Mass Effect (King Maker) - Glorious Way to End the Day. Mafia Wins!

[Death Bear]

Omni kill Hando with fire.

Gonna reread but Hando shot is 100% legit.

 

[Death Bear]

Oh and


etc.
:king:

 

[Jdietz43]

I'm here but too pooped to jump right in, not sure how I feel about Omni being king but at least it should be good for reads. (@Ryu: Had MagicJosh over... jeebus can he wear you out if you let him stay too long lol)

 

[Mastermind]

Whatever responses I had, I'll get to them tomorrow. I just caught up over 500 posts and made a push elsewhere. I'm done with mafia tonight.

 

[Handorin]

Hando, talk to me about anything.

I got nothing in mind at the moment. It's 2am. I'm too tired. I'll have more time Friday to look into this thread more. I have a at least 1 or 2 ideas floating around in my head that I'll try and get out by then.

I feel even on a Townbuz flip that a Kary execute is just as legitimate as ever. I really want to like JDietz but Kary is going to decide where I truly lean on him. Right now I'm in Agreement of Hando/Kary but I want Kary over hando. I trust that Omni will get **** done and not make this day last 1000 posts again.

I'm literally torn that marshy is dead so early in the game, this scum team is ****ing whack as hell

The town was probably split even on reads on him, leaving not tons of info, imo. Why wouldn't they kill him? I bet multiple mafia are of one opinion toward him. Look at his lovers/haters and look for connections there. That's where I'd like to start.

In a perfect world, everyone plays the same and nobody ever disagrees. I don't understand why i'm a 'liability' or anyone else for that matter is and why you're so adamant about lynching them despite not having a factual argument.

Bardull is a liability. He hasn't posted or stayed on topic with the game. His activity is sparse as is his reads. Do you want to lynch him?
Hando is being a liability. He hasn't posted or stayed on topic with the game. His activity is sparse as is his reads. Do you want to lynch him?
Kary is being a liability. He hasn't posted or stayed on topic with the game. His activity is sparse as is his reads. Do you want to lynch him?

What's the argument on why lynching a liability is better than lynching a scumread? Don't snuff your nose at me either.

Am I being a liability because you don't like how much I post? or because I'm not able to post so much?

Omni kill Hando with fire.

Gonna reread but Hando shot is 100% legit.

 

[Omni]

Don't drag this out, dude.

 

[BSP]

I'll get back into this game soon.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Am I being a liability because you don't like how much I post? or because I'm not able to post so much?

What kind of question is this? You made one quick case on Omni and before you know it Omni is king and you haven't lead up on it. What's your thought process this game?

 

[Handorin]

Well, I'm looking for scum.

But as I'm sitting on the toilet right after I woke up and have to be at school in an hour then work directly after that...

I can't really expound more than that.

Smell ya later

 

[Omni]

*rubs temples*

this is turning into exactly what i had hoped it wouldn't. now scum can hide and lurk because half the game is barely participating. hm.

alright, that's fine. i've got a gun. i'm omni: ultimate disliker of lurkers and inactives. we'll just see what happens

 

[~ Gheb ~]

this is turning into exactly what i had hoped it wouldn't. now scum can hide and lurk because half the game is barely participating. hm.

Yes, because by "opting" to lynch liabilities you gave the actual scumbags to hide and lurk it out. FoS Omni

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Yes, because by "opting" to lynch liabilities you gave the actual scumbags to hide and lurk it out. FoS Omni

EBWOP: You gave them a chance to hide and lurk it out.

 

[Omni]

I'm not dying today, Gheb. Do some actual work and get off my nuts for the last time.

 

[Omni]

this game is driving me nuts already. crybaber whiner baby gheb and inactive galore

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I would love to play it as much as you would. Could always hbc and shoot your scumread. I wouldn't call harm on it as long as the logic is sound.

 

[Omni]

I'm annoyed, but I'm not going to act on it. Except with Gheb. Shooting him would feel good and be totally worth it.

