Lucas, Roy, Ryu (1.0.8) Community Patch Notes

[LordWilliam1234]

I'll send you pre-patch footage of all my findings then. Same settings as last time.

That shouldn't be necessary. Just tell me the moves, I should already have footage for it.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

And to think I had already dropped the discussion. "But wait! It's sanic we're talking about! Let's make some snarky comment about this, 'cause, well, it's sanic, duh"

*World's smallest violin*

Sincerely,
All low tiers

Oh, look, big letters, should make my clever joke a better argument, right?

So, just because there are low tiers I'm not allowed to voice my opinion on my main being nerfed? It's like saying you shouldn't feel in the dumps because one of your parents is sick while appending "Sincerely, all orphans". Go figure.

To be honest, I'm okay with the nerf because, eventually, I'll have to deal with it. It will pass. What won't ever pass is the BS we Sonic mains have to deal with which is all of this hate. I'm sure a LOT of people who complained about "sanic op, plz nerf" before 1.0.6 didn't even try to learn something about Spindash mechanics. "I don't know how to shield a Spin attack and I'm too stoopid to try to learn the MU. plz nerf".

And then the 1.0.6 made the full charge SD go from 10% to 7%, while uncharged it's 6%. One. ****ing. Percent. What's the point in charging it now? Charging makes it faster but predictable. Also, when fully charged, you won't be able to shield cancel it anymore. The % nerf doesn't help with the move's already low priority either. A ****ing nerf due to public uproar that pretty much killed one of the move's mechanics/uses.

Upsmash is a pretty insignificant nerf tbh while gaining a safer d-air. I personally find you sounding pretty spoiled.

Spoiled? Nah, it's not like I wouldn't know what would happen if they decided to nerf all of my main's kill options, right?

And sonic's frame data is more than completely luxurious.

Are these boohoohoo nerfs all of a sudden gonna stop Sonic from appearing in Top 8?

I don't know and you don't know either, so what's the point of mentioning it? All I know is that Sonic's been losing a lot of early/solid kill moves and should be debatable if he's even good enough to be considered a top tier anymore.

And dude Sonic has the best ground speed and Rank 6 in aerial speed and straight up middle weight with decent recovery and has ridiculous damage output and great punish game and super hard to deal with neutral. There were no trade offs in terms of design. Sonic pretty much had it all except needles and Luma. Sonic never deserved a kill throw and lowering Sonic's kill power even more is undeniably justified. I'm actually more surprised Sonic's KO power wasn't hit harder.

Wow, so Sonic should be able to rack up damage nicely and take forever to kill? I'd agree if he had Sheik-tier frame data, which he doesn't.

You just want Brawl Sonic back.

TL;DR Stop embarrassing yourself. You are spoiled. Sonic is a solid top character.

Yeah, that's why he has soooo many good MUs against the top/high tiers, right? He's so gud, man. OP. plz nerf

Look, I can underline text too. You're a hater. Sonic struggles against the tops but has some easy MUs against the lower tiers (which means that we should nerf Sonic instead of buffing the low tiers, according to most of you guys).

 

[Eureka]

Look, I can underline text too. You're a hater. Sonic struggles against the tops but has some easy MUs against the lower tiers (which means that we should nerf Sonic instead of buffing the low tiers, according to most of you guys).

He's not really being a hater, being a hater would be if he was whining about the fact that Sonic is fast and saying he's an awful character you should feel bad for playing. Now let's be real here, sonic still has plenty of kill options, forward smash and bair to name a few, and up smash is still very strong. Not to mention sonic has an excellent edge guarding game and racks up damage quickly and efficiently. You can say know the matchup, but knowing the matchup and executing on that in a fight are two different things. Also any decent player who knows you know the matchup can play around that. Also no one has said at any point in time that they want Brawl Sonic back or that Sonic should have no kill options, and really this nerf is very minor. This is not a big deal, and take care you don't slide off the slippery slope. Let's move on from this argument now please.

 

[LordWilliam1234]

On Game & Watch's b-air:

Landing lag reduced by 5 frames: 24 -> 19.

...still not very good but it was improved nonetheless.

Side note they still haven't fixed Game & Watch's (albeit extremely situational) infinite.

 

[Steeler]

Not gonna lie, despite this patch giving me a fair/throws/jab buff

still kinda salty they nerfed zard nair in 1.06

 

[LRodC]

Nah, his weight defined his character since Melee. That'd be like Jigglypuff mains asking for a weight increase. Unlike Melee Mewtwo, This Mewtwo has more competently designed hitboxes, a reflector that works, even better recovery and his low weight is far better suited to a game that doesn't have Waveshine > Usmash from Fox.



I'll send you pre-patch footage of all my findings then. Same settings as last time.

I also agree that Mewtwo's weight is definitely a characteristic of him and shouldn't be changed heavily. He should still be lightweight. I do think 72 might be a little too much though. I think 78-79 around Rosalina level would be perfectly fine. If they did happen to buff it to around there and fix some other weird hitbox stuff, I think Mewtwo would be pretty much good to go.

