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That’s not how it works. You drop through the platform if you keep holding down. If your shine connects, you have some more frames additional timing to let go of down. If you don’t connect the shine, but still let go of down on the control stick on the next frame, you won’t drop through either.
No. Extreme potential for degenerate camping (and in many cases outright unbeatable stalling) on both the clouds and the platforms, and the edges are bad (edgeguarding, wavedashing to grab the ledge, and options from the ledge are messed up because they slope upwards). There are also the slopes in the main stage that slightly interfere with lots of of things.
WowWelcome to the Question & Answer Thread and FAQ's
This thread's purpose is to try and keep the melee discussion board from being so cluttered and give those that are new to the game or those that have just a general question about the game to come here and ask! Everyone here is willing to help you, so don't be afraid to ask even the dumbest question! As long as it goes in here, you probably won't get trolled...probably
Also anyone feel free to IM me about this thread and smash in general, I love talking about smash online.
A Guide About Competitive Smash by SCOTU This a really good guide made by SCOTU, some of it is brawl material, but the general concepts apply. Read it.
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Fun stuff to read
The almighty Magus DI Thread (Credit Witchking for Compiling)
Witchking Compilation of frame data
Mew2King's SSBM Statistics List
Out of Shield options frame data by Wiseman
The Official Everything Thread - The Basics, How to Improve, Frame Data, etc
FAQ’s
What is a frame?
A frame is 1/60th of a second, so 60 frames = 1 second.
How do I L cancel?
There are three timings to L cancelling: hitting nothing, hitting an opponent, hitting multiple opponents (ice climbers, teams, hitting shy guys on YS, etc), and hitting a shield. Each three have varied timings for each aerial. The only real way to get better at l cancelling is practicing.
How do I practice L cancelling on a shield if I don’t have anyone to play?
Go grab a rubber band, and around another controller wrap the rubber band around L or R and just go play.
What is DI, SDI, and ASDI and how are they different?
DI is your directional influence. After you are hit by an attack you are sent away in a direction depending on the attack. DI affects the trajectory at which you are flying at after you are hit. The better your DI is, the higher chance you have at living at higher %. There are frames of hitlag where you are frozen right before you are sent flying by an attack. During these frames, you can move using Smash DI. If you smash the control stick in that hitlag, your character “teleports” to that direction. It isn’t a very big difference, but enough to save yourself (Sdi’ing a fox uair). Automatic smash Di, or ASDI, occurs on the 1st frame of hitlag. The game reads the position of the stick on the frame of hitlag. C stick out prioritizes the control stick in this situation. The difference between SDI and ASDI is that ASDI doesn’t send you as far as SDI.
So…what are the best ways to DI?
Well it depends on the situation. If you want to DI out of a combo, You most likely hold away along with another direction depending on the move. If you want to survive a hit, like Marth’s fmash, then you want to survival DI, which is perpendicular to the trajectory that the move is sending you. For SDI and ASDI, it depends on what you are trying to do. Sometimes people try to SDI and ASDI into the stage so that they can tech. Other times they try to avoid follow ups, like the second hit of fox’s uair. Other times we try to tech on the stage so we SDI or ASDI in towards the stage so we don’t die from an edgeguard. It’s really situational depending on what you are trying to do.
Who should I main?
We can’t tell you. It all depends on how you want to play. For example, I love playing as sheik, but I don’t think most others do. I just find her enjoyable to play as. It’s all about preference, so take time to figure it out.
What exactly is CC?
CC is crouch cancelling. When you are hit while you are crouching, your knockback is reduced and hitstun is reduced apparently. You can also crouch cancel to cancel a dash. At low percentages you don’t fall over and can react with a variety of things, but when you start getting to higher percentages you fall and you can get wrecked…or you can tech it.
What are all these grabs?
Well theres your basic standing grab, dash grab, jump cancel (jc) grab, boost grab, pivot grab, and dash dance grab. The first two are exactly what their name implies. A jump cancelled grab is a grab where you dash, jump then grab before you start the jump animation. A boost grab is where you cancel the dash attack animation with a grab. A pivot grab is when you utilize the pivot, where you dash, then dash back into the neutral position instead of dashing the opposite direction, and grab. A dash dance grab is also exactly what it sounds like. When you dash dance, then grab. Each is good in its own right. You rarely use standing and dash grab. JC grab almost always > dash grab. Boost grab is really only good for the characters that gain momentum in their dash attacks, as they speed up when they grab, giving them a slight frame advantage. Pivot grabs are good for chaingrabing characters or for spacing, and same with DD grabs.
When Can I tech?
You can tech within 20 frames of hitting the ground, and then you can’t try for another 40.
What is buffering?
Out of a shield you can buffer an attack so that it does what you are imputing as soon as possible. You can jump cancel an upsmash, roll, jump and side dodge.
My favorite question: What button should I use for *insert command*?
WHATEVER THE **** YOU WANT
I'm going to my first tournament, what should I expect??
