Social NintenZone Social 4 - Bring It In, Guys!

[Skyblade12]

Yeah. Sometimes things just don't break the right way. Sometimes a character might get considered early on, only to be too low priority to make it in or have something else happen to mess up their chances.

And sometimes the master fire wizard just gets overhshadowed by the waterbending ninja frog.

Golden Sun had both fire wizards and water ninjas, and still didn't get get a character.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

all of my characters got into the game...granted wonder red is a trophy and phosphora an assist

Well, all of my characters have gotten into smash in some fashion, if not the same game, in at least the form of a sticker in Brawl

 

[FalKoopa]

I agree with the first half.


I loathe the second half. Absolutely loathe it.

The biggest problem Smash players have is using whether they got into Smash as a benchmark of quality. There are tons of great characters, games and series's that didn't get in. And just because a character was cut, doesn't mean the character is terrible.

Sakurai's choices aren't magical seals of quality.

Getting a developer to agree with your choice does legitimise it in the eyes of many people. Like it or not, Smash Bros is seen by most people as the best characters Nintendo has to offer. Don't downplay the importance of it. People won't be this crazy about character inclusion otherwise.

It's not any different from winning a Nobel prize in Literature. Sure, there are several other great writers out there, but this grants you a level of fame and legitimacy that support from fans/public simply won't.

I do believe my comparison is accurate, as motivations for wanting to see a character in Smash stem not just wanting to play as that character, but wanting to see them in the same light as other big name characters. This is why rivalries form and get heated, and why some people dislike the inclusion of certain characters.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Of all characters ever dropped, only two weren't clones or Pokemon. They were dropped due to issues that couldn't be resolved, namely 3DS limitations and Konami's fear of money and success. Not to mention almost all the clones found their way back with only Pichu, Wolf and arguably Young Link missing.

 

[Skyblade12]

Of all characters ever dropped, only two weren't clones or Pokemon. They were dropped due to issues that couldn't be resolved, namely 3DS limitations and Konami's fear of money and success. Not to mention almost all the clones found their way back with only Pichu, Wolf and arguably Young Link missing.

Did anyone realize just how truly insane Konami had become at the time of the game's original release?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Did anyone realize just how truly insane Konami had become at the time of the game's original release?

Jim Sterling claimed they went downhill since 2010 iirc

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Jim Sterling claimed they went downhill since 2010 iirc

We just didn't notice it because Kojima was keeping them afloat. Now they threw him overboard and he washed up on the shores of Sony.

 

[Strider_Bond00J]

Did anyone realize just how truly insane Konami had become at the time of the game's original release?

Cancelling Silent Hills was the straw that broke the camel's back for many former Konami fans, not to mention how totalitarian their employment methods were becoming as more word got out about their falling relationship with Kojima and treating their employees.

 

[Skyblade12]

Cancelling Silent Hills was the straw that broke the camel's back for many former Konami fans, not to mention how totalitarian their employment methods were becoming as more word got out about their falling relationship with Kojima and treating their employees.

I know, but that was, what, a year after release? While there were hints and problems surfacing before hand, even between Kojima and Konami, a lot of it went relatively under the radar until after the release of Smash 4. Since then, though, it's exploded. I'm just amazed at how much, and how badly, the perception can change in a couple of years. From "eh, they've gone off track, but can still pull out of it" to "burn them with fire and never let them make a game again".

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I don't care a bit about relevance when choosing characters. We could all be happier if the amount of time between a Smash game and the last game the character was in didn't control whether they got in.

 

[Aetheri]

I'm never really going to warm up to the idea of clones in smash...
I don't mind extra content but if the extra content feels a lot like something we already got in the game then to me it just feels like unnecessary padding...and with cases like Ganondorf it's unjust for the character since they could've been something completely different but instead they were shoehorned in as a clone without actual quality time and thought put into the character...

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

and with cases like Ganondorf it's unjust for the character since they could've been something completely different but instead they were shoehorned in as a clone without actual quality time and thought put into the character...

I didn't mind Ganondorf being a clone initially, but now it looks like he is never going to have unique moveset, so maybe it would've been better if he didn't make it to Melee and would've been added later instead...

 

[Champ Gold]

I agree with the first half.


I loathe the second half. Absolutely loathe it.

The biggest problem Smash players have is using whether they got into Smash as a benchmark of quality. There are tons of great characters, games and series's that didn't get in. And just because a character was cut, doesn't mean the character is terrible.

Sakurai's choices aren't magical seals of quality.

They're not but sometimes things just don't fall the right way and in some cases ideas are just ideas

It ain't about seal of quality but more about hitting every single check mark.

