Online Tourney Mode - Thought and Impressions

[1FC0]

I actually think that 1 stock 2.5 minutes is better than 2 stock 2.5 minutes becaus eit avoid Sudden Death. I'd rather have the game be based on a normal 1 stock match than have it be decided on a Sudden Death 1 stock match.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

I actually think that 1 stock 2.5 minutes is better than 2 stock 2.5 minutes becaus eit avoid Sudden Death. I'd rather have the game be based on a normal 1 stock match than have it be decided on a Sudden Death 1 stock match.

This. The two biggest flaws with tourney mode are:
-The awful internet connections (it's worse on Tourney mode and I'm not sure why)
-Sudden death. I can live with however many stocks they want, but I don't want to rely on SD

 

[DeDeDIke]

That makes me wonder what the FFA Smash tourney rules are now...

 

[Will]

team member #1: ok so everyone's complaining about the time limit, what should we do?

team member #2: i mean an extra minute isnt gonna hur-

that guy: ONE STOCK BABYYYYYYY

that guy proceeded to get a raise.

 

[Sucumbio]

It's two different ways of playing. The two plus stock game gives strangers more time to flesh out their opponent.

The one stock game is all about who can ko who first.

In the first you get a chance to come back if you lose your 1st stock.

In the second there's nothing you can do so you gotta be much more careful.

230 is plenty for a one stock though I've gone to SD twice in this new format.

230 for 2 stock is definitely too short 3 would be in line with the new mode in terms of SD frequency.

I prefer 2 stock because I usually lose the first stock first lol.

 

[1FC0]

-Sudden death. I can live with however many stocks they want, but I don't want to rely on SD

Sudden Death is not even close to being fair when it comes to matchups in general and even when the specific matchup is fair it is likely to be won by a lucky fluke.

But I find some consolation in that it's at least better than losing to a Bob-Omb being spawned on you after both players ledge camping for 6 minutes.

 

[Sucumbio]

Sudden Death is not even close to being fair when it comes to matchups in general and even when the specific matchup is fair it is likely to be won by a lucky fluke.

But I find some consolation in that it's at least better than losing to a Bob-Omb being spawned on you after both players ledge camping for 6 minutes.

What happens with the new SD when the two smallest characters stand nose to nose in the exact center and wait? I wonder if it's random who's kod or always left side player etc...

 

[1FC0]

What happens with the new SD when the two smallest characters stand nose to nose in the exact center and wait? I wonder if it's random who's kod or always left side player etc...

Never tried it, I think it's a highly unlikely situation in a serious match anyway. Though it does appear to me that the zooming in slows down or even stops after a while. I also just read that Bob-Ombs start falling in this mode after a while, though I have never had that happen to me, probably because this mode makes stalling a highly unviable strategy.

 

[IsmaR]

Don't mind the change from 2 to 1 stock so much as I wish they would have changed the stage rules up. Was under the impression they'd run BF instead of Omega.

 

[Sucumbio]

I'd love it set to random between the two.

 

[J.I.L]

BattleField is a toxic stage. Heck no. That stage should be classfied like the rest of the other stages on quickplay.

 

[1FC0]

BattleField is a toxic stage. Heck no. That stage should be classfied like the rest of the other stages on quickplay.

What is so toxic about it?

 

[J.I.L]

What is so toxic about it?

It’s breeds fricking swamp creatures and swamp monsters. Why else?

 

[DeDeDIke]

It’s breeds fricking swamp creatures and swamp monsters. Why else?

Care to explain what you mean by "swamp creatures and monsters"?

 

[1FC0]

It’s breeds fricking swamp creatures and swamp monsters. Why else?

I see no reason why it would be toxic. It has no good circling routes, no random hazards, no special places for infinites, no special camping places, and no other thing that is objectionable.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

What happens with the new SD when the two smallest characters stand nose to nose in the exact center and wait? I wonder if it's random who's kod or always left side player etc...

As a frequent in casual matches, what happens is of course it zooms in to the middle and then if no one does anything for, like, 10 seconds, bob-ombs start falling. Then it's just like regular sudden death, first to get blown up loses. This is where you try to cheese the bombs with shield, relfectors, etc.

 

[J.I.L]

Care to explain what you mean by "swamp creatures and monsters"?