Also, can somebody test out Zelda's forward tilt and see if it still has trouble whiffing up close for certain characters? It was mostly the very thin ones like Zero Suit Samus or Wii Fit Trainer. It seems to still have the issue for me.

 

[Sonic Orochi]

He's not really being a hater, being a hater would be if he was whining about the fact that Sonic is fast and saying he's an awful character you should feel bad for playing. Now let's be real here, sonic still has plenty of kill options, forward smash and bair to name a few, and up smash is still very strong. Not to mention sonic has an excellent edge guarding game and racks up damage quickly and efficiently. You can say know the matchup, but knowing the matchup and executing on that in a fight are two different things. Also any decent player who knows you know the matchup can play around that. Also no one has said at any point in time that they want Brawl Sonic back or that Sonic should have no kill options, and really this nerf is very minor. This is not a big deal, and take care you don't slide off the slippery slope. Let's move on from this argument now please.

Oh, so that's the true and only definition of being a hater! Thanks.

Like I said, I'm okay with the nerf (in the long run). It's just that I know we're not going to stop having to deal with BS when it comes to Sonic tweaks.

FSmash, okay. Bair? Decent, but too laggy. They gave our Bair to ZSS and, to be honest, I'd rather have it back (yes, even if it meant a lower KO power).

I know that knowing a MU and executing are different things, but what do people end up doing: training in order to git gud or yelling "nerf plz" every now and then? Exactly.

Now let's move on from this argument because I want my post to be the last, please.

 

[Eureka]

Oh, so that's the true and only definition of being a hater! Thanks.

Well I was just giving an example, there are many like it, but that was mine.

Now let's move on from this argument because I want my post to be the last, please.

What!? Never, I will fight to the death for the last post! Nah, just kidding. As I recall though, wasn't Brawl Sonic just getting a stock lead and timing people out and having an absurdly annoying taunt?

 

[Sonic Orochi]

Well I was just giving an example, there are many like it, but that was mine.

What!? Never, I will fight to the death for the last post! Nah, just kidding. As I recall though, wasn't Brawl Sonic just getting a stock lead and timing people out and having an absurdly annoying taunt?

More like getting to kill percent on his opponent's first stock while Sonic was at kill percent of his second/third stock.

Mind you that Sonic's kill percents were like 150+. It was sad.

And his taunt was top tier. We got nerfed pretty hard in that department.

But hey, it's cool. You seem like a reasonable person, I'm fine with giving you the last post. Oops.

edit: confusing phrasing

 

[⑨ball]

-brawl sonic-

Never forget.

 

[Antunee]

I should probably opt to combine things so it's all just one big 1.04 -> 1.08 change log (noting which patch they came in).
But I have an incredibly bizarre and soul destroying phobia of patch note OP editing right now, need a bit of a break; I'm in university exam period at the moment and I haven't even really played since this patch (briefly last night only as a STEAM RELEASE)

Spoiler: Does this help you any?

Mario
-----
(1.06)
Fsmash (all)
    hitbox 0
        y 0.0 -> 0.7
        made irreversible

Luigi
-----
NO CHANGES

Peach
-----
(1.08)
Jab2
    hitbox 1
        size 2.4 -> 3.0
    hitbox 2
        size 2.4 -> 4.0

Bowser
------
(1.08)
Utilt
    unknown events frame 11 -> 10
    hitbox 2 removed
    all hitboxes
        frame 12 -> 11
        damage 10 -> 9
        x 7.4 -> 6.9
    animation speed 1.5x for frames 17-52 (11 frames faster?)

Yoshi
-----
(1.06)
Ftilt (up/down)
    hitboxes appear on frame 6 -> 5 (matches normal ftilt)
Fsmash
    hitbox 0
        size 3.1 -> 2.9
        made irreversible

Rosalina
--------
(1.08)
Rapid Jab End
    hitbox
        kbg 170 -> 150

Bowser Jr.
----------
(1.06)
Fsmash
    second hitbox added to initial repeating hit
        identical, except positioned differently and angle 361 rather than 93
    initial hitboxes
        y 18 -> 17 (angled down only)
    final hitbox
        size 6 -> 7
        y 10 -> 8 (13 -> 11 for angled up)
        x 20 -> 18 (17 for angled down)

Wario
-----
(1.08)
Unknown parameters set to 63 and 15 on many of his hitboxes
Jab1
    hitbox 0
        angle 65 -> 55
        bkb 35 -> 45
    hitbox 1
        angle 75 -> 72
        kbg 50 -> 40
        bkb 28 -> 38
Jab2
    third hitbox added, positions adjusted
    all hitboxes
        size 5.5/3.5 -> 5.8/3.8/3.3

Mr. Game & Watch
----------------
(1.06)
Minor unknown tweaks
Ftilt
    delayed hitboxes
        angle 100 -> 115
        bkb 20 -> 30
Chef
    Pan hitbox
        size 5.76 -> 6.76
        y 6.4 -> 7.4
XXL Chef
    Pan hitbox
        y 6.4 -> 7.4
Short-Order Chef
    Pan hitbox
        y 6.4 -> 7.4
(1.08)
Dtilt
    hitbox 0 (6%)
        kbg 120 -> 125
        bkb 10 -> 40
    hitbox 1 (1%)
        kbg 100 -> 120
        bkb 60 -> 70
        size 9.0 -> 10.5
        unknown param 11.0 -> 9.0