It's only been a day into the D2 so far, but with Kary V/LA, Hando being too busy, Bardull busy, and JDietz lurking it's gonna be a sad, sad Day. Glad Dabuz is gone because he would have just been another person to add to the lurker list. But hurtin' without Nabe/Marshy.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I'm not a crybaby and I'm not whiny. You're just scum and need to be shot soon and you're trying to ridicule me to undermine my points. But this town is actually dumb enough to buy it.

Are you gonna shoot soup or Kary toDay? You'd make yourself a million times more useful than you have been all game.

 

[Jerkus]

Gheb, please stop making Omni want to shoot you.

Omni, please don't shoot Gheb.

Gheb, I would love to see you make a case for some of your scum reads. That's probably a better way to get Omni to listen to you, and it's a better way to get certain scum reads to actually start participating.

Getting to everything now, starting with DBear's wall.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

No, Omni will somehow manage to squeeze something he doesn't want to hear out of any post I make. Right now the only way I can see to make myself useful is to bring new people into the spotlight. For example: I'm extremely annoyed by Bardull, I think the way he played Day 1 was liable *and* scummy and the way he's buddying BSP is odd.

Anybody agree?

 

[BarDulL]

BSP is obvTown based on his play here.

Like, it matches his Town meta PERFECTLY from PB/BaM mafia. Literally.

 

[Jerkus]

How much is he a factor now ? What does his push on Dabuz do to your read on him, you said earlier any combo of dumb or scum could be on dabuz so whats your take on Omni and what do you expect out of him now that dabuz is gone ?

After a big reread, Omni currently stands as my lightest town lean. His push for Dabuz was bad, as was everyone's push for Dabuz (Marshy is gonna tell me off in endgame, I'm sure), but as a general concept, I do understand the idea of wanting to get rid of people that are viewed to be difficult to read ("liabilities," if you want to go with the current buzzword). Omni, in particular, is known for this, so that doesn't ring any alarms for me. What does bother me about Omni is that he apparently stuck to this concept despite already forming a scum read on at least one player (that was Soup). I would think that would trump lynching a null player for being null, so seeing him go that route while buddying NH gives me the willies. Seeing him talk about NH so much after his death and group himself together with the slot now that the slot has flipped town is also bothering me.

Also bothering me is the fact that I have not seen him push his biggest scumread from yesterDay, Soup. I would think he would have started the Day brandishing his gun at Soup to make him talk, but that didn't happen. I asked him which slot he most wanted to shoot at the start of the Day, and he blew that off saying he needs to reread. Currently unsure if I'm seeing Scumni trying to wriggle out of shooting his scum partner Soup, or if I'm seeing TownOmni getting levelheaded now that he's in charge of the big gun. Currently leaning toward the latter because I would think scum would relish this distancing opportunity.

Ultimately, I'm currently going with the scenario that Omni is town and trying to make an informed decision while also being a little too attached to NH. It's not like we can execute him toDay anyway, sooooo. People should just keep an eye on him ToDay and make him answer for any shady **** on D3.

What made you dislike soup specifically at this point, you say he's been chasing wild geese which i assume was in reference to dabuz, now you say your not sure if sinister > out of whack so give me your take on it post dabuz flip. This is your first mention of soup so the level of interest is visible but not present, this is notable for later.

This will be something I'll be able to get into more deeply when I go HAM on my scum reads a little later. Currently thinking that I let Soup's AtE get to me and that I need to not do that.

Here's your next mention of soup and what i can safely assume is you implying he is scum, now you make a big deal out of what soup posted , but you seem hesitant still, this is more notable considering you started your post with it, meaning it was top of your head , needs to be addressed now material.

This seems like nitpicking, so allow me to nitpick back. First, as the post you quote shows, I actually didn't start the post with my Soup comments; I started with informing everyone that Gheb, Ditzy and B-dull were the only ones really on the right track (imo) and that people who think they're scum are either dumb or scum. Second...

