Namco Character discussion

[mewi]

I agree Black Ops sucks.

i never said it was all about popularity, but it does play a large enough role that it does need to be taken into account. i say Pac-Man's likely cause he's a mascot, a Tekken character is likely cause it is Namco's biggest franchise at the moment, a Tales of character is likely cause one of the creators of the series is working on Sm4sh. these series just have more working for them then Xenosaga does. if we were to talk about Kos-Mos becoming DLC for PSASBR then it has a decently strong leg to stand on. but for Smash it has more obstacles than assistance.

Well if we want to talk about popularity, okay Pac man has popularity, but he is also lacking in so much... character, you know? o.o and Tekken I just don't see happening, I mean when was the last time anyone actually cared about Tekken?

and because of Monolith, I think KOS-MOS probably has the 2nd best chance in that list, but that could be personal BIAS, but I doubt it.

 

[Deleted member]

I suggest you do the same, as you clearly don't know that sexism works both ways.

Sexism is "a set of beliefs claiming that real or alleged differences between women and men establishing the superiority of one sex over the other."

The fact you're trying to play the "more women in population equals more females in Smash" card and that there are "enough male characters" is being sexist against the male gender.

Smash is not sexist just because there are few female characters. It's not like that was done deliberately against females. Nintendo characters are chosen for their importance and popularity, which just happens to have more males than females. I mean, the females in Smash are Nintendo's most important: Peach, Zelda, and Samus. Now, some others could be included for importance and popularity, such as Palutena and Dixie Kong, but there's simply not that many that don't take away from other more important characters such as Ridley or K. Rool.

Now 3rd Parties? They're another horse entirely. Especially when you talk about Namco Bandai.
At this point, there are only three series with a shot at a character, Pac-Man, Tales Of, and Tekken, and that's just because the first one is the mascot while the other two have their developers involved in Smash 4's production and are not against their characters being in the game.
I wish this was not the case, as I would really love to have a Pikachu vs. Agumon match for the sake of my childhood, but I have to manage.
That's not to say KOS-MOS wouldn't be interesting, as she would be very much interesting. It's just that, too much is going against her, and no, her having a vagina doesn't magically make her more likely or logical.

EDIT: Also, "character" means nothing in Smash, given we have someone like Captain Falcon, who pretty much had no character (or moveset) prior to Smash. And even when was established with some character, it completely differs from the one he was given in Smash.
And Tekken is a pretty big deal. Otherwise, the series would have died out quite a while ago.

 

[mewi]

I suggest you do the same, as you clearly don't know that sexism works both ways.

Sexism is "a set of beliefs claiming that real or alleged differences between women and men establishing the superiority of one sex over the other."

That is making the assertion that I argued that females were more superior over males. I did not, I argued I wanted a more balanced roster, whereas, you argue that I am sexist for wanting a more balanced roster, where you defend a male superior roster, hence you think males should continue holding superiority over the roster.

You draw your own conclusions from that.

 

[3Bismyname]

actually i work at Gamestop and our reserves list for upcoming Wii U titles show that Tekken is the 3rd most preordered title after the new Mario and Nintendo land. then there was that whole Street Fighter X Tekken thing. meanwhile Pac-Man has enough to work for him that make him maybe not the most interesting character but a more well rounded and easy to master character. which all fighting games need. personal bias, i want Agumon. but its not gonna happen and i accept that.

 

[mewi]

actually i work at Gamestop and our reserves list for upcoming Wii U titles show that Tekken is the 3rd most preordered title after the new Mario and Nintendo land. then there was that whole Street Fighter X Tekken thing. meanwhile Pac-Man has enough to work for him that make him maybe not the most interesting character but a more well rounded and easy to master character. which all fighting games need. personal bias, i want Agumon. but its not gonna happen and i accept that.

Considering there is like 10 games for the WII U, and over 30% of WII U's are marked up and not sold yet, also, are sold out at retail and were already severely limited, that isn't saying much

 

[N3ON]

So you don't think that the world's population being more female than male, and having a game that is what? 90% male characters, a sexist position?

You might want to look up the definition of sexism, before engaging in an argument about sexism. Wanting more female characters, isn't "sexist" it is logical.

