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Q&A Meta Knight: Questions & Answers Thread (Don't make or reply to new threads just asking questions)

CaptainVul

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Thats nice and something I'll check out but its not exactly what I'm looking for. I'm more specifically looking for something that explains all the things that go into pulling off the up air strings, like I know where you hit someone on Meta-Knights boot changes the trajectory of how your opponent is sent, like you usually want to get the tip of the boot right?

And percentages that the Dash Attack/Down Throw Up Air stuff starts working generally and stuff like that.

Does something like that exist?
 

CaptainVul

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Like for example with Sheik I'm only able to get the dash attack/down throw -> full 4 up air string up b combo on her from 29%-32% (on practice mode so no rage).

Does that sound about right or am I just really bad at doing it lol
 
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eclipsis17

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In regards to a list, I believe there was one but was taken down because of backlash. Doing your own research isn't that hard anyway, plus will make you better at performing the combo.

Dash Attack has 3 different hitboxes. The first is the heel, second is what I like to call the sole, and the third is the toe which is the tip you were referring to (in training mode, it will be obvious when you hit with this as it will do 5% while the other two do 6%). Other ways to start the combo include Uptilt (This has two hitboxs), down throw, and forward throw (and sometimes back throw). However the throws tend to be more DI dependant.

I'll try and give you a run down of the logistics of the combo. Before I start, keep in mind that this combo doesn't necessarily have to be 6 uairs, or 5 or 4. It can be any number and will vary on character and percent. With that out of the way...

The percent range for the combo will vary depending on which move you used to initiate it. For example dash attack toe will allow the combo to work at earlier percents, where as the sourspot of Uptilt will allow it work at later percents. The "Golden Percent" refers to a percent or range of percentages where most, if not all, of the combo starters will work.

Depending on percents and rage, you will probably need to either fastfall your first upair or delay your last. Most MK's I'm sure are quite protective of the more specific type of info, especially in regards to a comprehensive list. Most posters here will have labbed the percents for each move for every character entirely.

Once you can successfully pull off the most basic form of the combo (no ff's or delay) the rest will naturally follow as you get used to the way it works. (I'd recommend practicing against a DDD at 42% and linking dash attack to 4 up airs, as DDD is so easy to combo.)

There's no shortcut to doing this other than practice and trying to remember a comprehensive list of percents is unrealistic.

Hope I helped and good luck.
 
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CaptainVul

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Yeah that helped confirm a lot of the things I was trying to find out and the first part about finding out the percents yourself definitely is the best way so I started doing that especially the characters I plan on using Meta-Knight against in bracket. And ironically I already was labbing them against Dedede since hes actually my main so I wanted to find out what percents I should especially be scared of and I was able to do it against Dedede from 30-48% which is a little terrifying lol.

But yeah I also figured out some of that how at the lower percent of the percent range you want the tip of the dash attack and the higher range you want the last hitbox of dash attack. So basically thank you for confirming the stuff I was trying to figure out I really appreciate it.


I have 1 more question though, at high percents when you're out of range for an up air after a dash attack completely you want to go for the tip of the dash attack hitbox right? Because it seems like it puts your opponent in sort of a 50/50 where you could immediately go for Up B or bait the air dodge and go for Up B
 

CaptainVul

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That actually is really helpful thanks, but man I guess I am bad at pulling off the dash attack/down throw up air strings because I was only able to get it on Sheik from basically 29-32% and it said its possible from 27-44% lol
 

Katakiri

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or is it just insanely easy to land?
thanks, and merry christmas
In regards to D-Throw, yes but it's not optimal and can be punished at 0%.

Try D-Throw to Up-Smash for starters. Real easy, real safe.
On floaty characters, D-throw to SH Nado works.
On fast-fallers, D-throw to Dash Attack works and you get a follow-up after.

And that's just the basics, welcome to the world of MK combos.
 

not pete

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In regards to D-Throw, yes but it's not optimal and can be punished at 0%.

Try D-Throw to Up-Smash for starters. Real easy, real safe.
On floaty characters, D-throw to SH Nado works.
On fast-fallers, D-throw to Dash Attack works and you get a follow-up after.

And that's just the basics, welcome to the world of MK combos.
ok, ill try those and a few others
thanks
 

heraldmetatron

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Been playing for a while now, and I feel lost at what to do against a competent cloud. Against ones that try to go aggro on me i can punish them really hard, but ones that space nair and dair properly are a pain since i can't get close, plus i'm a floaty so i die easily. Is this a bad matchup for him or is there something i'm not understanding here?
 