I wnt you to go into why you didn't place something palpable on soup in the form of a vote or a fos, it's clear you disagree with his play but it really reads to me like your unwilling to commit to that read, beyond quesy.

The idea of voting for anyone in this game lost its appeal pretty much immediately. I think someone (BSP?) was trying to keep a vote tally for a while and be all democratic about this, but that idea dropped pretty quickly and I think that's fine. I didn't vote for him because a vote in this setup is exactly as useful as an FOS, and, generally speaking, I consider Fingers of Suspicion to be almost completely useless and do not use them.

I committed to the read by stating it out in the open and giving brief reasoning for why I had it. That's the necessary part because that the only thing that a King can actually analyze and decide to agree with. A vote attached to that would have done little, I think. In fact, I think a lot of people elected to pretty much stop casting votes on D1.

Again, noncommittal to calling NH scum, this is less telling but of note, i already know his dabuz push bothered you as you clearly outlined, I want you to go into what your were expecting out of townNabe and how it would have changed what marshy was saying about dabuz. I also want to know why shutting the marshy side out would be protown or pro your read on them, were you more confident in reading nabes intent oevr marshys ?

Out of TownNabe, I expected more restraint and questioning, which I eventually got. It is Marshy's style to hardbody people. It is Nabe's style specifically not to do that, in my experience. So watching the NH slot in the earlier part of the Day just call for Dabuz's head without any reasoning (reasoning that I would have expected to see from Nabe if that head was really in sync with what Marshy was doing), and blow up at me for asking him a basic question just rubbed me the wrong way entirely.

But I tried to drop that by telling Marshy to basically just stop arguing with me, because I was done arguing with him. I wasn't blocking him out; I still read everything he said. But I didn't want to engage with him anymore because it was leading nowhere. It was just him getting mad at me over apparently not just letting him run wild like he thinks he should get to do, and me getting mad that I couldn't get away from all the stupid points brought up in the conversation. It was toxic to the thread.

What games have you played with dabuz btw ?

I don't know. I don't keep a list of things like this in my back pocket. He's just been around a lot—enough for me to know that his play on D1 was not out of the ordinary for him as any alignment.

Now, onto more pressing issues, this paragraph is throwing me circus, because it's given me a feeling i can't shake, which is that your D1 was spent brow-beating the people on Dabuz's wagon without really offering up what seemed to be your chosen scum pick(soup) wagon, it just felt like soup was the after thought and telling people why they were wrong was more important, is this telling in itself ? Not on it's own, but like i said, it's not just this post, it's the feel i get from most of your content posts, in terms of doing more to dissuade dabuz lynch then to pursue your own reads

I think your criticism is fair, to a degree. I would agree that I ended up spending more of my time trying to explain to people why Dabuz was a silly lynch than actually pushing any alternatives. But that's because that's what dominated general discussion. Dabuz was becoming the frontrunner for execution based on nothing, and no one on his wagon would even explain why. It's hard to to get people like that to follow a new train of thought since the one they're glue to has no backing anyway. How do you fighting something that irrational?

And it's worth noting that, while I'm not sure exactly when this happens, there's a point during Day 1 where BSP seems to start leaning toward Soup for the execution, which was my favorite execution option at the time. Why would I try to build a wagon for Soup in that scenario? Since you are aware that Soup was one of my biggest scum reads on D1, I obviously must have made that read pretty clear, and the guy with the gun didn't need to be convinced by me. What would I gain from trying to convince other people?

Note the underlined here: You say it can go only one of two ways and yet..no soup push, not to mention this is flawed logic based on : NH pushing dabuz + NH town flip.

Yes, it is true that NH did an anti-town thing even though he was town. Marshy's kind of a unique case in that his natural style of play is kind of anti-town. But I was correct when I said that anyone with a strong scum or town read on Dabuz was bull****ing (you saw Nabe say that Dabuz could be town even though Marshy was trying to shove Dabuz off a cliff anyway). Not much more to say on this than that.

So now we know dabuz is town, so today your top lynch pick must be soup / omni / kary, so who is it ?