Plus I was kinda wrong on the buzzword thing since "Relevancy" is probably the only worthwhile thing here since it does and forever will play a factor and did so in Melee and Brawl and same here with Smash 4

Melee's new fighters sans ICs and G&W was relevant to what Nintendo did earlier and later in not only roster but stages and music. Even the rushed in clones

Brawl was 50% getting in the other fan favorites and looking at recent showings () with some from Japan when the roster was finalized in 2007 despite the changes

And Smash 4 finalized its original roster (without the clone triplets and DLC fighters) at the start of development in the end of 2012 aka how barely squeezed in or how certain characters were still in the mindset of Sakurai's team.

 

[Wolfie557]

They actually did it. - 2 hours!!

 

[Champ Gold]

I'm never really going to warm up to the idea of clones in smash...
I don't mind extra content but if the extra content feels a lot like something we already got in the game then to me it just feels like unnecessary padding...and with cases like Ganondorf it's unjust for the character since they could've been something completely different but instead they were shoehorned in as a clone without actual quality time and thought put into the character...

I don't as upset as with clones most cases since if you do different things with them then that's fine but when your differences is just the size of the character, one new move added which is just the same but different knockback angles and removed sweet spot hitboxes then that's when the issues show up and I don't mind fist master Dorf since it works with the Triforce of power, I would like some extra still like his teleport, Deadman's volley and ground pound but I just want Ganondorf to be GOOD again


Accuracy is irrelevant when Ganondorf is as accurate as he has been for years and he's still bottom 5. That's the big problem. Why because the last time he was good, it was back when he was truly a clone character

 

[ChikoLad]

They actually did it. - 2 hours!!

Was gonna drop in here to post that. Watching/listening to it right now and I love it. I can't wait for this game.

...Also, people pretending they know Sakurai's inner workings and acting like there is a set list of requirements for getting into Smash? Guess that's my cue to go.

 

[Deleted member]

This is now my favorite Fire Emblem video
Warning: Swearing. Lots of it.

20 minutes purely of trying to capture Gazak with a Lv2 Adventurer Niles

 

[Ura]

I disagree with a lot of what's being said here but I really don't want to open the can of worms. Just thought I would say that.

 

[ChikoLad]

Can't say this surprised me. I do agree with him though. I'm not a Pikmin fan but this game still just embodies one of my main problems with Nintendo lately.

 

[Wario Bros.]

Pikmin 3DS is actually exciting for me.

 

[Arcanir]

New updates from the Riddler of Sun/Moon:

Spoiler

Picture of a Rugby player and a monkey.

How many professors are there in Alola? 1 or 2 or 3 or 4?

He posted a picture of Anabel, one of the Frontier Brains from the Battle Frontier in Emerald.
-Maybe the Battle Frontier will return, maybe Anabel will return, maybe a girl with violet hair will appear in the storyline. Any of these can be the answer (Not sure if this part is what he said or an assessment by the poster).

He wrote a cipher code about chronology: ! [Zelda25]，288

Have fun guys!

 

[Chrono.]

New updates from the Riddler of Sun/Moon:

Spoiler

Picture of a Rugby player and a monkey.

How many professors are there in Alola? 1 or 2 or 3 or 4?

He posted a picture of Anabel, one of the Frontier Brains from the Battle Frontier in Emerald.
-Maybe the Battle Frontier will return, maybe Anabel will return, maybe a girl with violet hair will appear in the storyline. Any of these can be the answer (Not sure if this part is what he said or an assessment by the poster).

He wrote a cipher code about chronology: ! [Zelda25]，288

Have fun guys!

Spoiler

Well that first one is obvious thanks to leaks.

Not sure about the rest, but the chronology one interests me.

 

[Arcadenik]

I think the Nintendo franchises that could get fighters in SSB5 might be:

Pushmo (Mallo)
Rhythm Heaven (Chorus Kids)
Splatoon (Inkling)
StarTropics (Mike Jones)
StreetPass Mii Plaza (Wandering Hero)
The Mysterious Murasame Castle (Takamaru)

 

[Ura]

So where's the poll A Distant Demon said he was going to start?

I think the Nintendo franchises that could get fighters in SSB5 might be:

Pushmo (Mallo)
Rhythm Heaven (Chorus Kids)
Splatoon (Inkling)
StarTropics (Mike Jones)
StreetPass Mii Plaza (Wandering Hero)
The Mysterious Murasame Castle (Takamaru)

That's pretty sad.

 

[Chrono.]

