Namco Character discussion

[Swamp Sensei]

Yes but Smash would have sold without Sonic (maybe not quite as much). Smash is still Smash even without other characters. It is my view that most of the time, third party companies are likely not receiving payments other than perhaps payments to the contractors working on the game and a small fee perhaps. I work for a Japanese Company and this is how they work. Now Sega likely made some money off of contractor the Sonic team out for the game but I doubt they asked Nintendo to pay much for the IP if anything at all. Also Japanese don't value IP as much as US Companies do.

Wrong on so many levels....

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Just presenting some sort of thought process to 3rd parties because I see lots of arguing. Uhh...here goes.

1. Does not matter if they have been in a crossover (See Snake)
2. Popularity is one of the most important aspects to a character's inclusion.
-From what I have seen, Pac-Man is mentioned frequently because he is expected, not so much that everyone wants him. I feel as if a Tekken character is considered based off of Heihachi's appearance in PSAS. I honestly would be like 'WTF?" for a Tekken character to appear (and I always thought of Tekken as more of a Playstation game. Don't know why).
3. If there is going to be a 3rd party rep, it will be the main (or A main) character from the series. It will be THE character from said series. So if its Tales it will most likely be Lloyd, Tekken will be Heichachi or whoever, etc...

Theres probably lots of other stuff but i'm lazy and want to go play Gears Judgement. So i'll be back later. Or tomorrow. Or whatever.

 

[8-peacock-8]

@Scoliosis Jones

Considering Tekken a Playstation franchise is the correct way to view it. It was built on PS1 hardware. So that should be enough. Lol

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

@Scoliosis Jones

Considering Tekken a Playstation franchise is the correct way to view it. It was built on PS1 hardware. So that should be enough. Lol

Ah. Alright then, so i'm not crazy. Not that that really means anything in the grand scheme of things. I'd really rather not see a Tekken character though.

 

[Mario123311]

What about Susumu Hori? You know. From Mr. Driller?
http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs34/f/2008/239/7/b/hori_hori_hori_hori_hori_hori_by_Momogirl.jpg

 

[8-peacock-8]

About the same amount as Dig Dug. So not very good.

 

[final lap]

What about Susumu Hori? You know. From Mr. Driller?

I hope he's included.

 

[final lap]

Wow, I just got Mr Driller: Drill Trill you Drop from the 3DS eshop.
Susumu has freakin emerald powers in it! He's like a summoner from an RPG!
In Dristone mode, you collect "Dristones" which are items which can be used from a menu.
Their effects include the ability to destroy all blocks of a certain color on screen, or change their color.

This is a breakthrough new source for a special move for his SSB apperance. Or.. maybe just a final smash. (ho-hum)
For one thing this gives Susumu the license to create blocks, something which probably wouldn't have made sense for him otherwise.

Actually, suddenly I remembered the fact that in Mr Driller Drill Spirits, the characters defeat the boss by shooting fireballs. Since joining this board I had completely forgotten about that.

How cool would it be if Susumu got in SSB4, and could attack with fireballs!

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I still want Lloyd . A LOT more than Pac-Man.

Argue this all you want, but Tales of Symphonia is considered one of the best games on the Gamecube, and Lloyd is considered by many to be a mascot of the series. I haven't played it, but soon enough and I will be playing it, and honestly, besides the Mario Kart arcade crossover, Pac-Man doesn't have a whole lot of "OMGZ he's relevant to Nintendo". Not to say that Lloyd is super relevant, but most Pac-man games are re-releases of the arcade game. I owned one at one point when I was younger.

Moral of the story is, I don't want Pac-Man in Smash. But to each his own

 

[final lap]

image:

The cover art actually has the fireballs!
Don't they look kinda like the stage hazard fireballs from Super Mario World? That's what they always reminded me of.

The cover art makes them look too small and puny though. In-game they are as big as Susumu and you fire only one at a time.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Susumu, as in Taizo Hori's metrosexual son?

