Apparently you are not... samus is not a person, she is a CHARACTER... and since she is a character there are a billion different ways to play her. You did not learn a match up my friend, you learned a play style and how to counter it. Sometimes the best way to beat a campy samus, like the one you are describing, is to be patient, powersheild her missiles or just hit them alway with titls, and wait for samus to come to you. You are posting on the wrong board for help and you are asking all the wrong questions. Really think about the game and maybe you will understand.
I didn't learn the match-up?
WHAT!!!!
What i've learned is that samus has to rely on certain aspects to thrive. From what ive witnessed, From a distance Samus has the ability to barrage you with projectiles, why would any Samus player not do it? So its safe to Say that every Samus player will snipe you from afar,
Good. That is one Strategy that i have seen
EVERY Samus player do, and it is effective, it forces an approach.
Now what i have also noticed is that Samus on ground is very dangerous, she has a very fast/long wavedash, she
CAN approach if the player chooses to do so, but ive learned that an approaching Samus is at a
DISADVANTAGE, her missiles work from afar, but how bout up close? Marth has a very strict
ZONING game, there is a danger bubble around marth where
HE CAN GET YOU BUT YOU CANT GET HIM. Truth is the
wind up and
cool down of the missiles gives Marth enough time to throw out a fair, if perfectly spaced you can hit Samus with the very tip of the sword, and when full hopping you can follow it up with another fair. (If somehow the Samus is able to shield your fair, if spaced correctly, short hopped, fast falled, and l cancelled, you should be safe from anything Samus can throw at you out of shield), after fair the follow up could be a grab(more favorable) or a nair/fair. Fair
MUST BE SPACED, Crouch Cancel d-tilt is a favorite amongst Samus players ive noticed. F-tilt is safer, its range allows for a safe poke, although the drawback is lack of follow ups.
Ideally if you are closer to the ground than Samus the best option would be WD u'tilt, once she's in the air, marth has
SO MANY options against Samus, she cant do anything.But, wd u'tilt can be dangerous, this is not a move to throw out all the time. Another option for approach is WD down tilt, it can be followed up, its fast, and its a good mix up.
Ive learned that Samus's air mobility is strictly for combo purposes, she cant put on pressure with shffling, that's just asking to die. She has to get close via the ground in order to get you, so you lock down anything she can do, the second she dives in for an attack a well placed grab out of dash dance is all it will take, so it basically comes down to
MIND GAMES at this point
When will Samus make her move? When can i throw out that grab? This is when it comes down to the
PLAYERS, the mind games at this point are crucial, if the grab misses Marth is toast, Samus can wd f-smash the baited out grab, and if marth is locked in hit stun she can shoot a missile or power blast and it will surly hit, so long as marth is in the air.
Ive also learned that marths combo strings in the air are damn near IMPOSSIBLE for Samus to escape, his u'air stings lead to fairs, which lead to Ken combo's. If it cant finish with a Ken combo an fsmash will do the job. BUT, ive learned that against Samus an fsmash should only be used when Samus is slightly off the ground, When she is grounded she can avoid it quite easily, and punish accordingly, so Fsmash on a grounded Samus is a big no no, UNLESS i get a solid read off a tech roll, or a baited fsmash.
Ive also learned that Samus
ALWAYS makes it back, there is no way around it. The only way to K.O. her is to SPIKE or FSMASH, and if she is really damaged an utilt will work too. Ive never dared venture off the edge to try and take her down, the lag on netplay makes it too dangerous, so i let Samus grab the ledge, but now she has LIMITED options that marth can easily lock down. If she decides to Fair onto the stage, wave land, or tech roll, marth can easily grab her, if she decides to jump, you can juggle, as you can see the mind games also play a big roll in this situation, a miss prediction could be the end for marth.
Ive also learn the it is not ok to be on a platform above samus, fair in particular is a nasty move, not only that, but she can also break out with nair. uair has the same nastiness as fair, and bair is a fast, strong ko move that i find is very dangerous when i go for air approaches, ive also found that her dair is often miss used, it is easily shield gradable. all in all she has very excellent air moves, what s holding her back is her air mobility. Ive found that in order to beat Samus you need to respect the power on her air moves, just because she is in the air does not mean she is obsolete.
Samus's grab is a joke, unless she somehow gets you. d throw into super charged shot is gg. It really only hits on solid reads though. But really this move kinda sucks, it is very punishable.
Ive found that Samus can be VERY dangerous, when there is a point when Samus forces a reaction out of you with her missiles.
For example
A missile comes my way, i roll forward to get closer to Samus while avoiding the missile, the second i come out of the invincibility from the roll, i can be shot with a charged blast, grabbed, smashed, tilted, or abused in any other way Samus can think of
and if samus gets a successful bait, as with most characters she can make the most out of it.
Another dangerous aspect i have found is her charge shot, its potency seeps through every aspect of her moveset. She can blast you with it off of nearly ANY HIT, it is a move that everyone should be keeping tabs on.
Ive tried my hardest to beat Samus players, and i have succeeded. I'm not even sure if everything i have said is 100% accurate, but it has been working for me, if there are better options out there i will gladly take them, if someone finds a way to beat me, ill just keep on adapting, i have a determination to make it over every road block in my way.
As for playing "Gimmicky", each character can only use what was given to them... if you consider... ANYTHING in this game a gimmick, it is because you are too inexperienced to understand what the opponent is trying to do with their character. Marth is a very standard character... a sword and what the player can do with it, dont cry on other boards because Marth was not given projectiles. Use your brain, to figure out how to use that sword in the best possible way to get a win, if grabs and up throws work on that one samus, gratz on actually thinking, instead of getting frustrated and stop playing.
I consider "Gimmicky" to be when one does not use there character to there potential, and instead rely on repetitive tactics that only involve a small portion of the characters move set, in other words, when someone plays CHEAP/SPAMMY.
i am not what you would call "inexperienced." I've also been on this site longer than you have, and at this point your probably going to pull up the old bull**** excuse "IVE BEEN A LURKER ON THIS SITE FOR LIKE 2 YEARS BRA." And if your wondering, i only lurked on this site for a few months before joining, before that i was into melee, i could do the techs and i watched competitive melee, i just didn't play competitively.. I'm not whining about anything, i was just requesting help, and when everyone said Samus sucks in the air i thought of the best character for juggles, Marth. And who is also one of the best characters for tech chasing? Marth. Who also has the upper hand in the games of footsies? Marth. The list goes on, but Marth was the clear winner for a character who i could easily take down Samus with. and after overcoming her with marth, my GnW can now do the same(although without that grab range things are a bit more difficult).
I never once whined about my Characters not being good enough, and like i said in the op
*Disclaimer*
im not trying to say "omg, Samus OP! NERF NERF NERF!* I know i can overcome this match up, i just need help
I believe all the characters in this game have the tools they need to thrive, its just a matter of figuring it out. I was just requesting help from those who know more about Samus than I. Im not as inexperienced as you say i am, and i DO understand this game.
Please tell me, what are you trying to prove to me
