Official Takamaru in Brawl Thread! *ADDED MORE MATERIAL*

[Lord_Deathborne]

As good a choice as Goemon is, his chances of getting in SSBB - as is the case with Simon Belmont - were cut considerably with Konami's inclusion of Solid Snake. Unless Nintendo decides to work only, or mostly - with Konami this time around, I don't see him getting in - which is a total bummer...

On the other hand, I see it as nearly impossible for Takamaru not to get in. He is one of the most requested characters on Sakurai's list, he would be another great representative of the classic Nintendo franchises, and, although his series was never released outside of Japan, he seems to be the type of character that would "translate" easily over to Western audiences. Being Link's spiritual "brother" dosen't hurt either (hopefully this will help Link's other spiritual sibling Mike Jones of Star Tropics... ).

 

[FlipTroopa]

A lot of people were shocked by Pit's inclusion (which in turn shocked me), because he's "obscure, too old-school." But if you were to think about it, Pit is from the same era as Link, Samus, Mario, Little Mac, Kirby, and so on... all the great franchises were being born in the late '80s/early '90s, and Kid Icarus was right up there with the rest of them for a few years. Pit was chosen to be used in both the Captain N TV show and comic, Kid Icarus was always talked about in magazines as one of those "up-and-coming" games to look out for (like they said about Zelda), and Kid Icarus was directed by the inventor of the Game Boy himself, Gunpei Yokoi, as a sister game to Metroid.

If anything, it's shocking Pit WASN'T in the original SSB OR Melee. He's the "long lost" brother of Samus and Link, who just never got a chance after he moved onto his portable sequel. Kid Icarus SNES was canned before it even got off the ground, and he was relegated to "obscure" status. But he's definitely not from the same "old-school" times as the Ice Climbers or Excitbike, no no. That's the Arcade/early NES generation, where games were simple and there was no intention of making franchises.

Takamaru falls into this same era of Nintendo history. Nazo no Murasamejou was launched besides Zelda on the Famicom Disk System, and was advertised heavily as its "sister game." In compilation soundtracks, even to this day, the two are thrown together, and back then you would hardpressed NOT to see them crossing paths as almost the same game.

But Zelda got the Western release, and because of that, it became more popular worldwide and warranted a sequel. Nazo was left behind, slowly fading into scant references and cameos here and there. But it too is from the Golden Era of Nintendo, the same time as Kid Icarus and Metroid and Zelda, so there is nothing holding back Takamaru from entering (maybe even with a redesign, like Pit's).

The way I see it, Nazo no Murasamejou is just another key franchise they have yet to touch upon. Just like Punch-Out, or Kid Icarus. When you want to talk about obscure characters that have a smaller chance of appearing, that's where you start running into Bubbles, Tamagon, and Urban Champion (though they too have recently seen the light of day again, thanks to the fancy "Retro" movement Nintendo started after Melee).

 

[Super Smash Master]

A lot of people were shocked by Pit's inclusion (which in turn shocked me), because he's "obscure, too old-school." But if you were to think about it, Pit is from the same era as Link, Samus, Mario, Little Mac, Kirby, and so on... all the great franchises were being born in the late '80s/early '90s, and Kid Icarus was right up there with the rest of them for a few years. Pit was chosen to be used in both the Captain N TV show and comic, Kid Icarus was always talked about in magazines as one of those "up-and-coming" games to look out for (like they said about Zelda), and Kid Icarus was directed by the inventor of the Game Boy himself, Gunpei Yokoi, as a sister game to Metroid.

If anything, it's shocking Pit WASN'T in the original SSB OR Melee. He's the "long lost" brother of Samus and Link, who just never got a chance after he moved onto his portable sequel. Kid Icarus SNES was canned before it even got off the ground, and he was relegated to "obscure" status. But he's definitely not from the same "old-school" times as the Ice Climbers or Excitbike, no no. That's the Arcade/early NES generation, where games were simple and there was no intention of making franchises.