StreetPass Mii Plaza (Wandering Hero)

Isn't this just a Mii?

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

New updates from the Riddler of Sun/Moon:

Spoiler

Picture of a Rugby player and a monkey.

How many professors are there in Alola? 1 or 2 or 3 or 4?

He posted a picture of Anabel, one of the Frontier Brains from the Battle Frontier in Emerald.
-Maybe the Battle Frontier will return, maybe Anabel will return, maybe a girl with violet hair will appear in the storyline. Any of these can be the answer (Not sure if this part is what he said or an assessment by the poster).

He wrote a cipher code about chronology: ! [Zelda25]，288

Have fun guys!

Spoiler

First one doesn't surprise me. Since Morelull's reveal, it's been obvious rugby monkey will happen.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Even Arlo can't wait for the ACTUALLY CONFIRMED PIKMIN 4 to come out.

It's like I would cry foul at every Mario Kart, Mario Party, Mario Golf, Paper Mario (even the original), Mario and Luigi etc for not being Super Mario 64 instead of taking it for what it is even though it's inevitable there's a new main game coming.

I get Paper Mario Color Splash/FedForce because it either obviously shows a series' direction or it came out at the time there was no series direction, but shouting at a fun little spin-off to warm up for the CONFIRMED MAIN GAME is why we can't have nice things.

I do agree Nintendo tries to extract the core of the formula, leaving out the other great parts of a game, the things that definitely contributed to being a great game, and turns that "core" into a game, and that's definitely a problem but this game (of a series where expecting a true handheld version is actually overasking) is not the worst offender of the crime, if it is an offender at all (once again, spin-off of a series with a confirmed future)

 

[Shadowwolflink]

Can't say this surprised me. I do agree with him though. I'm not a Pikmin fan but this game still just embodies one of my main problems with Nintendo lately.

You mean making spinoffs that don't take the place of main series games and just exist as an added bonus? My god, those ********. We should put them out of business for this.

 

[Arcadenik]

Can't say this surprised me. I do agree with him though. I'm not a Pikmin fan but this game still just embodies one of my main problems with Nintendo lately.

I just hope Pikmin 3DS is better than what was presented in the video. I'd be happy if it was a Metroidvania where Olimar has to explore around a large world map and he gets "upgrades" by finding new Pikmin so he can explore new areas.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I mean yeah I've seen more complex mobile games than Pikmin 3DS but that doesn't make it a bad game.

 

[A Distant Demon]

So where's the poll A Distant Demon said he was going to start?

Later tonight probably


In Bravely Second "Tiz" has a really epic speech going on right now. . . but I have him currently set as a performer.


So imagine an epic, and extremely plot important speech coming from a guy who looks like ... this

 

[Wario Bros.]

But this Pikmin 3DS wouldn't be the first attempt at a handheld Pikmin. Miyamoto once stated they tested both GBA & DS Pikmin (the former might explain the existence of e-Reader support for Japan Pikmin 2). Plus back in 2006, Pikmin programmers Yuji Kando and Yutaka Hirameki filed a patent for a game that clearly resembles a Pikmin game for DS.

This sidescroller still looks fun though.

 

[Ura]

I think the Nintendo franchises that could get fighters in SSB5 might be:

Pushmo (Mallo)
Rhythm Heaven (Chorus Kids)
Splatoon (Inkling)
StarTropics (Mike Jones)
StreetPass Mii Plaza (Wandering Hero)
The Mysterious Murasame Castle (Takamaru)

Well might as well list my possible franchises that can be in Smash 5 as well.

Spoiler

Splatoon (Inkling)

- Pretty much a lock to show up in the next Smash Bros game.

Wars/Advance Wars (Andy)

- If Intelligent System's statement about Advance Wars not being dead has any merit then we should see a new title on the NX. If that's the case Andy will have everything going for him from moveset potential to relevancy to being apart of a series that has so much history on Nintendo dating back to the NES so there would be no good reason to omit him.

Rhythm Heaven (Chorus Kids)

- RH is a relatively large Nintendo franchise (selling in the millions) and is relevant with the new titles coming out. Why not?

Ever Oasis (Main character from the game)

- IDK if it will happen but it could. Would much rather have Isaac but Golden Sun is showing no signs of life unfortunately so unless Ballot support brings him in it'll most likely be an EO character or some other character getting in.

The Mysterious Murasame Castle (Takamaru)

- The most likely candidate for Smash 5's retro character that I can think of.

 

[Curious Villager]

Wasn't it stated that it wasn't quite possible to make a traditional Pikmin game for a handheld console due to the small screen and all? I suppose this was probably just their way to compromise for that.

