Nerfed into the trash can

[LightLV]

Dair is like a surprise move, so you can't use it a lot and you need to have good damn read. Once it lands and you meteor someone it's so satisfying. Same with on stage e.g. meteor someone back to the ground to give yourself a breather or something.

Yeah it still does its job if you get it off, but the first thing I did when deciding to pick up Falco on this game was just pretend like it didn't exist anymore. Its hitbox is in no way forgiving, it's very slow, has little range and its landing lag is horrible.

I'm trying to slowly put it back into my arsenal, but i've had 10x more success with illusion spikes than his Dair. It's still a great card to keep hidden though.

 

[Goldschuss]

Holy! This thread has gotten more replys, than I ever expected it to get.
Thank you for all the contribution guys. What do you think about the Up Smash Spike?

For me, this has become a really cool move, but I noticed there is a hidden "second hit" on his upsmash which seems to be the spike. Sadly this second hit, doesn't always appear as it should, so you can spike only when the target is directly above you. Same stuff with Greninja. They should change it like Mr. Game and Watch's Upsmash so it always spikes

 

[Zionaze]

Holy! This thread has gotten more replys, than I ever expected it to get.
Thank you for all the contribution guys. What do you think about the Up Smash Spike?

For me, this has become a really cool move, but I noticed there is a hidden "second hit" on his upsmash which seems to be the spike. Sadly this second hit, doesn't always appear as it should, so you can spike only when the target is directly above you. Same stuff with Greninja. They should change it like Mr. Game and Watch's Upsmash so it always spikes

what? spike? with up smash?

 

[Goldschuss]

Yea you can also see it here: http://youtu.be/gxQGAdJPpL4?t=56s I just landed 2 of them in a row. and yea they were a lot stronger than the usual Up smashes so I suppose It can be considered a spike

 

[Zionaze]

i think you mean sweetspot not spike

 

[HandzOffMyPrey11]

been doing that for awhile

 

[Foster J.]

I think having 2 hits on an Up Smash is dumb if the 1st hit is meaningless, if we were to compare it to Greninja's, then Falco's is a pointless Sweet Spot that couldn't even KO a Megaman at 92 %

But as for the laser talk, you could do with some short hop love for some reduce ending lag, it wouldn't be too strong if we keep the current speed, range and ROF, and would add to the zoning tool, especially helping in the ZSS match up.

Fun thing about his FAir is how it'll launch of the last frame, even when landing, though the damage insignificant it'll at least provide a "reset" option, considering the landing / ending lag of it. - It also does okay at wall diving if he's staying at the ledge and you knock them into the wall, here's an example of it's usage against tether recovery twitch.tv/nairomk/b/607974614?t=2h45m30s -
Can't post a link without 10 posts LEL

But, is it just me or does Falco something have absurd small grab ranges, already being one of the slowest - ESPECIALLY for his weight class, so the dash grab ain't nothing to sing about.

 

[GreatDave]

Effectively, I noticed Falco has a really tiny grab range. I've always wondered if every character has the same grab-range or if the problem is ME. Maybe it's me who doesn't perform properly the grabs? Or...is Falco?
Just 'cause online other players grab me so easily and repeatedly (especially who uses Mario, Luigi, Ness or Zelda)...I started to wonder about this.

 

[Ffamran]

I know Ganondorf's grab range is short as well, but I'm not sure who has what range and where Falco falls under that grab range and speed ranking. There's data on it, but not a ranking yet. Check out this thread: Complete Hitbox/Frame Data For Every Character.

 

[Beach]

I'm just really hoping we see some buffs/changes to Falco and perhaps some other weaker characters. We just don't have much to go off of now.

 

[Foster J.]

The question is more or less when though, 1.0.4 game out a month after effectively removing any Greninja from a top10 placement.
And we know Nintendo are collecting tons of data from match making online, but the real question regarding that data is they apply the numbers, cause most KO's from Falco are likely to be fSmash or bAir these days.

The fact that laser makes you take such a high risk is a pain, yet so it does with Fox, so it's very likely the ending lag on the lasers will get changed for the better, perhaps we can hope on faster fire rate, or short hop improvements.

At least we're pretty much schedule for a patch when Mew2 comes out, though that's probably not before March.

 

[GreatDave]

Effectively, the Blaster lag is a great problem. As the opponent gets near, if he/she is a fast character it's a problem. The same with Fox, though he is slightly faster. Falco would be a great gimper and a perfect fighter for mind-games, but in this way it's very hard to use some laser...

 

[The21stSmasher]

Yeah, the fact that Falco's kill potential is now very slim in Sm4sh, I often get frustrated when it comes to killing my opponent. And I'm really good with him too!