Donkey Kong
-----------
(1.06)
Jab 1
    hitboxes 0 and 1 IDs swapped
    new hitbox 1
        angle 361 -> 110
        kbg 100 -> 25
        bkb 0 -> 35
F-smash
    all hitboxes
        made irreversible
A couple 1.13x multipliers on unknown actions (nothing with a hitbox)
Cargo fthrow
(1.08)
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 8 -> 10
Cargo bthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 8 -> 12
        angle 55 -> 72
        bkb 80 -> 70
Cargo uthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 7 -> 10
Cargo dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 6 -> 7
        angle 45 -> 48
        kbg 38 -> 80
        bkb 65 -> 50
    unknown event moved from frame 18 -> 17
        momentum boost added

Diddy Kong
----------
(1.06)
Fsmash
    second hit, hitbox 0
        angle 40 -> 46
Usmash
    initial hitbox 0
        angle 120 -> 110
        wkb 130 -> 120
    initial hitboxes 1/2/3
        angle 110 -> 95
    initial hitbox 3
        wkb 80 -> 70
    middle hitbox 0
        angle 115 -> 105
    middle hitboxes 1/2
        angle 110 -> 95
Fair
    initial hitboxes
        damage 12 -> 10
    delayed hitboxes
        damage 10 -> 8
Uair
    all hitboxes
        damage 8 -> 6
Uthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 6 -> 4 (total damage (10 -> 8)
Dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 7 -> 6
        kbg 40 -> 50
Monkey Flip
    kick hitbox
        decays from damage 14/12 -> 12/10 on frame 11
    throw hitbox
        damage 5 -> 3
    additional hitbox added to throw
Flying Monkey Flip
    throw hitbox
        damage 5 -> 3
    additional hitbox added to throw
(1.08)
Jab1
    all hitboxes
        damage 1.5 -> 1.2
    transition to jab2
        frame 10 -> 8
Jab2
    all hitboxes
        damage 1.5 -> 1.2
    transition to jab3
        frame 9 -> 8
Jab3
    all hitboxes
        wkb 30 -> 25
        size 4.0/3.5/3.0 -> 4.2/3.7/3.2
    transition to rapid jab loop
        frame 22 -> 15
Rapid Jab Loop
    a variety of small hitboxes replaced with one big one
    new hitboxes
        damage 0.6 -> 0.5
        angle 70/90 -> 60
        wkb 6 -> 4
        size 3.0 -> 6.7
        SDI 1.3 -> 0.7
        unknown param (default) -> 6.8
        unknown param (default) -> 6.0
Rapid Jab End
    animation speed 2.0x for frames 0-8 (4 frames faster)
    hitbox
        kbg 180 -> 177
        bkb 30 -> 45
        size 5.0 -> 7.2
        y 5.5 -> 6.8
        unknown param 5.5 -> 6.8
        unknown param 5.5 -> 6.0
Dtilt
    new 3rd hitbox (centered on clap?) identical to other two
    all hitboxes
        damage 6.0 -> 5.5
Uair
    all hitboxes
        begin frame 3 -> 4
        kbg 99 -> 89
        bkb 65 -> 64
    landing lag window
        3-15 -> 0-27
Uthrow
    hitbox (launching component of throw)
        damage 4 -> 1 (total 8 -> 5)
        bkb 100 -> 120
        bkb 30 -> 50
Dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 6.0 -> 7.0
        angle 105 -> 106
        kbg 50 -> 59

Link
----
(1.06)
Dash Attack
    hitboxes appear on frame 21 -> 20
    hitbox 2
        damage 13 -> 12
        kbg 78 -> 72
Dtilt
    hitboxes completely remade
    went from having 4 hitboxes to 2 on changed bones--one aerial only, one irreversible
    all hitboxes
        angle 80/80/280/280 -> 280/80
        kbg 50 -> 62/30
        bkb 90 -> 0/90
Fsmash 1
    hitbox 2 (sourspot)
        bone 16 -> 0
        size 3.4 -> 3.2
        x 0 -> 6
        y 0 -> 8.5
        z 1 -> 0
        made irreversible
Fsmash 2
    hitbox 2/3
        made irreversible
Usmash
    2nd round of hitboxes appear frame 26 -> 25
Pummel
    hitbox
        x 0 -> 2
        y 0 -> 1.5
        z 0 -> -1
Ground Spin Attack
    initial hitboxes 0/1
        damage 12 -> 14
    all hitbox 2s
        z 6.6 -> 7.0
    new stage of hitboxes on frame 6 that do 12/12/7 damage
    third stage of hitboxes now on frame 11, not 9
Ground Shocking Spin Attack
    all hitbox 2s
        z 6.6 -> 7.0
(1.08)
Jab 1
    massive adjustments; hitbox timings, sizes, positions, angles, and knockback entirely reworked with separate ground/aerial target hitboxes
Dtilt
    animation speed 1.33x for frames 0-12 (2 frames faster?)
    hitboxes
        damage 12 -> 11
        x 12.8/15.4 -> 14.1/16.6
Grab
    unknown param 28 -> 32
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 30-70 instead of 1.33x for frames 30-54 (3 frames faster?)
Dash Grab
    unknown param 28 -> 32
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 32-71 (8 frames faster?)
Pivot Grab
    unknown param 37 -> 41
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 33-72 (8 frames faster?)
Fthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        angle 55 -> 50
Dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 4 -> 3
        angle 110 -> 83
        kbg 90 -> 85
Spin Attack
    all stage 1 (of 4) hitboxes
        kbg 84 -> 85
    all stage 2 (of 4) hitboxes
        kbg 80 -> 85
    all stage 3 (of 4) hitboxes
        kbg 80 -> 82
Shocking Spin Attack
    all stage 2 (of 3) hitboxes
        kbg 80 -> 82

