Orange Star's Hyperactive Whiz Kid! - Andy For Smash Ultimate! We'll Live To Fight Another Day...

[chocolatejr9]

A reminder that Wayforward is a western developer through and through, so it's only natural that japanese localization will take longer, like Ubisoft's Mario + Rabbids. They've certainly been trying to break into that market lately, though.

Ain't that the truth. If there's any Western game company that wishes it was a Japanese game company, it's Wayforward.

 

[Ura]

I don't think that a guessing game would go over well for Advance Wars though. Not only because older fans would not be convinced the rep won't be someone from Orange Star, but younger fans wouldn't know any of them.

Yeah agreed. With how long it's been since the last AW, a guessing game wouldn't work. It's one of those things that needs to be revealed right away to get people interested with the moveset and all.

I'd be surprised if it didn't make it over; it does just appear that modern Nintendo isn't as willing to announced localizations without localized text being ready for the reveal trailer... I'm unsure if it'll be day-and-day in Japan as it is over here though.

I'm glad there is an audience hoping for it to be out over there though!

A reminder that Wayforward is a western developer through and through, so it's only natural that japanese localization will take longer, like Ubisoft's Mario + Rabbids. They've certainly been trying to break into that market lately, though.

Yeah it's just a thing for Nintendo to do with the dormant IP's they're bringing back. Obviously, Advance Wars is a big release for December so I wouldn't expect it to be omitted from Nintendo's domestic market. It's just that with their dormant IP's, some of them are more known in other areas in the world. That's the reason why they didn't reveal Famicom Detective Club in the September 2019 Direct for the West. It would have been all like "huh what's this?" which is something you don't want happening too far out from release. Likewise, it's the same thing for Advance Wars in Japan. It has nothing to do with them not selling it there, it's just a matter of revealing closer to launch so it's fresh on the minds of the market where you want it to do better.

I fully expect the remakes to be a same day worldwide release like the FDC remakes were as well. But yeah, it's really nice to see Japanese fans that are excited at the prospect of getting the AW remakes.

Yeah, this seems possible to me too. Or maybe having some sort of post-game/NG+ situation going on...

Yeah, I really hope there's some kind of post-game stuff like what the Pokemon games do for their remakes. Or hell, they could even do a setup for after the events of Black Hole Rising. Remember how Hawke says at the end of the game that he'll return to challenge the CO's? Maybe we could see that actually unfold and the post-game involves Hawke wanting to entertain himself by challenging the CO's to various missions where they have to face him or risk another invasion (remember, Hawke isn't exactly what you would call a nice guy so it's in character for him to do something like this).

Just throwing out ideas here. I really like the idea I mentioned with Andy having to face Sturm solo in a bonus mission in the AW1 Campaign that wasn't in the original game. It would be like Rivals but an actual fair challenge and not some hellish torture mission haha.

That's why I really think we will have balancing for the whole Re-boot. There won't be two games in one game, there will be two campaigns in one game. Note the difference.

This is a very good point. Several CO's were changed up between games like Max being nerfed and Eagle switching up his CO Powers. Very interested to see how WayForward approaches this. Maybe this will be addressed in an Advance Wars Direct in November?

I suppose that's the best case scenario, having a multiplayer with a separate roster balancing for that alone, with options for both AW1 and AW2 rules (Super CO Powers versus not having them), while possibly being able to unlock the unaltered versions of COs via campaign playthroughs, but they would be restricted from normal online play.

Last Andy change tidbit I wanna share for today, he now gets pissed when people destroy his units, instead of just sad.

Interesting, so CO's would have three separate balancing then? One for the AW1 Campaign, one for the AW2 Campaign, and then one for the multiplayer/War Room modes? That's a lot to take in but i'd be down for that provided the balancing in multiplayer mode isn't too unfair haha.

Yeah I noticed that tidbit with Andy as well. I love that they gave him a bit of an attitude in this game. It's those little touch up's that I really like in these remakes. I'm all in for menacing yet comical Sturm haha.

 

[amageish]

Yeah it's just a thing for Nintendo to do with the dormant IP's they're bringing back. Obviously, Advance Wars is a big release for December so I wouldn't expect it to be omitted from Nintendo's domestic market. It's just that with their dormant IP's, some of them are more known in other areas in the world. That's the reason why they didn't reveal Famicom Detective Club in the September 2019 Direct for the West. It would have been all like "huh what's this?" which is something you don't want happening too far out from release. Likewise, it's the same thing for Advance Wars in Japan. It has nothing to do with them not selling it there, it's just a matter of revealing closer to launch so it's fresh on the minds of the market where you want it to do better.

I fully expect the remakes to be a same day worldwide release like the FDC remakes were as well. But yeah, it's really nice to see Japanese fans that are excited at the prospect of getting the AW remakes.

Interesting theory about the announcement times!

I've rambled about this enough in the Ayumi thread, but to give the cliffnotes here: the FDC localization is very odd to me as Miyamoto and Takahashi happened to be asked about Adventure Games during a shareholder meeting only a month before the September 2019 announcement, with Miyamoto commenting that they're too difficult to localize in the current global market just due to the raw amount of text involved and their relatively niche audience. This is kind of odd, as it results in this weird cyclical logic of "FDC can't have been planned for localization because Miyamoto pretty explicitly said they wouldn't be doing something like that, but also FDC can't have been localized on a whim because localization for that type of game is hard (though they obviously cut costs with no dubbing, which Miyamoto did specifically note as a challenge in the presentation)."