 

[gameplayzero]

Yeah, the fact that Falco's kill potential is now very slim in Sm4sh, I often get frustrated when it comes to killing my opponent. And I'm really good with him too!

falco has a very good amount of kill options. D-tilt, fair, back throw, bair, smash attacks (not upsmash), uair are the best. Might want to watch some falco vids on the video thread to see how to properly use them. Knowing when to use them is going to be your biggest problem though.

the only real issue falco has is the lag on his laser. That and "possibly" his dair are the only changes that he needs. Everything else he has is fine (his up smash is pretty bad too, but everyone has at least one bad smash attack).

 

[The21stSmasher]

falco has a very good amount of kill options. D-tilt, fair, back throw, bair, smash attacks (not upsmash), uair are the best. Might want to watch some falco vids on the video thread to see how to properly use them. Knowing when to use them is going to be your biggest problem though.

Believe me. I've been looking into Falco videos for the longest time. And I'm still doing it today. Proving bit by bit tho. Also, there are times when I know when to use the kills move (Well, most of the time.). So, yeah.

 

[gameplayzero]

Believe me. I've been looking into Falco videos for the longest time. And I'm still doing it today. Proving bit by bit tho. Also, there are times when I know when to use the kills move (Well, most of the time.). So, yeah.

then there is obviously something wrong. Upload some replays. I'd like to help.

 

[The21stSmasher]

then there is obviously something wrong. Upload some replays. I'd like to help.

Hm, I WAS thinking about uploading other video of me playing For Glory. If you really wanna help improve my Falco, then you're gonna have to wait for my #3 to come out some time before the end of today. Then you can give me some tips and what not.

 

[gameplayzero]

Hm, I WAS thinking about uploading other video of me playing For Glory. If you really wanna help improve my Falco, then you're gonna have to wait for my #3 to come out some time before the end of today. Then you can give me some tips and what not.

sounds good.

 

[Foster J.]

From my observations of your lil video, then it seems you dash attack a lil too much

Your use of Phantasm as recovery sometimes gets read when you try to recover onto the stage, so try to take notice of where the enemy stands, not a big problem, this only happened a handful of times, and not use it while being to high off the ground if you choose to go towards the stage instead of the ledge.

You sometimes end up doing a dAir or fAir when landing adding unnecessary lag to yourself, instead try to use nAir to lag or flinch the opponent.

Also, you are not grabbing enough in my opinion, and I don't think I saw you use uTilt even once.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9s5p1K5FX9I#t=699
I legitimately raged, this happens WAY too often, Sakurai adding HEY LETS ADD A MEANINGLESS KICK THAT CAN RUIN THE SMASH - /fist

 

[gameplayzero]

From my observations of your lil video, then it seems you dash attack a lil too much

Your use of Phantasm as recovery sometimes gets read when you try to recover onto the stage, so try to take notice of where the enemy stands, not a big problem, this only happened a handful of times, and not use it while being to high off the ground if you choose to go towards the stage instead of the ledge.

You sometimes end up doing a dAir or fAir when landing adding unnecessary lag to yourself, instead try to use nAir to lag or flinch the opponent.

Also, you are not grabbing enough in my opinion, and I don't think I saw you use uTilt even once.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9s5p1K5FX9I#t=699
I legitimately raged, this happens WAY too often, Sakurai adding HEY LETS ADD A MEANINGLESS KICK THAT CAN RUIN THE SMASH - /fist

this guy basically made a better and shorter summary of my feedback to you 21st smasher. This stuff happens to a lot of falco players though and this is why I highly everyone watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYWXCTKKDV0&index=3&list=LLGzrFaIpxd9hnC3Hn6MKOOw


and falco's up smash is just ugh. Sakurai must have been drunk. Just like removing Samus' Nair, the best approaching tool she had.

 

[Foster J.]

this guy basically made a better and shorter summary of my feedback to you 21st smasher. This stuff happens to a lot of falco players though and this is why I highly everyone watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYWXCTKKDV0&index=3&list=LLGzrFaIpxd9hnC3Hn6MKOOw


and falco's up smash is just ugh. Sakurai must have been drunk. Just like removing Samus' Nair, the best approaching tool she had.

Sakurai obviously is super butt hurt with Falco, considering Fox's uSmash wasn't nerfed, plus his laser game wasn't as potent. We can only pray that he changes this in the future.

 

[gameplayzero]

Sakurai obviously is super butt hurt with Falco, considering Fox's uSmash wasn't nerfed, plus his laser game wasn't as potent. We can only pray that he changes this in the future.

I wouldn't be surprised if he was butt hurt after how good falco was in brawl (he specifically removed everything that made falco high tier). I'm surprised he hasn't made fox and falco low tier in brawl since they were the face of competitive melee. At least falco isn't garbage tier in this game and fox is getting lots of love.

 

[The21stSmasher]

Also, you are not grabbing enough in my opinion, and I don't think I saw you use uTilt even once.