Kaffei

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Been playing for a while now, and I feel lost at what to do against a competent cloud. Against ones that try to go aggro on me i can punish them really hard, but ones that space nair and dair properly are a pain since i can't get close, plus i'm a floaty so i die easily. Is this a bad matchup for him or is there something i'm not understanding here?

Cloud loses to shield camping

Also play vs him like you most other sword fighters. Sword swing hitboxes go in an arc. This means they only cover a small amount of area for a given active frame; basically wait for them to swing and then hit them. Obviously it's not that easy but hopefully it gives you a better picture.
 

Jamurai

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Cloud is obnoxious cause he's basically a sword user without a sword user's classic weaknesses (aka average mobility, somewhat laggy attacks). Sword users are usually fairly difficult to play because you have to learn to abuse the extra range and disjoint to make up for these. Cloud doesn't have to space correctly all the time because his moves have good frame data despite being massively disjointed and powerful. This makes him fairly easy to do well with, his recovery weakness doesn't matter enough since he can compensate with his vertical stall tools and of course LB Up-B.

His big weakness imo is as Kaffei said, shielding. In a somewhat similar vein to Fox but worse, his throws are garbage, at best he gets you above him to start off a juggle trap scenario but thankfully MK has plenty of landing mixups to get out of it. He especially has trouble killing you if you keep shielding at high %.
 

warionumbah2

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We all know this character(Cloud) is easy as hell, takes more effort to fight him that playing him here's my advice from watching top level play(aba putting komo to sleep) and from my experience.

  • Don't airdodge, seriously after dtilt to uair for example what is he gonna get? We use one of the few characters that gives no ****s about his juggle game. Usually they'd CP to DL or BF but that only opens up more landing options for mk.
  • Stay at his max dtilt range, like our late dash attack its poor on block. No other burst movement goes as far as dtilt, at this range its easy to react towhat he does.
  • Don't challenge dair or uair
  • http://pastebin.com/nr5rUZ2k
  • Remember when his finishing touch kills, whenever he gets his limit mode mks tend to play scared around 20-30% why? He can't kill us at this percent, knowing the percents allows u the player to know when to play more carefully and when to avoid his dair or uair which confirms into it. Most of the time usually high percents he'll go for LB cross slash for the kill.
  • Dimensional cape is our best friend, invalidates his attempt to juggle, ignores his LB sword beam ledge guard where you cannot tech the wall. In disadvantage states in general you shouldn't be afraid. Just gotta understand the neutral against him.
  • Research his frame data, understand the AC and landing lag on aerials, what is or isn't safe on block and FAF on his moves
 

Cold_Ninja_Emperor

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does somebody know other combos for meta knigth that doesn't start with a dash or grab attack?
 

Jamurai

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does somebody know other combos for meta knigth that doesn't start with a dash or grab attack?
Dtilt trip > anything
FF Nair > dash attack
Onstage Dair > tech chase
Edge-cancelled jab > Up-B
Ledge-cancelled Up-B > Up-B
Ftilt 1 > Up-B at high %s
Dtilt > tech chase at high %s

Utilt and SH Uair also start the death combo.
 

Cold_Ninja_Emperor

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Dtilt trip > anything
FF Nair > dash attack
Onstage Dair > tech chase
Edge-cancelled jab > Up-B
Ledge-cancelled Up-B > Up-B
Ftilt 1 > Up-B at high %s
Dtilt > tech chase at high %s

Utilt and SH Uair also start the death combo.
thanks:)
 
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Baby_Sneak

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What would you guys classify metaknight as a character? Based on his strengths and weaknesses, what would you guys call him based on archetypes? Idk what to think of him.
 

ぱみゅ

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What would you guys classify metaknight as a character? Based on his strengths and weaknesses, what would you guys call him based on archetypes? Idk what to think of him.
:popo:



No, but seriously, he's pretty much a bait-and-punish kind of character.
:196:
 
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Kaffei

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What would you guys classify metaknight as a character? Based on his strengths and weaknesses, what would you guys call him based on archetypes? Idk what to think of him.

He doesn't really have safe poke tools like Sheik fair/ZSS nair that cover entirely in front of him so he has to rely more on movement kinda like how Hax plays melee

I'd agree with bait and punish
 

Kaffei

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Does invincible nair still work in this game?

To clarify, in Brawl, MK can grab the ledge then immediately drop nair while retaining some invincibility frames.
 