Yeah, I really hope there's some kind of post-game stuff like what the Pokemon games do for their remakes. Or hell, they could even do a setup for after the events of Black Hole Rising. Remember how Hawke says at the end of the game that he'll return to challenge the CO's? Maybe we could see that actually unfold and the post-game involves Hawke wanting to entertain himself by challenging the CO's to various missions where they have to face him or risk another invasion (remember, Hawke isn't exactly what you would call a nice guy so it's in character for him to do something like this).

Just throwing out ideas here. I really like the idea I mentioned with Andy having to face Sturm solo in a bonus mission in the AW1 Campaign that wasn't in the original game. It would be like Rivals but an actual fair challenge and not some hellish torture mission haha.

Yeah, that could be a lot of fun! Or even just some basic post-game that re-uses old maps could be engaging... Just something new for returning fans who have beaten this game at least once already.

 

[Ura]

More love for the Advance Wars remakes from Japanese fans. Seeing stuff like this warms my heart after hearing so much about AW's mishaps in Japan haha.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The tweet translates to the following...

"Domino (Sami's name in the JP version) Game Boy Wars Advance Remake If it seems that domestic sales are undecided, please consider it ..."

Interesting theory about the announcement times!

I've rambled about this enough in the Ayumi thread, but to give the cliffnotes here: the FDC localization is very odd to me as Miyamoto and Takahashi happened to be asked about Adventure Games during a shareholder meeting only a month before the September 2019 announcement, with Miyamoto commenting that they're too difficult to localize in the current global market just due to the raw amount of text involved and their relatively niche audience. This is kind of odd, as it results in this weird cyclical logic of "FDC can't have been planned for localization because Miyamoto pretty explicitly said they wouldn't be doing something like that, but also FDC can't have been localized on a whim because localization for that type of game is hard (though they obviously cut costs with no dubbing, which Miyamoto did specifically note as a challenge in the presentation)."



Yeah, that could be a lot of fun! Or even just some basic post-game that re-uses old maps could be engaging... Just something new for returning fans who have beaten this game at least once already.

The announcement was interesting to me as well. Like you mentioned, FDC was brought up in some sort of investor meeting earlier that year in 2019. I think Miyamoto knew the game was in development and had to give a PR'ish sort of answer since the game was months away from being announced. That being said, FDC was indeed localized in the West and given AW has much less dialogue relative to FDC, that's even less of an issue haha. I just think Nintendo realizes that the Wars series has traditionally seen bad luck in Japan which is why they have taken a different approach with these remakes rather than just not releasing them like what they did with Days of Ruin. It doesn't make any sense to revive a series and omit from a major market in the world. In that case, you just don't even bother lol. The fact that Nintendo went ahead with reviving this franchise is proof enough that they want to give it a chance to succeed in every market, not just some markets.

That could be an interesting idea. Or maybe additional difficulties for the Campaign? Maybe have an Easy mode for the Campaign (for people starting out for the first time) in addition to the Normal and Hard ones. And then they could add a Very Hard Campaign of sorts for seasoned players looking for a serious challenge. I like the sound of that.

 

[meleebrawler]

Interesting, so CO's would have three separate balancing then? One for the AW1 Campaign, one for the AW2 Campaign, and then one for the multiplayer/War Room modes? That's a lot to take in but i'd be down for that provided the balancing in multiplayer mode isn't too unfair haha.

Yeah I noticed that tidbit with Andy as well. I love that they gave him a bit of an attitude in this game. It's those little touch up's that I really like in these remakes. I'm all in for menacing yet comical Sturm haha.

You say that like the balancing can't be worse than it already is.

Darkest Dungeon is a great example of how you can make the same roster of characters similar, yet different enough in both single-player (the main game) and competitive multiplayer (Butcher's Circus). Andy, in particular, feels like he could really use shake-ups the way Sonja did in later games, even if I sort of understand he is the way he is because the game needs a simple CO for a starting player to understand. And that's totally fine for single-player, but I'm thinking, why not dive deeper in the repair aspect to give him an edge in multiplayer? Things like getting a big discount on units repaired, or perhaps a temporary, but stacking buff on his units every time they get repaired (including from his CO powers)? Or for specialist COs in general, maybe give them ways to induce battlefield conditions in their favor ala Olaf's snow, like Sonja causing Fog of War for a couple of turns (if not already present), or Drake creating some bodies of water and ports for his ships?

But in single-player, I'd argue the "imbalanced" COs as we know them actually lend themselves better to making unique, challenging levels. Max may be seen as overpowered in 1, but he also has his own dedicated levels against Grit that can be quite challenging even for him to beat.

 

[Ura]

You say that like the balancing can't be worse than it already is.

Darkest Dungeon is a great example of how you can make the same roster of characters similar, yet different enough in both single-player (the main game) and competitive multiplayer (Butcher's Circus). Andy, in particular, feels like he could really use shake-ups the way Sonja did in later games, even if I sort of understand he is the way he is because the game needs a simple CO for a starting player to understand. And that's totally fine for single-player, but I'm thinking, why not dive deeper in the repair aspect to give him an edge in multiplayer? Things like getting a big discount on units repaired, or perhaps a temporary, but stacking buff on his units every time they get repaired (including from his CO powers)? Or for specialist COs in general, maybe give them ways to induce battlefield conditions in their favor ala Olaf's snow, like Sonja causing Fog of War for a couple of turns (if not already present), or Drake creating some bodies of water and ports for his ships?

But in single-player, I'd argue the "imbalanced" COs as we know them actually lend themselves better to making unique, challenging levels. Max may be seen as overpowered in 1, but he also has his own dedicated levels against Grit that can be quite challenging even for him to beat.

