Official "Ask Chip Stuff... about Stuff" Thread

[Chip.]

Title explains the purpose of the thread. Or I hope so anyway.

This thread is designed to intelligently discuss and examine various aspects surrounding young Link in the competitive enviornment and also to explore solutions to problems all competitive young Link players may face in tournaments. Sometimes we as individual young Link players may not be able to discover answers to challenges that are too overwhelming on our own. So that's where this thread comes in.


To make this sound simpler, you basically can ask questions on this thread and they will be discussed and then answered by me (or any other young Link player who knows the answer). Please try and make a significant number of the questions young Link related to prevent the thread from being closed due to spam.

But of course other questions are welcome and encouraged.

I will edit some of the better questions and answers to this first post.

If I feel your question asked is not legit or worth answering, I will likely answer it with a heavily sarcastic comment. These will probably be the answers most worth reading (This is answering Cactuar style! As well as the title being plagerized).

You may also bring up casual discussions and serious debates as well in this thread with intelligent posting; this was the Official Discussion Thread after all until I decided to change it.

I decided that the young Link forums as a whole should probably get some activity going here.



So let's discuss.

Update! -

I will now be editing links to posts on this thread to the first post; primarily I will host a number of links to posts that are discussing various charachter matchups, tactics and strategies, best stage choices and so forth. You'll see what I mean.

Charachter Match-ups:


-Falco-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3454325&postcount=26

-Sheik-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3490171&postcount=60
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3490484&postcount=62

-Samus-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3474610&postcount=49





Edge Guarding:

-Fox-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3610641&postcount=140

-Sheik-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3497201

-Marth-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3610641&postcount=140





Sheild Pressure:

-Fox-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3591341&postcount=127





Killing:

-General Killing Attacks-
http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=3608043&postcount=138















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Now this is completely unrelated but -





1,000 Post! I'm a Smash Lord! Yhayuuuuuuuz!

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Alright, now ask your questions

 

[adaptor17]

i know most of the advanced techniques and combos for young link, but surprisingly wavedashing is not one of them. when i first looked into wavedashing, i started trying it out w/ luigi because he has one of the worst tractions. after getting a hang of it i tried it on young link and it didnt seem to work. yes, i know that young link's traction is much better and that there won't be a dramatic length of a wavedash, but i don't see him move at all when i do it. do you think its just a lack of experience on my part? im kinda lookin 4 a little advice on specific controls on wavedashing. and if possible, a video of young link wavedashing would be amazing.please and thank you.

 

[Chip.]

i know most of the advanced techniques and combos for young link, but surprisingly wavedashing is not one of them. when i first looked into wavedashing, i started trying it out w/ luigi because he has one of the worst tractions. after getting a hang of it i tried it on young link and it didnt seem to work. yes, i know that young link's traction is much better and that there won't be a dramatic length of a wavedash, but i don't see him move at all when i do it. do you think its just a lack of experience on my part? im kinda lookin 4 a little advice on specific controls on wavedashing. and if possible, a video of young link wavedashing would be amazing.please and thank you.

Yup, that's about all it takes: practice. I really can't give much more advice than that unfortunately . But you see, the only answer to master a Technical Skill in smash (or mastering anything in life really) is giving up some time of your day, sit down, and do some sheer hard-core training on what your working on: wavedashing. The only other bit of advice I can say is after you get the timing down on wavedashing, you must learn to tilt the Control Stick in-and-above the diagonal mark to perform a PERFECT wavedash. Perfect wavedashes are much more useful than normal crappy ones (in terms of how far the wavedash goes) and are standard in competitive play. Young Link has a mediocre wavedash; he basically has a balanced level of traction so he has a sufficient wavedash, but nothing incredible. That's why perfect wavedashing is also more useful with him.

So yeah, practice makes perfect. That's about it.

Oh yeah, your welcome on the help too . Anytime!

 

[Cactuar]

If I feel your question asked is not legit or worth answering, I will likely answer it with a heavily sarcastic comment. These will probably be the answers most worth reading (This is answering Cactuar style!).

I approve of doing things my way.

 

[Chip.]

I approve of doing things my way.

thx =) 10 char

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

Here is my question: You actually made an "official discussion thread" about Young Link in the midst of a Young Link forum?
...
...
...
HAHAAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!!

 

[Chip.]

Here is my question: You actually made an "official discussion thread" about Young Link in the midst of a Young Link forum?
...
...
...
HAHAAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!!

