more uairs to shake off most Pikmin (Except white ones, they should die to one uair most of the time).

Nair is good for removal when Olimar is at low percents because it should be destaled (9 or 10 hits) by the time he's at KO percents (unless he keeps walking into sweetspot fsmash, at which point you probably don't need to worry about a stale nair if you land sweetspot fsmash over and over again).

There's 2010 footage of Anther vs a few different Olimars (no names I recognize). The MU looks pretty awkward for Pikachu, despite Anther's smooth play (and when I played an Olimar in tourney [I won game 1, lost game 2, and went Falco game 3 for the win] it felt weird trying to get in).

 

[Angiance]

The yellow pikmin being attatched to us are invulnerable to electricity, but at the same time they extend the duration of the electric attacks hitbox, which I guess we could use offensively, kinda like sacrificing health for power

If there are many pikmin attatched, it of course means Olimar has less of the little ******** to defend himself with, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to "steal" his little friends instead of knocking them off. The hits can be shielded, and shield sliding is how we attack anyways

Also, I'm assuming Olimars are looking for us, or anybody to knock off the pikmin since it extends the duration of the attack giving Olimar a seemingly legitimate opportunity to strike considering the laglessness of Pikmim Toss

Correct me if I'm off

Question: wouldn't QAC > Grounded D-Air seperate ICs?

 

[Thor]

Question: wouldn't QAC > Grounded D-Air seperate ICs?

Given the lag, if they shield, that should be a stock. Theoretically I suppose yes, but I think that's just a bad idea.

 

[Player -0]

Yeah, you can always tank the pikmin and "try" to go in if Oli threw too many and get at him but you'll probably eat a ton of damage.

Also QAC -> Dair sounds like a horrible idea. The startup on QA gives IC's enough time to shield easily and then free grab.

 

[PZ]

I was sure that whistle(down b) recovers/calls back pikmin...
The cooldown on that move is somewhat amazing like all of his b moves.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

QAC-Dair is super risky because it isn't a true combo until late %s and also hitting the climbers at different times will make it even less safe considering the ones that are hit first will be out of hitstun much much quicker

 

[Angiance]

**** ICs AND Olimar

Which one is most beneficial?
FH > U-Air > N-Air

Or

FH > U-Air > U-Air > Fastfall

 

[PZ]

Percentage and DI changes what you would go for and your opponent predictions may or may not effect what you do.
But if I were to answer instead of leaving you in speculation, I would say that the uair>uair option is better for higher percents while uair to nair is the guaranteed damage builder.

 

[Thor]

**** ICs AND Olimar

And the Fox boards have probably said somewhere "**** ICs AND PIKACHU".

I generally try the uair -> nair (not just out of a fullhop, when I land a uair), but uair-> uair is great low to the ground since [I believe] uair has less total duration so I can land and then jump-> uair -> nair/uair them for even more percent or else be in position on the ground for a different followup.

 

[hell-dew]

Bair wont get rid of pikmin its hit box wont cover you entirely and Bair is slow. Oilmar also kind wreaks us in the air his moves are disjointed far better then ours. our best move for getting rid of pikmin is Nair which also sucks hard cause Nair is also our best move against oilmar in general. hes insanely hard to juggle to cause of his aerials being really good against us. also yellows make the MU stupid as heck. your best tools in this MU is use your ground speed an grab

the whole delayed attack thing off pikmin is really not that useful either it gives them way more time to shield our stuff. IMO the most luck ive had in this MU is watching his pikmin order (watch for mainly yellows and purples) and approaching accordingly. this MU is BS as heck through his options are way way more rewarding and punishing on us then what we can do to him. the other thing is he will grab the hell out you to if the oilmar isnt bad.

funnily enough while this MU is insane in singles and stupidly bad. in doubles we have a pretty damn good advantage on him to the point where i would argue the MU is far closer to even in doubles. out speed makes gimping him easy with your partner there he cant wall easily making you able to just get in on him and tear him apart. his mobility is also terrible making him really easy to break from his teamate then rather gank him or his teamate lol. basicaly in doubles its easy to exploit his flaws.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I like unplugging their controller.

 

[Player -0]

Unplugging an Olimar's controller only works so well. At some point they become so lame that they can play without their controller in. This also happens with Luigi.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I like Luigi's Jab.


Obama looked at it and said "I like that Jab, that is a nice Jab".

 

[Angiance]

HEY! F-Tilt is a powerful ass spacing attack, unless it's shielded

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

As a spacing move D-tilt is better. It is i think 2 frames slower but has much more range and less cooldown, plus you can do the slide.

 

[Gunnermaniac]

F-tilt is a really awesome move but I wouldn't space with it. It's extremely laggy/punishable. D-tilt is amazing for it though. More range, significantly less cooldown, chance to trip (which = free grab).

 

[Deleted member 189823]

HEY! F-Tilt is a powerful *** spacing attack, unless it's shielded

Doesn't look that special...
What's it got going for it? It's speed is kind of average, it doesn't exactly kill and...yeah.

 

[Pikabunz]

Up-angled ftilt is a good spacing move against aerial approaches.

