Midnight Ops Mafia: Game Thread. Game Over!

[Malakandra]

Chaco, idk about his playstyle, but that is advice he gave at the end of last game.

 

[Xivii]

Xivii

I can't say I've seen him do it as either alignment. It seems less likely to come from scum!Laser though. But the only scum game I can recall is Oasis and his play was different, but it was because of being busy. As town he's usually focused strictly on the game and wagon leader.

 

[Xivii]

Chaco, you read Token mafia, yes?

 

[Chaco]

Chaco, you read Token mafia, yes?

If that was the game linked prior, yes. But in all honesty my short term memory is quite terrible.

 

[Chaco]

I can't say I've seen him do it as either alignment. It seems less likely to come from scum!Laser though. But the only scum game I can recall is Oasis and his play was different, but it was because of being busy. As town he's usually focused strictly on the game and wagon leader.

I was just wondering if it was anything unusual about his style, especially since it was aimed towards a widely accepted town player. But if it’s consistent, that reads more town motivated then.

 

[Z25]

Quite a few player have been like “iT cAn Be EvErYoNe AnD LaSeR iS tHe CoMmOn FaCtOr”, if that’s not setting up a Laser lynch then I don’t know what is. I see no other directions this discussion can be going with that mentality, and if it’s -Lo then we have two more scum, not only one, and people seem to be ignoring that. Why not try to hit one of them instead of going for the one that is probably being scumread by scum in the phase they can possibly win?

And I’m not trying to end any phase, I’m trying to follow what I believe what I feel like it’s right after getting cucked with two mislynches I wasn’t fond of and if I have to be a douche about it then I’ll be a douche about it


hell no

Only one person has said this.

This, can you explain what gave you that impression?

I'm reading, but I'm not seeing the posts where he switches to Chaco. Can you point them out?

Well first, by switch I don’t mean in a voting sense but in laser’s actually reads sense.
Starting the day, Posts like 2,043 have Laser scum reading me.
2,228 he mentions why he liked Chaco shows no signs that he he has changed now.
He disappears and comes back in 2,275.page 58 he doesn’t show any signs of different reads.

2,310 he starts going in on how Chaco is scum. Which I could have missed something in my FE re-read but that progression doesn’t make any sense imo. It feels forced and fake.

This doesn't seem true at all. Traitor would want literally any other non-scum to get yeeted, because if that happens scum wins. A traitor yeet just puts us back at LyLo tomorrow. Why would they try to get misyeeted over trying to misyeet someone else to get a definite win?

That’s exactly what I was saying though. Although the Of in that post was suppose to be if so I can see how it reads a little off.

 

[Darkpit54]

I can't say I've seen him do it as either alignment. It seems less likely to come from scum!Laser though. But the only scum game I can recall is Oasis and his play was different, but it was because of being busy. As town he's usually focused strictly on the game and wagon leader.

This seems to be implying that his play this game is going to his scum meta, right? Although I think that may be somewhat due to irl restrictions from what he's said earlier

 

[LaserGuy]

Why Mala over Z25? Can you lay out the argument for why the points against him are greater than the points for him?

I think the biggest sticking point for me for Malakandra is their interaction with the D1 Frozen wagon. Malakandra is around for basically the entire time, and posts a fair bit, but never really comments on fonti's case that I noticed. He spends most of the time trying to figure out if the PR claims are confirmable, and then jumps on Frozen at the end when it's clear that the lynch is unavoidable. It just feels like a bus. Malakandra otherwise has played a very tight, townie-looking game. There's a few posts here and there that I've seen that have given me pause, but that's the critical interaction of the entire game and Malakandra was on the wrong side of it.

z25 I feel basically is basically scum if and only if Malakandra is scum (I guess it's possible z25/Exlight are a thing, but Exlight just doesn't feel like mafia to me). Mostly it comes back to 3DS. Either slot is Town, slot is traitor and hopelessly lost (unlikely given z25's play) or slot is mafia and the buddies were absent for enough of the game that 3DS gave up. FrozenFlame was fairly absent for most of D1, so if the other partner was Raxxel (or somitomi) then I could plausibly see 3DS behaving in this manner. I have a hard time believing that 3DS would be so dejected if they were paired with a hyperactive player like Chaco.

So I think scum is either Mala/Chaco (most likely) or Mala/z25 (possible) and therefore Mala is the optimal play to cover both options.

What gives you the impression that I preferred your wagon? I remember voting because I didn't want you to get yeeted.

My impression was that you were reading Frozen as fairly Town compared to me and weren't terribly sold on fonti's case.

I’m not going to unvote him while I reread
if he’s town scum can just go ahead and end this and I’ll apologize later, but I’ll stand my ground on this until the very end even if my denseness means me losing

I retract my comment about gamethrowing being unlikely at this stage. I think Exlight is still Town though.

I can't say I've seen him do it as either alignment. It seems less likely to come from scum!Laser though. But the only scum game I can recall is Oasis and his play was different, but it was because of being busy. As town he's usually focused strictly on the game and wagon leader.

