Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Ring Fit is about to take over Splatoon 2 pic.twitter.com/IawKzhvWMB

— Zalman (@enterzalman) November 4, 2021

Yeah it's safe to say we should expect Ring Fit Adventurer in the next Smash

 

[Lyncario]

Ring Fit is about to take over Splatoon 2 pic.twitter.com/IawKzhvWMB

— Zalman (@enterzalman) November 4, 2021

Yeah it's safe to say we should expect Ring Fit Adventurer in the next Smash

Yeah. Ring Fit is like the second most obvious addition to the next Smash in my opinion, behind only Tom Nook.

 

[Gengar84]

Yeah. Ring Fit is like the second most obvious addition to the next Smash in my opinion, behind only Tom Nook.

I’m pretty confident we’ll get another Splatoon character as well, seeing how well that series is doing. None of the obvious characters really excite me personally but I’m willing to give them a chance. They could still end up being a lot of fun to play.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

hot take:

“I want more newcomers” and “I want everyone is here to happen again” are two statements that can 100% coexist

look at how many newcomers ultimate got, including DLC. It’s the most of any smash game so far, even taking into account bringing everyone back.

another hot take: “any cuts can easily be brought back via DLC” because that worked so well for Wolf, Ice Climbers and Snake for 4, right? /s

I could at the very least understand if Sora was a preorder bonus to become paid dlc later on because Disney, but I wouldn’t rest on the laurels of veteran DLC.

 

[Guynamednelson]

look at how many newcomers ultimate got, including DLC. It’s the most of any smash game so far, even taking into account bringing everyone back.

Now look at the newcomers Ultimate got WITHOUT DLC. They needed clones to ensure it wasn't super tiny, just like with Melee.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

The real question:

Would Tom Nook be considered the villain rep for the Animal Crossing series?

 

[Dukefire]

If they should be modes that comes to the next smash bros game, I can say that they could bring back Smash Run. Well, idk how the next story mode should be since World of Light was the biggest entry.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Of all the people who insist the next game should do Everyone Is Here again...

...how many of you even main Corrin or Incineroar, or think the fact that they're in is acceptable?

 

[Gengar84]

Of all the people who insist the next game should do Everyone Is Here again...

...how many of you even main Corrin or Incineroar, or think the fact that they're in is acceptable?

I don’t main either (I main Ganondorf and Sephiroth) but I enjoy playing as both. They have really fun and unique movesets even if there are tons of Pokémon and Fire Emblem characters I would have chosen over them.

 

[Sucumbio]

UMK3 had an everyone here is vibe...

Mk4 had a relatively smaller returning cast and yet 7? Newcomers.

This is how I feel the next Smash will go. Many won't return except maybe the core brawl cast but we'll have several newcomers.

 

[walugurl]

Next smash has to go back to being just Nintendo characters again. No more third parties.

 

[Guynamednelson]

UMK3 had an everyone here is vibe...

It was MKT that was truly an Everyone Is Here game. UMK3 only brought back the recolor ninjas.

 

[Dukefire]

If we have to guess the next character(s) that might be promoted from Mii costume to fighter. Who would it be?

 

[Gengar84]

I think the only way Smash 6 can have a much smaller cast and not be hugely disappointing to me is if they have a story mode along the lines of Subspace Emissary but incorporating more existing worlds and enemies. I think it could be fun to add some voiced dialogue of characters that speak in their games. Finally, reworking a lot of veterans like Samus, Donkey Kong, Lucario and Ganondorf to make them play more like they do in their home series would be great to see.

 

[Yamat08]

hot take:

“I want more newcomers” and “I want everyone is here to happen again” are two statements that can 100% coexist

look at how many newcomers ultimate got, including DLC. It’s the most of any smash game so far, even taking into account bringing everyone back.

If anything, it seems like more and more newcomers are being introduced with each new Smash iteration. I mean, Smash4 introduced a pretty hefty number (even before DLC), while keeping all but a small handful of characters from Brawl, working under a new developer (Bandai Namco), AND being split between two systems.

Incidentally, for all the people talking about a "reboot", Smash4 seems like the best opportunity there was for that. And in some ways, the reboot actually did happen (characters like Zelda/Shiek and Olimar have been forever changed just to suit the limitations of the 3DS).

another hot take: “any cuts can easily be brought back via DLC” because that worked so well for Wolf, Ice Climbers and Snake for 4, right? /s

I could at the very least understand if Sora was a preorder bonus to become paid dlc later on because Disney, but I wouldn’t rest on the laurels of veteran DLC.

