Newbie 23 // MGS3 Villains Mafia - Game Over

[STEM]

Oh and I think vinyl's trolling was immature but didn't really mean anything

 

[Monstmrna]

@ Ranmaru: Sometimes they are, and sometimes they aren't.

@ Vinyl: I brought it up because you made it sooooo easy for someone to quicklynch ttar. Honestly, it would have been suicide if they had, but I just generally don't see town people putting someone at l-1 that quickly in RVS. It doesn't sit right with me.

 

[BSP]

Same with you, sonny.

Town leans - Ran, Soup
Null - everyone else

How are you reading Ttar now that the wagon is done and over with? (Since you are now voting Vinyl)

I have a null on Ttar right now.

What is your opinion on Monstrmna?

I have a null on Monstrmna right now.

Soup, how is Badwolf leaning town for you right now?

Ran, what do you think of me so far?

 

[BSP]

Also, I have suspicions as of right now, but I don't want to out them just yet. It's still early in the game.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

No, I didn't miss anything, actually. I'll fill you in. See, you said you didn't want to push it because you were expecting Badwolf to not give a good answer regardless of alignment, yet I think that was closer to him trying to paint you as scum, and I want him to clarify how he got you confused. I feel as though you are just letting Bad go because you don't want to deal with the 'process' of doing so, and I feel you should have kept pushing.

Now tell me how you think my vote is off?

You asked me for my reads on Ttar and Stem? I have no solid reads on them. They haven't done enough to give me a read. Yet, they aren't on my radar since they haven't done anything I'm suspicious of.

I am also suspicious of Vinyl, slightly. Why? Because he isn't doing anything, and I'd expect him to do more. He's being a bit trolly and I don't like it.

I got the reaction that he had an earnest opinion of my slot but didn't have his thoughts all together, a bit scattered brain if I were to describe it. I don't think he was trying to paint me as scum, I think he would have been more blunt about it. I'm townreading him based on his attitude lately and how he has been acting, I don't think he's trying to force towntells like I've noticed in recent scumplay.

I don't think you looked at that as much as I thought you would, considering Badwolf's response I'm not sure how you could exactly see Badwolf trying to paint me as scum.

Okay.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

People, scumreads do not just come out of thin air and you cannot expect for scum to be willing to give them. I hear a lot of 'no scumreads' right now, but I am confident most of you have something you want to say or have a read that you're holding back, If you feel that it's important, then address it with the town. You should never be scared to be open.

 

[BSP]

Monstmrna and STEM

Do either of you have an idea of who we should lynch toDay?

 

[Monstmrna]

As of right now, the only thing I've got is Vinyl and that vote. It still doesn't sit right with me, but even still... I'm not entirely convinced she's scum.

I can see what Ranmaru was saying about badwolf, but honestly I'm not convinced about that either.

As for town reads... I'd say leaning town on Ranmaru and possibly soup, and slightly town on Ttar. BSP is possible town.

I'd like to hear more from the people who haven't posted much before I assess anything else though. Mafia should be a game of everyone expressing who they think is scum and why, otherwise it gives scum a chance to lurk and fade into the background and then we'll be lynching based on chance.

 

[Monstmrna]

Or vinyl is a he I guess. My bad

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

and slightly town on Ttar.

Elaborate.

 

[STEM]

Monstmrna and STEM

Do either of you have an idea of who we should lynch toDay?

Not a person we should lynch, but I think we should not lynch you, ragnarock. soup, or monstrmra. I'm most suspicious of Vinyl, for the trolling, and badwolf for his reactions to questions.

I usually would FoS people who are aggressive (not gonna say who), but it's not worth the risk to lynch anyone like that in this early stage imo. Also, I don't like voicing the opinions because mafia could twist them to their advantage.

 

[Monstmrna]

Elaborate.

Mostly gut feeling. In case you guys haven't heard, I play using gut feelings sometimes to sort of try and base my suspicions, and I didn't really sense any sort of ulterior motives in Ttar's posts.

 

[BSP]

I usually would FoS people who are aggressive (not gonna say who), but it's not worth the risk to lynch anyone like that in this early stage imo. Also, I don't like voicing the opinions because mafia could twist them to their advantage.

Define aggressive. Who do you think is aggressive in this game?

Also, if you're town, your opinion is one of your strongest weapons. You need to voice it.

 

[BSP]

Not a person we should lynch, but I think we should not lynch you, ragnarock. soup, or monstrmra.

Why?

10****ingchars

 

[ranmaru]

Oh and I think vinyl's trolling was immature but didn't really mean anything

Hold on.

Not a person we should lynch, but I think we should not lynch you, ragnarock. soup, or monstrmra. I'm most suspicious of Vinyl, for the trolling, and badwolf for his reactions to questions.