I'm not opposed, don't get me wrong. I just find it interesting if each CO had 3 different skill sets for the campaigns and then for all the other modes. And hey, it's not unprecedented either. Remember in AW1 where Sturm was a glass canon in the final mission of the Campaign and was weaker with higher defense in multiplayer? If they did something like that, I wouldn't mind it too much so as long as they don't ruin the CO's haha.

Andy did get a buff in AW2. His Super CO Power compensates for having a lackluster CO Power and just being very basic. I mean, it heals 5HP, gives him +1 movement, and gives him a strength buff. Not to mention he can get his Super relatively quickly relative to other CO's in AW2. Beyond that, i'm not sure how else you can buff Andy given he's supposed to be the "Mario" of the game having no weak points but not excelling at anything either.

As for a "wishlist" of mine when it comes to balancing, I really hope they make Drake a powerhouse in naval combat the way he's supposed to be. And by that, I want him to have +20% attack and +30% defense when it comes to his naval units. It's the least he can get given how bad he is with air units and being average with land units. Also, I think his regular CO Power should be nerfed so that it doesn't cost the opponent half their fuel for every unit lol.

Sonja doesn't create Fog of War with her CO Power, it just lets her see farther in FoW IIRC. Maybe she could be buffed so she isn't a pushover in non-FoW matches.

I get what you mean by having imbalanced CO's in the Campaign. Many of the missions in the Campaign are designed for a CO in mind (more so, AW2). But yeah, i'm not at all opposed to multiple skill sets in the game as long as the CO's are fun to play as in the multiplayer/War Room modes.

 

[Pacack]

Figured you guys might like this thing my brother made. It's Sami's theme rather than Andy's, but still.

 

[Ura]

Figured you guys might like this thing my brother made. It's Sami's theme rather than Andy's, but still.

Oh, funny that you posted this video here because I stumbled across this video on Youtube the other other day haha.

I love these 8-bit styled remixes for Advance Wars themes. It almost makes me think of Famicom Wars but if that game had actual CO's like the Advance Wars games.

 

[Pacack]

Oh, funny that you posted this video here because I stumbled across this video on Youtube the other other day haha.

I love these 8-bit styled remixes for Advance Wars themes. It almost makes me think of Famicom Wars but if that game had actual CO's like the Advance Wars games.

Oh, cool! Good to know that at least some people are coming across his work on their own. He did a whole week of E3 remixes, with two a day. I actually had to help him with coming up with the games to remix, since he ended up doing so many.

 

[meleebrawler]

I'm not opposed, don't get me wrong. I just find it interesting if each CO had 3 different skill sets for the campaigns and then for all the other modes. And hey, it's not unprecedented either. Remember in AW1 where Sturm was a glass canon in the final mission of the Campaign and was weaker with higher defense in multiplayer? If they did something like that, I wouldn't mind it too much so as long as they don't ruin the CO's haha.

Andy did get a buff in AW2. His Super CO Power compensates for having a lackluster CO Power and just being very basic. I mean, it heals 5HP, gives him +1 movement, and gives him a strength buff. Not to mention he can get his Super relatively quickly relative to other CO's in AW2. Beyond that, i'm not sure how else you can buff Andy given he's supposed to be the "Mario" of the game having no weak points but not excelling at anything either.

As for a "wishlist" of mine when it comes to balancing, I really hope they make Drake a powerhouse in naval combat the way he's supposed to be. And by that, I want him to have +20% attack and +30% defense when it comes to his naval units. It's the least he can get given how bad he is with air units and being average with land units. Also, I think his regular CO Power should be nerfed so that it doesn't cost the opponent half their fuel for every unit lol.

Sonja doesn't create Fog of War with her CO Power, it just lets her see farther in FoW IIRC. Maybe she could be buffed so she isn't a pushover in non-FoW matches.

I get what you mean by having imbalanced CO's in the Campaign. Many of the missions in the Campaign are designed for a CO in mind (more so, AW2). But yeah, i'm not at all opposed to multiple skill sets in the game as long as the CO's are fun to play as in the multiplayer/War Room modes.

In terms of easing players in, AW1 does have interesting progression. You start with Nell who is also an all-rounder and doesn't need to do anything specific to cause extra damage, then she leaves and you get Andy, who is similar but can't rely on luck as much to get him out of scrapes and needs to play smarter to make good use of his power. Next comes Max who is the first CO with defined strengths and weaknesses to introduce players to more specific playstyles and strategies, albeit a straightforward one in Max's case, and finally there is Sami who is the most unorthodox of Orange Star and pushes you to really think about more than just how to match the enemy's strength in combat.

In the campaigns certainly Andy needs no changes, in fact his simplicity allows for more flexible level design. But in multiplayer a strategy solely dependent on Super CO power to get an edge doesn't seem like a particularly reliable one to me. Sturm, and to a lesser extent Hawke work well with their powers supplementing their strong units without needing their powers as a lynchpin. Giving Andy's units gradual buffs on repairs of any kind sounds intuitive enough for beginners to me.

Drake's problems are deeper than the character itself, you said it yourself he has effective powers as it is and in maps that practically force naval combat, he can excel even without an actual offensive buff. The problem is that most of the time it's just not worth the time or money for any CO to build a navy. By the time you have the funds for things like battleships and frigates at minimum, the enemy's ground forces are probably knocking at your door, or have enough bombers to stomp anything that dares set sail from port. Devs clearly overestimated how powerful they are. Given the choice between quantity or quality, players will choose quantity every time.