Please let's not try and get too much spam on this topic. These forums lack activity and I'm just trying to revive it a little bit. Can we get a useful question?

 

[Wikipedia]

I guess I've been curious about Y. Link lately and I'm too lazy to do my own research and stuff.

So I'm a Falcon main and there are certain inescapable combos that you can do against certain characters at certain percents. For example, you can always up throw to knee a Falco or Fox at 98%.

My question is, what kind of these combos can Y. Link do? Please list the percent because it is far to vague to say, "Y. Link can up-smash to Dair Fox." That combo won't work at 0% so there for Y. Link technically can not do that combo on Fox...but only at certain percents. That's why listed the percents is useful.

Sorry for the rant but other character forums often "share" combos this way (without listed percents or even against what character) and I don't find it useful because then I have to go research for myself at what percent it will work.


Thanks.

 

[D20]

I'm fairly sure that dthrow > dsmash works against Sheik from about 30% - 120%.

What are the dthrow > dair percents on characters? I typically play it safe and just uair, but I'd like to know which dairs are automatic.

 

[Chip.]

I guess I've been curious about Y. Link lately and I'm too lazy to do my own research and stuff.

So I'm a Falcon main and there are certain inescapable combos that you can do against certain characters at certain percents. For example, you can always up throw to knee a Falco or Fox at 98%.

My question is, what kind of these combos can Y. Link do? Please list the percent because it is far to vague to say, "Y. Link can up-smash to Dair Fox." That combo won't work at 0% so there for Y. Link technically can not do that combo on Fox...but only at certain percents. That's why listed the percents is useful.

Sorry for the rant but other character forums often "share" combos this way (without listed percents or even against what character) and I don't find it useful because then I have to go research for myself at what percent it will work.


Thanks.

Young Link has some beefy combos on all weight classes n_n (floaty, semi-floaty, fast faller, etc). I'm not entirely sure if I can answer your question completely since I don't know what certain charachters your refering to to unleash these "definite" combos on. But I'll just list them anyway; let's take a look:

I'm going to go off on a small tangent now. I remember G-reg posted a thread that is exactly what your talking about with Falcon's "definite" combos; one's where almost no matter which way your opponent DIs the Up/Down throw against Falcon they will always get a killer knee in the face. So, from this, I'm assuming you're asking if young Link has any "definite KILLING" combos like Captain.

Young Link does have an ancient combo still used today much like this, in which I dub: the Bomb Plant combo. Now to be clear, young Link has more complex combos that end with KOs at specific percentages, but I'm going to elaborate on the Bomb Plant. Basically it's a universal killing tool that works well against ANYONE at different percentages.

And if you don't believe me infallible of how accurate and good this combo is, here's what Cort says:

bomb to dair *****

Here's a small tangent again: the combo is basically throwing a bomb at your opponent (and the bomb must HIT them as well =p) and then launching young Link's Dair on the opponent. The combo is basically a free Dair. It's a logically proven combo. Young Link's bombs have 4 hitboxes on them for large HitLag Stun time on the opponent. During this time, you can follow up with any attack at will without getting punished. Young Link's most punishing arial is his Dair, (and if you ever used young Link you'll understand how HARD it is to land a Dair without getting punished), so landing a Dair with little to no risk of getting counter hit by your opponent is pretty dang good.

As you stated, Falcon can get "definite killing" combos on basically anyone with specific percentages. But with young Link it's a little different because young Link's bomb plant will actually work on any percent really.





bomb plants- tested at FD, but remember this is with NO DI (for most of these I tested I used increments of 5%)


Fox- you must SHFFL the Dair after the bomb hits and combo will land at around 0% - 100% (at approximately 105%, accidental Fire Spikes start to appear). Bomb plant approximately kills at 125%

Falco- you must SHFFL the Dair after the bomb hits and the combo will land at around 0% - 105% (at approximately 110%, accidental Fire Spikes start to appear). Bomb plant approximately kills at 125%

Sheik- combo will land 0%-60% when SHFFL'd. After that percent, you have to full hop Dair after the bomb. Will approximately kill at 95%

Marth- combo will land 0% - 70% when SHFFL'd. After that percent, you have to full hop Dair after the bomb. Will approximately kill at 100%

Peach- combo will land 0% - 60% when SHFFL'd. After that percent, you have to full hop Dair after the bomb. Will approximately kill at 90%

Captain Falcon- combo will land 0%-95% when SHFFL'd. After that percent, you have to full hop Dair after the bomb. Will approximately kill at 124%



So here's the conclusion: young Link's bomb plant is killing combo, much like Falcon's, that will most often work at any percent ( except really, really high ones because the DI will get you out no matter what).