I mean, IF cuts happened, I'd like them to return as DLC myself, and in many ways, I'm expecting it to happen at least with the 3rd party characters (Square Enix, especially, gives me the impression that they wanna nickle and dime us after the way they locked all the actual FFVII content behind Sephiroth, plus NONE of the 3rd party Mii costumes were included in the base game). Also, keep in mind that, unless there's a complete engine overhaul (like between Brawl and Smash4), it's looking as though it might be a relatively simple matter to port over old assets (plus, IceClimbers returning for Smash4 would've meant having them overhauled in some way or featuring Popo alone with Nana as an alt...... or they could've just allowed a WiiU exclusive character, but for some reason, that wasn't an option at the time).

If they should be modes that comes to the next smash bros game, I can say that they could bring back Smash Run. Well, idk how the next story mode should be since World of Light was the biggest entry.

I mean, I guess you could say it's the biggest in that it's the longest to complete, though in terms of an actual story, it's barebones as hell. And even in terms of content, it's just a bunch of stuff copy/pasted from the Spirit Board, with about the only things it could really call its own being about a dozen hand-illustrated maps and a pair of final bosses who don't appear in anyone's Classic route.

 

[Guynamednelson]

plus, IceClimbers returning for Smash4 would've meant having them overhauled in some way or featuring Popo alone with Nana as an alt...... or they could've just allowed a WiiU exclusive character, but for some reason, that wasn't an option at the time

Besides that, I think they just wanted to split DLC resources between veterans and newcomers, so Ultimate could be the game that focuses on everyone being back.

Also I think it's merely a coincidence that Ultimate eventually got the most newcomers of any Smash game anyway. Remember, at one point we were presumably only going to get 1-2 of the newcomers FP2 added.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Of all the people who insist the next game should do Everyone Is Here again...

...how many of you even main Corrin or Incineroar, or think the fact that they're in is acceptable?

Me ( I don't think they necessarily have to do Everyone is Here again but I have to interject on something)

I like Incineroar and think his inclusion is super neat considering Smash doesn't have a large amount of grapplers. There's DK and Bowser.....and uhh Luigi kinda.....and that's about it really.

 

[Yamat08]

Of all the people who insist the next game should do Everyone Is Here again...

...how many of you even main Corrin or Incineroar, or think the fact that they're in is acceptable?

The thing about Everyone Is Here isn't necessarily that YOU can main everyone, but rather that anyone else can, leading to a massive variety in potential match-ups.

 

[Mamboo07]

Yeah. Ring Fit is like the second most obvious addition to the next Smash in my opinion, behind only Tom Nook.

Raven Beak as well if Metroid got another villain rep after Ridley and Dark Samus.

 

[Megadoomer]

Next smash has to go back to being just Nintendo characters again. No more third parties.

I'm not a fan of that mindset; in fact, it's honestly baffling to me. It would mean cutting fifteen different series from Smash (Metal Gear, Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, Bayonetta, Castlevania, Persona, Dragon Quest, Banjo-Kazooie, King of Fighters, Minecraft, Tekken, and Kingdom Hearts), alienating people who would have gotten into Smash Bros. because of those series being included, and severely limiting what can be included in Smash, and it doesn't seem like there'd be a good reason for it.

Sure, it seems to increase the chances of some first party characters getting included, but the base game reveals for Smash tend to be pretty first-party heavy to begin with, so it really only seems like it would impact DLC. (a vast majority of those third party franchises were added through DLC - the only ones that weren't were Metal Gear, Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man, and Castlevania)

It doesn't seem like it's worth it to remove all of that just to slightly increase the chances of Waluigi, Skull Kid, or Isaac avoiding assist trophy status and maybe getting into the base roster. I can understand thinking that the next game will decrease the amount of third party characters (I don't see Disney returning unless that was part of a deal for including Sora, and even Square-Enix and Microsoft seem questionable to me), but removing them all entirely seems to have way more drawbacks than benefits, and I have no idea why it "has" to remove all third party characters.