 

[Ura]

Today marks the 18th anniversary of one of my favorite video games of all time.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Black Hole Rising is Advance Wars at it's peak IMO.

In terms of easing players in, AW1 does have interesting progression. You start with Nell who is also an all-rounder and doesn't need to do anything specific to cause extra damage, then she leaves and you get Andy, who is similar but can't rely on luck as much to get him out of scrapes and needs to play smarter to make good use of his power. Next comes Max who is the first CO with defined strengths and weaknesses to introduce players to more specific playstyles and strategies, albeit a straightforward one in Max's case, and finally there is Sami who is the most unorthodox of Orange Star and pushes you to really think about more than just how to match the enemy's strength in combat.

In the campaigns certainly Andy needs no changes, in fact his simplicity allows for more flexible level design. But in multiplayer a strategy solely dependent on Super CO power to get an edge doesn't seem like a particularly reliable one to me. Sturm, and to a lesser extent Hawke work well with their powers supplementing their strong units without needing their powers as a lynchpin. Giving Andy's units gradual buffs on repairs of any kind sounds intuitive enough for beginners to me.

Drake's problems are deeper than the character itself, you said it yourself he has effective powers as it is and in maps that practically force naval combat, he can excel even without an actual offensive buff. The problem is that most of the time it's just not worth the time or money for any CO to build a navy. By the time you have the funds for things like battleships and frigates at minimum, the enemy's ground forces are probably knocking at your door, or have enough bombers to stomp anything that dares set sail from port. Devs clearly overestimated how powerful they are. Given the choice between quantity or quality, players will choose quantity every time.

That's a good point you brought up about easing the players in to different playstyles in the campaign. I never really thought of it that way until now.

I definitely get what you're saying about Andy but he's always supposed to be the Mario-esque jack of all trades. I also think it's a "shonen" esque trope to have the main character start off as average but then unleash some kind of mega power up that makes them super powerful. I'm not sure if that's what the devs were going for with Andy but it does remind me of that concept. Andy's units getting buffed every time they gets repaired sounds pretty neat. So basically, each time he heals his units or they recover on one of his properties, they become more powerful? I could dig that and it could be a work around for being the basic, average CO of the game.

As for Drake, I think the work around would be to have more maps that integrate more naval combat and less of a reliance on air units. Just make it so that Drake's naval units are so powerful that the opponent has to allocate significant resources to take down his naval forces so that Drake can use his other units to gain the advantage. Or even better, Drake gets a 50% discount on all naval units in addition to the buffs I mentioned. Drake having OP Battleships a lot quicker than most CO's can afford Rockets would make him helluva broken and could probably be up there with Eagle. The way I would compensate for this is by having his CO Power not reduce his enemy's fuel by half. That feat would be reserved for his Super CO Power instead.

 

[MAtgSy]

Today marks the 18th anniversary of one of my favorite video games of all time.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Black Hole Rising is Advance Wars at it's peak IMO.

Andy's finally old enough to enlist.

 

[Ura]

Andy's finally old enough to enlist.

Well technically...

The first Advance Wars on the GBA released in 2001 so Andy was old enough 2 years ago haha.

The more appropriate observation would be that Colin is now able to enlist.

 

[meleebrawler]

Today marks the 18th anniversary of one of my favorite video games of all time.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Black Hole Rising is Advance Wars at it's peak IMO.

That's a good point you brought up about easing the players in to different playstyles in the campaign. I never really thought of it that way until now.

I definitely get what you're saying about Andy but he's always supposed to be the Mario-esque jack of all trades. I also think it's a "shonen" esque trope to have the main character start off as average but then unleash some kind of mega power up that makes them super powerful. I'm not sure if that's what the devs were going for with Andy but it does remind me of that concept. Andy's units getting buffed every time they gets repaired sounds pretty neat. So basically, each time he heals his units or they recover on one of his properties, they become more powerful? I could dig that and it could be a work around for being the basic, average CO of the game.

As for Drake, I think the work around would be to have more maps that integrate more naval combat and less of a reliance on air units. Just make it so that Drake's naval units are so powerful that the opponent has to allocate significant resources to take down his naval forces so that Drake can use his other units to gain the advantage. Or even better, Drake gets a 50% discount on all naval units in addition to the buffs I mentioned. Drake having OP Battleships a lot quicker than most CO's can afford Rockets would make him helluva broken and could probably be up there with Eagle. The way I would compensate for this is by having his CO Power not reduce his enemy's fuel by half. That feat would be reserved for his Super CO Power instead.

Yeah, that's essentially what I had in mind for Andy, in addition to maybe cutting the costs for property repairs specifically. However, any buffs gained in that manner would only last until the first time the unit enters combat (whether attacking or defending), to keep the abuse to a minimum.

Why should Drake be the only one allowed to have any fun with naval units? Decreasing their costs globally would make them more viable alternatives for anyone, even if they (well, really only battleships) have to be nerfed to allow that. Only in such a scenario would I be happy with Drake getting an offense buff to compensate.

And speaking of Black Hole Rising, judging by how many more COs are available to play as in that campaign, and the general increase in difficulty of the standard version, it's definitely one of those Nintendo sequels that assumes players are familiar with the first game and cranks things up accordingly. I wonder if Re-Boot Camp, having both in one place, will nudge new players to AW1 first as a result?

 

[Ura]

Yeah, that's essentially what I had in mind for Andy, in addition to maybe cutting the costs for property repairs specifically. However, any buffs gained in that manner would only last until the first time the unit enters combat (whether attacking or defending), to keep the abuse to a minimum.