I'm fairly sure that dthrow > dsmash works against Sheik from about 30% - 120%.

What are the dthrow > dair percents on characters? I typically play it safe and just uair, but I'd like to know which dairs are automatic.

D throw -> D smash ***** Sheik aw ya >_>



Hm, well D throw -> Dair usually doesn't work too well.


Against Fast fallers, at around 100 - 140%ish, you can Up throw and mayyybe land a Dair.

Semi Floaties and Semi Fast Fallers might work at like 60%? (I'm guessing on that one/ too lazy to check)

Against Floaties... well, Floaties usually have some attack (specifically their Nair) that will break them out of the Stun Lag of the D throw and hit you before you get out you're Dair since young Link's Dair comes out at 13 frames and Floaty charachter's Nair,(such as Peach, Samus, Luigi, etc.), come out at 3-4 frames.

Honestly, I play it safe too and usually go for a Nair off the D throw vs Floaties and Semi Floaties and Up throw -> Nair vs Fast Fallers & Semi Fast Fallers. Dair is better for punishment, but is too risky. There might be an automatic percent vs anyone with D throw -> Dair but I'll have to investigate it more.

 

[Wikipedia]

Too good, Chip. Too good. That's exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking for. And yea it was that exact G-reg thread that I was referring to.

I'm guessing it doesn't work the same with Y.Link because with Falcon there are so many combinations of combos that work at certain percents. Like against a Doc at 25% you can Dair > Nair > Uair > Knee as long as the Doc doesn't DI away on the Nair.

Young Link wouldn't happen to have anything like that would he?

 

[Chip.]

Too good, Chip. Too good. That's exactly the kind of stuff I'm looking for. And yea it was that exact G-reg thread that I was referring to.

I'm guessing it doesn't work the same with Y.Link because with Falcon there are so many combinations of combos that work at certain percents. Like against a Doc at 25% you can Dair > Nair > Uair > Knee as long as the Doc doesn't DI away on the Nair.

Young Link wouldn't happen to have anything like that would he?

No problem Wiki ^_^


I get what you're asking, at least I think. Young Link's projectiles are the staples of many of his combos and especially his bomb. Here's a good combo I can show ya.



Bomb -> Point-Blank Boomerang -> Fair -> Dash attack (if dey missed Tech OR just Tech Chase them with Dash attack)

Right there, is approximately a 55 -59%ish combo than can be used at 0%

Bomb = 12%

Point-Blank Boomerang = 19%

Fair = 15%? (not sure)

Dash attack = 11%




OR





Bomb-> P-B Boomerang -> Bair -> Reverse Sheild Grab -> Do whatever combo will work according to that charachter's weight class

Bomb = 12%

P-B Boomerang = 19%

Bair = 12%

Reverse Sheild Grab = 6% (any throw does 6%)

more comboeing of the grab= XD



That's just a a couple of examples of buff combos like that. Young Link has many (and I mean MANY) options after throwing the bomb that lead into some pretty friggin nice combos. This is the most basic one I can think of off the top of my head that can compete with a combo of Falcon's like the one you mentioned. Against Spacies, I can get a bomb -> fair -> dsmash -> maybe tech chase with dash attack or off a missed tech. Does that answer your question? =[

 

[Wikipedia]

Absolutely, that's good stuff.

 

[PDOT]

Some fastfallers can be chaingrabbed until around 32%..at 32% they will land on their backs and not on their feet so chaingrabbing will be impossible.

Note - You are just Uthrowing them and regrabbing them as soon as their feet land on the floor.

 

[Quiksilv]

My combo, Throw bomb in air, hook up then up-throw. I call it: Quiksilvering.

 

[Chip.]

Some fastfallers can be chaingrabbed until around 32%..at 32% they will land on their backs and not on their feet so chaingrabbing will be impossible.

Note - You are just Uthrowing them and regrabbing them as soon as their feet land on the floor.