Zelda
-----
(1.06)
Fsmash
    looping hitbox 0
        angle 60 -> 25
        wkb 60 -> 40
        size 4.3 -> 4.2
        x 10.0 -> 8.0
    looping hitbox 1
        angle 160 -> 165
        wkb 80 -> 50
        size 5.0 -> 4.5
    final hitbox 0
        size 6.7 -> 5.5
        x 16.0 -> 9.5
    final hitbox 1
        size 5.7 -> 6.0
        x 11.0 -> 16.0
Din's Fire/Flare/Blaze
    sweetspot hitbox
        size 2.7 -> 2.1
Phantom Slash (uncharged swipe)
    animation speed 0.5x for frames 60-70 (10 frames slower)
Phantom Slash (partially charged overhead)
    animation speed 0.5x for frames 90-100 (10 frames slower)
Phantom Slash (partially charged uppercut)
    animation speed 0.5x for frames 135-145 (10 frames slower)
(1.08)
Usmash
    all looping hitboxes
        increased in size by 0.5
        wkb 40/50/60/60 -> all 40
        SDI 1.0 -> 0.5
    final hitboxes
        kbg 190 -> 214
Nair
    hitbox 0 and 1 IDs and damage (1.0/2.0) swapped

Sheik
-----
(1.06)
Dtilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 7.5 -> 5.0
        kbg 80 -> 100
        bkb 35 -> 37
Bair
    initial hitboxes 0/1
        damage 10 -> 7
    initial hitbox 2
        damage 11 -> 8

Ganondorf
---------
(1.06)
Jab
    hitbox 0
        damage 6 -> 7
        kbg 105 -> 90
        bkb 40 -> 38
    hitbox 1
        damage 8 -> 10
        kbg 105 -> 90
Fthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.5
Bthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.5
Uthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.6

Toon Link
---------
(1.06)
Dsmash
    all hitboxes
        trip 0.15 -> 0.0
        made irreversible
    first hit, hitbox 0 (aerial only)
        x 16.0 -> 15.5
    first hit, hitbox 1 (ground only)
        wkb 140 -> 60
        y 2.0 -> 2.6
        x 16.0 -> 9.5
    hitbox 2 added to first hit
        angle 168
        kbg 100
        wkb 120
        ground only
        irreversible
    second hit, hitbox 0
        kbg 130 -> 127
        size 4.0 -> 4.3
        y 3.0 -> 4.5
    hitbox 1 added to second hit
        size 5.0
(1.08)
Jab1
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
Jab2
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
    kbg 37 -> 34
    bkb 16 -> 25
Jab3
    all hitboxes
        size 3.5 -> 4.2
    hitbox 0
        z 5.0 -> 4.5

Samus
-----
(1.06)
Ftilt (all)
    hitbox 1 and 2 IDs swapped
    hitbox 0
        bone 7 -> 6 (6 -> 5 for straight-angled)
        damage 7 -> 6
        kbg 90 -> 70
        bkb 15 -> 10
        size 3.0 -> 1.8
        z 0 -> -1.5 (1.8 for up-angled)
    new hitbox 1
        kbg 90 -> 70
        bkb 15 -> 10
    new hitbox 2
        kbg 90 -> 100
        bkb 15 -> 30
        z 6.0 -> -0.6
    hitbox 3
        bone 8 -> 9
        damage 6 -> 9  (5 -> 8 for straight-angled)
        kbg 90 -> 100
        bkb 15 -> 30
        size 2.5 -> 3.0
        z 0 -> 6
        y 0 -> -0.5
(1.08)
Usmash
    all hitboxes increased in size by 0.5
    some hitboxes split in two, or given angle+wkb adjustments
    final hitbox
        kbg 135 -> 150
        size 7.0/3.5 -> 7.3/4.0

Zero Suit Samus
---------------
NO CHANGES

Pit
---
NO CHANGES

Palutena
--------
(1.08)
Utilt
    all hitboxes
        bone 1000 -> 0
        size and positions adjusted heavily
    looping hitboxes
        damage 1.0 -> 1.2