The idea that all third party characters need to be cut reminds me a lot of Marvel vs. Capcom Infinite removing all of the X-Men and Fantastic Four characters and the developers claiming that they're just functions (so if people liked playing as Magneto, they could play as Ultron), and look at how that turned out.

Besides, cutting Snake managed to generate enough uproar that his reveal for Ultimate was the big centerpiece of "Everyone Is Here", even though his inclusion was controversial (people said that he "didn't fit" in Smash Bros.) - imagine how annoyed/angry people would get if they cut Sonic the Hedgehog, a three time veteran who's got a much bigger media presence than Snake. (and has a huge history/rivalry with Mario)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If anything, it seems like more and more newcomers are being introduced with each new Smash iteration. I mean, Smash4 introduced a pretty hefty number (even before DLC), while keeping all but a small handful of characters from Brawl, working under a new developer (Bandai Namco), AND being split between two systems.

Incidentally, for all the people talking about a "reboot", Smash4 seems like the best opportunity there was for that. And in some ways, the reboot actually did happen (characters like Zelda/Shiek and Olimar have been forever changed just to suit the limitations of the 3DS).


I mean, IF cuts happened, I'd like them to return as DLC myself, and in many ways, I'm expecting it to happen at least with the 3rd party characters (Square Enix, especially, gives me the impression that they wanna nickle and dime us after the way they locked all the actual FFVII content behind Sephiroth, plus NONE of the 3rd party Mii costumes were included in the base game). Also, keep in mind that, unless there's a complete engine overhaul (like between Brawl and Smash4), it's looking as though it might be a relatively simple matter to port over old assets (plus, IceClimbers returning for Smash4 would've meant having them overhauled in some way or featuring Popo alone with Nana as an alt...... or they could've just allowed a WiiU exclusive character, but for some reason, that wasn't an option at the time).


I mean, I guess you could say it's the biggest in that it's the longest to complete, though in terms of an actual story, it's barebones as hell. And even in terms of content, it's just a bunch of stuff copy/pasted from the Spirit Board, with about the only things it could really call its own being about a dozen hand-illustrated maps and a pair of final bosses who don't appear in anyone's Classic route.

Re: the bolded part - Sakurai said he wanted the rosters of 3DS and Wii U to be the same. Nevertheless I don’t think split platform development will be a thing again

I worry the most about Konami characters either returning in base or as DLC. I’m inclined to believe Konami was the most problematic company to renegotiate with, not Square Enix, especially considering the state of the company from 2014-2017

I don’t see how an engine change would have affected Snake not returning in 4, im convinced it was Konami’s company politics at the time

 

[Chuderz]

Honestly? Go ahead with major roster cuts, so long as it brings us substantial new content. Ultimate will always exist, and I'm sure everyone from the new games will be ported to Brawl modding (they're already working on Sora). I'd rather Nintendo focus on new stuff, be it new characters or new modes. Besides, there's no reason a character can't just miss a game and come back in the next one.

Ultimate DX could do all of this and cut no one. Ultimate DX could literally do everything a "reboot" could do and more.

Also cuts don't accomplish anything other than trashing that work. It doesn't magically provide more development to other aspects of the game than they already would have received regardless. Actually Ultimate DX would be closer to your ideal because all the single player content wouldn't have to be redeveloped and they could instead focus development on these new modes and characters.

 

[Ivander]

Of all the people who insist the next game should do Everyone Is Here again...

...how many of you even main Corrin or Incineroar, or think the fact that they're in is acceptable?

I quite enjoy using them.

Some people just focus on playing the game than hating on characters they'll never play.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Ultimate DX could do all of this and cut no one. Ultimate DX could literally do everything a "reboot" could do and more.

Also cuts don't accomplish anything other than trashing that work. It doesn't magically provide more development to other aspects of the game than they already would have received regardless. Actually Ultimate DX would be closer to your ideal because all the single player content wouldn't have to be redeveloped and they could instead focus development on these new modes and characters.

If they have to spend time balancing and bugfixing an 80+ character roster, less time can be spent on adding new content, including newcomers. That's the logic behind "cut characters so we can add more new content".