Takamaru falls into this same era of Nintendo history. Nazo no Murasamejou was launched besides Zelda on the Famicom Disk System, and was advertised heavily as its "sister game." In compilation soundtracks, even to this day, the two are thrown together, and back then you would hardpressed NOT to see them crossing paths as almost the same game.

But Zelda got the Western release, and because of that, it became more popular worldwide and warranted a sequel. Nazo was left behind, slowly fading into scant references and cameos here and there. But it too is from the Golden Era of Nintendo, the same time as Kid Icarus and Metroid and Zelda, so there is nothing holding back Takamaru from entering (maybe even with a redesign, like Pit's).

The way I see it, Nazo no Murasamejou is just another key franchise they have yet to touch upon. Just like Punch-Out, or Kid Icarus. When you want to talk about obscure characters that have a smaller chance of appearing, that's where you start running into Bubbles, Tamagon, and Urban Champion (though they too have recently seen the light of day again, thanks to the fancy "Retro" movement Nintendo started after Melee).

If you put it that way, Takamaru almost has to be included. It's a shame we didnt get him in the states, but we got Star Tropics to make up for it.

 

[Sinistar71]

This Takamaru character sounds like a fine addition to the smash bros. roster, my only regret is that I've never played any of his games. I would be cool to have a Link VS. Marth VS. Takamaru ultmate swordsman event.

 

[FlipTroopa]

If anyone wants to play his game, *ahem* e-mail me and I can tell you about it >.>

It's really just a pure action version of Zelda, set in Japan. It's pretty awesome, because you're constantly flashing your blade and killing ninjas and stuff. The powerups are nice too, like the power to walk on water or turn invisible

 

[Super Smash Master]

So basically it's like if Jesus was a samurai?

 

[FlipTroopa]

So basically it's like if Jesus was a samurai?

That's exactly it! I was looking for the right words, and you just took em right out of my mouth!

 

[Super Smash Master]

Jesus for Brawl!

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

So basically it's like if Jesus was a samurai?

Samurai Jesus...
I'm going to Hell for sure now...

EDIT: Suddenly, I'm reminded of that Kill Bill skit starring Jesus on that show Robot Chicken.

 

[100links]

Jesus for Brawl!

lol i can see his brawl attack he calls for god to smite them and he wins automatically

 

[Super Smash Master]

Samurai Jesus...
I'm going to Hell for sure now...

EDIT: Suddenly, I'm reminded of that Kill Bill skit starring Jesus on that show Robot Chicken.

You mean Kill Bunny.

 

[FlipTroopa]

Like I did for Joy Mech Fight, I'll update this puppy with some game footage, maybe tonight, maybe tomorrow, maybe later this week. But I'll do it, by Jove! You all must see how fun a game you could be playing

 

[GenG]

Takamaru is a sure bet, but I think his samurai swordplay may collide with Lyndis one. Do you think there is room for two extremely fast samurais? I'd rather drop Lyndis for Takamaru, but if he gets the Samurai Shodown's samurai style (like Mitsurugi in SC), both will be great.

Nazo no Murasame is considered the father of the actual hack'n'slash games, aka "me versus the whole neighbourhood", like Dinasty Warriors, Berserk, Devil May Cry and Onimusha. A 3D version of Nazo no Murasame would be pretty similar to Onimusha.

 

[xianfeng]

so he's a samurai Link? look's ok I don't want him in over characters from games that are recognisable.

 

[Doggalina]

so he's a samurai Link? look's ok I don't want him in over characters from games that are recognisable.

If I'm not mistaken, Kid Icarus was a sister game to Metroid just as Nazo no Murasaemjou was a sister game to Zelda.

Of course Nazo no Murasaemjou isn't recognizable to you. It was Japan only.

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

Also, the mere fact that it isn't WIDELY recognized shouldn't be the ultimate detirmining factor anyway. AC's Tom Nook and the Duck Hunt dog may be widely recognized, but it dosen't neccesarily make them the best suggestions (and I know many disagree with on those two - but it seems recognizability is the ONLY reason they've been mentioned at all...).

Also, I notice that you currently have a total of 666 posts (at the time of this posting) FlipTroopa - you haven't been possessed by Satan yet, have you?