Marth
-----
(1.06)
Dancing Blade Ground Third Hit (Forward)
    all hitboxes
        angle 60/70/35 -> 50/55/40
        bkb 30 -> 40
(1.08)
Jab1
    all hitboxes
        damage 4/6 -> 3/5
        angle 361 -> 78/65/90
        kbg 50/70 -> 30
        bkb 20/30 -> 55
        hitlag 1.0 -> 0.7
    transition to jab2
        frame 20 -> 17
Jab2
    all hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 45
        kbg 50/70 -> 75
        bkb 20/30 -> 62
Utilt
    initial hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 100 (already 100 on hitboxes 0,3)
        bkb 50 -> 65
    delayed hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 100 (already 100 on hitboxes 0,3)
        bkb 40 -> 52
Dolphin Slash
    initial hitboxes
        kbg 68 -> 74
        hitlag 0.5 -> 0.7
Crescent Slash
    initial hitboxes
        hitlag 0.5 -> 0.7

Ike
---
(1.06)
Counter
    hitbox
        kbg 74 -> 100
(1.08)
Jab1
    transition to jab2
        frame 13 -> 10
Jab2
    new hitbox added as hitbox 1; old hitbox 1 changed to hitbox 2
    hitbox 0
        y 8.0 -> 7.5
    new hitbox 1
        angle 80 (others are 65)
        kbg 80 (others are 80/100)
        wbg 25 (others are 40/50)
        size 3.5
Jab3
    hitboxes appear on frame 7 -> 6 (1 frame faster)
    hitbox 3
        size 2.5 -> 3.2
    hitbox duration 3 -> 4 frames
Dash Attack
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 0-17 (3 frames faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 18 -> 17 (4 frames faster total?)
    hitbox 0
        damage 10 -> 14
        angle 55 -> 52
        kbg 70 -> 78
        size 6.0 -> 6.3
        hitlag 1.0 -> 1.2
    hitbox 1
        damage 8 -> 11
        angle 55 -> 52
        kbg 70 -> 78
    hitbox 2
        damage 5 -> 9

Ftilt (all)
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 0-14 (2 frames faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 15 -> 14 (3 frames faster total?)
    all 3 old hitboxes replaced with 1 new one
    new hitbox
        bone 1000 -> 1
        damage 14/14/12 -> 12.5
Utilt
    initial hitbox
        y 12.0 -> 13.0
    delayed hitbox
        y 10.5 -> 12.0
        lasts until frame 19 -> 22 (duration 5 -> 8 frames)
Fair
    hitboxes appear on frame 16 -> 14 (2 frames faster)
    hitbox 0
        y 9.0 -> 10.5
    hitbox 1
        y 6.2 -> 6.75
    hitbox 2
        y 4.0 -> 3.0
Some 1.25x animation speed added to a couple unknown minor actions (non-attacks)

Robin
-----
(1.06)
Jab1
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
        hitbox 0
            angle 361 -> 70
            kbg 30 -> 25
            bkb 30 -> 35
        hitbox 1
            angle 60 -> 88
            kbg 30 -> 25
            bkb 30 -> 35
        hitbox 2
            angle 75 -> 90
            kbg 30 -> 25
            bkb 30 -> 35
Jab2
    hitbox 0
        angle 92 -> 98
        kbg 24 -> 20
        bkb 50 -> 30
    hitbox 1
        angle 80 -> 88
        kbg 24 -> 20
        bkb 50 -> 30
    hitbox 2
        angle 70 -> 80
        bkb 50 -> 35
Rapid Jab Loop
    hits on frames 3/8/13/18/23/28 -> 4/8/12/16/20/24/28
    hitbox
        kbg 100 -> 30
        wkb 16 -> 0
        bkb 0 -> 14
        SDI 0.7 -> 0.8
Rapid Jab Final Hit
    animation speed 2.0x for frames 1-7 (3 frames faster)
    hitbox
        damage 3 -> 2
        kbg 160 -> 186
        x 13 -> 15
Ftilt
    hitbox
        size 5 -> 4
        y 10.0 -> 9.5
        x 16.5 -> 16.0
        made irreversible

Kirby
-----
(1.06)
Fsmash (angled up)
    delayed hitbox
        damage 13 -> 12
Usmash
    initial hitboxes 0/1
        kbg 96 -> 102
        bkb 34 -> 33
Dsmash
    all hitboxes
        angle 76 -> 69
        kbg 102 -> 108
Dthrow
    loop hitbox
        damage 0.4 -> 0.8 (total throw damage 6.6 -> 10.2)
Ground Hammer Flip/Bash
    hitbox 0
        size 4.4 -> 5.4
        y 4.0 -> 4.5
    hitbox 1
        size 2.5 -> 3.5
        y 4.0 -> 4.5
Ground Hammer Flip Max Charge
    hitbox 0
        size 4.8 -> 5.8
        y 4.0 -> 4.2
    hitbox 1
        size 2.9 -> 3.9
        y 4.0 -> 4.2
Ground Giant Hammer
    all hitboxes
        y 4.0 -> 4.5
Aerial Hammer Flip/Bash
    all hitboxes
        size 4.2/2.0 -> 5.2/3.0
        y 4.0 -> 4.3
Aerial Hammer Flip Max Charge
    hitbox 0
        size 4.4 -> 5.4
    hitbox 1
        size 2.5 -> 3.5
Aerial Giant Hammer
    all hitboxes
        y 4.0 -> 4.3