Sakurai includes characters based on individual merit, not because they are female or not, and definitely not because he's sexist. It's just that, comparatively, very few female characters are, for lack of a better word, deserving, to be included in Smash, when compared to the males, partly due to just how many more central male characters there are in Nintendo's series, and gaming as a whole. If there was another super-worthy female character like Samus or Peach or Zelda, it's not like Sakurai would purposely not include them just because they are female, that would be sexism.

Luckily, there are several female characters this time around that have fairly decent chances, like Palutena, Dixie, and Krystal.

Well if we want to talk about popularity, okay Pac man has popularity, but he is also lacking in so much... character, you know? o.o and Tekken I just don't see happening, I mean when was the last time anyone actually cared about Tekken?

and because of Monolith, I think KOS-MOS probably has the 2nd best chance in that list, but that could be personal BIAS, but I doubt it.

Hmm, I'm all for supporting KOS-MOS, but realistically her chances shouldn't be overstated like this. A ton of people do actually care about Tekken (personally not me), even if they don't necessarily want a Tekken character in Smash. If not many people cared for it, it wouldn't be one of Namco's currently most successful IPs. Also, Tales is ridiculously popular in Japan, and even a Soul Calibur character has more demand than KOS-MOS, sadly.

Truthfully, KOS-MOS's chances are far from ideal, definitely not 2nd most likely. If Monolith was a main developer of Smash 4, then KOS-MOS might be an outside possibility, but as it stands now, chances are we'd get no Namco characters before her.

 

[mewi]

Truthfully, KOS-MOS's chances are far from ideal, definitely not 2nd most likely. If Monolith was a main developer of Smash 4, then KOS-MOS might be an outside possibility, but as it stands now, chances are we'd get no Namco characters before her.

I will libs in my world where KOS-MOS will kill Kirby o.o

 

[Deleted member]

Do not put words in my mouth.
I never said that you were sexist for wanting a balanced roster, nor did I defend a male superior roster.

I said you were being sexist for trying to bring in the population excuse on why it's "logical" to add females characters SOLELY for being female and that the roster being male superior has nothing to do with sexism. It's just that as N3ON said above, Nintendo happens to have more central male characters, and to try to "balance" this for the sake of adding more females would be the same as adding non-important characters that happen to be male (such as say, Nabarl from Fire Emblem) or genderless (such as Voltorb from Pokemon).

Smash is also lacking in any race that isn't similar to European or Japanese. Does that mean unimportant minority characters should be included to balance out the "racism"? I also don't see any transgenders. Should we get the likes of Birdo and Vivian from Mario, and Poison from Street Fighter?

 

[mewi]

Smash is also lacking in any race that isn't similar to European or Japanese. Does that mean unimportant minority characters should be included to balance out the "racism"? I also don't see any transgenders. Should we get the likes of Birdo and Vivian from Mario, and Poison from Street Fighter?

What would be wrong with that? You have something against transgendered peoples? By the way, the way they keep the roster so small, is also a cause for concern it could be so much bigger.

 

[3Bismyname]

Smash is also lacking in any race that isn't similar to European or Japanese. Does that mean unimportant minority characters should be included to balance out the "racism"? I also don't see any transgenders. Should we get the likes of Birdo and Vivian from Mario, and Poison from Street Fighter?

Hey we got Blackimar. that good enough for me

 

[Deleted member]

Much larger roster = horrible gameplay balance

Think of Brawl's balance, but up to MVC2 levels, where only a few characters are actually any good, another few are absolutely overpowered, and the rest are all garbage.

And if there were actually important ****** characters from Nintendo that are main characters in their series, and they were popular, then by all means, add them.

 

[mewi]

Much larger roster = horrible gameplay balance

Think of Brawl's balance, but up to MVC2 levels, where only a few characters are actually any good, another few are absolutely overpowered, and the rest are all garbage.

And if there were actually important ****** characters from Nintendo that are main characters in their series, and they were popular, then by all means, add them.

Since when do all characters in smash bros have to be important or popular? Pretty sure not all of them actually are.

also I am tired of seeing 80 different types of Marios and Links and Fox Builds X.x

and you can balance the game with multiple characters, if you build certain characters around similar stated skills. I dont want to see 50, but an increase of 10 would be nice. :3

 

[Deleted member]

You would be wrong. All of the characters in Smash thus far are important to their respective series. For popularity, I admit, there are some that gained popularity through Smash rather than in their home games (Captain Falcon), however, there is not a single character that is not important to their home series.