Since we're apparently getting a proper Pikmin 4 for the NX, it doesn't seem like something to lose sleep over....

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

I think Splatoon, Rhythm Heaven and Murasame Castle are the most likely franchises to get a fighter in Smash 5.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, I finished Fate/Stay Night: UBW today so I'll post my final thoughts here

Spoiler

Overall, it was good and the fight scenes were way flashier than in Fate/Zero, which I liked, but as an anime and technically a follow-up to Zero, it felt lacking
I understand that Zero is a prequel but the way it was presented made it feel like Kirei was supposed to be the Big Bad yet he shows up 4 or 5 times in UBW only to then get casually killed by his own Servant. Gilgamesh ended up as the final boss yet they failed to present him as such in Zero
And I guess I should blame Zero for this instead of UBW but, well, I watched them in chronological order
Another problem UBW suffers is the fact the VN it is based off has multiple routes which makes the anime lack certain information and development
True Assassin never showing up, Rider having almost no screentime, Sakura just disappearing halfway through, foreshadowing that leads nowhere, Kiritsugu's influence barely gets any mention, Illya and Berserker having a straight "A Death In The Limelight", etc.

I also liked how Zero introduced all Masters and Servants right away and balanced their screentime, though that is just my personal opinion


And yeah, Lancer really was Brolancer
Even after having stabbed himself, he still took Kirei with him and freed Rin

Oh look, fake Assassin, he was a cool guy, fortunately, he got the fight he was looking for
I liked what they did with him, the whole "putting a face on an unknown swordmaster" since that's how most heroic tales are born

Gilgamesh lost to a Ordinary High School Student, well, that was certainly satisfying
The guys that "could end the 4th Grail War in one night" finally got what he deserved
This is what you get for killing the best character
No, not Archer, **** that edge, I'm talking about the great Broskander

And speaking of Broskander, by the end I started thinking "well, Waver survived in Fate/Zero so he had to exist in Stay Night" and then that guy shows up in the last episode and I'm all like "that could be him" and I look it up and holy **** it was best character. He even took Kayneth's title
And now that I think about it, Waver was the only survivor of the 4th War in the end

So, tl;dr
UBW is an 8/10, Zero is a 9/10 and Waver and Rider are 10/10 best characters

Also
Zero!Lancer=UBW!Lancer
Zero!Assassin<fake Assassin
UBW!Caster>Zero!Caster
Zero!Saber>>>>UBW!Saber
Zero!Berserker=UBW!Berserker
Both Archers are trash
Zero!Rider>literally everyone else

 

[ChikoLad]

You mean making spinoffs that don't take the place of main series games and just exist as an added bonus? My god, those ********. We should put them out of business for this.

It's not that they're making a spin-off, I just think there were much better ideas they could have gone with than a "head for the goal" 2D puzzle platformer when it comes to Pikmin. Not to mention that it looks way too similar to both Lemmings, and Kirby Mass Attack. They just seem to make way too many games like that. First it was Paper Mario becoming more like a platformer, then 3D Mario being more like a 2D Mario game (for the record, Super Mario 3D World is my favourite Mario game from a pure gameplay standpoint), then Chibi-Robo, and now it's Pikmin. What next, an F-Zero or Animal Crossing 2D platformer?

It's also yet another game that seems like it's lacking in any sort of creative drive or soul. It just looks bland as a game in general, like they are making it for a quick buck because they know some Pikmin fans will buy it out of curiosity, not to mention the fact that Olimar being slapped in there also helps drive a few people's interest since he is in Smash. That's just the general feeling a lot of Nintendo games have been giving me lately. I get that they are trying to make smaller, lower budget projects, but they could stand to be more creative. Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker was an example of a game that did it right.

I think it would have been more interesting to make a game solely focusing on the Pikmin, without the lead of some captain like Olimar. I think there is a lot they could do with that, and would make more sense than just making a Lemmings clone. Maybe some kind of game where the Pikmin are building a sort of paradise for themselves with Pikmin houses and vistas and such, but they have to protect it from all of the monsters that wander by. Sort of like a Pikmin tower defense game. I think it would make much more sense, as you could take the core aspects of the main games (resource gathering, exploration and survival), apply them in a different way (such as using resources you find to upgrade defenses), and make the Pikmin themselves the main characters, rather than the captains from the main games, therefore expanding on the Pikmin as characters in a meaningful way (sort of like the animated shorts did).