King Dedede
-----------
NO CHANGES

Meta Knight
-----------
(1.06)
Fthrow
    New hitbox added alongside existing one (same values)
(1.08)
Rapid Jab Loop
    all hitboxes
        divided into 2 for better coverage (positions adjusted)
        damage 1.0 -> 1.2
        kbg 40 -> 30
        size 5.5 -> 5.8/6.8 pairs
        SDI 1.0 -> 0.6
Rapid Jab End
    hitbox
        size 5.7 -> 8.0
        y 5.5 -> 7.0
        x 18.0 -> 20.0
Ftilt3
    all hitboxes
        damage 3 -> 4
        angle 65 -> 361
        kbg 110 -> 107

Little Mac
----------
(1.06)
Ftilt
    first hit, hitbox 2
        z -3.8 -> -5.8
        y 0 -> 0.5
Fsmash (straight)
    pre-hit windbox
        x 14 -> 11
Dsmash
    second hit, hitbox 1
        bone 22 -> 0
        size 3.0 -> 2.8
        y 0 -> 7.5
        x 0 -> 3.0
Aerial KO Punch (all)
    all hitboxes
        duraction 4 -> 3 frames
Jolt Haymaker
    all hitboxes
        kbg 95 -> 98
        bkb 25 -> 33
Grounding Blow
    all delayed hitboxes (non-spike)
        kbg 95 -> 98
        bkb 25 -> 33

Fox
---
NO CHANGES

Falco
-----
(1.06)
Usmash
    initial hitbox 0/1
        angle 140 -> 110
        kbg 20 -> 25
        bkb 30 -> 60
        can now hit grounded opponents
    initial hitbox 2
        can now hit aerial opponents
(1.08)
Unknown parameters set to 63 and 15 on many of his hitboxes
Jab1
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
    all hitboxes
        bkb 30 -> 35
    hitbox 0 (new)
        angle 80 -> 68
        size 2.0 -> 2.5
        z 0.0 -> -0.5
    hitbox 1
        angle 80 -> 77
        size 3.0 -> 3.2
Jab2
    hitbox 2
        angle 50 -> 45
        size 2.0 -> 5.0
        z 0.0 -> -0.5
    transition to jab3
        frame 10 -> 9
Rapid Jab Loop
    hitbox 0
        size 2.0 -> 2.7
    hitbox 1
        size 3.0 -> 3.2
Usmash
    ID and GID tweaks to hitboxes
    final hitboxes last frames 13-20 -> 12-21
Nair
    basically a different move; same timings, but all 16 of its hitboxes have been altered
        generally wkb increased and most angles set to 367 and sizes significantly increases
Fair
    animation speed 1.33x for frames 0-37 (9 frames faster total? hits 2 frames faster?)
    looping hitboxes
        refresh time 6 -> 4 (total looping hits 3 -> 5, or 7 -> 9 damage total)
Fair Landing
    hitbox
        damage 5 -> 3
        bkb 30 -> 50
Uair
    animation speed 1.5x for frames 0-8 (2 frames faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 10 -> 8 (4 frames faster total)
    all hitboxes
        damage 11 -> 10
        angle 68/68/80 -> 65/75/85
        kbg 100/100/20 -> 90/90/90
        bkb 27/27/30 -> 35/35/35
    hitbox 0
        size 4.8 -> 5.0
Dair
    initial hitbox bifurcated; hits grounded targets at angle 80
    sourspot replaces on frame 19 -> 20 (sweetspot duration 3 -> 4)
    sourspot hitbox
        size 5.0 -> 5.3

Pikachu
-------
NO CHANGES

Charizard
---------
(1.06)
Dtilt
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 1-11 (2 frames faster; hits on frame 11 -> 9)
Nair
    hitboxes appear on frame 8 -> 9
    hitbox 0 (10% fire)
        size 4.0 -> 3.5
    hitbox 1 (7%)
        size 4.0 -> 3.0
    hitbox 2 (7%)
        size 4.0 -> 1.5
    hitbox 3 (7%)
        size 4.0 -> 3.5
    hitbox 4 added (7%, size 4.0)
    hitboxes removed on frame 28 -> 26 (total duration 20 -> 17 frames)
Fair
    all initial hitboxes (11%)
        kbg 100 -> 92
        bkb 45 -> 35
    delayed hitbox (12%)
        kbg 80 -> 98
        bkb 25 -> 35
Bair
    hitbox 0 (15% fire)
        size 4.0 -> 4.5
        x 0 -> -1
    hitbox 1
        z -1.3 -> -1.2
        x 0.0 -> 0.5
    hitbox 3
        y 0.0 -> 0.5
        x 0.0 -> 1.0
Uthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 2 -> 3
    hitbox
        damage 6 -> 8 (total damage 8 -> 11)
(1.08)
Jab1
    hitbox 0
        wkb 15 -> 26
    hitbox 1 + 2
        wkb 10 -> 22
    transition to jab2
        frame 10 -> 9
Jab2
    transition to jab3
        frame 10 -> 9
Jab3
    all hitboxes
        kbg 110 -> 130
Fair
    hitbox 0
        size 4.3 -> 4.6
        x 7.0 -> 7.5
    delayed hitbox 0
        kbg 98 -> 97
        size 4.5 -> 4.8
        z 7.0 -> 7.5
    hitboxes removed on frame 12-> 13 (total duration 4 -> 5)
Uthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        angle 60 -> 70
        kbg 160 -> 220
Dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        angle 361 -> 70
        kbg 300 -> 130
        bkb 40 -> 70