And quit with the overexaggerations. There's only been one other Mario, and he's not in Brawl, and there has never been more than 2 Links at a time (and even then, Toon Link is not the same person). There's only two with a similar build to Fox, but they aren't quite the same.

You also have no idea what you're talking about with balance. "Build characters around stated skills"? Smash doesn't already do that?

EDIT: For the sake of my sanity, it'd probably be best just to set you on Ignore. I think I killed a few brain cells just replying to this....

 

[mewi]

EDIT: For the sake of my sanity, it'd probably be best just to set you on Ignore. I think I killed a few brain cells just replying to this....

Can't handle the heat, get out of the sun, good idea. But if you actually lost brain cells to a forum chat, you might want to see a doctor about that, maybe Dr.Mario? o.o

 

[grizby2]

are we talking about characters ORIGINALLY from namco or can namco-bandai characters be considered? cuz id like to know... ya know?

 

[N3ON]

are we talking about characters ORIGINALLY from namco or can namco-bandai characters be considered? cuz id like to know... ya know?

As long as they originated in a game and have been on a Nintendo system, it really doesn't matter if the character is Namco, Bandai, or Namco-Bandai for this discussion.

 

[grizby2]

my dream character would be yoshimitsu from soul calibur. *drools*

odds are that pac-man's priority reigns supreme, though id love to see a namco/bandai character that ISN'T pac-man. i like those those type of suprises.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Surprise is one reason to support a Tekken or Tales character. Still, Namco isn't exactly what we'd call a company with a solid choice.

 

[dezeray112]

I think Pac-man would be the likely choice although I wouldn't rule out anyone from the Tales series, Soul Calibur series or Tekken series for being a rep of Namco.

Wouldn't mind seeing Lloyd Irving, either Siegfried Schauffen or Taki and a Tekken rep for this.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Since when do all characters in smash bros have to be important or popular? Pretty sure not all of them actually are.

Two words: Ice Climbers!

also I am tired of seeing 80 different types of Marios and Links and Fox Builds X.x

I quote you.
I hope they will turn Luigi, Lucas, Ganon, Roy, Falco and Wolf more different.
And about Mario and Luigi:
Or they get Mario rid of that stopid water thing or they give Luigi his goddamn vacuum. I'm sick of seeing him as an inferior version of Mario.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Much larger roster = horrible gameplay balance

This is probable but not automatic. And it's one of the things where the skill of the authors is much more important than the power of the machine.
Knowing Nintendo and Namco I think they can stand fifty characters and make all them more than acceptable. Ice Climbers included.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Because i can, Heihachi moveset.

B: Tekken ball ()
B Forward: Hell Axel
B Down: Spinning Demon (+ B: Spinning Demon uppercut)
Up B: Demon Uppercut + Rising Uppercut

Final Smash: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YHI5aje4k18#t=7s

 

[SSBCandidates]

Of course a problem is that he is already on PSASBR. But then again, I do feel third party characters have the right to where they feel like to. And well Tekken has enough characters to get reps from, let alone all of Bandai-Namco. This reminds me that many prefered for Paul Phoenix to have been on PSASBR than Heihachi as he has more of a history with PS.

 

[3Bismyname]

Of course a problem is that he is already on PSASBR. But then again, I do feel third party characters have the right to where they feel like to. And well Tekken has enough characters to get reps from, let alone all of Bandai-Namco. This reminds me that many prefered for Paul Phoenix to have been on PSASBR than Heihachi as he has more of a history with PS.

Heihachi is the creaters favorite character though so it makes sense that he gets some favoritism whenever they have a chance to show off Tekken characters like with Soul Calibur 2 and Pac-Man Fever. and theres no rule saying that he couldn't appear in both Smash and Battle Royale. He would be the best choice from the Tekken franchise really cause he is the iconic face to the series you know.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Heihachi also represents the serious and hilarious sides of Tekken.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Heihachi should wear his mawashi as an alternate costume.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Heihachi should wear his mawashi as an alternate costume.

Why not this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZfJYq6mb-A

 

[SSBCandidates]

Heihachi is the creaters favorite character though so it makes sense that he gets some favoritism whenever they have a chance to show off Tekken characters like with Soul Calibur 2 and Pac-Man Fever. and theres no rule saying that he couldn't appear in both Smash and Battle Royale. He would be the best choice from the Tekken franchise really cause he is the iconic face to the series you know.

Reminds me how Ono wants M. Bison in Smash. Sort of OT but still.