Gut's saying Soup, but Kary may be the safer and ultimately better play. Obviously we can't lynch Omni and I already explained where my head is on him. And I still think people need to be keeping an eye on RykEEr/Hando (ultimate rule #1, holy ****). Part of me wants to spend a fair amount of time just getting them to post and own some reads.

This is stuff I'll get into later. Please dare to trust me.

This is your second time bringing up soup and this time it's in the context of the wagon participators , and again you mention how you want to see him go, but this is as far as you take it , once again the odd disconnect between your interest in soup vs what your actually doing and pursuing, i don't believe you laid any sort of "vote" on Soup during this time, an odd occurrence given the apparent interest you have in him.

I would like you to delve into why you didn't pursue soup further than what you did, and if you didn't vote him, why you felt the need not to.

Once again i'm going to mention a nice chunk of this post is more dedicated to brow-beating those against dabuz and praising those who defend him as opposed to pursuing your own interests.

Got into all of this already.

This time the post is finally directed at Soup, but again, you don't commit to seeing Soup go, You say he reeks and you hope he gets shot , but again You aren't pushing his case you arent' advancing your soupScum, you say you want him shot, almost top of your list, but the way you've posted previously around him doesn't suggest as much, nor do you explicitly go out and show BSP what Soup has done to be at the top of your shoot list, it almost reads like your content with what has already been posted about soup and that should be enough. So really your sitting on your soupScum in the end, is how i take it.

I guess I'm not understanding why you expected more than what I gave. I never went into an all-out case on Soup because I generally don't like doing that (and it sucks that I may have to do this later; I'm already dreading it). I just commented on all the scummy things I noticed in his play and stated, in no uncertain terms, that I would like him dead. Again, there was a point near the end of the Day when plenty of other people, including BSP, were already agreeing with me. Mission pretty much accomplished at that point.

Eventually, BSP got into a one-on-one with Soup and seemed to decide that he didn't want to go that route. That was also about the time that I was starting to fall for Soup's AtE. I will admit that I did not push Soup as hard as I should have at that point, and that's one of the things that resulted in the Dabuz lynch basically becoming an inevitability. But that's a town mistake, not a scum slip.

So one of soup/kary/omni is def scum then, so again, who is it today, why them, what about their push makes them scum.

Getting pretty repetitive now.

Now this is where it gets interesting , only towards the end do yo ustart reconsidering soupScum, so really to this point your entire D1 can be summed up as "soup read which went nowhere" and "brow-beating the dabuz haters" I want to know what J said that made you reconsider your stance so visibly , you can paraphrase or whatever , but i expect it to be something amazing considering your previous attitude to soup.

I think I've pretty roundly explained why "Soup read which went nowhere + brow-beating Dabuz haters" isn't a fair characterization of my play on D1 by now.

To be clear in regards to J, he didn't really swing my mind around all by himself in regards to Soup. Soup's AtE did that, and when I said something about it to J in our QT (because that's how we're communicating), he basically just agreed that Soup was starting to lean "dumb" over "scum" for him.

For the record, J has not said a word to me since D1 ended.

All in all Jerkus, your play hasn't been centered around what you've been posting , your soup push seems disinterested at best and really amounts to you doing no more than sitting on soup, and you spent more time telling people why they were wrong then you did trying to prove you were right, from this i have come to the conclusion you didn't much care to be right whether due to knowing you were right, or due to needing something besides dabuz to do, and were more interested in being there then actually being there in terms your pushes.

Vote Jerkus

The idea that "[my] play hasn't been centered around what [I've] been posting" is rich. It's like saying my driving hasn't been centered around the way I turn the steering wheel.

This post was actually a lot longer than I thought it was. I'm going to check on that other game I'm in real quick and that probably have myself a nice, long break.

 

[Jerkus]

No, Omni will somehow manage to squeeze something he doesn't want to hear out of any post I make. Right now the only way I can see to make myself useful is to bring new people into the spotlight. For example: I'm extremely annoyed by Bardull, I think the way he played Day 1 was liable *and* scummy and the way he's buddying BSP is odd.