Swamp creatures are people who pick BF stages and cheese on BF by doing standard toxic things like running up and around the flats like monkeys or hiding under flats like a bunker.

Swamp monsters are that but far worse. They are exceptionally hard to beat since they abuse BF with cheap disgusting and disgraceful. They aren’t even that good, but just incredibly abusive on BF stages. Worst offenders or candidates to likely be a swamp monster:
Snake
Robs
Mii gunners
Samus
Hero

These characters and players who use them on that wretched stage are just disgusting IMO. You don’t get anymore toxic then a swamp monster.


1FC0 youre probably a swamp monster.

 

[1FC0]

Swamp monsters are that but far worse. They are exceptionally hard to beat since they abuse BF with cheap disgusting and disgraceful. They aren’t even that good, but just incredibly abusive on BF stages.

It seems that you are a scrub. The reason that they are so hard to beat for you is that they outplay you.

Under a platform is no unbeatable camping spot since the camper's opponent can still approach without jank like having to jump over a pit or risking being thrown into a very nearby blast zone. In most match-ups you always have a reasonable set of options to approach the camper with — you just need to use them properly.

As for circling, you know you can just hit through the platforms, right? Being above the opponent is generally a disadvantageous state so circling requires the circler to put himself in a slight disadvantage. You can abuse this if you can outplay the opponent.

1FC0 1FC0 youre probably a swamp monster.

I take this as a compliment. Scrubs always designate people as cheap whenever those people far outmatch the scrub. Sure, the scrub has his excuses, but the real reason is always that he's just being outplayed hard and does not want to face the fact that someone out there is much better than he is. Unfortunately for the scrub, the scrub mentality keeps the scrub bad because he never improves since improving requires one to first acknowledge his flaws. Though luckily the scrub does not need to win to consider himself skilled, he just needs to have invalid excuses ready.

I used to have trouble with BF, but I acknowledged that was my own fault and played a lot on BF to fix it. Now my playstyle on BF has changed and BF has become a good stage for me. I guess that improving my skills made me a swamp monster.

 

[Sucumbio]

To BF or not to BF

https://smashboards.com/threads/battlefield-or-final-destination-stages.483508/

I personally think it's a key stage to learn. Learning FD, BF and SV involve all necessary elements to competition stage mechanics. Eliminating bf is eliminating how to use static platforms which only limits your ability.

While I don't like name calling the player who avoids a game mechanism is always at a disadvantage and if it's self imposed well that's just silly.

 

[J.I.L]

It seems that you are a scrub. The reason that they are so hard to beat for you is that they outplay you.

Under a platform is no unbeatable camping spot since the camper's opponent can still approach without jank like having to jump over a pit or risking being thrown into a very nearby blast zone. In most match-ups you always have a reasonable set of options to approach the camper with — you just need to use them properly.

As for circling, you know you can just hit through the platforms, right? Being above the opponent is generally a disadvantageous state so circling requires the circler to put himself in a slight disadvantage. You can abuse this if you can outplay the opponent.


I take this as a compliment. Scrubs always designate people as cheap whenever those people far outmatch the scrub. Sure, the scrub has his excuses, but the real reason is always that he's just being outplayed hard and does not want to face the fact that someone out there is much better than he is. Unfortunately for the scrub, the scrub mentality keeps the scrub bad because he never improves since improving requires one to first acknowledge his flaws. Though luckily the scrub does not need to win to consider himself skilled, he just needs to have invalid excuses ready.

I used to have trouble with BF, but I acknowledged that was my own fault and played a lot on BF to fix it. Now my playstyle on BF has changed and BF has become a good stage for me. I guess that improving my skills made me a swamp monster.

You dare trash talk me you swamper? I see Coolboy Has liked another post questioning my skill.
That's fine.

Set up a Battle arena both of you. Making an example of arrogant ignorance could give me great satisfaction.

Nice plug for my own thread Sucumbio But you're wrong. BF needs to be abolished and done away with in serious online game play just like smash 4 rightfully did. Hence why it is the best online mode smash has ever done. In their honor, when I play seriously online - my ruleset is 5 min 2 stock FD STAGE.

 

[Sucumbio]

I'm gonna move this bit to the other thread

let's stay on topic pls.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

Anyways, why is it that Tourney mode has such a bad connection almost always? Is it that all the Walmart-Wifi's come out to enjoy a tournament, or is it something silly like EVERYONE in the tournament is connected to each other?

