My dear friends of the Smash community...

[Zodiac]

ONLY FOR MATCH UPS THAT ARE NOT SPACE ANIMAL RELATED...

so no....

 

[DYLirious94]

#stopfeedingthetroll

 

[SwiftOfDaSouth]

A skiller Roy can beat any Fox

EDIT: This thread gave me cancer

there is so much faulty thought here I can't even argue against it just because part of my brain refuses to acknowledge that other beings can be so stupid

Kid, I play Pichu. A lot. He's a bad character. He was put into the game as a, according to SAKURAI, "handicap". Do I still play him frequently when I want to style on spacies? Yes. Is he the most viable counterpick? No. Why? Because he simply doesn't have the tools that other characters have. This thread's existence is so stupid. I don't want to go through three pages of mostly drivel, so if anyone wants to dispute that tiers don't matter, just reply to me. I'll shoot anything down. Self nomination to defend common sense, ACTIVATE

 

[Hunybear]

I come to you today to discuss a GRAVE EVIL among us... and that evil is... TIER LISTS

But Radical! How else will people know which character is the best?

Simple, my friend. They won't. Because there IS no "best character!" There are no "good characters" and no "bad characters." You can argue stats with me all you like, but ultimately a character's quality is up to the user! Anyone can make any character the best character.

My evidence? Why, I do believe there's a certain Yoshi player who's been causing quite a stir in the pro Melee circuit... Yoshi... a LOW-TIER CHARACTER!

Now then... how should you choose a character if you're not going by the tier list? Simple! Which character is your favorite? Who did you grow up with? Who was there before Smash came along and made you abandon them in favor of "superior" stats?

Speaking of "superior" stats, stats are worthless. True, some characters may be better by stats and stats alone... but it is their moveset and playstyle that evens the odds. Take, for example, Kirby. He's light, doesn't do too much damage, is somewhat difficult to handle, and his Up Special only works as recovery if he's already by the edge. HOWEVER... his Neutral Special makes all the difference. Not only is it a good opportunity to push someone off the edge( Even if it's easy to recover from ), but you gain their power as well.

For now I shall end my rambling, and invite the input of the SMASHBOARDS COMMUNITY!

Just curious. Do you believe in match ups? Also I believe in the evil of teirs but... lets say for a minute there were only two characters with practically the same move set. like Pikachu and pichu. All the same tools just one is clearly not as good. If I were to make a teir list could I really put these two as equals? Sure if a better player can beat me with him then pichu can win but dose a great player make a bad character better? aMSa just proved Yoshi wasn't as horrible as everyone though but dose that mean he has tools to deal with every situation as well as fox? I don't think so.

 

[GenNyan]

Just curious. Do you believe in match ups? Also I believe in the evil of teirs but... lets say for a minute there were only two characters with practically the same move set. like Pikachu and pichu. All the same tools just one is clearly not as good. If I were to make a teir list could I really put these two as equals? Sure if a better player can beat me with him then pichu can win but dose a great player make a bad character better? aMSa just proved Yoshi wasn't as horrible as everyone though but dose that mean he has tools to deal with every situation as well as fox? I don't think so.

This comparison was made several times and the OP admitted that he might have been wrong. This thread was just about dead, so let it stay that way.

 

[gmBottles]

Do you believe in match ups?

Lol what

 

[RadicalRat]

Just curious. Do you believe in match ups? Also I believe in the evil of teirs but... lets say for a minute there were only two characters with practically the same move set. like Pikachu and pichu. All the same tools just one is clearly not as good. If I were to make a teir list could I really put these two as equals? Sure if a better player can beat me with him then pichu can win but dose a great player make a bad character better? aMSa just proved Yoshi wasn't as horrible as everyone though but dose that mean he has tools to deal with every situation as well as fox? I don't think so.

Well, I'm not gonna comment too much here, because I still don't have the technicaly experience I need to debate this beyond any more than the ideology. But yes, I do believe in match ups. Even Fox has some bad match ups though, so I don't necessarily think that's a fair indication of a "better" character, but I think if a group of people could get together and make a proper match up chart( I've been told those that exist are woefully inaccurate ) that'd be a much more useful tool than tiers.

 

[gmBottles]

Well, I'm not gonna comment too much here, because I still don't have the technicaly experience I need to debate this beyond any more than the ideology. But yes, I do believe in match ups. Even Fox has some bad match ups though, so I don't necessarily think that's a fair indication of a "better" character, but I think if a group of people could get together and make a proper match up chart( I've been told those that exist are woefully inaccurate ) that'd be a much more useful tool than tiers.

Fox doesn't really have "bad" MUs. His MUs that are considered bad are usually even, the only MU I would consider bad for him is Marth, but only on Final Destination, and probably only 40:60 at worst.

 

[ECHOnce]

Well, I'm not gonna comment too much here, because I still don't have the technicaly experience I need to debate this beyond any more than the ideology. But yes, I do believe in match ups. Even Fox has some bad match ups though, so I don't necessarily think that's a fair indication of a "better" character, but I think if a group of people could get together and make a proper match up chart( I've been told those that exist are woefully inaccurate ) that'd be a much more useful tool than tiers.

Take what you will from this. People with anywhere from 15 years to no experience at all prob chimed in on the threads that led up to this chart. So it's liable to inaccuracy, but I'd imagine this sort of discussion is the most constructive and realistic way to go about it.