Lucario
-------
(1.08)
Jab1
    hitbox 0
        angle 60 -> 80
        kbg 30 -> 10
        bkb 45 -> 33
    hitbox 1
        kgb 30 -> 10
        bkb 45 -> 33
    delayed hitbox 0
        angle 90 -> 80
        kbg 30 -> 10
        bkb 50 -> 32
Jab2
    hitbox 0
        angle 72 -> 60
        kbg 30 -> 20
        bkb 50 -> 38
    hitbox 1
        kgb 30 -> 20
        bkb 50 -> 32
    hitbox 2
        kgb 30 -> 20

Jigglypuff
----------
NO CHANGES

Greninja
--------
(1.08)
Ftilt (all)
    all hitboxes
        damage 6.5 -> 7.3
        kbg 112 -> 110/90/70
        bkb 15 -> 20/30/40
    hitboxes 1 + 2 have z-pos adjusted
    hitbox 2 bone 3 -> 5
    animation speed 1.33x from frame 13-38 (7 frames faster?)

Duck Hunt
---------
(1.06)
Unknown element change (30 -> 32) for non-damaging hitboxes related to the can

R.O.B.
------
(1.06)
Uthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        kbg 72 -> 70
        bkb 70 -> 60

Ness
----
NO CHANGES

Captain Falcon
--------------
(1.06)
Fsmash downward
    all hitboxes
        angle 40 -> 38
        kbg 94 -> 84
(1.08)
F-smash (up)
    all hitboxes
        KBG 94 -> 95
F-smash (straight)
    all hitboxes
        KBG 94 -> 95
F-smash (down)
    all hitboxes
        KBG 84 -> 83
Uair
    initial hitbox 0
        damage 13 -> 11
        bkg 10 -> 16
    initial hitbox 1
        damage 12 -> 10
        bkg 10 -> 16
    late hitbox 0
        damage 12 -> 10
        bkg 8 -> 10
    late hitbox 1
        damage 10 -> 9
        bkg 8 -> 10

Villager
--------
(1.08)
Weird Facing Restriction Flag removed from Bair Projectile Hitboxes
Fthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        bkb 100 -> 102
Bthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        bkb 15 -> 18
Dthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        damage 4.5 -> 6.0
        kbg 105 -> 80

Olimar
------
(1.06)
Very slightly less kbg on 6 unknown attacks for all 5 pikmin
Very slight bkb increase on 3 of those

Wii Fit Trainer
---------------
(1.06)
Fsmash
    all hitboxes
        made irreversible
Usmash
    initial setup hit, all hitboxes
        kbg 105 -> 100
        bkb 30 -> 31

Dr. Mario
---------
(1.06)
Usmash
    all hitboxes
        angle 110 -> 130
        kbg 105 -> 108
Fair
    all middle hitboxes
        damage 14 -> 15
        duration 3 -> 4 frames (final hitbox duration shorted 1 frame to match)

Dark Pit
--------
NO CHANGES

Lucina
------
(1.06)
Ftilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 8.075 -> 8.5
Dtilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 8.075 -> 8.5
Fsmash
    all hitboxes
        damage 14.725 -> 15.0
Dsmash
    second hit, all hitboxes
        damage 13.775 -> 14.0
Ground Shield Breaker Uncharged
    all hitboxes
        damage 8.075 -> 8.5
Ground Shield Breaker Charged
    all hitboxes
        damage 21.85 -> 23
Dancing Blade Ground Third Hit (Forward)
    all hitboxes
        angle 60/70/35 -> 50/55/40
        bkb 30 -> 40
(1.08)
Jab1
    all hitboxes
        damage 4.75 -> 3.325
        angle 361 -> 78/65/90
        kbg 50 -> 30
        bkb 20 -> 55
        hitlag 1.0 -> 0.7
    transition to jab2
        frame 20 -> 18
Jab2
    all hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 45
        kbg 60 -> 75
        bkb 25 -> 62
        hitlag 1.0 -> 0.7
        unknown param 0 -> 1
Ftilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 9.975 -> 10.925
Utilt
    initial hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 100 (already 100 on hitboxes 0,3)
        bkb 50 -> 65
    delayed hitboxes
        angle 361 -> 100 (already 100 on hitboxes 0,3)
        bkb 40 -> 52
Dolphin Slash
    initial hitboxes
        kbg 68 -> 74
        hitlag 0.5 -> 0.7
Crescent Slash
    initial hitboxes
        hitlag 0.5 -> 0.7