 

[Opossum]

another hot take: “any cuts can easily be brought back via DLC” because that worked so well for Wolf, Ice Climbers and Snake for 4, right? /s

Considering the Ice Climbers literally only got cut because of technical issues that couldn't be overcome for the 3DS, and that we know Snake was highly requested to return (so his absence was very likely due to rights issues that were only exacerbated by the Kojima stuff), it's pretty much only Wolf who got left out of those three. But it's also ignoring the fact that Dr. Mario, Roy, Mewtwo, and Lucas did return after being cut, and how the other four cuts (Pichu, Young Link, Squirtle, and Ivysaur) had almost no one requesting for them to return by comparison.

So the fact that the cut characters that 1) didn't have outstanding issues, and 2) were actually highly requested to return did return, with the sole exception being Wolf, I don't think this rebuttal did the job you intended it to.

 

[Tankman from Newgrounds]

Guys, do we have a Chance to Get Obscure SEGA Rep like Spacer Harrier?
Because according to me, we're gonna get it, because Sakurai Played Space Harrier II and like I said earlier, he could possibly join the Roster.
Opa-Opa remains as Assist Trophy due to his Status.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Considering the Ice Climbers literally only got cut because of technical issues that couldn't be overcome for the 3DS, and that we know Snake was highly requested to return (so his absence was very likely due to rights issues that were only exacerbated by the Kojima stuff), it's pretty much only Wolf who got left out of those three. But it's also ignoring the fact that Dr. Mario, Roy, Mewtwo, and Lucas did return after being cut, and how the other four cuts (Pichu, Young Link, Squirtle, and Ivysaur) had almost no one requesting for them to return by comparison.

So the fact that the cut characters that 1) didn't have outstanding issues, and 2) were actually highly requested to return did return, with the sole exception being Wolf, I don't think this rebuttal did the job you intended it to.

I do think Squirtle and Ivysaur will see a huge influx of demand. Now that we have a Pokemon Trainer that works, I can see them becoming much bigger requests than before. Ivysaur is no longer the "worst designed character in Smash" for example.

And on another note, they (along with Young Link and Pichu) may have been seen as less popular due to being seen as unlikely. Smash fans tend to be more upfront with their wants when the situation is perceived as likely.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

For those that DO want substantial cuts, i propose a question

what if someone you wanted to get in that did get in, either in Ultimate or a previous installment, got cut next time?

I’m only saying, be careful what you wish for

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Opa-Opa remains as Assist Trophy due to his Status.

This is blasphemy.

 

[Guynamednelson]

For those that DO want substantial cuts, i propose a question

what if someone you wanted to get in that did get in, either in Ultimate or a previous installment, got cut next time?

I’m only saying, be careful what you wish for

I really wanted Little Mac but I'm just one of many people who dislike how Sakurai balanced him anyway, so

 

[Sucumbio]

For those that DO want substantial cuts, i propose a question

what if someone you wanted to get in that did get in, either in Ultimate or a previous installment, got cut next time?

I’m only saying, be careful what you wish for

For me I'm expecting the next Smash to be ground up new and on a new platform console that's at least twice as powerful as Switch is now.

Kazuya was an awesome addition and I love that I got a Tekken rep but if I want to play as Kazuya I'll play ultimate. I see ultimate aging waaay better than the likes of brawl or smash 4. I think it'll have the same staying power as Melee in terms of popularity. And it'll be the go to game for the simple reason that it has that huge roster.

But! I see the next Smash being a brand new experience with either new mechanics, maybe branching into 3d platforming or some other type of craziness.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Problem is, you seem to be wanting Mario to be complex, when he's not. He's supposed to be the beginner character, which is why some of us hate FLUDD's inclusion in the moveset in the first place.

He seems to want everyone to be way more complex. He keeps trying to add tons of moves to characters.

 

[PeridotGX]

For those that DO want substantial cuts, i propose a question

what if someone you wanted to get in that did get in, either in Ultimate or a previous installment, got cut next time?

I’m only saying, be careful what you wish for

I would be perfectly willing to sacrifice one of my mains. Hell, all of them if it means I get new characters I would like to play as. They'll always be in Ultimate, and they could always come back later.

 

[Chuderz]

If they have to spend time balancing and bugfixing an 80+ character roster, less time can be spent on adding new content, including newcomers. That's the logic behind "cut characters so we can add more new content".

Well I don't think the theoretical time saved would be meaningful enough to warrant losing characters. I don't even really see how time would be saved because they'd still be working on redeveloping all the old standard modes and balancing/bugfixing whatever roster they came to anyways.