Why should Drake be the only one allowed to have any fun with naval units? Decreasing their costs globally would make them more viable alternatives for anyone, even if they (well, really only battleships) have to be nerfed to allow that. Only in such a scenario would I be happy with Drake getting an offense buff to compensate.

And speaking of Black Hole Rising, judging by how many more COs are available to play as in that campaign, and the general increase in difficulty of the standard version, it's definitely one of those Nintendo sequels that assumes players are familiar with the first game and cranks things up accordingly. I wonder if Re-Boot Camp, having both in one place, will nudge new players to AW1 first as a result?

I dig the idea for Andy having repair buffs and all, I just think he should remain the all-arounder of the franchise.

I guess you could reduce the naval costs for all the CO's but I think Drake getting it for even cheaper would make his viability go up when he's traditionally looked at as one of the weaker CO's of the game. And the man needs something to compensate for having garbage air units and average land units haha. That's just my work around for Drake in addition to nerfing his regular CO Power.

I dunno about you but the AW2 Campaign is a lot easier relative to the AW1 Campaign. Like, even the Hard Campaign of AW2 isn't that difficult VS the AW1 Normal Campaign. Not to mention the AW1 Hard Campaign is the most difficult Campaign in any Wars game in the franchise. If anything, newcomers who are able to finish the first Campaign will be able to breeze through the second story.

 

[Ura]

Yoooooo...

So you heard it in the Sakurai Presents video today, there's going to be a longer wait for Fighter 11. Theories have ranged for why this is but all in all, i'm feeling pretty optimistic for our boy being the last fighter.

Keep in mind how complex an Advance Wars character would be mechanically and potential cross-promotion with Reboot Camp in December. I think both of those factors work in favor for this franchise getting a playable character in Smash.

While Andy is anything but a shoe-in, I would wager that our boy has a pretty good shot for the Fighter 11 spot. Until then, let's keep hope alive!

 

[meleebrawler]

Yoooooo...

So you heard it in the Sakurai Presents video today, there's going to be a longer wait for Fighter 11. Theories have ranged for why this is but all in all, i'm feeling pretty optimistic for our boy being the last fighter.

Keep in mind how complex an Advance Wars character would be mechanically and potential cross-promotion with Reboot Camp in December. I think both of those factors work in favor for this franchise getting a playable character in Smash.

While Andy is anything but a shoe-in, I would wager that our boy has a pretty good shot for the Fighter 11 spot. Until then, let's keep hope alive!

My gut feeling is admittedly a Nintendo character closing things out, with most if not all the biggest third-party companies covered at this point. Going by recent trends it's come down to Famicom Detective Club's Ayumi and Orange Star. The former has retro appeal going for it and was actually considered for Melee, but the latter has a conspicuously absent assist from the past two games...

 

[Dr. Richie]

Yoooooo...

So you heard it in the Sakurai Presents video today, there's going to be a longer wait for Fighter 11. Theories have ranged for why this is but all in all, i'm feeling pretty optimistic for our boy being the last fighter.

Keep in mind how complex an Advance Wars character would be mechanically and potential cross-promotion with Reboot Camp in December. I think both of those factors work in favor for this franchise getting a playable character in Smash.

While Andy is anything but a shoe-in, I would wager that our boy has a pretty good shot for the Fighter 11 spot. Until then, let's keep hope alive!

Andy should have joined Smash during Smash 4 at the latest and I hope he gets in. When compared to other series, AW has mediocre representation. The assist trophy was removed, no music tracks, and only 4 spirits!

As you said, the fact that Nintendo hasn't announced the remakes in Japan combined with Challenger Pack 11 coming out later this year, I'd say his chances are quite high. Just like Sephiroth, Andy would bring some needed AW representation! Spirits for various COs, music tracks, Mii costumes, and a unique stage!

Imagine a stage in which CO powers such as Blizzard, Tsunami, Covering Fire, and Meteor Strike serve as hazards! It would be an interesting coincidence if another Intelligent Systems character also finishes off the 2nd Fighters Pass!

 

[Ura]

So I had a funny thought the other day. If Andy were to become a playable character, would that make him the 4th Assist Trophy upgrade? (Following )

I mean that is, if you consider the units from the Brawl/Smash 4 Assist Trophy to be Andy's units. My headcanon is that they belong to him anyways (they are Orange Star units, after all).

My gut feeling is admittedly a Nintendo character closing things out, with most if not all the biggest third-party companies covered at this point. Going by recent trends it's come down to Famicom Detective Club's Ayumi and Orange Star. The former has retro appeal going for it and was actually considered for Melee, but the latter has a conspicuously absent assist from the past two games...

IMO, if they were going to add Ayumi they would have had her in the Fighter 9 or 10 spot closer to the release of her game rather than months later. Timing is everything and fortunately for us, the Advance Wars remakes are timely enough for cross-promotion with the last Smash Ultimate fighter. I also feel that the Wars series has a bigger legacy not to mention, a perfect attendance on Nintendo systems prior to the Wii U/3DS-era (including a cancelled N64 game).

Andy should have joined Smash during Smash 4 at the latest and I hope he gets in. When compared to other series, AW has mediocre representation. The assist trophy was removed, no music tracks, and only 4 spirits!

As you said, the fact that Nintendo hasn't announced the remakes in Japan combined with Challenger Pack 11 coming out later this year, I'd say his chances are quite high. Just like Sephiroth, Andy would bring some needed AW representation! Spirits for various COs, music tracks, Mii costumes, and a unique stage!