Anybody agree?

Nope.

Also, DBear, consider any questions I asked in my lost post to be rhetorical.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Why do you not agree? Do you realize that Bardull disappeared throughout most of Day 1? The beginning consisted mainly of him randomly complaining about stuff and when he came back out of nowhere he was suddenly throwing dirt at me for not "protecting dabuz strongly enough" as if it was within my power or responsibility to do that [not to mention that dabuz' death doesn't bother me and I've made that clear a couple of times]. I also wonder what happened to his push against soup - now that he's no longer under pressure Bardull is nowhere to be seen to push him. I think that's pretty fishy, especially coupled with the fact that Bardull has placed this entire Day phase on his backburner and reduces his input to random claims that BSP is pro-town based on meta. If that's not the kind of case you people want from me then I can't do much more for you.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

saw jerkus wall, response not likely to be up soon

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Btw, I completely agree with your stances at soup and Kary. I really wanna think soup is the play because of how badly he flailed when people gave him flak. The points I made D1 against him still stand. But I can see why Kary would make the better lynch still.

 

[Death Bear]

saw jerkus wall, response not likely to be up soon

all of the quotes

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Another stupid ****ing wall to reply to regarding me. What is it going to take to show you people I'm town? Getting ****ing tired of this.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Btw, I completely agree with your stances at soup and Kary. I really wanna think soup is the play because of how badly he flailed when people gave him flak. The points I made D1 against him still stand. But I can see why Kary would make the better lynch still.

Maybe I'm someone who likes being town and lynching scum. If I'm dead I clearly can't do anything so frankly I'm not going to just roll over and die. The point regarding flailing is laughable and you can pretend all you want that I'm flailing but an act of flailing requires an intention. I'm trying to get it through your thick ****ing skulls that I'm town so frankly yes I am put my hands up in the air just asking to be read correctly. I'm not Dabuz.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

EBWOP: Putting my hands up.*

 

[~ Gheb ~]

You are not dabuz.

You are me in Disney Singalong.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Lmao really I haven't even stated poor me I've had my attitude on proving everyone wrong and on top of the fact you weren't active and here I am just willing to pile out ****

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I will respond to Jerkus when I get home.

 

[Jdietz43]

Jerkus should go.
BSP should out all his reads and tell us his overall feel of yesterdays dayPhase.
Soup should talk to me about Jerkus.
JD should talk to me about kary.
Mastermind should step it up.

/thats prolly it

I don't think there's much to say. Kary hasn't done anything to dissuade my read of him lately and now he's V/LA entirely. Unless I'm missing some huge Kary post I don't even think he responded to my case or did anything of note since last time he came up?

 

[Jdietz43]

I acknowledge your acknowledgment jerkus, be aware though i'm preparing to take a run at you and possibly soup because i think i figured out why he felt so off to me before.

Really? What do you see in Jerkus now, and how does it connect with Soup? I didn't notice anything telling in Jerkus's play to dissuade me from my town read on the slot.

 

[Jdietz43]

EBWOP: My mistake, I see it's already all written up.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

JD has a town read on a hydra involving J ?

This is more interesting than most of D1

 

[Death Bear]

JD has a town read on a hydra involving J ?

This is more interesting than most of D1

and then the wrong account again

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

My Body tells me no...But I won't quit.

Let's get back into this damn game once more.

This will be something I'll be able to get into more deeply when I go HAM on my scum reads a little later. Currently thinking that I let Soup's AtE get to me and that I need to not do that.

I am tired of this argument and I am tired of having to respond to this. There is no definitive stance here. Why are you taking AtE into a huge factor instead of looking at the substance of the posts? I will not stand for getting called for AtE without someone actually looking at the arguments I've presented. I'm literally seething at the point where trying to keep a cool head seems like an impossible alternative.

