Neutrals

[milesg2g]

I wanna throw a national with only Neutral levels allowed, that'd be so dope to me. Like with the same stages the Japanese players use/used. You can only CP Neutrals no other stage.

Seeing how there's all this complaining about MK going on anyway, I think it'd be sick. Most of our Top players only lose to MK on his gay counter pick stages and only win on neutrals. (Which they could still very well lose) I think that's the case with most of our mid level players too. MK would still be the best character in the game of course but I think we'd see some crazy results from it. Plus, it'd be dope to see how the Japanese play against our best THEIR way lol.

If you stop and think of it some of the most hype matches played in this game were on neutrals and it's not any coincidence. I think playing those stages only in tourney would make out for a more entertaining and faster game of Brawl. Now I'm not gonna sit up here and say "Hey man this is how the game SHOULD be played" because I like the current way the game is played. But lets be real here how many hype crew matches have been on a counterpick stage? Against a MK? lol.

Someone needs to get on this like real talk, I live in TX and I don't really know anyone here because I just moved here like 5 days ago. However, I know Xyro is a dope TO and he seems like he'd be down for some innovative. But I mean I would love it if ANY TO would do this. The name of the tourney would have to be named NEUTRALS, lol. And it should only change to keep count of it lol. (NEUTRALS II or something etc.)

Idk what I'd do for doubles because some people really need the CP's given in doubles but yeah. I'm willing to do this with a strong enough support system so tell me what you think.

What do you think?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

You overestimate the effect of counterpick stages on Meta Knight's dominance, for one. I'm pretty sure that Battlefield and Smashville are considered some of Meta Knight's best levels.

I've never felt that neutrals create significantly more exciting matches. In fact, the current list of neutrals is silly to me; various things on Yoshi's Island affect the match too much for my taste, and Final Destination gives an obnoxious advantage to many of the best characters. I tend to enjoy watching people fight on stages with a lot of things to take advantage of, such as Rainbow Cruise or Brinstar, rather than flat-and-plat stuff. Of course, Meta Knight tends to be able to abuse things much better than everyone else, but, that's not any other character's fault. Link loves Norfair; should he be forced to abandon it just because Meta Knight breaks the level?

That said, it's less that counterpick stages promote camping than it is that counterpicks create an advantage for a specific player, which would happen within neutrals or not. Ice Climbers will love Final Destination more than you will; Meta Knight will love Battlefield more than you will. It's just the nature of the counterpick system.

I can see why such a tournament would appeal to some players, but I don't think that only using commonly-accepted neutral stages would "fix" anything, other than the fact that camping would be slightly harder to manage (for some matchups, anyway).

 

[milesg2g]

You overestimate the effect of counterpick stages on Meta Knight's dominance, for one. I'm pretty sure that Battlefield and Smashville are considered some of Meta Knight's best levels.

I've never felt that neutrals create significantly more exciting matches. In fact, the current list of neutrals is silly to me; various things on Yoshi's Island affect the match too much for my taste, and Final Destination gives an obnoxious advantage to many of the best characters. I tend to enjoy watching people fight on stages with a lot of things to take advantage of, such as Rainbow Cruise or Brinstar, rather than flat-and-plat stuff. Of course, Meta Knight tends to be able to abuse things much better than everyone else, but, that's not any other character's fault. Link loves Norfair; should he be forced to abandon it just because Meta Knight breaks the level?

That said, it's less that counterpick stages promote camping than it is that counterpicks create an advantage for a specific player, which would happen within neutrals or not. Ice Climbers will love Final Destination more than you will; Meta Knight will love Battlefield more than you will. It's just the nature of the counterpick system.

I can see why such a tournament would appeal to some players, but I don't think that only using commonly-accepted neutral stages would "fix" anything, other than the fact that camping would be slightly harder to manage (for some matchups, anyway).

I'm actually glad you made this post because I knew it'd be a argument concerning the stagelist of this type of tourney.

First we'd have to come to a mutual agreement on what neutrals are, not the one's currently listed in the BBR.

Second I never said neutrals completely balance the game, there are many characters that destroy other characters on neutral stages. I just believe MK wouldn't be as dominant on the current counterpick stages. Also myself like MANY others really enjoy watching the Japanese play. Granted, their different people than us but I like their ruleset and would love to see how they'd do against us. This tourney isn't to balance the game I just would really like to see it.


THIS ISN'T TO FIX ANYTHING. lol <3Reflex

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I'm actually glad you made this post because I knew it'd be a argument concerning the stagelist of this type of tourney.

First we'd have to come to a mutual agreement on what neutrals are, not the one's currently listed in the BBR.

Second I never said neutrals completely balance the game, there are many characters that destroy other characters on neutral stages. I just believe MK wouldn't be as dominant on the current counterpick stages. Also myself like MANY others really enjoy watching the Japanese play. Granted, their different people than us but I like their ruleset and would love to see how they'd do against us. This tourney isn't to balance the game I just would really like to see it.


THIS ISN'T TO FIX ANYTHING. lol <3Reflex

I figured it was partly a means of fixing the metagame because you used "Meta Knight wouldn't be as dominant on these stages" as a way to make it seem appealing, is all.

There are a lot of Japanese players who we don't get to see play under our ruleset, simply because they don't travel out of country (mess is expensive). If we want to see how the US's best players would stack up on their terms, perhaps we should send some players their way sometime, rather than devoting a whole tournament series to a foreign ruleset.

Also, off the top of your head, what would seem like an acceptable set of neutrals for this kind of tournament?

 

[milesg2g]

Well I brought up the MK thing just to point out a fun fact of the ruleset. I just want to see a tourney with this ruleset take place.

Also I think FD, SV and BF are the most neutral. But I'm sure like 3 others would be fine to add on as well.

 

[Player-3]

i'm fine with this, because rainbow cruise is a neutral

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Stupid idea.

 

[EPsilon933]

Would anyone ever enjoy playing on counter pick stages only in friendlies?

 

[Saki-]

National with neutrals only would fail imo.

 

[milesg2g]

=[ negative responses.


I still might do it though lol

 

[T-block]

Can we not call them neutrals? >_>

Starters is a much better term, or in this case call them static stages.

If you stop and think of it some of the most hype matches played in this game were on neutrals and it's not any coincidence.

And I guess the other most hype matches are played on counterpick stages?

(No seriously, I see plenty of hype matches on counterpick stages... the players and the characters used have more effect on the amount of hype than the stage imo)

All in all, I see nothing wrong with the idea. I'm not going to say I'm coming, but I'd be interested in seeing the results.

 

[Kantrip]

Castle Seige, Smashville, Lylat Cruise, Yoshi's Island: Brawl, and Halberd are hardly static. Starter is probably the best term so people don't throw a fit over it.

 

[milesg2g]

Guys I'm not saying hype matches AREN'T played on Cp's just some of the most hype are on neutrals IMO. lol

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Flossing > starters only
Flossing = neutrals only