Imagine a stage in which CO powers such as Blizzard, Tsunami, Covering Fire, and Meteor Strike serve as hazards! It would be an interesting coincidence if another Intelligent Systems character also finishes off the 2nd Fighters Pass!

I mean, Andy should have been in Brawl if we're being realistic. And I agree with the representation really sucking. An AW Challenger Pack would help alleviate the problems with this series' representation in this game.

I honestly feel like the Japanese localization is being saved for the September Direct TBH. Not only that, but I also believe it's being saved to tie in with a Fighter 11 reveal for Andy. If you want to make an impression on the market where you want this franchise to do better, putting a character in Smash is a sure fire way to get people interested in that franchise. Basically, it would kind of be like what they did with Dragon Quest but the opposite. Getting the East to try out Advance Wars where the series has traditionally seen bad luck.

Ideas for a stage are endless and i'm pretty sure most of us have contributed to what we think could be an AW stage. I think something basic could suffice since the fighter would use up a lot of development resources but I also like your idea of having multiple CO Powers used on stage and what have you.

Also, funny that you would bring up IntSys since it reminded me of something. Every character selection since Melee has included at least one character from Intelligent Systems in it's selection. Granted, they've all been FE characters but my point still stands haha.

Melee:
Brawl:
Smash 4:
Smash 4 (DLC):
Ultimate:
Ultimate (FP1):

Maybe this pattern will hold up for Andy in FP2, let's hope so!

 

[Ura]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I apologize for the double post but I saw this tweet from WayForward that was interesting. It seems we might be getting more news about this game in the coming weeks or so.

Personally, I hope we get some bits and pieces of news throughout the Summer and in the September Direct, they could reveal the AW2 portion of the game. From there on, they could continue to drop bits and pieces of the game until it launches in December.

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

I always like it when stuff like that happens. It shows that the fans have not been toxic and that the developers both love, and are excited by, the game they are working on. Wholesome gaming stuff right there.

 

[SPEN18]

It probably won't happen, but it would be cool if they could set up an official site for the game and then maybe every week leading up to release add a new profile page for one of the COs.

Also, does anyone think there is a chance for brand new War Room and/or Vs. mode maps?

 

[Ura]

It probably won't happen, but it would be cool if they could set up an official site for the game and then maybe every week leading up to release add a new profile page for one of the COs.

Also, does anyone think there is a chance for brand new War Room and/or Vs. mode maps?

I don't think official sites for games exist anymore (or at the very least, they're not as prominent as before). IIRC, that was more of a 2000's kind of thing. Nintendo had a lot of websites designated for games but nowadays, it just links to the official Nintendo website to purchase said game.

As for the War Room, I would like to think so. There hasn't been any mention of it just yet but there's no way they're going to cut such a huge feature like that. I think the War Room will be highlighted later on, possibly in the next Direct. I would really hope for new War Room maps and VS modes maps. I would go a step further and have an online feature where you can create your own maps and share it with others worldwide.

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

Game websites used to be awesome. Then again, game manuals used to be awesome and a thing that existed. Oh man I’m old

 

[Ura]

Game websites used to be awesome. Then again, game manuals used to be awesome and a thing that existed. Oh man I’m old

Oh you and me both buddy! I remember going to gaming websites to see all those neat features that were very much a product of their time (the 2000's) lol. I remember going on the official Mortal Kombat website and having to lie about my age to access it as well, good times (kinda lol).

Game manuals I would check out when I get bored of playing. Sometimes, I would go read the manual and find all sorts of hidden stuff that I never imagined in the game.

 

[DNeon]

I always like it when stuff like that happens. It shows that the fans have not been toxic and that the developers both love, and are excited by, the game they are working on. Wholesome gaming stuff right there.

Unfortunately I have seen far too much toxicity in discussions of the remake to see it this way...

 

[meleebrawler]

Unfortunately I have seen far too much toxicity in discussions of the remake to see it this way...

Samus Returns survived fan work controversy, I'm sure this game will be fine with new fans. If the old ones decide they'd rather stick with their nostalgia, it's on them.

A decade of old-game inertia will be hard for longtime fans to overcome.

 

[amageish]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I apologize for the double post but I saw this tweet from WayForward that was interesting. It seems we might be getting more news about this game in the coming weeks or so.

Personally, I hope we get some bits and pieces of news throughout the Summer and in the September Direct, they could reveal the AW2 portion of the game. From there on, they could continue to drop bits and pieces of the game until it launches in December.

I'm not personally sure if this tweet means "Look out on Nintendo's account for more news soon" because more news is coming soon or if it just means "Nintendo will be posting news about this; we're glad you're excited but please stop asking us as we don't control reveals."

Game websites used to be awesome. Then again, game manuals used to be awesome and a thing that existed. Oh man I’m old

I do miss both detailed websites and manuals... At least the few we get nowadays tend to have a lot of effort put into them? That is nice...

I recall the Twilight Princess website had a minigame involving collecting gems for Minda that I really enjoyed as a child, though I also have a feeling it was probably glorified I Spy designed to make you check the full site out...

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

Unfortunately I have seen far too much toxicity in discussions of the remake to see it this way...

What have you seen?

 

[Ura]

So I came across this video which has all the cutscenes in the latest Shantae game. It got me thinking if we got something like this in the Advance Wars remakes. What if there were limited cutscenes with voice acting in them? Like, a cutscene at the start of the story, a few in between, and then one or two at the end.

And TBH, it's something I can see happening given WayForward is making these remakes. Battalion Wars had cutscenes and that was from a decade and a half ago.

Unfortunately I have seen far too much toxicity in discussions of the remake to see it this way...