 

[LaniusShrike]

I think if Soul Calibur or Tekken got a character, it would have to be Yoshimitsu just because he's silly enough to fit. His character design can be as silly or as serious as needed. His moveset already fits Smash Bros. perfectly with him helicoptering around and pogo sticking. The only thing about him I'd take out is his, cough, occasional ritualistic suicide.

Pacman is... well, I really don't like his 3D incarnation with the nose and limbs. Looks like a really dumb Chucky Cheese type mascot to me. Mostly because of the nose. If I were designing him, I'd want to make him essentially an amorphous orb with a mouth that spawns limbs/tentacles/whatever as needed.

And I'm a big supporter of Tales representation, which I'm confident means Lloyd Irving.

Dig Dug is a remarkable fit. Wielding a giant drill and harpoon could be super badass. A pity that he didn't actually originate on a Nintendo system, not that it's necessary but... it would help.

Klonoa seems pretty well suited to Smash Bros. I didn't enjoy playing his Wii game at all, but he still seems appropriate.

I didn't like the Baiten Kaitos games. Then again, I did play two of them and the first one had a really great and original story twist, so maybe I'm lying. Kalas would be nifty... Nice design. I also wouldn't mind seeing the freaky, awful, terrifying creature known as Guillo from the Origins game.

The wiki page for Namco's games makes it nice and clear what has appeared on Nintendo systems.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Namco_games

 

[3Bismyname]

Pac-Man is still the only good choice to me. everyone else is just boring to me. im hardly joking.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Pac-Man is still the only good choice to me. everyone else is just boring to me. im hardly joking.

See i'm the exact opposite. I find Pac-Man incredibly boring as a character for Smash. It also worries me that all they could come up with for him in Street Fighter X Tekken was a robot suit. Obviously there were reasons for that, but it still bugs me.

 

[8-peacock-8]

See i'm the exact opposite. I find Pac-Man incredibly boring as a character for Smash. It also worries me that all they could come up with for him in Street Fighter X Tekken was a robot suit. Obviously there were reasons for that, but it still bugs me.

He was meant to be a joke character in SFXT. But you seem to be taking that a little too seriously.

Megaman was a joke character, so it's only fair that Pac-Man got the same treatment.

 

[3Bismyname]

See i'm the exact opposite. I find Pac-Man incredibly boring as a character for Smash. It also worries me that all they could come up with for him in Street Fighter X Tekken was a robot suit. Obviously there were reasons for that, but it still bugs me.

see now i never thought they put him in the Mokujin suit because he's incapable of fighting. realistically they could've easily made a moveset for him for that game. he's got 2 legs and 2 arms with a round shaped body and can bite people. i can imagine a million ways he could be transferred into a fighter and i'm sure they did as well. however somewhere along the line someone suggested adding Bad Box Art Megaman and i feel that they put Pac-Man in the suit to match the ridiculousness of that. which imo they accomplished. Lloyd is the only other character that i've been interested by at all but that means very little considering that i do truly enjoy Pac-Man and the only thing that interests me about Lloyd is the moveset and in the end i really dont care about that cause its not like Pac-Man has bad moveset potential either. just different and less flashy.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I never played the game so I wouldn't have known that. I still think it's a bad idea to include Pac-Man because he's Pac-Man. That's a bad idea for any third party really.

Pac-Man has more relevance to gaming history, but I would argue he doesn't have that much history with Nintendo besides a game here or there. Lloyd however, with not as much gaming history, was the lead protagonist in one of the Gamecube's best selling games(still highly praised too. With a sequel exclusively for the Wii in which he appears). He has appeared in other installments in the Tales series as well.

I'm sure once I play Tales of Symphonia i'll be able to argue my case for Lloyd better. But for now, all I know is I DON'T want Pac-Man.

 

[8-peacock-8]

I never played the game so I wouldn't have known that. I still think it's a bad idea to include Pac-Man because he's Pac-Man. That's a bad idea for any third party really.

Pac-Man has more relevance to gaming history, but I would argue he doesn't have that much history with Nintendo besides a game here or there. Lloyd however, with not as much gaming history, was the lead protagonist in one of the Gamecube's best selling games(still highly praised too. With a sequel exclusively for the Wii in which he appears). He has appeared in other installments in the Tales series as well.