 

[Angiance]

@Oz
F-Tilt is fast (frame 5), and has a disjointed hitbox that stays out for 6 frames. It's very good

My perspective of spacing is: The shorter the horizontal range, the higher the value; their is more to be gained from short ranged attacks conpared to longer ranged attacks

I've been practicing short range attacks that hit high, so I've been seeing D-Tilt as a crappy attack in general as of late, just because it controls so little >area<

 

[Ookami Hajime]

@Oz: F-tilt is an amazing move to just throw out when you need to breathe. It has good enough knock back to get people to back off for a second, decent range, and comes out fast. In terms of spacing and such, d-tilt is an overall better move because of pika sliding, more range, trip, speed, and it's cute.

When someone attacks your shield from behind, do you guys prefer oos u-air or n-air? Or is it just situational for you? Just a quick little preference question.

 

[Angiance]

D-Tilt overall better than F-Tilt? I disagree

Opponents should know better than to attack our shield from the back, but OoS U-Air is dominant in that instance

 

[Ookami Hajime]

@ Angiance : I say this because of its multiple beneficial properties. D-tilt has proved a better, more versatile move to me. You can tell me more about f-tilt if you want to =o I'd like to know more about why you prefer it.

@ESAM: Do you know if your brother is planning to attend CEO?

 

[PZ]

I like ftilt because chicken legs.

 

[Ookami Hajime]

I like ftilt because chicken legs.

It's like a strange horse kick

 

[1PokeMastr]

I like F-Tilt because it has a silly Animation.

 

[Angiance]

Well, it's just a preference thing really. I have a close range, reactive playstyle, so I hate long range attacks since it destroys my flow

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Your avatar is adorable.

 

[Thor]

Says the guy with a Chocobo chick avatar [I think that's what it is].

I like both ftilt and dtilt, because they have more range and less punishability than jab. Dtilt is good if I expect the ground approach, ftilt is good if I think they prefer the air (shoutouts to Falco) or am not sure, and if they're really close at that point.

I still like fsmash a bit too much, but hitting MK out of ftilt is so darn satisfying.

 

[Ookami Hajime]

I need to start using d-air more. I like the move, but my usage of it is subpar. Outside of spot dodge/air dodge reads, how do you all use this move efficiently? And is there some secret to the timing for auto canceling it?
Also, when getting juggled, is it ever really a good idea to try to challenge someone coming up at you with d-air?

 

[Angiance]

Says the guy with a Chocobo chick avatar [I think that's what it is].

I like both ftilt and dtilt, because they have more range and less punishability than jab. Dtilt is good if I expect the ground approach, ftilt is good if I think they prefer the air (shoutouts to Falco) or am not sure, and if they're really close at that point.

I still like fsmash a bit too much, but hitting MK out of ftilt is so darn satisfying.

I've started seeing Jab as a frame 2, 22% damage attack: Jab > Trip > D-Throw > N-Air

I see F-Tilt as Kirby's B-Air turned into a ground move. F-Tilt is extremely good for clashing with attacks, like Kirby's F-Smash

I need to start using d-air more. I like the move, but my usage of it is subpar. Outside of spot dodge/air dodge reads, how do you all use this move efficiently? And is there some secret to the timing for auto canceling it?
Also, when getting juggled, is it ever really a good idea to try to challenge someone coming up at you with d-air?

Well, it beats alot of grounded attacks since it goes over the hitbox

You can fastfall D-Air from a specific height it'll autocancel

You can slowfall D-Air from , a platform or something and it'll autocancel

On BF you can SH D-Air and hit above the platform

 

[Deleted member 189823]

I had to look up what a Chocobo is...but no, it's just a normal chick, with it's mouth full, of sunflower seeds.

I am a fan of destroy. I like hangbang game, is good and also I like fight. I teach, talk and tell of fight at my bolg, you see here? Sometimes people take **** cause to be friend with you. I don't like that, I like fight hard style.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Spacing =/= close range move that is good. That' s just...not the right definition. D-tilt is definitely better overall than F-tilt as it has the chance to trip, it has more range and is safer. F-tilt is really good, don't get me wrong, and it can actually beat tornado if it isn't stale (yay) if it's up-angled. I use it for killing a lot as well.

As i play more and more I like dair less and less. It has huge start-up and is really only good for sidestep read. If you get it it has huge implications since it links into a grab or f-tilt or a lot of other things, but it's meh. At least in neutral. I use it while falling a bunch because people don't expect it.

Yes, Nick Riddle and I are both going to CEO. Why?

 

[Ookami Hajime]

@ESAM: Yeah, I noticed you don't ever really use d-air

I was just asking because I'm attending and curious about which high level players will be there.

I've only seen you at one tournament before and I was too lame to say hi or anything, haha. I hope we can play friendlies or something. What are you entering?

 

[Angiance]

It's a special kinda spacing...

I kinda like, use my opponent's spacing against them

You don't use SH D-Air if you read a ground approach?

 

[1PokeMastr]

Everyone uses the opponents spacing against them.
Kind of have to because you're playing against moving targets that can read situations, etc.

It's not like you're playing against someone who stands still.