Samus Returns survived fan work controversy, I'm sure this game will be fine with new fans. If the old ones decide they'd rather stick with their nostalgia, it's on them.

A decade of old-game inertia will be hard for longtime fans to overcome.

So much of this. I swear, I saw so many takes on the Advance Wars sub-reddit and other places that complain nonstop about the art style or the price tag. Like, I really hope these people are a vocally minority and that most people are hyped for this franchise coming back. That being said, I do hope WayForward takes in to account the fan feedback to make the game better but some people are just plain toxic and bring down the mood.

It was encouraging, however to see Advance Wars Re-Boot Camp listed in Amazon's Best Sellers across every market it was being sold on. Granted, it wasn't doing Metroid Dread numbers but it had a respectable placing and was even ahead of WarioWare: Get It Together in some places. When December comes around, hopefully this game will have broken the 1 million sales mark and then some.

I'm not personally sure if this tweet means "Look out on Nintendo's account for more news soon" because more news is coming soon or if it just means "Nintendo will be posting news about this; we're glad you're excited but please stop asking us as we don't control reveals."

Ahh well, that could explain things. I just sorta hoped we would be getting more news throughout the Summer. Like, little tidbits of news to tide us over until the September Direct. It's not unfeasible really, I hope Nintendo does that instead of saying nothing until the next Direct.

 

[meleebrawler]

I'm not personally sure if this tweet means "Look out on Nintendo's account for more news soon" because more news is coming soon or if it just means "Nintendo will be posting news about this; we're glad you're excited but please stop asking us as we don't control reveals."

Well, it's a safe assumption that Nintendo will talk more about this game as it's release nears. Right now Skyward Sword HD and Metroid Dread are the ones getting the focus, but after October, barring unforeseen announcements releasing games almost immediately after, Advance Wars is going to have at least one whole month to itself for new info.

Here's a fun video comparing music:

So I came across this video which has all the cutscenes in the latest Shantae game. It got me thinking if we got something like this in the Advance Wars remakes. What if there were limited cutscenes with voice acting in them? Like, a cutscene at the start of the story, a few in between, and then one or two at the end.

And TBH, it's something I can see happening given WayForward is making these remakes. Battalion Wars had cutscenes and that was from a decade and a half ago.


So much of this. I swear, I saw so many takes on the Advance Wars sub-reddit and other places that complain nonstop about the art style or the price tag. Like, I really hope these people are a vocally minority and that most people are hyped for this franchise coming back. That being said, I do hope WayForward takes in to account the fan feedback to make the game better but some people are just plain toxic and bring down the mood.

It was encouraging, however to see Advance Wars Re-Boot Camp listed in Amazon's Best Sellers across every market it was being sold on. Granted, it wasn't doing Metroid Dread numbers but it had a respectable placing and was even ahead of WarioWare: Get It Together in some places. When December comes around, hopefully this game will have broken the 1 million sales mark and then some.

Ahh well, that could explain things. I just sorta hoped we would be getting more news throughout the Summer. Like, little tidbits of news to tide us over until the September Direct. It's not unfeasible really, I hope Nintendo does that instead of saying nothing until the next Direct.

Somehow I feel like putting cutscenes all throughout the game would stray a bit far from the old feel of these games, which have pretty much all very much about pushing gameplay before story. An opening cutscene on booting the game could be fun, though, and since we have two games in one it could do some fun stuff with the whole cast.

Interestingly, you can kind of see two styles from Wayforward in this reboot. The CO Power cut-ins pull more from the cutscenes you mentioned (albeit more smoothly animated), whereas the character portraits, and the way they move, pull more from general sprite work in Half-Genie Hero onwards.
Check out this gif and you can see the way these characters move is not far off from what our COs are doing now:

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

The heck is she doing in that idle animation? Jazzercise?

 

[chocolatejr9]

The heck is she doing in that idle animation? Jazzercise?

For reference, Shantae is a belly dancer.

 

[Ura]

Somehow I feel like putting cutscenes all throughout the game would stray a bit far from the old feel of these games, which have pretty much all very much about pushing gameplay before story. An opening cutscene on booting the game could be fun, though, and since we have two games in one it could do some fun stuff with the whole cast.

Interestingly, you can kind of see two styles from Wayforward in this reboot. The CO Power cut-ins pull more from the cutscenes you mentioned (albeit more smoothly animated), whereas the character portraits, and the way they move, pull more from general sprite work in Half-Genie Hero onwards.
Check out this gif and you can see the way these characters move is not far off from what our COs are doing now:

I mean, the cutscenes wouldn't play for like, every mission lol. I mean, you have cutscenes placed at the right time at key moments in the story and whatnot. For an example...

• A cutscene in the game's intro
• A cutscene at the start of each Campaign
• 3-5 cutscenes throughout each Campaign
• 2 cutscenes for each Campaign's finale

I think something like that could be feasible and would give each story's Campaign a lot more life other than just text. TBH, I think that's what we would have got if the Advance Wars games were made in 2011/2013 on the 3DS instead of 2001/2003 on the GBA.

 

[Dr. Richie]

A while ago, a Smash website was created so that people could add and support their favorite characters. I added Andy to the poll since no one had. As of now, he has 170 votes! Here's a link to the website:

Global Smash Roster

www.globalsmashroster.com

 

[chocolatejr9]

A while ago, a Smash website was created so that people could add and support their favorite characters. I added Andy to the poll since no one had. As of now, he has 170 votes! Here's a link to the website:

Global Smash Roster

www.globalsmashroster.com

Sadly, that site is notoriously inaccurate. For example, the reason the TF2 cast is so popular is because somebody shared it on the TF2 subreddit.