I'm sure once I play Tales of Symphonia i'll be able to argue my case for Lloyd better. But for now, all I know is I DON'T want Pac-Man.

I never played Street Fighter X Tekken either, but it was easy to figure out their roles just by looking at what they'd be doing in game.

Saying that it's a bad idea just to have him in the game isn't a very good argument. I respect your opinion and i understand that you don't want him. But at least give us better reasons then stuff that sounds biased.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm pretty sure people wanted Sonic in Brawl because he was Sonic.
What makes it different than Pac-Man?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I'm pretty sure people wanted Sonic in Brawl because he was Sonic.
What makes it different than Pac-Man?

Cause people just don't seem to want him as much.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Well Sonic had obvious connections with Nintendo, as far as his games appearing on Nintendo consoles, the rivalry with Mario etc... With Pac-Man, I don't see any of that. I suppose you could say the same for Lloyd however.

I personally find Lloyd far more interesting than Pac-Man. I quite honestly can't think of anything that Pac-Man could have in his moveset. I'm sure there are possibilities, but when I think Pac-Man, I think eating pellets/ghosts.

Sonic was a bit different in this aspect. He has attacks to work with from his games, and his figure in general i'm sure would be easier to work with than Pac-Man. Pac-Man is a yellow ball with arms and legs. Kirby shares a similar form, but has a moveset that makes sense for him. i don't see that with Pac-Man.

Don't worry, i'm not going to be one of those people who doesn't concede points for the sake of being butthurt. I've never been a huge fan of Pac-Man, which also adds to me not wanting him.

 

[3Bismyname]

realistically Pac-Man has better history with Nintendo than any other Namco IP does. being arcade cabinet rivals, Pac-Man being one of the first third party title Nintendo ever received on the Famicon, Miyomoto making a Pac-Man game as well as being his favorite character, way more exclusives than i care to count. saying he doesnt matter to Nintendo's history is comparably like saying Sonic has no Nintendo history.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Pac-Man has been famous for one thing and that's for the old arcade machine that came out so many years ago. That simple pizza shaped pac-man that has almost no content that can be made into a fighting style.
Compared to the arcade game, the newer 3D pacman is not popular or even as well known. Its why his appearance in wreck it ralph takes on his simple circular form.
In comparison the 3D pacman games makes as much of a good contribution to the series as a fan made star wars movie filmed in your back yard does to Star wars.

If anything pacman will make an appearance in his 2D form as an assist trophy or a level where his style and traits come a little more naturally than forcing him into a fight.
Not to mention that, although pacman is an important part of namco history, Namco doesn't consider him their mascot. If you look at nintendo's or Sega's website you'll see mario and sonic everywhere. If you look at namco's site, you may not even know they're responsible for the series. So picking him because hes the best to represent Namco doesn't make much sense either.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I'll completely admit most of my argument stems from opinion. I still don't find him interesting lol.

Overall I don't think we will know who the rep will be until E3. I honestly think it will be between Pac-Man and Lloyd. But again, my opinion only counts for so much.

 

[8-peacock-8]

It's good thing to see that your reasonable.

The one of main things for Pac-Man is that he could have a lot of interesting A button attacks just by basing them off his round body alone. Which would be vey interesting to see what Sakurai could do with that. (Two of his moves from the 3D games actually refference the fact that he has a ball body. One of them is a spin dash and the other is a ground pound that turns him into a super ball)

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

It's good thing to see that your reasonable.

The one of main things for Pac-Man is that he could have a lot of interesting A button attacks just by basing them off his round body alone. Which would be vey interesting to see what Sakurai could do with that. (Two of his moves from the 3D games actually refference the fact that he has a ball body. One of them is a spin dash and the other is a ground pound that turns him into a super ball)

Oh i'm sure Sakurai could come up with something. I'm probably just not creative enough. Or i'm tired...