It just seems too consistent to be one bad apple every tournament.

 

[Sucumbio]

I don't have lag issues so I can't comment specifically but have you researched all the blah blah on improving your connection or is it hopeless?

My advice to anyone that has consistent lag issues regardless of software / settings and hardware - including trying another Switch, etc. - give up before you hate the game. Brawl online lag used to make me want to throw the wii into the moon but it is what it is I count my blessings my setup works (when I have power thats is >.>)

 

[Call_Me_Red]

I don't have lag issues so I can't comment specifically but have you researched all the blah blah on improving your connection or is it hopeless?

My advice to anyone that has consistent lag issues regardless of software / settings and hardware - including trying another Switch, etc. - give up before you hate the game. Brawl online lag used to make me want to throw the wii into the moon but it is what it is I count my blessings my setup works (when I have power thats is >.>)

That's the thing, I have really solid games 90% of the time on Elite and Arenas, but tourney always plays in PowerPoint mode. I'm not sure why that is.

 

[Sucumbio]

That's very interesting. From what I understand even tournament mode follows the same matching scheme they've always used which is to base it on radius from you keeping nodes within the same regions etc. But maybe this is lesser a case in this mode because of the pools required... I've been in some 8 player tourneys during slow time. And it definitely can take longer than expected in between rounds... But if a match starts laggy it's usually able to sync up after a few seconds.

 

[Silask20]

Then i realized items were turned on. Seriously...

 

[Predatoria]

Hmmm what tournament is this? I must see!

Does Ridley count as heavy? He's kinda light, but biggish.

 

[Technourgos]

Hmmm what tournament is this? I must see!

Does Ridley count as heavy? He's kinda light, but biggish.

I believe it's the current online tournament that you can enter via online mode. I tend to wait for online tournaments to lack items and Final Smash meters. The first one I attended was rather large and I made it in first place. I worried over nothing. Getting first counts as an achievement, apparently.

 

[Sucumbio]

I'm gonna try it. I'm betting bowers ends up being the dominant finalist...

I also wish it was no items / fsm but I also which they'd change the no items tournaments they do run back to 2 stock...

 

[J.I.L]

Not sure if I have already said this, but online tourneys are a joke. I’ve stopped taking them seriously long ago. Winning the tourneys with my 3 mains used to be my warm-up. I once swept through an entire 32 man 1v1 tourney without losing a stock with my bowser jr. now on tourney, I just play bowser and troll either by side b-ing people off the stage (more effective the. You think) or just standing at the end of an flat stage and throwing people out of bounds. Lol. Tourneys aren’t places to find good comp. stick to BA or QP

 

[Sucumbio]

I'm not sure how Plant, The Belmonts, Samus/Dark, Wariio and Bowser Jr are considered heavies? I guess heavy doesn't necessarily mean large lol

I was literally expecting like 6 characters. Ike DK Bowser DDD KRool and Ganondorf.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

I'm not sure how Plant, The Belmonts, Samus/Dark, Wariio and Bowser Jr are considered heavies? I guess heavy doesn't necessarily mean large lol

I was literally expecting like 6 characters. Ike DK Bowser DDD KRool and Ganondorf.

I don't remember exactly where I read it (I think in the description of the event), but it's supposed to be the top 16(?) heaviest characters in the game. Past the top 5 there are a lot of liberties taken.

 

[IsmaR]

Anyone that shares the same weight as Ridley (for what I assume is thematic purposes) and above got included. I'd say it makes sense since it also made Wario eligible. Would have gone as far to say I wish they could have included Banjo & Kazooie/R.O.B./Snake (tied for 17th heaviest) and some way to include Charizard
(if they could turn off down B switching somehow)

That said, I had fun even if almost every tourney consisted of fighting Double Ganondorf/Bowser/DK every other (sometimes several in a row) round.

 

[J.I.L]

Anyone that shares the same weight as Ridley (for what I assume is thematic purposes) and above got included. I'd say it makes sense since it also made Wario eligible. Would have gone as far to say I wish they could have included Banjo & Kazooie/R.O.B./Snake (tied for 17th heaviest) and some way to include Charizard
(if they could turn off down B switching somehow)

That said, I had fun even if almost every tourney consisted of fighting Double Ganondorf/Bowser/DK every other (sometimes several in a row) round.