I usually would FoS people who are aggressive (not gonna say who), but it's not worth the risk to lynch anyone like that in this early stage imo. Also, I don't like voicing the opinions because mafia could twist them to their advantage.

Why did you say initially, that Vinyl's trolling didn't mean anything, yet you now state a suspicion for it? You also said on the last page you didn't have any suspicions yet, when did you get the suspicions you just posted, and why did you say that initially?

Also tell me, how does aggression = something scum would do, and not town?
Underlined, what does that mean?

When it comes to opinions what really matters is your scumreads. Yet, the thing here is you say you would FoS a certain person yet won't say yet. That's different. I can see why someone would want to hide a town read, yet hiding a scum read doesn't help town because you don't know if you will live past the night. I encourage everyone to speak out their suspicions EARLY, not late. I can see merit to someone mentioning it later during that day, since they would still have time to voice their opinion. Express yourself when you still can.

@ Ranmaru: Sometimes they are, and sometimes they aren't.

Why? Can you quote the other ones? (Or link them) I just want to see a comparison. Also, what is your opinion of Stem?

 

[ranmaru]

@BSP: I have a town read on you. I saw all your actions as pro-town. You created discussion (in RVS), and are scumhunting, while others aren't doing much.

 

[Monstmrna]

I'm really lazy, so no. But I'm also playing in cave story mafia over here if you wanna give that a look see. It is also a very over the top joke post.

As for Stem... I don't really know what to think of him. He seems to be making some insightful posts, but at the same time is playing very... carefully. At least it feels that way to me. As to exactly what that means, I can't say, but I will say I'm not getting any bad vibes from him yet.

 

[BSP]

btw STEM, Soup = Ragnarock

 

[ranmaru]

I'm really lazy, so no. But I'm also playing in cave story mafia over here if you wanna give that a look see. It is also a very over the top joke post.

As for Stem... I don't really know what to think of him. He seems to be making some insightful posts, but at the same time is playing very... carefully. At least it feels that way to me. As to exactly what that means, I can't say, but I will say I'm not getting any bad vibes from him yet.

Oh yeah if it's ongoing games don't mention it then.

Underlined, can you go further, possibly with quotes?

 

[BSP]

Ttar, Vinyl, Badwolf, and Loli

Give out some reads on your next post.

 

[Vinylic.]

Oh my gawd, quit asking already. I'll get to it.

 

[Vinylic.]

Oh and I think vinyl's trolling was immature but didn't really mean anything

Not a person we should lynch, but I think we should not lynch you, ragnarock. soup, or monstrmra. I'm most suspicious of Vinyl, for the trolling, and badwolf for his reactions to questions.

Ran already got to this but I'm responding to it for twice the charm; You say and this and now that. Is there any reasoning why you changed your mind?[/QUOTE]

As of right now, the only thing I've got is Vinyl and that vote. It still doesn't sit right with me, but even still... I'm not entirely convinced she's scum.

He.

And after saying that my post looks "scummy as hell" and then voting me? Why did you place your vote on me then?

I can see what Ranmaru was saying about badwolf, but honestly I'm not convinced about that either.

As for town reads... I'd say leaning town on Ranmaru and possibly soup, and slightly town on Ttar.

Explain Ttar.

 

[Vinylic.]

EBWOP:

I can see what Ranmaru was saying about badwolf, but honestly I'm not convinced about that either.

Can you also explain what doesn't convince you?

 

[Vinylic.]

Town leans - Ran, Soup, BSP
Null - Loli, Ttar, STEM, Monstrama
Scum-lean - Badwolf

Am I missing anyone else?

 

[BSP]

As for Stem... I don't really know what to think of him. He seems to be making some insightful posts, but at the same time is playing very... carefully. At least it feels that way to me. As to exactly what that means, I can't say, but I will say I'm not getting any bad vibes from him yet.

What Ran said, and, since you pointed it out, I'm guessing you're viewing "playing carefully" in a negative light. Would you be willing to vote STEM for toDay?

Unvote - I feel that we're out of RVS and I don't want Vinyl lynched, so no need for my vote to sit on him. I still want those reads when you get a chance though.

 

[Monstmrna]

Monstmrna's vote in omgus was evidently a joke, and I just kinda chuckled to myself and moved on. It wasn't particularly funny but I didn't really see it as a big deal. However, it seems that you guys are really serious about this game. I'm more used to the epicmafia culture, I guess, where people are less serious. I think we should pay no attention to this vote until any conflict rises between them.

Right here I kind of feel like he's sort of subtly defending me, while at the same time leaving the possibility that I could become suspicious open. Again, not necessarily telling one way or the other, but like I said... it feels careful.

I think ttar had the right to be annoyed. Who knows if someone, town or mafia, would hammer? This is a newbie game and someone may lynch out of suspicion.