Jamurai

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Does invincible nair still work in this game?

To clarify, in Brawl, MK can grab the ledge then immediately drop nair while retaining some invincibility frames.
I had no idea that this was a thing, pls lab it and let me/us know what you find (unless someone else has an answer)!
 

Kaffei

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I had no idea that this was a thing, pls lab it and let me/us know what you find (unless someone else has an answer)!
ok lemme think of a way to test this by myself rofl

be back later

EDIT: it doesn't work. In this game u lose invincibility frames as soon as you drop off the ledge which is lame
 
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Amadeus9

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ok lemme think of a way to test this by myself rofl

be back later

EDIT: it doesn't work. In this game u lose invincibility frames as soon as you drop off the ledge which is lame
*which is balanced
 

Gemba Board

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Guys, how do we feel about stale shuttle loop? Does it connect both hits easier at high percentage when its stale, or is that a placebo? I normally opt for anything but shuttle loop combos to tack on percent but I see so many mks who are better than me using it early as hell and to punish air dodges and whiffed attack when they know it won't kill. I'm thinking the uair chain to shuttle loop is exempt from staleness since you finish so close to the top blast zone. Is that the case? Ponder with me here.
 

eclipsis17

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Melee ledge dash

Brawl air dodge onto the stage
Not every character in Melee had equally good ledgedashes, and very few characters can perform the lagless ledge getup in Smash 4. Retaining invincibility would cause those characters ledge options to become much better than the rest of cast.

Although I do agree it would be awesome.
 

Kaffei

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Not every character in Melee had equally good ledgedashes, and very few characters can perform the lagless ledge getup in Smash 4. Retaining invincibility would cause those characters ledge options to become much better than the rest of cast.

Although I do agree it would be awesome.
I didn't say every character in Melee had equally good ledgedashes, but all of the relevant meta characters excluding Jiggs/Peach can retain invincibility while ledge dashing

What Smash 4 lagless get up are you talking about btw, the no impact land one?
 

Amadeus9

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are you one of those fools that thinks melee is a good competitively balanced game

haxdashing is a load of bull****, just saying

Gemba Board Gemba Board keep it fresh.
 
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BoxedOccaBerrys

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OK so, I have trouble reliably canceling his Back-Air to spike people in the stage, do you guys have any tips? Since when I fast-fall it, I only get one hit, and I get punished...

Also does anyone know the percentage of times when the Down-Tilt trips?
 

Perris6

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Guys, how do we feel about stale shuttle loop? Does it connect both hits easier at high percentage when its stale, or is that a placebo? I normally opt for anything but shuttle loop combos to tack on percent but I see so many mks who are better than me using it early as hell and to punish air dodges and whiffed attack when they know it won't kill. I'm thinking the uair chain to shuttle loop is exempt from staleness since you finish so close to the top blast zone. Is that the case? Ponder with me here.
I've been thinking about this too. It seems that the more I use shuttle loop it really doesn't matter TOO much with killing, but idk if it links better. I also noticed professional MKs like Ito, tyrant, kiri, and aba use it to punish and after fthrow follow ups and STILL net the kill later on. I would like an explanation as well.
 

warionumbah2

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Stale Uairs are amazing. You see Aba and Ito purposefully stale it to make the percents virtually unknown, Aba stales it so he can link FH Uair to FF Bair easier, they won't get sent as far from the back hit of Uair. Stale Uairs also allows you to link at least 5 or 6 Uairs on the whole cast, yes it deals less KB/damage and yes they stay in hitstun less so the timing for the Uairs are more strict but you're taking them much closer to the blastzone than you would with fresh Uairs in Training mode. The more jumps you sacrifice the better(unless you fast fall).

Stale Shuttle loop sucks, its best to keep it fresh but its our main way to rack up damage out of throws so its inevitable. You probably won't notice its kill power weakening because of rage and poor DI. Rage makes this move janky as hell, the 1st hit of Shuttle loop can demolish people sometimes similar to Boost kick with rage.

Also does anyone know the percentage of times when the Down-Tilt trips?
Dtilt has a 40% chance of tripping, not sure on the percents where Dtilt stops tripping. Around 40-60%?.
 

Gemba Board

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So if there is a bird or a ballon wondering about, I should show it who's boss with uair. Sweet. I figured shuttle loop might not benefit from staleness I just wasn't sure since Ito shows little to no concern about lol. I guess shuttle loop works out regardless, but I will aim for fresh ones when possible. Thanks for the uair info.
 
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