Don’t, for the love of god, expect to win. Come expecting to give it everything you’ve got and play to win, but don’t feel disappointed if you don’t come in first, or top 15, or make it out of pools even. Some of these players have been playing this game for 4-5 years, maybe more. Even if you haven’t heard their name, it doesn’t mean they still aren’t good. But come to play, come to win, but most importantly come to have fun. Be open with the players that are there. There is seriously nothing like the melee community. You will be glad you are apart of it. But again I digress. Please never expect anyone to have a controller for you. It is your responsibility to bring a controller to play with, besides, I personally like to play with a controller I know will work and know the ins and outs of. Don’t be late, don’t be late in your games, don’t john, don’t complain unless its legit, be a good sport. As far as money, it will usually cost 5-10 dollars for teams and another 5-15 dollars for singles. Plus, you will want money for food and drink, as these tournaments last the whole day. So 45-50 dollars is more than enough. Just be ready, don’t be an ***, and be prepared to meet a ton of new people and have a lot of fun!
Read this . Help TO's out in anyway you can, even if it means just not being late to the tourney, playing your matches when your supposed to, and cleaning up after yourself.
If I missed any or more pop up let me know and I will edit this
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So for the love of all things beautiful..
USE THIS THREAD
The thing about light shield for WD OOS is it makes it much smoother. If you hard press you have to release shield then mash it then release it then mash it again, but for light press you just have to press in harder to trigger the airdodge then let go slightly to bring up the shield again. However you cannot power shield with a light press of the shoulder button.
Or you can just use the other shield trigger in tandem....I actually find that method much easier whether I'm light shielding or full shielding.
Yeah I guess that could be easier
In order to be able to find the most appropriate solutions for your nerves, you need to explore what specific things make you choke (fear of looking bad in front of your opponent, fear of not performing to your potential, being recorded, etc.) and what the symptoms of that choking are (technical flubs, distracting thoughts, choosing greedy panic options that you wouldn't normally do, etc.). That way you have a clear idea of what you should be improving (rather than a nebulous idea of "not choking"), and you're able to measure the results of your solutions effectively. Being aware of what's happening during the game and the specific instances where your choking manifests itself is important, since you need it in order to adjust/fix your play mid-game.
Thanks for the tips, I was starting to get into music, but my headphones broke; solid reminder to get a new pair ahha! Also, the money match idea is pretty good, definitely gonna try that out.
to add to what stride was saying, i find with myself that when i start playing poorly is when i become more focused on what my character is doing (combo execution, movement, etc.) then what my opponent is doing and then i get punished for not thinking enough about my opponent. So when i start playing bad i usually remind myself to refocus on what they are doing and not worry about where i am.
You only have a short distance to dash and then dash the other way without turn lag, it's call "dash dance distance". Ice climbers have a more useful wave dash then their dash dance, but just practice dashing back and forth quickly then delaying it by a bit to find the max distance. Fox, Falcon and Marth have awesome dash dances.
Melee is the most popular it's ever been and still growing even though it's almost 14 years old now..
Yep, and on top of all that, if people start thinking it's "not worth it" to start, then the community will die faster. If you play it, it literally makes it "worth it".
Would Puff be a good character as well? I would think yes, but at my local scene we have only 1 puff, so I don't have a lot of data to back it up.
No, I'd strongly recommend against that unless you want to main Puff.
Whoever you plan on maining. Wavedash input timing varies for each character, based on the amount of Jumpsquat frames (frames that you're on ground after a jump input, before being airborne).
I agree that Jigglypuff is not a good first character to learn, but I also don't think Falcon is.
HDTV's make a huge difference, but if you've never played on a CRT before then you wouldn't be able to tell. You should get a CRT (also Melee is hard)I obviously know about the delay associated with HDTVs, but to how much of a degree will this affect my game? I've been in training mode with Fox just grinding out movement and basic stuff like wavedashing applications, SHFFL, etc just because PM has probably spoiled me with how much easier the inputs are. It's still super hard, and I'm hoping that it has something to do with the TV and not just how bad I am.
Yeah it becomes really noticeable once you're familiar with CRTs, to the point of frustration if I have to play on even the most minimally laggy setups.I obviously know about the delay associated with HDTVs, but to how much of a degree will this affect my game? I've been in training mode with Fox just grinding out movement and basic stuff like wavedashing applications, SHFFL, etc just because PM has probably spoiled me with how much easier the inputs are. It's still super hard, and I'm hoping that it has something to do with the TV and not just how bad I am.
Yeah I figured the "Melee is hard" thing was going to be the response. I'll look for a CRT I suppose. Thanks for the info people.
Melee may be hard, but it's probably worth the learning, it seems that P:M is dying off to some extent what with Nintendos lack of support and VGBC (and others') lack of streaming.
It takes a long time, like upwards of a year for most people, to get somewhat decent at the game. The only way to expedite this is with a lot of dedication: you have to practice a lot to get your tech skill down, you have to play a lot of people, you have to enter tournaments, you have to analyze your own gameplay to see what you are doing wrong (or get other people to help with that), and you have to analyze pro gameplay to see what makes them so good. It'll still take a long time though.
Wow, my friend told me it would take a while, but I didn't expect this long! Would it take a year to be able to beat regular people at tournaments, or is it gradual? Thanks, I'll try my best.
Yeah basically just try to play as much as you can against the best players you can find, and study your gameplay.
You get out what you put into it. Unfortunately, if you are working hard but not smart, it can take you way longer than someone else who isn't working as hard. Fortunately, there's now tons of tools and resources out there to help you learn and improve smart these days. When I started, I had no one to play, no 20xx, and no YouTube. Identify the most useful tools and resources and apply them as intelligently as possible.