Here I get the sense that he's trying to placate Ttar by agreeing with his reaction to getting so close to lynch in RVS. Of course, I agree with Ttar as well, so I again don't think it's telling one way or the other, but it's another post where I get that careful feeling. It's hard to explain... more of a gut feeling thing.

Personally I think that question isn't that bad. Sometimes people answer with "yes, lololol jk".
I've seen mafia do this before to look town (they think "what mafia would ever admit to being mafia?")
Basically, if you ask that question and someone jokingly answers "yes", I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that they're mafia, but I would definitely fos them

This kind of feels like another one of those placation things.

At this time it's hard for me to get reads anyone. I'm not used to this style (Tell me what you think about him, accusing and stuff) so I wait for more posts before I get a real opinion on anyone. Plus, badwolf barely even did anything. He voted for me, which from what I can tell isn't a big deal in RVS, and someone voted for him saying "it was only fitting". That's the only thing I'm confused about.

"Wait and see" can be a common mafia tactic. When they don't necessarily want to toss all their cards on the table, they say something like this. "I'm going to wait for 'x' before I do 'y'" Of course, town do this all the time too, and usually I only see scum using the "wait and see" approach when some town person is about to be lynched and the scum is debating on whether or not to jump on the wagon.

No scum suspicions yet.

Here he offers no scum suspicions. Again, not telling... but at the same time, he could have at least offered some people who he thought might have been town.

To be honest, I wanted to let this one develop a bit so I could possibly make a real case, but yeah... that's what I mean by careful.

 

[BSP]

EBWOP: Thanks Vinyl. Explain your scum lean on Badwolf if you don't mind.

@Monst

Would you be willing to vote STEM for toDay?

 

[Monstmrna]

@Vinyl, I voted you because my playstyle is, and always will be, always vote and always lynch. If you are even a little bit suspicious of a person, you vote them. If they get lynched, and are scum, then you weren't wrong. If they get lynched and are town, you have information to go off of. If at some point a more scummy suspect arises, you switch to them instead. It is and always will be how I play this game.

I already explained Ttar.

I have a null read on badwolf, hence the "not convinced". Besides, I had my sights elsewhere.

 

[Monstmrna]

I suppose I would be willing to lynch STEM, but I don't really have a scum read on him as much as I'm simply watching him. Right now, I'd place him around the level of suspicion I have for Vinyl. Namely: Not really that much at all.

 

[Monstmrna]

Er, vote. To me, voting and lynching are essentially the same thing anyway. One is just a means to the others end.

 

[STEM]

I thought soup was ran. My bad.

I thought about what Vinyl said, reread, read what others said, and perhaps my wording was a little too strong. I don't mean that I'm that suspicious, I just think it'sslightly possible that his trolling had intent. I noted that we should watch him more carefully in my original post, right?

The reason behind not lynching Monstrmrna is mostly gut. I know he hasn't been talking a lot, but he seems very neutral to me. Not town, not mafia.
Also I've noticed it looks like we're buddying here. He gave his opinion on me as town and he seems very odd to place in the group of people not to lynch I made. I'm not mafia, I don't know if he is, but I feel like it was necessary to address this before anyone pointed this out.

Also to define what I mean by aggressive people and how we shouldn't lynch them, I think that at least one of them is mafia (not sure which), but it's not worth the risk to lynch a great player who's potentially town.

 

[Vinylic.]

@Vinyl, I voted you because my playstyle is, and always will be, always vote and always lynch. If you are even a little bit suspicious of a person, you vote them. If they get lynched, and are scum, then you weren't wrong. If they get lynched and are town, you have information to go off of. If at some point a more scummy suspect arises, you switch to them instead. It is and always will be how I play this game.

Odd playstyle at first, but okay.

I have a null read on badwolf, hence the "not convinced". Besides, I had my sights elsewhere.

And exactly what sights are they?

 

[Vinylic.]

I thought soup was ran. My bad.

I thought about what Vinyl said, reread, read what others said, and perhaps my wording was a little too strong. I don't mean that I'm that suspicious, I just think it'sslightly possible that his trolling had intent. I noted that we should watch him more carefully in my original post, right?

No, I don't think you did. Point it out otherwise, because all I see from you is saying "no scum suspicions yet" and then a post on you saying I was suspicious for that troll post.

 

[BSP]

@Vinyl, I voted you because my playstyle is, and always will be, always vote and always lynch. If you are even a little bit suspicious of a person, you vote them. If they get lynched, and are scum, then you weren't wrong. If they get lynched and are town, you have information to go off of.

If this is true, why haven't you put a vote on STEM yet? You've shown that you think he's done some pretty suspicious things, but you haven't put a vote down on him yet.

Unless you think Vinyl is more suspicious right now?

I suppose I would be willing to lynch STEM, but I don't really have a scum read on him as much as I'm simply watching him.