Thanks for the feedback. I didn't think I'll have not 1, but 2 people giving me feedback for the price of one video. Anyways, I little something I wanna say about that sentence of yours:

1.) Pretty sure you saw me attempting to use the grab. (And it'll either miss or connect, but it mostly missed...)
2.) I actually did used the U-Tilt in the first 2 battles against that Greninja.

 

[Foster J.]

Thanks for the feedback. I didn't think I'll have not 1, but 2 people giving me feedback for the price of one video. Anyways, I little something I wanna say about that sentence of yours:

1.) Pretty sure you saw me attempting to use the grab. (And it'll either miss or connect, but it mostly missed...)
2.) I actually did used the U-Tilt in the first 2 battles against that Greninja.

Well attempting, it's hit or miss, you know of power shield grabbing right? Basicly shielding an attack and grabbing the character afterwards. This is also why I said you dash attack too much, as it's the most common move that gets you grabbed.

Well I'm human ;v But that's still 2 little man, the uTilt is amazing if you are going to get grabbed if he has shield lag, as it comes out at 5 frames and can be followed up by a 2nd one.

 

[The21stSmasher]

Well attempting, it's hit or miss, you know of power shield grabbing right? Basicly shielding an attack and grabbing the character afterwards. This is also why I said you dash attack too much, as it's the most common move that gets you grabbed.

Well I'm human ;v But that's still 2 little man,

Like I wouldn't know what power shield grabbing is and I think I already know the point of the overuse of the dash attack feedback. That flaw's common enough for you to mention it again. Also, What does that (The words I bold on your quote) suppose to mean???

 

[The Dom Bomb]

IMO, Falco's biggest problem from Melee to Smash 4 is his HUUUGE downgrade in speed in general. Pretty much every one of his moves has much, much more lag and is harder to execute, especially his blaster and up smash. I find his grabs to be slightly more usable than the rest of his moveset, and his up-special is still reliable recovery, but god darn if he isn't just disappointingly bad after his domination in Melee

 

[gameplayzero]

Like I wouldn't know what power shield grabbing is and I think I already know the point of the overuse of the dash attack feedback. That flaw's common enough for you to mention it again. Also, What does that (The words I bold on your quote) suppose to mean???

He is just trying to help. Lets not make this a bigger deal than it actually is. You just prove to us that you know your stuff by improving and winning more matches, and then showing us the replays. Action speaks louder than words!

I'm looking forward to your next replays.

 

[EchoesOfRain]

Just popping in here real quick. Falco was one of the very few characters that I played in melee and brawl, but once i played him in wiiU/3ds I immediately dropped him. He just not feel like he used to. I dont see anyone play him online either

 

[Zionaze]

Just popping in here real quick. Falco was one of the very few characters that I played in melee and brawl, but once i played him in wiiU/3ds I immediately dropped him. He just not feel like he used to. I dont see anyone play him online either

this is the exact reason why i started playing falco.
gotta love the underdogs m8ty

 

[Zionaze]

At 1:50 and 2:00 i somehow spammed jab1 over and over.
while im not entirely sure on how to do this, it did rack up an incredible amount of dmg in a short period of time since his jab1 does 3 damage per hit.
If someone can recreate this that'l be a great tool falco can use.

 

[Foster J.]

Also, What does that (The words I bold on your quote) suppose to mean???

How about bolding the entire sentence instead then? As the sassy comment was just for sass and not part of it? Not using the uTilt more is just, not making full use of it, as in every case of the opponent not getting a power shield off, you can use it to knock them up in the air due to the frame speed of the move, and him having shield lag.

 

[The21stSmasher]

How about bolding the entire sentence instead then? As the sassy comment was just for sass and not part of it? Not using the uTilt more is just, not making full use of it, as in every case of the opponent not getting a power shield off, you can use it to knock them up in the air due to the frame speed of the move, and him having shield lag.

Well dang, I just wanted to know what little "sass" meant. >_> And I didn't bother bolding the entire sentence of yours, because I acknowledged the U-Tilt advice. It's pointless for me to bold the entire sentence, rather than it part of it, if I got no words to say, other than taking your advice about the U-Tilt.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

At 1:50 and 2:00 i somehow spammed jab1 over and over.
while im not entirely sure on how to do this, it did rack up an incredible amount of dmg in a short period of time since his jab1 does 3 damage per hit.
If someone can recreate this that'l be a great tool falco can use.

Interesting. I think it's just because Ganon was too slow to jump out/do a move and too damaged to land and shield(he does land a few times but I think he's still in hitstun) but if there's some sort of iasa frames that don't overlap the cancel into jab2 or something that could be very useful. Both in damage racking and setting up dtilt kills. Especially after doing dtilt jab frame traps.