My meta is much more varied than either game would illustrate. Some of this is by design, some of this is, well, just how it ends up depending on my moods or other commitments. Not sure how useful these will be since all of these are pretty dated and I generally had more time to play in 2017-2018 than now, but here's some of my games from mafiascum, starting with the most recent (still 2018).

Spoiler

Scum: Replaced in late D1 into an inactive scum slot. Power wolfed for the entire game and yeeted my way through the entire Town. Was never really under any suspicion. This is probably the best game of mafia I've played as either alignment.

Town: I played this one pretty much identically to what you saw in SS for basically the same reason.

Town: I was much lower impact than SS or the one above. Complete troll game where we had a townie fake a cop result on another townie and both got lynched. I was apparently complaining about not posting on weekends as far back as 2018.

Town: Somewhere between the previous game and SS. I was a Town PR in a Jungle Republic game and couldn't afford to be mislynched. VCA makes a brief appearance this game.

Scum: Tried to play two games over Christmas. This one went very badly and I ended up replacing out, but I was busted anyway.

Town: The other game I tried to double play. Didn't replace out, but basically lurked through the entire game.

 

[Xivii]

Thank you for those. The feeling is that of someone giving you a giant bowl of candy.

 

[Xivii]

Unfortunately, however, there are a couple of distinctive differences between your scum and town play. Sadly, that means you're probably scum this game :|

 

[Xivii]

Malakandra is around for basically the entire time, and posts a fair bit, but never really comments on fonti's case that I noticed.

He did comment on it. He disagreed with some of Fonti's points.

 

[Xivii]

This seems to be implying that his play this game is going to his scum meta, right? Although I think that may be somewhat due to irl restrictions from what he's said earlier

It may because I wasn't in the game, but I felt like his play in Oasis was different than his play here. However, after skimming though the games he's provided above, I do think this is his scum meta.

 

[Xivii]

BoomFrog thought Z25 and LaserGuy
Fonti thought Z25 and LaserGuy
Rajam thought Z25 and LaserGuy

Z25 what are your reads on everyone in terms of percentage scum?

 

[Xivii]

Actually @ Everyone, could you provide the same

 

[Chaco]

Xivii 0%
DarkPit 5%
Ex 15-20%

Malakandra 50%
Laser 65%
Z25 65%

Those numbers jump significantly with the flip of another, I can’t accurately pin down which 2 of the three yet. But I’m rereading.

 

[Darkpit54]

Actually @ Everyone, could you provide the same

Xivii 0%
DP 0%
Ex 15%
Chaco 25%
Mala 40%
Z 50%
Laser 70%

Out of 200%, because there's at least two scum.

What's the likelihood of scum hard bussing toDay to avoid getting yeeted toMorrow?

 

[Darkpit54]

Or avoid their partner getting yeeted, if they think they're on the way out

 

[Z25]

BoomFrog thought Z25 and LaserGuy
Fonti thought Z25 and LaserGuy
Rajam thought Z25 and LaserGuy

Z25 what are your reads on everyone in terms of percentage scum?

Zen: 0

Dark Pit:3

Chaco: 1

Mala: 65

Ex: 50

Laser: 70

 

[ExLight]

Actually @ Everyone, could you provide the same

Xiivi 0%
Exlight 0%
Mala 25%
Darkpit 36%
Laser 55%
Chaco 67%
Z25 85%

 

[ExLight]

What's the likelihood of scum hard bussing toDay to avoid getting yeeted toMorrow?

they’re probably distancing just in case but I don’t think they’d prioritize pushing their scumbud lynch

 

[LaserGuy]

Mala - 70%
Chaco - 60%
z25 - 45%
Exlight - 20%
Darkpit - 5%
Xivii - 0%

 

[Malakandra]

Xivii - 0
Darkpit - 15
Exlight - 25
Chaco - 40
Laserguy - 50
Z25 - 50

 

[Xivii]

Zen: 0

Dark Pit:3

Chaco: 1

Mala: 65

Ex: 50

Laser: 70

Ok you're really going to have to lay down this Chaco read.

 

[Chaco]

Bruh I saw that myself and was like how the **** am I getting townread that hard by Z

 

[Chaco]

Like I feel the 25-40 percents all day, but 1? Cmonnnnn.

 

[Malakandra]

Xiivi 0%
Exlight 0%
Mala 25%
Darkpit 36%
Laser 55%
Chaco 67%
Z25 85%

Why am I less likely than Darkpit to you?

 

[Malakandra]

My impression was that you were reading Frozen as fairly Town compared to me and weren't terribly sold on fonti's case.

Laser, I think you really need to re-read my day 1. You are pushing me as your top scum and have gotten multiple things wrong about me that you have used to justify this.

 

[Malakandra]

To answer the quote: Yes in my first reads list Frozen was rather high and you were top of null. However that changed very much with the advent of Fonti's case on FF, which brought her down a lot, and while you still remained null, I didn't trust the Somi/Exlight slot back then, and saw the vote on you from that slot as a possible setup.

 

[ExLight]

Why am I less likely than Darkpit to you?

? do you think he should be townier than you?