Well, the chaingrab you speak of is more of a pseydo - chaingrab. Since young Link is able to grab them continiously due to their reaction of not dodging/ rolling. You will tend to only get 2 -3 chaingrabs on your opponent until they just spotdodge. . .

This is where you must control them by guessing and punishing their mistake. If you know they're going to spotdodge as soon as they hit the ground, then wait for the opponent to spotdodge and THEN grab after the spotdodge. The only hard move to regrab after them is if they roll or if they attack out've the sheild. Now you must anticipate and see if they continue to roll out've the Up throw or attack out've the sheild. If they roll, then roll chase them; if ya know they will attack out've sheild, then grab them before they do. Pseydo - chaingrabbing is simply a large guessing game between your actions as oppossed to the opponent's reactions.

There is some other good news. For the longest time I would Tech chase Space Animals with D throw. But, come to think of it, I figure Up throw would be more effective (after 32%). Up throw gives young Link less lag time after the throw is initiated thus giving you more time to react to their actions. Also, Spacies tend to either DI the Up throw forwards or backwards and when they do, there is more spaceing between you and the opponent which helps to see their Tech options and weather or not they will attack in place. If they Tech in place then you can most often grab them without moving at all. If they Tech in front, then do an easy run -> grab chase. If they Tech behind then Wavedash back and grab? Same applies for non- Techs too.

I'm not answering any questions, just elaborating
Sorry if I went a bit far though in explaining. =P I hope that helped you or anyone out ^_^

Hey PDOT, BTW, I heard you and your crew were flying down to Dan2 =)
Did I hear this right or not? I'm sure Spkz posted it in the tourney thread or something. If so, young Link $10?

My combo, Throw bomb in air, hook up then up-throw. I call it: Quiksilvering.

Hmm interesting. I'm sure I'll win against anyone with this combo! thx yo! >_>

 

[RikyuXz.~]

oh, my combo:
Defense style: *shield-grab*-> d throw -> up-tilt -> (an ariel that works well at that momment or juggle uair)
Offense style: *dash grab* -> d-throw -> uptilt -> u-air -> *while the opponent is falling take out bomb and throw it up (towards opponent) -> [if it hits, follow with full hop dair or nair] [if it does not hit, uphair juggle again]

btw: im RikyuXz... my original acc got screwed when i tried to change the email [tried to reverify and it doesn't seem to work]

 

[Quiksilv]

lol np, my sig move, works agaisnt those non-aggresive players and that expect a bomb thrown toward them but its thrown up and then u grab, gg btw, i need to know how to perfect my wavedash...not working how i want it to or even not at all

 

[Chip.]

lol np, my sig move, works agaisnt those non-aggresive players and that expect a bomb thrown toward them but its thrown up and then u grab, gg

http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Young_Link_(SSBM)

This combos been discovered bro

btw, i need to know how to perfect my wavedash...not working how i want it to or even not at all

Yup, that's about all it takes: practice. I really can't give much more advice than that unfortunately . But you see, the only answer to master a Technical Skill in smash (or mastering anything in life really) is giving up some time of your day, sit down, and do some sheer hard-core training on what your working on: wavedashing. The only other bit of advice I can say is after you get the timing down on wavedashing, you must learn to tilt the Control Stick in-and-above the diagonal mark to perform a PERFECT wavedash. Perfect wavedashes are much more useful than normal crappy ones (in terms of how far the wavedash goes) and are standard in competitive play. Young Link has a mediocre wavedash; he basically has a balanced level of traction so he has a sufficient wavedash, but nothing incredible. That's why perfect wavedashing is also more useful with him.

So yeah, practice makes perfect. That's about it.

Oh yeah, your welcome on the help too . Anytime!

There you go =)

 

[RikyuXz.~]

I know the best combo evar made.. >_>

Stand on edge -> grab -> d-throw -> spin atk (up-b)

Tried it against a fox in training mode and it *****.

ANYWAYS... I got a question:

How do you own a spamming/agressive falco?

I looked on the other thread but it didn't eleaborate much on the "spamming" part. All it mention was it was kinda hard to bypass it. (If i remember correctly anyways >_>)

 

[Quiksilv]

http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Young_Link_(SSBM)

This combos been discovered bro

oh no buddy, its mine .

ahh i practice alot but mines aren't really perfect...i guess thx thou

 

[Chip.]

oh no buddy, its mine .

