New Murder Choke Option

[TP]

We have a new option if we choke an opponent who is on a platform. Immediately after the choke, drop down and Uair. The timing is quite strict, for some characters you need to do it perfectly, but it is guaranteed and it hits all characters.... except one. The Dark Lord apparently knew about this before we did, so he prepared for it. There are usually better options than this, such as dropping down and chasing with a Dair, but this is good if your opponent is already at 120% or higher and you need a guaranteed kill.

All the proof needed

Credits:
Me, for discovering this.
pure_awesome, for finding out what characters it works on and making vids.

 

[Kholdstare]

Hmm, nice find. I'll try it out tonight, after I return to the hotel. I'm on my laptop

 

[Blad01]

Yes this deserves some tests indeed

But if you MC on a platform, just drop and techchase with an aerial (Uair / Dair for the easiest) or even a USmash.

 

[pure_awesome]

Hey guys, I just wanted to confirm that dropthrough -> Uair is indeed a guaranteed follow-up, at least on some characters, in some situations. The timing is fairly strict. I've got some time to kill today, so I'll run through a bit of the cast.

The easiest way to see this is to use Jiggs. Go on Battlefield, and have Jiggs DI Murder Choke towards Ganon, then try to roll away or get up. Since this trajectory takes slightly longer for Jiggs to hit the ground, Ganon has plenty of time to kick Jiggs' cute little face in.
To get an idea on how strict the timing can be, try this combo on a Bowser who DIs straight down (not sure if that even makes a difference, tbh) and rolls as soon as possible. The timing for the dropthrough ->Uair must be very precise, but it does work.

One thing I learned today: Using C-Stick for aerials while Training Mode is set to 1/4 often doesn't work.

I can put up a video of this later, but it would be a high quality cell phone video. I'd also need to know which characters you'd like to see, and how you'd like them to react.

 

[TP]

But if you MC on a platform, just drop and techchase with an aerial (Uair / Dair for the easiest) or even a USmash.

If my opponent is at 120% or higher, I'd prefer the guaranteed option.

One thing I learned today: Using C-Stick for aerials while Training Mode is set to 1/4 often doesn't work.

I also learned that today.

 

[pure_awesome]

Does anyone know if just doing your normal get-up animation puts you into invincibility frames faster than doing a roll? Sometimes it seems like it does, most of the time it seems like it doesn't.

If noone knows, I'll pose the question in Tactical.

 

[Z1GMA]

Very nice T-prince !
I will try this out.

I wonder if a (turn around > drop through > bair) is fast enough to hit the opponent.
That would be cool since bair tends to be "fresh".

________

You got me thinking about Ganons drop through in general..
I'm thinking of MC-spike on a moving platform, say Smashville; then instantly dropping through the platform and Dair them : )

 

[pure_awesome]

I've been trying the turnaround Bair as well, but it would seem that YOU'RE TOO SLOW! the Bair doesn't come out fast enough.

Ganon's Nair also doesn't appear to work, which kind of surprises me since it's pretty fast.

 

[Dr. Hyde]

MC -> Drop _> Aerial MC is my favorite way of doing things

 

[Ray_Kalm]

MC -> Drop _> Aerial MC is my favorite way of doing things

Yeah, especially when you're a stock above and get a ganoncide.

 

[Gaussis]

Can someone post frame data to at least support this? If uair comes out faster than dtilt/jab, then it could be possble. However, we would also need frames for the platform drop.

 

[pure_awesome]

I can 99% confirm that this works on all characters except one.

It's pretty easy once you get the timing, save for a few characters:

Fox, Falco, Marth, and Peach have fairly strict timing.

Wolf and Samus have patently absurd timing, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was 1 frame.

So, who is it impossible on? Well, have you ever wondered if Ganondorf could create a combo so powerful even he himself would be hurt by it? Well, I don't have the answer to that question, but this combo sure doesn't. Yep, the only character that does not appear susceptible to his follow-up is Ganondorf himself.

I put up a quick, un-edited runthrough of the roster so that everyone could see just how strict the timing is on certain characters as opposed to others. Done high quality cell phone.


First video
tests ROB, Kirby, MK, DDD, Olimar, Fox, Falco, Wolf, CF, Pikachu, PT. Testing Wolf starts around 5:15 and goes downhill from there.

Second video
tests Lucario, Jiggs, Marth, Ike, Ness, Lucas, G&W, Snake, Sonic, Ganondorf. Testing Ganondorf starts around 7:20 and proves fruitless.

Third video
tests Samus, ZSS, Link, Zelda, Sheik, Toon Link, Wario, Yoshi, Diddy Kong. Samus is tested first.

Fourth video
tests DK, Bowser, Peach, Luigi, Mario, and has a bonus Murder Choke to Dair combo at the end of the video that does 31% damage fresh, can KO, and looks awesome.


Enjoy! These things weren't even done uploading by the time I got back from work. I also just realized that I accidentally cut out Ice Climbers and Pit, so just trust me that it works on them.

 

[:034:]

Nice find, guys. :D

Can it be tested if people can escape if they buffer rolls? I would do it myself, but my testing skills aren't good enough to fully control two characters at the same time.

 

[Shadow Nataku]

Nice new addition though I wonder how useful it'd actually be considering the only characters you'll really want to use this on is those who are uneffected by the DAir followup and the timing is pretty strict.

 

[Dr. Hyde]

Yeah, especially when you're a stock above and get a ganoncide.

well I mean in general.

The platform on Battlefield for example you choke and then drop away to the side.
Then you can just Aerial choke if they roll or attack no matter what.
You get a 2nd Murder Choke for free, and an almost guarantee that the person will get up attack so shield and stomp.

More effective than the drop Uair, IMHO

I just never considered the Uair because of two things:

1) Doesn't kill until high percents. Let's be honest I would consider the Uair Drop if my opponent was around 130, but that's that otherwise this leads to my 2nd reason

2) The opponent is knocked further away and out of combo range. I know combo, not a word I mean to use with Ganon but "Tech Chase range" to be to my liking. If you choke some one of the platform from 0% and do the aerial you can easily keep the momentum up to a kill.

I always try and get the momentum to a stock lead and then go for a suicide to get the moral down but it has to be suicide or another stock for 100% damage b/c Ganon needs to instill fear for victory. However when my opponents get scared they get campy and try and space even more so.

just my point of view on the technique, if it lands them on another platform at early on then I'd use the Uair more

 

[TP]

well I mean in general.

The platform on Battlefield for example you choke and then drop away to the side.
Then you can just Aerial choke if they roll or attack no matter what.
You get a 2nd Murder Choke for free, and an almost guarantee that the person will get up attack so shield and stomp.

That is far from a guarantee. I think you are greatly overrating that concept. Do you know what my most common response is after I have been choked? Nothing. I just lie there for a while, knowing he will move away to try some crazy Dair or SS Fsmash. If you tried to aerial choke me, I would be all over you.

Thank you, pure_awesome, for earning your name.

The first post has been rewritten completely, presumably for the last time.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

I'll add this to the Question& Answer thread.