 

[#HBC | marshy]

What a coincedence that Fliptroopa is suggesting Jesus samurai when he has 666 posts. I'm still not too sure, I know he can fit into Brawl easily, but there are just too many characters I already want in.

btw Deathborne, I meant to go to one of the banner shops in the art emporium and ask them to make your sig. Sorry that I wasn't clear on that.

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

The Anti-Christ!!!

Yeah, I'll check into that. Thanks Marshigio.

 

[FlipTroopa]

I shook it off kids, don't worry

 

[xianfeng]

If I'm not mistaken, Kid Icarus was a sister game to Metroid just as Nazo no Murasaemjou was a sister game to Zelda.

Of course Nazo no Murasaemjou isn't recognizable to you. It was Japan only.

how was kid icarus a sister game to metroid it takes place with all the greek mythology and stuff but metroid is all futuristic.

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

I shook it off kids, don't worry

"The Force is strong with this one."

 

[Doggalina]

how was kid icarus a sister game to metroid it takes place with all the greek mythology and stuff but metroid is all futuristic.

Do some research, buddy. Or read the newest Game Informer.
All you had to do was read some of the Kid Icarus Wikipedia article.

Kid Icarus was based on the Metroid game engine and contained both side and vertical scrolling action sequences. In fact, both games were released on the same day with the same "Password Pak" selling point. (However, the Famicom Disk System version featured save slots, unlike the NES version of the game which has a password system [known in-game as "Sacred Words"].) Metroid went on to become a major Nintendo franchise while Kid Icarus became a cult classic.

Also, there are enemies that look strangely like Metroids in Kid Icarus.

Do you believe me now?

 

[FlipTroopa]

Kid Icarus was pushed heavily as part of the "Major Franchises" during the days of the NES, actually. It saw its GB sequel, just like Metroid did, and was featured just as much as the other major titles of the time (Legend of Zelda, Metroid, Mario, Castlevania, Mega Man).

That's why a lot of older gamers always saw Pit in the same league as Link and Samus, because he WAS. It's a lot different nowadays since people who are currently in their mid-teens were born in the '90s, and thus have no recollection of the games, so it's always been really "retro" to them (the same way 20 and 30 years always saw characters like Pac-Man, who THEIR older brothers and sisters were familiar with).

The only reason Kid Icarus wasn't continued is because the creator, Gunpei Yokoi, had focused on other projects, such as the Virtual Boy, and was soon tragically killed in a car accident If he had not passed, there would likely have been a Super Kid Icarus. But the failure of the Virtual Boy had given him reason to leave Nintendo and form his own studio in '96, the same year he died.

 

[GenG]

Pit may not be starring game but he is not dead. He got a trophy in Melee and I heard he was about to enter (I have heard about all nintendo characters almost entering... *sigh*). In 2003-2004, a rumor popped up about a Kid Icarus sequel on GC and Miyamoto even left clues in many interviews. Kid Icarus was ported to GBA in the Famicom Anniversary series, but didn't came to the States.

And about Gunpei Yokoi, he wasn't busy, he LEFT Nintendo and he was working on the Bandai's WonderSwan some time before the accident.

Takamaru is like Pit, but only for Japan. There was even a vynil disc featuring music from both Zelda and Nazo no Murasame at the time, and Japanese gamers never forgot them. Nazo no Murasame was ported to the Famicom Anniversary series too (again, only in Japan). Someone resurrect him! Sakurai!

 

[#HBC | marshy]

This annoys me, Meta-knight, Sigurd, Balloon Fighter, and Pit Kid Icarus were all planned sometime during SSB64-SSBM production, but were excluded. Oh well, at least we got them in Brawl(although Balloon Fighter is questionable, Sigurd will definetly be in)

Anyway, this guy seems cool, cooler than Pit. I change my mind, I'd like to see him in Brawl.

 

[Super Smash Master]

This annoys me, Meta-knight, Sigurd, Balloon Fighter, and Pit Kid Icarus were all planned sometime during SSB64-SSBM production, but were excluded. Oh well, at least we got them in Brawl(although Balloon Fighter is questionable, Sigurd will definetly be in)

Anyway, this guy seems cool, cooler than Pit. I change my mind, I'd like to see him in Brawl.