I think your criticism is fair, to a degree. I would agree that I ended up spending more of my time trying to explain to people why Dabuz was a silly lynch than actually pushing any alternatives. But that's because that's what dominated general discussion. Dabuz was becoming the frontrunner for execution based on nothing, and no one on his wagon would even explain why. It's hard to to get people like that to follow a new train of thought since the one they're glue to has no backing anyway. How do you fighting something that irrational?

And it's worth noting that, while I'm not sure exactly when this happens, there's a point during Day 1 where BSP seems to start leaning toward Soup for the execution, which was my favorite execution option at the time. Why would I try to build a wagon for Soup in that scenario? Since you are aware that Soup was one of my biggest scum reads on D1, I obviously must have made that read pretty clear, and the guy with the gun didn't need to be convinced by me. What would I gain from trying to convince other people?

No. I don't buy this and I'm going to be intervening here looking at this. You had an obvious opposition to Dabuz and you explained your logic about it, but you just let it happen. You let him get pushed and you had all the free time in the world to push me as much as you wanted. This is not about influence, because if you want to be influental you make yourself heard. My influence is clearly shown and I feel like I'm being thrown a surprise birthday party, and the cake is coconut flavored. You are that person who came into my party and gave me coconut flavored cake. You could have got something else but of course you had to suffice on the worst flavor and you're just expecting me to eat up this putrid ****. That's quite the figure of speech if you think about it but the point I'm trying to get at you're trying to present something against me, make it seem pretty yet you come with nothing. Your arguments are literally at the level of Bardull right now. I don't recall me being your hugest scumread either to be honest and you're playing this love-hate thing with me right now. Am I flailing town? Am I flailing scum? One of your arguments prior was that I was too charismatic to be scum. Does that stick? What changed? You're not telling me anything in this post other than you want to make excuses why you haven't acted on things. I am literally treating you like Bardull right now. Your argument on nobody explaining why is also complete **** because the guy you're suspecting right now was the only one to step up and give some meat to the argument. There's something about you that I haven't disliked this game and I think I have found it. I don't think either of you are blind on details like this and you're going to have to back your claims on why you believe nobody was explaining why they were on Dabuz.

I guess I'm not understanding why you expected more than what I gave. I never went into an all-out case on Soup because I generally don't like doing that (and it sucks that I may have to do this later; I'm already dreading it). I just commented on all the scummy things I noticed in his play and stated, in no uncertain terms, that I would like him dead. Again, there was a point near the end of the Day when plenty of other people, including BSP, were already agreeing with me. Mission pretty much accomplished at that point.

Why did you feel that this was satisfactory? I don't understand your need to let Dabuz roll over and die if you had obvious problems with his execution in the first place. Even then, you still show this attitude towards me that goes from 'well I want to like Soup but...' to 'I don't like Soup but...' Which is it?

To be clear in regards to J, he didn't really swing my mind around all by himself in regards to Soup. Soup's AtE did that, and when I said something about it to J in our QT (because that's how we're communicating), he basically just agreed that Soup was starting to lean "dumb" over "scum" for him.

Tell J to get the paper bag off of his head and give me a reason why he thinks I'm being dumb. I honestly don't feel my play is something I would call dumb. I sit here and appease to all these people and write all these goddamn walls and I do all this ****ing effort to get shot down with petty ****ing arguments such as "You're AtEing." You want to talk about dumb? That's ****ing dumb. You're gonna come in here on D2 and try and make a scumread based on one intention of AtE? Get the **** out. It's not even about defending myself anymore, and I don't even feel on the defense at this point. I keep putting people into their place and literally it's like everyone collectively rolls their eyes at me. This is tiring as hell but go ahead and show the town why I'm a babbling idiot over your master scum theory on me.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

This game is going to break me. I feel like EE right now.

 

[Death Bear]

Zen, whenever you catch up , should you replace in, tell me i'm only being paranoid about Jerkus.

Jerkus, read you post, waiting on you to make a push on your reads, not sure what i feel about your responses but i'll unvote till i decide.