Basically, it's all well and good that they want to make a Pikmin spin-off for the handheld, but they literally took the most uninspired approach that barely takes anything from an actual Pikmin game beyond "you play as Captain Olimar and chuck Pikmin at enemies". It's like if Nintendo made a Mario spin-off game starring Rosalina (something myself and a lot of people reallyw ant), and made it a game where you have to pick a nice outfit for Rosalina to go on a blind date on and you make clothing designs for her to wear on those dates. Like yeah, people might want a spin-off featuring the character, but playing dress-up isn't exactly what people came to appreciate the character for, and has nothing to do with her. When you're making a spin-off, you're supposed to retain a good number of the core aspects of the franchise/character you are making a spin-off for, usually elaborating on them in some way, otherwise it's not gonna appeal to fans of that franchise/character. This is why Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric failed so hard (besides the glitches). It was a Sonic game where Sonic traveled slower than Mario for most of the game. This is also why Animal Crossing: amiibo Festival failed, and Happy Home Designer succeeded. The former took nothing from Animal Crossing other than the characters and aesthetics and added an unneeded pay wall with amiibo, while the latter honed in on a specific element of the main games, and expanded upon it.

Hell, even Federation Force is actually successful in this regard (it just has one or two other problems holding it back). Shooting and action is a part of the Metroid Prime games, but those games aren't nearly as action-packed as most other shooters, so Federation Force decided to expand on those mechanics, and expand on a certain aspect of Metroid's lore (the Galactic Federation) in a meaningful way.

 

[Arcadenik]

Isn't this just a Mii?

Yes, they are Miis... but with more custom options.

They may be human Miis, cat Miis, dog Miis, or bunny Miis. The species of your choice does not determine what moves they get. It's purely aesthetic.

Cat Miis and dog Miis come in brown and black. Bunny Miis come in white and pink. The fur color of your choice does not determine what moves they get. It's also purely aesthetic.

The shirt color of your choice actually determines what special moves they get... just like in Find Mii and Mii Force. The shirt comes in 12 colors: red, orange, yellow, lime, green, cyan, blue, pink, purple, brown, white, and black.

Each shirt color comes with their own 12 custom special moves (3 neutral specials, 3 side specials, 3 up specials, and 3 down specials) and their own Final Smash. So... 144 custom moves and 12 Final Smashes.

They all share the same normal moves no matter what the color of their shirts are. Only the shirt color determines what elemental magic the Wandering Hero would specialize in.

Example 1. This cat is wearing a yellow shirt... so it would specialize in summoning sandstorms (Find Mii) and lightning bolts (Mii Force).

Exampe 2. This dog is wearing a pink shirt... so it would specialize in increasing its own sweet spots and increasing the opponent's sour spots (Find Mii) and throwing sticky globs that travel along the surface (Mii Force).

Example 3. This bunny is wearing a red shirt... so it would specialize in fireballs (Find Mii) and flamethrowers (Mii Force).

Wandering Heroes would represent StreetPass Mii Plaza. It would make sense for them to use moves based on StreetPass games. We have...

Puzzle Swap
Find Mii
Mii Force
Monster Manor
Warrior's Way
Flower Town
Ultimate Angler
Battleground Z
Slot Car Rivals
Market Crashers
Ninja Launcher
Feed Mii
Mii Trek

13 StreetPass games with plenty of material for Wandering Heroes to use in Smash.

We even had a StreetPass stage in SSB4 3DS. It was based on Find Mii.

This could be Wandering Heroes' home stage along with a new StreetPass stage from another StreetPass game in SSB5.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Not to mention that it looks way too similar to both Lemmings, and Kirby Mass Attack

To be fair, it's been a while since we got those games

then Chibi-Robo

Chibi Robo only had 2 games that had the same gameplay style so I don't think the comparison works that well (though the franchise has about 5 games so it IS a valid point)

What next, an F-Zero or Animal Crossing 2D platformer?

You say this and it IS a legitimate point, but I'd actually love a beat em up spinoff for F-Zero considering how people only remember Captain Falcon for punching and kneeing things. Though ideally that'd happen AFTER another racing game or two
EDIT: To clarify, I agree with your point that Pikmin has so much more potential than platformers, especially as you're not being an absolute moron whining about how Pikmin is dead.

 

[Arcadenik]

I just realized how Nintendo could revive Urban Champion. They could make a new beat'em up game like Double Dragon, Final Fight, and Streets of Rage... but it stars Urban Champion and it's a vast improvement over the NES game.

Well, that or Nintendo could play safe and make a F-Zero spin-off game where Captain Falcon wanders the streets and Falcon Punches punks and thugs.