Wait, you just said that if you see a little suspicion, you vote them. So why no vote on STEM?

Right now, I'd place him around the level of suspicion I have for Vinyl. Namely: Not really that much at all.

So you're not suspicious of Vinyl, but you're willing to carry your current vote on him to a lynch. You've acknowledged that STEM has been suspicious, but you don't have a vote on him.

Explain.

 

[Vinylic.]

From my mind:

Well Soup is scum. Damn.

Wat.

In IC games when you're scum you always have this air about you that you are just watching us plitter around in a playground.

Sounds like something you can clarify, yet you didn't.

I've never been scum in any game that I've IC'd. Your point is moot unless you have further explanation behind it.

Out of BW, Soup said something else as well. Without clarifying.

Explain this, soup. You left an opinion without giving evidence to make it a fact.

I must be confused then.... I'll reconsider.

How do you get confused in the end?

And then after that, he goes out. Ran's will await for the response to be answered. Out of all that, it's a scum-lean.

 

[BSP]

The reason behind not lynching Monstrmrna is mostly gut. I know he hasn't been talking a lot, but he seems very neutral to me. Not town, not mafia.
Also I've noticed it looks like we're buddying here. He gave his opinion on me as town and he seems very odd to place in the group of people not to lynch I made. I'm not mafia, I don't know if he is, but I feel like it was necessary to address this before anyone pointed this out.

So you thought about the rest of us thinking you're buddying. Interesting.

 

[ranmaru]

I thought soup was ran. My bad.

I thought about what Vinyl said, reread, read what others said, and perhaps my wording was a little too strong. I don't mean that I'm that suspicious, I just think it'sslightly possible that his trolling had intent. I noted that we should watch him more carefully in my original post, right?

The reason behind not lynching Monstrmrna is mostly gut. I know he hasn't been talking a lot, but he seems very neutral to me. Not town, not mafia.
Also I've noticed it looks like we're buddying here. He gave his opinion on me as town and he seems very odd to place in the group of people not to lynch I made. I'm not mafia, I don't know if he is, but I feel like it was necessary to address this before anyone pointed this out.

Also to define what I mean by aggressive people and how we shouldn't lynch them, I think that at least one of them is mafia (not sure which), but it's not worth the risk to lynch a great player who's potentially town.

Really? Your reasons for your suspicions on Badwolf and Vinyl are very weak though. Did it really take you a re-read to finally come to that conclusion?

Also consider you say you re-read, but you only mentioned those two scum reads because BSP asked you to, not because you were being pro-active.

Also, can you tell me what exactly about Badwolf's reactions make him scummy to you?

Also, my question to you was how aggressiveness = scummyness.

Bold + Underlined:

You say the reason for not lynching Monstrmna is because of gut, and that he is neutral to you. Why would you want to save someone who is only neutral to you? (Your other two reads, me and Soup, are town reads correct?, how does Monstrmna fit with town reads for 'not lynching'?)

 

[ranmaru]

EBWOP: (I think you also mentioned BSP as a town read, correct?)

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I usually would FoS people who are aggressive (not gonna say who), but it's not worth the risk to lynch anyone like that in this early stage imo. Also, I don't like voicing the opinions because mafia could twist them to their advantage.

This is a mindset that you should get out of, Mafia will not get lynched if you do not speak up, if you have a reason to suspect someone you need to tell us so we can look at it.

Mostly gut feeling. In case you guys haven't heard, I play using gut feelings sometimes to sort of try and base my suspicions, and I didn't really sense any sort of ulterior motives in Ttar's posts.

But certainly you have a reason for that gut feeling, just tell me why you get that feeling.

"Wait and see" can be a common mafia tactic. When they don't necessarily want to toss all their cards on the table, they say something like this. "I'm going to wait for 'x' before I do 'y'" Of course, town do this all the time too, and usually I only see scum using the "wait and see" approach when some town person is about to be lynched and the scum is debating on whether or not to jump on the wagon.

If you're going to make a point, don't contradict yourself or make your point useless by saying "Well mafia could do this...but town could do this also." I don't understand the need to elaborate on things like this if you're not certain about the tell or feeling you get, you're playing wishy-washy with your stances.

Here he offers no scum suspicions. Again, not telling... but at the same time, he could have at least offered some people who he thought might have been town.

You do it here again, I want you to be assertive about your stances before putting yourself out there, it is one thing to let people know what you're thinking, and another doing absolutely nothing or not giving us a stance. You're not giving me a solid opinion here, you're instead playing around with it and questioning yourself.

Explain this, soup. You left an opinion without giving evidence to make it a fact.

? I've never been scum as an IC. I've only IC'd Newbie 18 and 20.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

or monstrmra.

Why? What do you think about his slight case on you and him casting doubt on you yet kind of keeping you at arms reach?