I'm just saying it's not anything you discovered, nor is it really spectacular, and that you shouldn't just name it after yourself like that.

it's still charming though nonetheless <3

Be creative and discover combos. If it's really amazing, THEN name yourself after it. (a.k.a. Gimpyfish combo!)


@RikyuXz.~ - I will absolutely answer your question, but not now, because i need to study right now


PDOT - Are you coming to Dan 2? If so, $10 young Link ditto MM?

 

[PDOT]

Dude I have no idea tbh. Team haven't mentioned anything to me. but if somehow we make it..i'd def MM you 10 bucks no problemo.

 

[Chip.]

Would you mind if we bumped it to $20

Oh yeah we got your team a donation ^_^

Here yo!:http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=129544

 

[RikyuXz.~]

hey chip, you still working on the answer to my question? I just wanna say thanks for workin on it cuz it'll really help me since i got a tournament this sunday and there's gonna be mny falco players there.

thx!
-Rikyu

 

[Chip.]

hey chip, you still working on the answer to my question? I just wanna say thanks for workin on it cuz it'll really help me since i got a tournament this sunday and there's gonna be mny falco players there.

thx!
-Rikyu

Alright

Let's start off with stage selection, shall we? DL, FoD, and PS are all good stages for young Link. The rest of the stages are either in Falco's favor or are okay-ish or dealable. K, now remember that Blaster Spamming from Falco is the least of your worries, but is still very important to address. The Falco will either play campy and spammy with his lasers (unlikely style) or he will shoot about 1 - 3 lasers to approach you and start pillaring you. Your answer to Falco's lasers is to spam back lol. Bombs, boomerangs, AND bow will all prove to be useful assets in spamming against Falco. First off, if you're on a large stage, then pull out a bomb and you'll probably will want to full hop throw the bomb. This will help your spacing with the bomb against Falco. Throw boomerangs and shoot your bow for maximum pressure against your opponent. But remember, Falco doesn't just SHL you. He may also do full hop lasers with no fast-fall to you (will shoot 3 lasers in one jump) or he will full hop lasers WITH a fast - fall (will launch two lasers). The only advice I can tell you is to be very cautious around all of Falco's lasers, no matter where he's shooting out at you, and spam back carefully.

Now let's say Falco does reach you: if he does then that means he'll start pillaring you with the Dair -> Shine (sometimes jab). You'll want to sheild if he does start pillaring but you can't stay there forever or your sheild'll break! Now you do have some options (albeit limited) from the pillaring when you're in your sheild. One of the simple yet most effective ways is simply rolling. Rolling gives you invincibility frames so you don't get hit and will get you out of there. Just don't get predictable when you roll (like ALWAYS rolling in one direction) or Falco will chase you with some lasers and punish you. Rolling against Falco's pillar is somewhat effective and every charachter in the game does it, no matter however high the level of play may be. The other way you can use to get out of Falco's pillar is, if you have a bomb, to jump out of your sheild and Z drop the bomb onto Falco's head. Jumping out of your sheild and Z dropping the bomb comes out in a total of 6 frames if done correctly and is ONE of the FASTEST attacks in the game (Fox's jump canceled Shine out of sheild comes out in 5 frames, which is one frame off from young Link's). You may also have time to upB out of your sheild if your timing is good because the upB is an 8 frame attack so it's risky to land, but is probably possible.


Now if Falco does catch you in the pillar then he'll start to pillar COMBO you (which is different) then try and DI away from Falco. The best way to DI is to DI his Shine away from him and if you do then it will easily desist Falco's pillar combos. The best he can get you at this point is just fire a couple lasers, which isn't too bad. Of course Falco has more elaborate combos than this, but this is probably all you have to worry about for your opponents.

If YOU are able to land a bomb on Falco, then unleash some fairs or uairs to get some devastating combos in. Upairs **** Falco when he's above you. At mid% you'll be able to land about 3-4 upairs (which is approximately = 45 -60% damage) and you'll be able to finish with a Nair or possibly a Dair if you're lucky.

Now when you're recovering remember to always throw a bomb at the edge and land a sweetspot with your upB. Remember to shift your recovering to a airdodge -> hookshot consstantly to make your recovery unpredictable. Falco will probably edgehog -> Dair or Bair, but these edgeguards won't be that effective against young Link (after you've thrown the bomb out at the edge) if you space your upB properly to gain good protection around young Link's body.