 

[Malakandra]

I'm wondering why you have me townier. Darkpit has been mostly obv town to me, even now that I think he isn't a mason. Not saying your labeling is wrong, just wondering why? If it's just a personal feel thing, or maybe I'm missing something about darkpit you caught.

 

[Z25]

Ok you're really going to have to lay down this Chaco read.

I genuinely don't see that number as a stretch.

But a brief breakdown because theres a a lot of content to pull from for that.

Let's start early with day one,

48 is a brief post that outlines a few reads, does not overstep things, make bad assumptions(Like my top read in Laser's opening read on NSG) and it comes off very natural. They proceeded to sort naturally by asking you about past games and the meta of other players. 442 Ialso give points for, for not leaning into the easy 3ds yeet and realizing that his behavior didn't mean scum. Sure you could argue scum would do this to look good, but yeeting 3ds wouldn't have drawn suspicion and work way more in their favor. So they feel very town motivated day one. The rest of their posts day one involved answering and asking questions which kept a very strong activity. I can't really see anything wrong with their content there .

Day Two: They open talking about how they want Boom and 1,046 paints a good reasoning that makes more sense to come from town perspective then scum. Its a solid natural progression. 1,196 showcases them calling out EX on the drunk posting. Which is even more interesting when you realize Trisscar called them out on this earlier that day and mentioned how trying to bait masons was anti town. A slip by Triss that I think Scum Chaco would have noticed if they were piggybacking off of Triss's dislike of the drunk posting. Which leads me to they likely were not and those were actual thoughts on Triss by Chaco that comes from a townie perspective more then a scum one imo. 1,432 again shows strong town intent where they put together a lot of content by Frozen to prove why a Boom connection makes sense. Thats a lot of scum hunting, that that early in a game, scum won't usually go for. Then a few posts down, he mentions the possibilities of pocketing, keeping things open minded. At that point, most scum would just push for the Boom lynch under one mindset, not multiple. Most of the actual content that day comes from you, fonti, and chaco. With a lot of discussion coming from you three on the state of the game while everyone else comes off a little back seating. His reaction to your claim retraction also feels like frustrated town rather then an angry scum, because I can't see why scum would react like that.

Day Three: 2,131 is another post mentioning them rereading the thread. Something they seem to have done multiple times based on posts. Which seems backed upon by their reads and changing in views that I've mentioned. 2,203 brings up an intriguing point, that while it wound up being wrong, is a point I doubt scum thinks of, let alone aims to use to push a lynch when Rajam was another sketchy slot based on a lot of things Rajam had done. For example after a re read, they are much more accepting of Zen and look elsewhere to try and find scum. Which is again a very open mind you won't usually find in scum. 2,311 further shows they took lessons from the re read and made a change in their reads and mindset. This effort doesn't come so much from scum. Its something I find to come from a townie perspective, those changes feel nature and reading them, it feels like it came from a re read, not actually pre meditated. His literally next post is also a great rebuttal to that Laser post. A few posts later, he goes in on his thoughts on Jack Vs Triss, which is a response to Triss asking in 2,385 that shows a basis for why he had thought this because again, his re read led to this conclusion.

This is why I believe the slot is very likely Town. They have natural progression in reads, good content, have been active, stand with their points rather then folding and playing into the shenanigans this game has had. Hes clearly been actively invested in trying to solve and help. It makes him very unlikely to flip scum imo when I distrust other slots more. That's why I think the town core for sure right now are Zen, Chaco, DP. The rest I believe by process of elimination have better shots at flipping scum imo. With Laser I still think could be a good yeet today as he does work with teams, or if he does flip scum, it shouldn't be hard to figure out his partner.

Maybe I'm wrong on Chaco and if anyone has any scum points against him, I'm open for hearing it, but I don't think I make a play on yeeting this slot without the yeet from another shot first.

 

[Chaco]

Holy hell, I mean you’re right and all, but aww shucks. You still might be scum though <3

 

[Xivii]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Hnmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

 

[Xivii]

 

[Xivii]

 

[Xivii]

How far are you in your reread, Mala?

 

[Xivii]

Raxxel's early posting feels townie to me.

What about his posts felt town?

 

[Darkpit54]

I feel like I should be worried lol.

That was really in-depth Z. I wasn't really leaning toward Chaco being scum, but I think that argument had pretty valid points.

I don't think he would make that post about a scummate that's not really under much pressure, right? Could maybe see it with a townie he's trying to pocket though

 

[Malakandra]

How far are you in your reread, Mala?

Just got to your big post on me and Rajam. Not that much progress today sadly since I got stuck at the vet for 4 hours with my phone on 4%. RIP. I'll finish by tonight for sure.

 

[Chaco]

I feel like I should be worried lol.

That was really in-depth Z. I wasn't really leaning toward Chaco being scum, but I think that argument had pretty valid points.

I don't think he would make that post about a scummate that's not really under much pressure, right? Could maybe see it with a townie he's trying to pocket though

The latter was my opinion as well, hence my response. lol.

But then again, I beg the question of would scum really go that in depth late game? I don’t know players here well enough to discern if he would as scum. So I just ignore that sort of stuff from a read perspective.