That tournament was SOOOOO FUN. I concur. All I did was pick bowser and side B people off the stage or run to the corner of the stage and throw people out of bounds. Loooooll. I had a troll fest with that tourney. Sighs..... that was truly fun.
Of course I teabagged, as well as also sabotaging anyone who disrupted my fun. So that means, if there was a character getting in the way of my trolling - I’d simply Pick out on of the other oppenets in the game an SD myself everytime he touched me. Causing everyone else in the room to lose the game - even the innocent fighter who didn’t do anything wrong. LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL.
even with this trolling, I still ended up winning a few tournaments as well. Loool.

 

[Tankdank]

I think there would have to specifications for stage types but those be set before the tournament begins. I.E. alll Omega or Battlefield or all as they come. Don't know if there would be a way for multi man tournie modes but that would be cool too. At least duos would be fun but wouldn't be as much without couch co-op.

 

[1FC0]

The first one I attended was rather large and I made it in first place. I worried over nothing. Getting first counts as an achievement, apparently.

Same for me, it was also 1v1 on FD so I thought that was the norm. Unfortunately later I saw that tournaments are often much smaller and FFA.

I'm having approximately 4 of every legend spirit now. Winning tournaments is really easy. It's fun for when I want to be reminded of For Glory where winning is also pretty much automatic, but for practice I go to Elite Smash.

I wish they could have included Banjo & Kazooie/R.O.B./Snake

Me too, I love fighting against heavies with R.O.B.. Looks like I narrowly missed out on this one.

 

[Technourgos]

I'm not sure how Plant, The Belmonts, Samus/Dark, Wariio and Bowser Jr are considered heavies? I guess heavy doesn't necessarily mean large lol

I was literally expecting like 6 characters. Ike DK Bowser DDD KRool and Ganondorf.

Quite frankly, I don't think Piranha Plant or the Belmonts should be heavy. There is a difference between heavy characters and big bodies, though. Big bodies are going to be heavy, but not all heavy characters are big bodies. Wario is actually 300 lbs. based on one of the manuals from one of his games. I'm convinced Samus' armor is 198 lbs. and that most people have confused her weight outside the armor with her armor. I suspect the soles of her boots of her armor add maybe an inch, so she'd probably be 6'2", not 6'3" outside her armor. Using Hamwi's method, Samus should weigh 170 lbs. Actress Gwendoline Christie, who played as Captain Phasma, stands at 6'3" and weighs 185 lbs., so that's not too far off. Adding Samus' weight with her armor's weight gives you 360 lbs. Samus is quite heavy. Dark Samus, however, may be heavier or lighter than Samus canonically. I don't know the density of Phazon, though.

 

[1FC0]

R.O.B. is actually pretty light canonically. Maybe around 1 KG.

 

[Silask20]

Quite frankly, I don't think Piranha Plant or the Belmonts should be heavy. There is a difference between heavy characters and big bodies, though. Big bodies are going to be heavy, but not all heavy characters are big bodies. Wario is actually 300 lbs. based on one of the manuals from one of his games. I'm convinced Samus' armor is 198 lbs. and that most people have confused her weight outside the armor with her armor. I suspect the soles of her boots of her armor add maybe an inch, so she'd probably be 6'2", not 6'3" outside her armor. Using Hamwi's method, Samus should weigh 170 lbs. Actress Gwendoline Christie, who played as Captain Phasma, stands at 6'3" and weighs 185 lbs., so that's not too far off. Adding Samus' weight with her armor's weight gives you 360 lbs. Samus is quite heavy. Dark Samus, however, may be heavier or lighter than Samus canonically. I don't know the density of Phazon, though.

Honestly samus shouldnt be heavy either. Heavy should be strictly for your big boys not someone in a lean suit thats supposedly heavy.

 

[Technourgos]

Honestly samus shouldnt be heavy either. Heavy should be strictly for your big boys not someone in a lean suit thats supposedly heavy.

That's a more recent appearance probably leaning toward streamlined armor, but the most recent Metroid game returned to Samus' older, albeit polished, armor. That's beefy.

R.O.B. is actually pretty light canonically. Maybe around 1 KG.

1.46 lbs., or 662 grams, actually.