Young Link can decimate Falco's recovery when you're edgeguarding him. He's seriously one of the easiest charachters in the game to edgeguard. If Falco enjoys spamming the sideB onto the stage then just SHFFL/ full hop (depending on where his altitude is when he's sideB'ing his recovery) your Nairs or Jab. If Falco goes for sweetspots on the edge, then D -smash or F-tilt him/ go for an edgehog. Now, if Falco needs some more maneuverability (check spelling?) then he'll upB recover with his Fire Bird. At this point, pull out a bomb and throw it at him. There are various ways of landing the bomb; some simple ways are to throw it out there from the ground or full hopping over the edge and throwing it straight down (my personal favorite ^_^). If the Falco is by the stage he will ledge tech the bomb and continue his recovery. When he does this, then charge up a D -smash and kill him. If Falco CONTINUES to ledge tech the D -smash, then keep landing well place D -smashes and slip yourself into an edgehog to finish him.

Hope that helps you out. Good luck tomarrow.







Er, can we get some more activity on this thread please? I mean, this isn't JUST a questions thread. It's a discussion thread; so anyone feel free to discuss ANYTHING you want about young Link and it shouldn't be spam (as long as it's pretty useful).

 

[RikyuXz.~]

Wow, thanks so much dude. You saved my life . I'm predicting im still giong to get my *** whuped since this is one of the first times i played a competitive falco, (plus some of these falcos are the best in BC) but this will really help me in the long run so thanks again.

 

[Quiksilv]

Gross...Falcos, i hate them. They own Young Link so bad...but on the other hand...

 

[Chip.]

Wow, thanks so much dude. You saved my life . I'm predicting im still giong to get my *** whuped since this is one of the first times i played a competitive falco, (plus some of these falcos are the best in BC) but this will really help me in the long run so thanks again.

Hold on, you live in BC, as in, BC Canada?

Gross...Falcos, i hate them. They own Young Link so bad...but on the other hand...

Good Falcos can be rough

<3 Falco

 

[RikyuXz.~]

Yub, BC canada why?

 

[Chip.]

I luve B.C. Canada ^_^ <3333
I have lotsa friends up there. Almost everyone you see there at the tournament, could you tell them I said hellos? Just ask if they have been to some WA tournaments recently. Those are the mangz I know

 

[RikyuXz.~]

alright then. oh, i also heard from adam that you got owned by him cuz you were being cocky xD and the reason why i asked you about falco is eric is gonna own me with his falco.. so yeah

Spoiler

sry for spam, but do you gots msn? mine is dazzy.13@hotmail.com

 

[Chip.]

alright then. oh, i also heard from adam that you got owned by him cuz you were being cocky xD and the reason why i asked you about falco is eric is gonna own me with his falco.. so yeah

Spoiler

sry for spam, but do you gots msn? mine is dazzy.13@hotmail.com

What? I don't remember I was bragging or anything of the sort to Adam. I do lose to his Falcon, but our Ganon/young Link matches are 50/50. I'm a bit confused.

Yeah, Eric's Falco pwns all. He's crazy smart now from what I hear.

Sorry no MSN. I'm planning on getting one soon though anyway.

 

[RikyuXz.~]

Anyways, back to the yl discussion thread.. how bout that dropping bombs thread prince of fire made?

I think that sure dropping bombs is comes out on a single frame but the bombs fall so slow when you drop them.. making it inevitable that your opponent will simply run out of the way. But I don't know, do you have something different in mind? Like sh dropping it or something?

Discusscopterz.

PS. adam stated that you weren't being cocky to him.. but just cocky in general- ergo he vs'd you and brought you down to lower your confidence... thats what he said anyways (i could be mistaken so dont quote me on any of this...)

 

[Chip.]

Anyways, back to the yl discussion thread.. how bout that dropping bombs thread prince of fire made?

I think that sure dropping bombs is comes out on a single frame but the bombs fall so slow when you drop them.. making it inevitable that your opponent will simply run out of the way. But I don't know, do you have something different in mind? Like sh dropping it or something?

Discusscopterz.

Anyway, young Link has the fastest attack in the game. Or anyway, it's tied with the fastest attack in the game. The Z drop with young Link comes out at 1 frame.

1 freakin' frame!