The main appeal of Smash is the characters. Cutting them for single-player content far less people care about is not going to be appreciated by the audience at large. Smash is primarily a multiplayer game anyways. If you want a single-player-focused game there's plenty out there.

So then it kind of begs the question why some fans even want this? If the concept of an Ultimate DX worked on like a true Smash6 can theoretically give you the single-player content you're asking for, the character reworks you're asking for and do all this while retaining the roster then why are people supporting the idea of less content? I just don't see how anything is being gained in this cuts=worthwhilereboot concept people throw around and I think really only serves to upset large segments of the community by losing mains/matchups.

 

[Wonder Smash]

If we have to guess the next character(s) that might be promoted from Mii costume to fighter. Who would it be?

Bomberman is a high possibility. With him being an Assist Trophy, a spirit, and a Mii Costume (full of different alternate colors), along with Sakurai giving people an idea of how he would play, he's basically one step away from being a playable character. So I can picture him being upgraded in the next game.

Another possible character is Doom Slayer. He quickly became a popular request and with id Software's support for the Nintendo consoles, as well as being owned by Microsoft (which already has characters in the game), an upgrade for him is very likely too.

I can also picture Travis becoming a playable character too. It's clear that Suda51 really wants him in Smash. Now that No More Heroes actually has a Smash Bros reference (like a lot series had before they were represented), they could take it a step further and add him in the next game.

 

[Gengar84]

For those that DO want substantial cuts, i propose a question

what if someone you wanted to get in that did get in, either in Ultimate or a previous installment, got cut next time?

I’m only saying, be careful what you wish for

To be fair, I don’t think many people actually want cuts, they’re just preparing themselves for that possibility. There are benefits to having a smaller roster like having the resources to focus on single player content. Ideally, we’d have no cuts, tons of newcomers, and great single player or co-op modes but I’m not sure how feasible that is.

If I had to choose, I’d rather keep all the characters we have and have fewer newcomers in the base game. They can start up DLC again afterwards and we can get a lot of characters after release. For the base game, I’d prefer they gave us a good single player and improved stage builder rather than giving us a ton of new characters from the start.

 

[Guynamednelson]

If the concept of an Ultimate DX worked on like a true Smash6 can theoretically give you the single-player content you're asking for, the character reworks you're asking for and do all this while retaining the roster then why are people supporting the idea of less content?

Because it's unrealistic to expect all the content in Ultimate+a newcomer count closer to Brawl in base, a better adventure mode, additional side modes etc. unless Sakurai works on it for like six years. And don't you people want Sakurai to rest?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I don’t care THAT much about a new adventure mode

WoL has a good formula IMO, it just could use some touch ups here and there

 

[Gengar84]

I don’t care THAT much about a new adventure mode

WoL has a good formula IMO, it just could use some touch ups here and there

A big reason I want another SSE is I love co-op modes in games. It gave my brother and I something to do together in Smash beyond vs matches over and over again which can get old without something to break it up. I also loved that it really took advantage of the fact that Smash is a platform fighter by emphasizing the platforming aspect. It almost felt like playing a Kirby game. With some improvements, I think the mode has a ton of potential to be something truly special.

 

[PeridotGX]

Well I don't think the theoretical time saved would be meaningful enough to warrant losing characters. I don't even really see how time would be saved because they'd still be working on redeveloping all the old standard modes and balancing/bugfixing whatever roster they came to anyways.



The main appeal of Smash is the characters. Cutting them for single-player content far less people care about is not going to be appreciated by the audience at large. Smash is primarily a multiplayer game anyways. If you want a single-player-focused game there's plenty out there.



So then it kind of begs the question why some fans even want this? If the concept of an Ultimate DX worked on like a true Smash6 can theoretically give you the single-player content you're asking for, the character reworks you're asking for and do all this while retaining the roster then why are people supporting the idea of less content? I just don't see how anything is being gained in this cuts=worthwhilereboot concept people throw around and I think really only serves to upset large segments of the community by losing mains/matchups.

An Ultimate DX would still be Ultimate though. I like Mario Kart 8, but it's been eight and a half years since it came out. MK8D really didn't add much new, and I'm waiting for Mario Kart 9. After another five years of Ultimate I imagine I'll feel much the same.