 

[Deleted member]

What would be wrong with that? You have something against transgendered peoples? By the way, the way they keep the roster so small, is also a cause for concern it could be so much bigger.

Since when do all characters in smash bros have to be important or popular? Pretty sure not all of them actually are.

also I am tired of seeing 80 different types of Marios and Links and Fox Builds X.x

and you can balance the game with multiple characters, if you build certain characters around similar stated skills. I dont want to see 50, but an increase of 10 would be nice. :3

You would be wrong. All of the characters in Smash thus far are important to their respective series. For popularity, I admit, there are some that gained popularity through Smash rather than in their home games (Captain Falcon), however, there is not a single character that is not important to their home series.

And quit with the overexaggerations. There's only been one other Mario, and he's not in Brawl, and there has never been more than 2 Links at a time (and even then, Toon Link is not the same person). There's only two with a similar build to Fox, but they aren't quite the same.

You also have no idea what you're talking about with balance. "Build characters around stated skills"? Smash doesn't already do that?

EDIT: For the sake of my sanity, it'd probably be best just to set you on Ignore. I think I killed a few brain cells just replying to this....

Can't handle the heat, get out of the sun, good idea. But if you actually lost brain cells to a forum chat, you might want to see a doctor about that, maybe Dr.Mario? o.o

Wow... Holy ****! What's been going on in this thread?

[/URL] Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/IMG]
For ****s sakes, why does the other KOS-MOS supporter in here have to be bat**** insane...

DAMMIT mewi, if you weren't so crazy I'd take your side in some of these. Oh well, whatever, it seems to be over anyway.

As far as KOS-MOS goes, shame Monolith Soft doesn't own the rights to her, if they did, she'd have a MUCH higher chance of getting in.

That aside, how hard do you figure it'd be to make a PSA for her?

Because i can, Heihachi moveset.

B: Tekken ball ()
B Forward: Hell Axel
B Down: Spinning Demon (+ B: Spinning Demon uppercut)
Up B: Demon Uppercut + Rising Uppercut

Final Smash: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=YHI5aje4k18#t=7s

I'd be cool with Heihachi getting in as a Tekken rep, also he guest starred in Soul Calibur, and we don't have any Martial-Arts user in Smash afaik, C.Falcon is as close as we get.

Also, fix that moveset, it's too Shotokan (Ryu/Ken/etc...) Mario already fills that role. Never played Tekken before (though I do plan on it soon, recently picked up the PSP one), but isn't there something else we could give him? Something less generic?

 

[8-peacock-8]

There probably is. I'll be honest, I wasn't trying when making the moveset. However, I am serious about the down special (spinning demon is amazing) and neutral special. (Tekken Ball FTW)

 

[final lap]

oooh hope I don't get banned for necropost

Nobody in entire thread mentioned Mr. Driller... for shame. It's largely a Nintendo franchise, with iterations on GBC, GBA, Gamecube, DS, DSiware, and Wiiware.

I was brainstorming moves for Taizo Hori:

B left/right
He suddenly drives a Rally X go-kart in that direction. Can be used midair, in which case case he moves in that direction while beginning to fall. If the hits the ground while driving, he bounces one time, while still driving in that direction.

B up
places a giant rock (from Dig Dug) in midair above his head. The rock will rock back and forth for a second, before plummeting, causing massive damage and knockback to anyone it touches. (and anyone right next to it when it lands)

B down
Dig Dug pump
I actually had 2 ideas for how the pump could work.
a) The hose has an enemy already attached to it. The pump causes the enemy to inflate and then explode, causing damage to anyone touching it as well as knocks them back. But this version of the pump attack is sort of a copout since it means the hose is never actually used on opponents directly.
b) The hose touches an opponent and traps them. Opponent attached to the hose is completely immobilized for 2 seconds or until Taizo player lets go. During this time, Taizo can continually mash the button to pump, damaging the opponent. Doing this decreases the amount of time the opponent is immobilized.
However, whether doing this causes the enemy to inflate like a balloon or not, is up to the game devs, and really just an aesthetic choice in the end.

B

Taizo would have a flamethrower that would behave exactly like "Fygar's fire"

Final Smash:
This will be similar to Jigglypuff's. He inflates a Pooka and keeps inflating it until it takes up nearly the entire screen. Unlike Jigglypuff's final smash, however, the Pooka eventually explodes (Taizo at no point stops pumping it) knocking everyone else off screen.

other:
He would have an aerial sword-dive move similar to Toon Link's. Except his would be a drill not a sword.