I asked M2K about it =D

Of course the attack is tied with many other attacks for the fastest attack in the game (Fox's Shine; Jiggs Rest; y.Link's, Link's, and Peach's Z drop with bomb & turnips)

That basically sums it all up. The best way to use this attack usefully , from my experiences, is to negate Fox's pillaring of Dair -> Shine (or Falco's as well). Most often, after Fox's Dair is fast falled and L - canceled and everything, I tend to have enough time to jump out of my sheild and drop the bomb succesfully and completely neutralize Fox's pillaring approach. Even after L - canceled, Fox has land lag of 9 frames (2 frames slower than a "good" L - cancel) so that may give young Link a small window to instantly jump out and release the Z drop bomb to clash with the Shine (you still may get hit by the Shine of course, but you'll stop Fox's approach). I don't know if this is completely sure - fired, since I haven't played a good Fox, continiously using this new technique of mine.

Another way this could work is jumping out of your sheild and Z dropping AFTER Fox unleashes his Shine. You might have a better chance of getting this off, since you'll probably be able to jump and press Z before Fox can wavedash out of his sheild and Waveshine.

This is mainly all theory. I'm still experimenting with some more accurate ways of getting this off against the pillaring though. I'll try to update my thoughts of this on this thread ASAP.

PS. adam stated that you weren't being cocky to him.. but just cocky in general- ergo he vs'd you and brought you down to lower your confidence... thats what he said anyways (i could be mistaken so dont quote me on any of this...)

I remember he does go Falcon if he really wants to take my young Link down. I've never beaten his Falcon before, of course I've only played it about 3 times before in friendlies, but yeah.

 

[RikyuXz.~]

That basically sums it all up. The best way to use this attack usefully , from my experiences, is to negate Fox's pillaring of Dair -> Shine (or Falco's as well). Most often, after Fox's Dair is fast falled and L - canceled and everything, I tend to have enough time to jump out of my sheild and drop the bomb succesfully and completely neutralize Fox's pillaring approach. Even after L - canceled, Fox has land lag of 9 frames (2 frames slower than a "good" L - cancel) so that may give young Link a small window to instantly jump out and release the Z drop bomb to clash with the Shine (you still may get hit by the Shine of course, but you'll stop Fox's approach). I don't know if this is completely sure - fired, since I haven't played a good Fox, continiously using this new technique of mine.

Another way this could work is jumping out of your sheild and Z dropping AFTER Fox unleashes his Shine. You might have a better chance of getting this off, since you'll probably be able to jump and press Z before Fox can wavedash out of his sheild and Waveshine.

This is mainly all theory. I'm still experimenting with some more accurate ways of getting this off against the pillaring though. I'll try to update my thoughts of this on this thread ASAP.




I remember he does go Falcon if he really wants to take my young Link down. I've never beaten his Falcon before, of course I've only played it about 3 times before in friendlies, but yeah.

Hm, I can see where you are coming from with the 1 FRIKIN FRAME thing, but if you drop the bomb it tends to fall rather slow.. If the opponent sees it coming then can't they just roll/run/wavdash out of the way?

 

[Chip.]

Hm, I can see where you are coming from with the 1 FRIKIN FRAME thing, but if you drop the bomb it tends to fall rather slow.. If the opponent sees it coming then can't they just roll/run/wavdash out of the way?

Well you see, it's the 1 friggin' frame hit that will hit your opponent. NOT the actual speed of the falling bomb (which is rather slow). The Z drop attack is instant; which means AS SOON as you hit the button it will HIT the opponent right then and there. Basically, I'm saying the 1 hit frame is what's going to hit Fox after his Dair and not the falling speed of the bomb after young Link drops it.

Another useful way to use the Z bomb is when Fox up throws you -> Up airs (and if you have a bomb in your hand when he throws you up) you can Z bomb Fox before he can actually pull off the Up air to combo you.

It's pretty nifty.

 

[adaptor17]

ive seen many good young link players throwing their bombs up, and than catching them when necessary.now i know that z is to catch an item,but when i tried it on the bomb all it did was hookshot it and it blew up.any help?

 

[Chip.]

ive seen many good young link players throwing their bombs up, and than catching them when necessary.now i know that z is to catch an item,but when i tried it on the bomb all it did was hookshot it and it blew up.any help?

You're just doing it wrong. Pressing Z in the air is how you catch every item in the game (and yes that includes bombs as well). Don't forget that to catch items on the ground though is pressing A and not Z.

 

[RikyuXz.~]

you can catch bombs with Z??? o_O and all this time i've been doing it with R+a.. what a waste of time