Do you have any evidence of that?

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

While Balloon Fighter and Sigurd did make it into SSBM at some point during the Beta stage (ultimately replaced by the Ice Climbers and Roy respectively), I think Metaknight and Pit may have been present in a crude form, as Mach Rider supposedly did, only to get shafted due to time restraints. Sonic and Snake may have been tinkered with a bit just before release (while Sakurai did say Kojima's request for Snake was too late into the game's production, it dosen't mean there was NO effort to include him or atleast experiment with him to test for feasability).

EDIT: I was off topic, but back on the subject: Takamaru for SSBB!

 

[Super Smash Master]

Any links that can verify this information?

 

[#HBC | marshy]

Honestly, no. I remember someone had a link to it in another thread, at least for balloon fighter. Come on, surely other people have heard of this right?

It makes sense though, they put in Roy over Sigurd(they were considering Sigurd because he was the most popular lord in Japan) for advertisement. They wanted to revive Pit, but instead put in the most popular pokemon in Japan(Jigglypuff). Metaknight was very popular among Kirby fans, and they probably wanted to revive Balloon Fighter too.

 

[FlipTroopa]

Honestly, no. I remember someone had a link to it in another thread, at least for balloon fighter. Come on, surely other people have heard of this right?

It makes sense though, they put in Roy over Sigurd(they were considering Sigurd because he was the most popular lord in Japan) for advertisement. They wanted to revive Pit, but instead put in the most popular pokemon in Japan(Jigglypuff). Metaknight was very popular among Kirby fans, and they probably wanted to revive Balloon Fighter too.

They had OODLES of ideas since the first SSB they tried to carry over the Melee, namely the characters you mention here, but they really ran into trouble. Time constraints and, to an extent, space restraints. They simply did not have the time to create a few more precious full-fledged characters, so they went along with clones. The clones also sprang up because they felt they needed to push the roster as far as possible past the original...

As for JPuff, she was actually going to be dropped. Sakurai says so on the Japanese Melee site. But the team realized that even she had her fans, and ditched whatever character was replacement to reinclude her.

Balloon Fighter was originally there, but they realized the Ice Climbers had more potential, and were more well-liked by Japanese poll submissions.

Sigurd was there, along with Marth, but Roy replaced him because Nintendo wanted to advertise the new FE. That and Sigurd was a clone anyways, I believe.

Meta Knight and Pit were planned since the first along with Peach and Bowser, but were ultimately excluded on accounts of: A) time, B) space, and C) Nintendo. Nintendo was pushing them to include more recognizable and pop characters than the obscure, feeling that trophies were a better means of getting people like Bubbles across to fans. While it is true that the mainstream gamer is more apt to play Smash Bros. if it consists of mostly character he knows (hence the 7 Mario characters, 5 Zelda characters, 4 Pokemon, and 2 Star Fox), Sakurai was upset by this, and is pretty much using the guise of his 3rd party team to include the obscure and personal fave character he always wanted (i.e. Meta Knight and Pit).

Sonic and Snake were both considered for Melee, but I don't think tested at all. Just considered.

And on an aside, when Smash was first announced, it was meant to be mostly Mario characters. It was Sakurai who proposed that they instead opt for more of a Nintendo Universe flavor, if I'm not mistaken. But when it was first announced, I remember it being pushed heavily that the game would be starring, essentially, the cast of Mario Kart 64, along with maybe Link, Kirby, and some obscure favorites. So it would've been more like a Mario Hoops or RPG, where it's pretty much all Mario, with a few cameos.

 

[Super Smash Master]

Okay, I believe you. That was a very interesting story. I'd like G4's Game Makers/Icons to do a show about SSB. It'd be interesting.