 

[DNeon]

What have you seen?

"This looks like mobile game BS." - By far the most common, despite there being no single 'mobile game' monolith using 1 art style and a general inability to name any mobile games. At worst they mean it looks like a Supercell game which isn't even a bad thing, their art style is great.

"WayForward don't know what people liked about AW, they're already ruining it." - AW was only popular for pixel art that only took place in battle animations apparently.

"This reeks of corporate meddling, greedy management types cheaping out to make as much money as possible." - a big extrapolation from a change in art style.

"Advance Wars was never this childish and it's alienating adult fans/they won't let me feel like a war commander now." - aka gaming meets toxic machismo.

"[Some weird weeb **** about western animation all looking the same and being crap compared to anime stylings]" - I am a weeb but these attitudes are ridiculous.

Yeah, I've seen a LOT of bad takes, and that's not even including the amount of people who take a more mild stance on the "Advance Wars shouldn't lean this hard on the childish side" by completely misrepresenting the originals and thinking they were all more similar to DS in tone. They're not toxic but I just don't know if they really remember the first 2 games.

But yeah, the game will survive this because there's generally some good inertia behind it as Ura and meleebrawler pointed out, the series has been next to F-Zero in notably longing fans at Directs and we don't even have a Smash character (yet) to keep it relevant.

Despite the tweet I don't think there's going to be much changing from the preview, even in the art unfortunately as I do think the models could be improved (but not in need of an overhaul or anything just some tweaks). That said I do think the price point is a valid criticism if we have no promise of rebalancing or future content, but I will be buying it because value is subjective and it's worth it to me.

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

Ah I hear you. The price is the standard $60 isn’t it? So two games each worth $30 combined. I don’t understand the folks who question game worth. Yes Metroid Dread is going to be $60, have you even seen it? It’s gorgeous

 

[chocolatejr9]

Ah I hear you. The price is the standard $60 isn’t it? So two games each worth $30 combined. I don’t understand the folks who question game worth. Yes Metroid Dread is going to be $60, have you even seen it? It’s gorgeous

That's just an issue with gaming at the moment. First it was ports costing $60, then it was remakes, now it's 2D games. Some people...

 

[Ura]

"This looks like mobile game BS." - By far the most common, despite there being no single 'mobile game' monolith using 1 art style and a general inability to name any mobile games. At worst they mean it looks like a Supercell game which isn't even a bad thing, their art style is great.

"WayForward don't know what people liked about AW, they're already ruining it." - AW was only popular for pixel art that only took place in battle animations apparently.

"This reeks of corporate meddling, greedy management types cheaping out to make as much money as possible." - a big extrapolation from a change in art style.

"Advance Wars was never this childish and it's alienating adult fans/they won't let me feel like a war commander now." - aka gaming meets toxic machismo.

"[Some weird weeb **** about western animation all looking the same and being crap compared to anime stylings]" - I am a weeb but these attitudes are ridiculous.

Yeah, I've seen a LOT of bad takes, and that's not even including the amount of people who take a more mild stance on the "Advance Wars shouldn't lean this hard on the childish side" by completely misrepresenting the originals and thinking they were all more similar to DS in tone. They're not toxic but I just don't know if they really remember the first 2 games.

But yeah, the game will survive this because there's generally some good inertia behind it as Ura and meleebrawler pointed out, the series has been next to F-Zero in notably longing fans at Directs and we don't even have a Smash character (yet) to keep it relevant.

Despite the tweet I don't think there's going to be much changing from the preview, even in the art unfortunately as I do think the models could be improved (but not in need of an overhaul or anything just some tweaks). That said I do think the price point is a valid criticism if we have no promise of rebalancing or future content, but I will be buying it because value is subjective and it's worth it to me.

People complaining about the games being childish is absolutely hysterical to me because like, the originals weren't exactly known for being for adults lol. Hell, the director for Advance Wars 1 mentioned how they developed the first game with the intention of appealing to grade school kids but teenagers ended up liking the game more (hence why later games in the series weren't as light-hearted as the first).

Did these people somehow think they were going to remake these games in the style of Days of Ruin? Like honestly, what's wrong with these people lmao!

Also hysterical that people you make accusations about corporate meddling when they deadass left this series to rot for a decade and a half. If nothing else, they're giving this franchise the chance to live again because if it doesn't succeed, it's going right back to where it was before.

These people are so out of touch for real. I also see some people pointing to Dual Strike's artwork and being all like "this is how AW should look like" which is hilarious to me since that game (IMO) had the worst artstyle out of the 4 games (released in the West mind you).

Thankfully, these people seem to be in the minority since I have seen more positivity than negativity. A lot of people are genuinely hyped that this franchise is finally getting it's day after being slept on for as long as it did. This is reflected by the outpouring of support when the game was first shown off in the E3 Direct not to mention what I said before about this game being an Amazon Best Seller in just about every market (even outdoing WarioWare in some places).

Ah I hear you. The price is the standard $60 isn’t it? So two games each worth $30 combined. I don’t understand the folks who question game worth. Yes Metroid Dread is going to be $60, have you even seen it? It’s gorgeous

That's just an issue with gaming at the moment. First it was ports costing $60, then it was remakes, now it's 2D games. Some people...

Pretty much. People act like Nintendo is just porting the two GBA games and charging full price. Both games are being remade from the ground up with new 3D models, animations, and new online gameplay. Not to mention both of these games were $30-$40 when they were first on the market. Really wish people would stop acting like that over the price tag, they just bring down the mood.