 

[CalumG]

If you want to talk about shallow, your only reason seems to be "Because he is popular" your only actual defense.

A defense which has worked for many a character in the past.

Why KOS-MOS? Because she is strong, she actually has moves, she has elegance to her, she is of pure beauty, and most importantly, she actually has a plot. I actually played the entire Xeno series, KOS-MOS is part of my heart and always will be. What is Pac Man's plot? Punching something, or eating a few pixels? Sorry but that is the limit of what he can do. Pure boring ^__^

If you want to go there, what is Ice Climber's plot? R.O.B.'s plot? Mr G&W's plot? Plot may very well be the least significant factor in deciding a characters inclusion in Smash, if previous entries are anything to go by.

and sorry, if I want to support for more female characters in an otherwise male character dominated game, I can, and my support would be valid. So too bad.

Nothing wrong with wanting a character in Smash despite their odds, I respect that :3

I for example want to see Suicune in Smash 4, but I'm not going to argue that it's much of a logical choice to want him/her/it included.

So you don't think that the world's population being more female than male, and having a game that is what? 90% male characters, a sexist position?

This is where I must beg to differ. Smash, first and foremost, is a gathering of popular characters from Nintendo (and recently non-Nintendo) franchises. Think of it, if you like, as a microcosm of Nintendo's rich and on-going history. And historically, there are many male characters from Nintendo, Sega, Konami and Namco which are dozens of times more important to their respective franchise or company than some female characters. That's not to say they shouldn't have a more varied roster, but the gender slant in the roster isn't Smash Bros.'s fault - it's the industry's fault in general. Smash will continue to be heavily in favour of the male population for as long as the vast majority of protagonists and best-sellers are male. Smash isn't sexist; it's a semi-accurate depiction of a portion of the game industry which is sexist (in some ways, at least).

Since when do all characters in smash bros have to be important or popular? Pretty sure not all of them actually are.

No you're right, not all of them are popular. However, nearly every character in Smash does fall into one of three categories: a character that is a fan-favourite, a character that is either important to Nintendo/important to their respective Nintendo franchise, or a clone. Then of course there's Pokemon, which follow slightly different rules (possibly due to strict interference from the Pokemon Company, who knows), and third-parties. Now we can't accurately make a statement on Third Party characters since there's only two so far, but both of those two were long-running franchises and were critically important to their respective companies. Kind of like, say, how Pac-Man is to Namco.

 

[volbound1700]

Not trying to be a butt but technically there are 4 females in Smash: Peach, Zelda, Samus, Jigglypuff. Also Zamus is a seperate model with different move-sets, etc. so 5 characters are based on female models.

 

[CalumG]

Not trying to be a butt but technically there are 4 females in Smash: Peach, Zelda, Samus, Jigglypuff. Also Zamus is a seperate model with different move-sets, etc. so 5 characters are based on female models.

Gender Ratio: 25% male, 75% female
Gender Differences: None

Plus Jigglypuff is never specified as either male or female at any point in the Smash games, trophies and all. So not quite.

 

[Opossum]

Suddenly Nana isn't female.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

And so isn't... Zoroark. Or Saki.

Wait...

 

[Knight Dude]

I'm just gonna say that I'd like to see Yoshimitsu and/or Heihachi as the Namco rep for Smash 4.

 

[Second Power]

For some reason, I think Ivysaur is female. I can't remember where I heard it though.

 

[TheCreator]

Maaaaaan. Ive been supporting Pacman since pre brawl, and now he has a chance, but people STILL don't give a **** nor particularly want him. I mean....Pacman, man! The legacy!

 

[Knight Dude]

Maaaaaan. Ive been supporting Pacman since pre brawl, and now he has a chance, but people STILL don't give a **** nor particularly want him. I mean....Pacman, man! The legacy!

I'd argue that many people don't talk much about Pac-man because he seems like he's a given. He's Namco's answer to Mario,(or maybe its the other way around)He's their mascot, not much can really be said. Maybe it's due to most Pac-man not having as much moveset potential as say Jin Kazama, Lloyd Irving, or KOS-MOS, given that in their games, combat is integrated much more. Though I do still see alot of support for the guy. Not as much as say Megaman, but his fanbase is there.