Believe me, I hate when I get into a debate with fanboys who are quite possibly the DUMBEST people on the planet and endlessly deny things. It's stupid and doesn't add anything to the conversation at hand.

Why can't we just have Pac-Man AND Lloyd?

 

[3Bismyname]

i have yet to hear any better reason to add another character other than Pac-Man other than "They're more interesting." and that's not a good reason to add a character either. and i could get behind Pac-Man in addition to another character. but if we only hot one it should be Pac-Man imo

 

[Swamp Sensei]

i have yet to hear any better reason to add another character other than Pac-Man other than "They're more interesting." and that's not a good reason to add a character either.

More popular?

 

[8-peacock-8]

I would actually like to have both characters as playibles. Despite how unlikely it is. It would be great.

 

[3Bismyname]

More popular?

which is really subjective in itself and can be heavily debated.

 

[8-peacock-8]

True. Which will usually end in a flame war. Lol

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Well Lloyd has better reasoning than any Tekken character I would say. Considering the game he was the lead in was one of the best Gamecube games and he remains iconic to the series and that correlation to Nintendo. Not that that necessarily outweighs Pac-Man, but it's something.

Could go look up more stuff so I don't look like such an opinionated prick. But...too...lazy. Have...school...tomorrow...ughhh.

*Scoliosis Jones fainted!

 

[colder_than_ice]

Well Lloyd has better reasoning than any Tekken character I would say. Considering the game he was the lead in was one of the best Gamecube games and he remains iconic to the series and that correlation to Nintendo. Not that that necessarily outweighs Pac-Man, but it's something.

Could go look up more stuff so I don't look like such an opinionated prick. But...too...lazy. Have...school...tomorrow...ughhh.

*Scoliosis Jones fainted!

"Catches Scoliosis Jones before he hits the ground."

I'd like to see a Soulcalibur character in SSB4 as it's only fitting seeing as how Link was in Soulcalibur II.
He could finally have a rematch with one of his old rivals from that game.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

"Catches Scoliosis Jones before he hits the ground."

I'd like to see a Soulcalibur character in SSB4 as it's only fitting seeing as how Link was in Soulcalibur II.
He could finally have a rematch with one of his old rivals from that game.

LIZARD MAN!!!!

No, but honestly it would probably be nightmare if anyone. LIzardman is my favorite though. :D

 

[kikaru]

For me it feels as though including Pac-Man in Smash would be equivalent to adding Miis, Tekken, or Street Fighter characters in that it wouldn't sit well with either series. As an avid Lloyd Irving supporter I will admit that Pac-Man is the more iconic choice for Namco, however, he simply doesn't carry the same charm he used to, with his golden days long gone it seems like he's only a shadow of his former self. I also feel that Tales as a series has more to bring to Smash in terms of gameplay elements/ the little things that count more than Pac-Man's series. And finally, Street Fighter X Tekken added insult to injury as Pac-Man not only piloted some uninspired, but he also got paired with MegaMan...

 

[8-peacock-8]

What's wrong with Pac-Man wanting to do unspeakable things to Bad Box Art Megaman?

 

[Crap-Zapper]

Pac-Man or Lloyd Irwing is my guesses... I actually would mind if I ever see Kazuya as the representer, since as much as I love Tekken, I can't forgive Namco for not entering Pac-Man or Lloyd (mostly Pac)

 

[Deleted member]

@Pac-Man having little Nintendo history:
http://wiimedia.ign.com/wii/image/a...TheRoadToNamcosSuperSmashBros4_1342681298.jpg


As for Pac-Man supposedly not being known outside his pizza shape...

He's had arms and legs since his early days as Puck Man. He simply doesn't have them in-game because that would have been more work that what was worth.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

To be fair Golden, a lot of that time line is more of Namco's interaction with Nintendo. Not all of that specifically has to do with Pac-Man. But I see your point.

The other part of your post I understand too. If that was directed at my previous post, I never said he didn't.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Also, One thing I would like to note, is the conversation we're having as a whole. See how divided we are? This is essentially a microcosm of the debate on a Namco rep in general.