 

[Lord_Deathborne]

I hate G4... I'll never forgive them for: a) killing TechTV and b) abandoning their original gamer fanbase... and then trying to bring them back by airing Star Trek. Let me just get something straight: gamer ≠ trekkie ; they seem to think that there is some kind of uniform "nerd" demographic - what bleeding ignorance! Also, what the f### does The Man Show, Fastlane, Street Fury, etc. have to do with gaming?! Well at least Banzai's somewhat relevant... And they completely butchered icons and filter: how I miss Diane Mizota... and that Beth O. ***** sucks! And who gives a flippin' f### about Suicide Girls and the like (on the new "icons")! And what's up with the new Cheat? - The hostess is a twit and half the games they feature are the ones no self respecting gamer would be caught dead playing (i.e. King Kong). The ONLY thing I still watch is X-Play - the last remnant of my beloved TechTV... and even that is nowhere as good as it used to be... Sorry, I got a little carried away... As you can see, there's some bad blood between me and G4, so much so that I now refer to the shallow "gamer in name only" crowd as G4mers. Oh well... shutting up... [/rant]

Back on top, you are more than likely right about Snake and Sonic, FlipTroopa; I just wanted to throw out a wild hypothetical.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

Just about everyone hates G4 nowadays

Also, when was the last time Takamaru had a game? And is Nintendo planning on having a new game for him anytime soon?

 

[Super Smash Master]

I hate G4... I'll never forgive them for: a) killing TechTV and b) abandoning their original gamer fanbase... and then trying to bring them back by airing Star Trek. Let me just get something straight: gamer ? trekkie ; they seem to think that there is some kind of uniform "nerd" demographic - what bleeding ignorance! Also, what the f### does The Man Show, Fastlane, Street Fury, etc. have to do with gaming?! Well at least Banzai's somewhat relevant... And they completely butchered icons and filter: how I miss Diane Mizota... and that Beth O. ***** sucks! And who gives a flippin' f### about Suicide Girls and the like (on the new "icons")! And what's up with the new Cheat? - The hostess is a twit and half the games they feature are the ones no self respecting gamer would be caught dead playing (i.e. King Kong). The ONLY thing I still watch is X-Play - the last remnant of my beloved TechTV... and even that is nowhere as good as it used to be... Sorry, I got a little carried away... As you can see, there's some bad blood between me and G4, so much so that I now refer to the shallow "gamer in name only" crowd as G4mers. Oh well... shutting up... [/rant]

Back on top, you are more than likely right about Snake and Sonic, FlipTroopa; I just wanted to throw out a wild hypothetical.

Frankly, the only shows on G4 I like are Icons (When they talk about games) and X-Play (Even though it sucks now..). I think the whole station is a load of ****. I especially hate the people on Cheat and former Judgement Day. They are always ******** and poke fun at Nintendo. They always called them kiddy which pissed me the **** off. **** you Tommy Teleroco. **** you in the ***.

 

[TAMASHI]

Thumbs up to Takamaru in Brawl =D

 

[Super Smash Master]

Yay for Samurais!

 

[FlipTroopa]

Takamaru was only in one game, Nazo no Murasame, HOWEVER, and I'll say it again for simplicity's sake, it was selected to be included in the Famicom Anniversary Collection for GBA, and the actual game disk of Nazo appears in Pikmin 2 as one of the treasures.

As for outside of games (one game, one cameo, one re-release), Nazo was sold alongside Legend of Zelda on the Famicom Disk System for years, and is regularly included in Nintendo Music Remix compilations (if my external HDD were working, I'd upload and link to a few of the files myself, but for now, try Galbadia Hotel.

Bizarrely enough, and to our good fortune, Takamaru himself appears three times within Sakurai's "Selected Submissions" on the Japanese Smash Dojo. He also pops up from time to time in Nintendo fanart over in the East (just surf a few oekakis some day; you'll find him). He's a lot like Pit in many respects, because he hasn't seen a new game in over a decade, but is still fondly and regularly recalled by the gaming community.

And, I promised footage, so I'll get on that when I can. I swear

 

[Super Smash Master]

I wonder if there is a fan translation for Nazo no Murasame.

 

[FlipTroopa]

I wonder if there is a fan translation for Nazo no Murasame.

There is, and I use it

 

[Super Smash Master]

Could you PM me the link to it (since linking to roms is probably not allowed)?