Shulk
-----
NO CHANGES

Pac-Man
-------
(1.06)
Ftilt
    up-angled and down-angled now hit on frame 4 -> 5 (matches normal ftilt)

Mega Man
--------
NO CHANGES

Sonic
-----
(1.06)
Bthrow
    throwbox 0 (launching component of throw)
        kbg 90 -> 79
Homing Attack/Stomp/Surprise Attack
    second hitbox added (identical values to existing)
Spin Dash ??? + both customs
    hitbox
        damage 6 -> 3
        kbg 73 -> 112
        bkb 70 -> 66
Spin Dash + Hammer Spin Dash ???
    hitbox
        kbg 46 -> 62
        bkb 70 -> 67
Burning Spin Dash ???
    hitbox
        damage 7 -> 9
        kbg 46 -> 62
        bkb 70 -> 67
Burning Spin Dash ???
    hitbox
        damage 10 -> 12
Burning Spin Dash ???
    hitbox
        damage 4 -> 6
(1.08)
Usmash
    final hitbox
        kbg 177 -> 165

Mewtwo
------
(1.08)
Usmash
    initial hitbox
        angle 95 -> 100
        size 6.2 -> 3.0
        x 0.0 -> -6.0

Mii Brawler
-----------
(1.06)
Fsmash (all)
    all hitboxes
        made irreversible
    hitbox 1
        z -1.6 -> -1.9
Fair
    all initial hitboxes
        damage 4 -> 3
    all second hitboxes
        damage 6 -> 5
Bair
    all hitboxes
        damage 12 -> 10
    hitbox 0
        size 5.7 -> 4.7
Piston Punch
    initial hitbox
        wkb 200 -> 150
    final hitbox
        kbg 190 -> 180
(1.08)
Onslaught Startup (ground and aerial)
    all windboxes
        unknown params changed
    windbox 1
        angle 50 -> 361
        kbg 100 -> 0
        wkb 80 -> 0
        element Hit -> Push

Mii Swordfighter
----------------
(1.06)
Dtilt
    all hitboxes
        damage 6 -> 8
        angle 60 -> 65
        kbg 50 -> 80
        bkb 90 -> 50
Nair
    all hitboxes
        damage 5 -> 8
        kbg 100 -> 68
        bkb 42 -> 48
Fair
    all final hit hitboxes
        angle 60 -> 50
        kbg 150 -> 130
Fthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.7
Bthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.7
Uthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.8
Dthrow
    all hitboxes
        hitlag 2.0 -> 1.8
Ground Hero's Spin
    initial hitbox 0
        damage 12 -> 14
    initial hitbox 1
        damage 13 -> 11
    all hitbox 2s
        y 8.6 -> 9.1
    new stage of hitboxes on frame 6 that do 12/11/7 damage
    third stage of hitboxes now on frame 11, not 9
(1.08)
Unknown parameters set to 63 and 15 on many of his hitboxes
Jab1
    animation speed 1.25x for frames 0-5 (1 frame faster)
    hitboxes appear on frame 7 -> 6 (2 frames faster total)
    hitbox 2 split into 2
    all hitboxes
        angle 85/361/361 -> 85/50/45/45
        kbg 37 -> 20
        bkb 16 -> 32
    transition to jab2
        frame 10 -> 9
Jab2
    hitboxes 0 and 1 IDs swapped
    hitbox 1
        swapped angle 100 -> 96
    hitbox 2 split into 2
    transition to jab3
        frame 10 -> 9
Jab3
    hitboxes 0 and 1 IDs swapped
    hitbox 2 split into 2
Dash Attack
    all hitboxes
        size 3.0/2.2 -> 4.0/3.0
Ftilt
    hitbox 1 split into 2
Nair
    animation speed 1.18x for frames 0-10 (1 frame faster?)
    hitboxes appear on frame 12 -> 11 (2 frames faster total)
Fair
    hitbox 2 (initial and middle)
        size 2.4 -> 3.5
    hitbox 2 (final)
        size 3.2 -> 3.5
Bair
    all hitboxes
        damage 12 -> 14
Dair Landing
    hitbox
        x 9.0 -> 10.5
Slash Launcher
    windbox 0
        x 5.0 -> 6.0

Mii Gunner
----------
NO CHANGES

 

[Kofu]

On Game & Watch's b-air:

Landing lag reduced by 5 frames: 24 -> 19.

...still not very good but it was improved nonetheless.

Side note they still haven't fixed Game & Watch's (albeit extremely situational) infinite.

Earlier you said it was three frames, is 5 the correct number? 5's a lot better but 19 frames of landing lag is still a lot (more than Marth FAir but it IS multihit. Hey, I'm not complaining too much, I'll take the buffs I can get (DTilt buff is cool).

What is this infinite you speak of? I'm aware of no infinite.

 

[RayNoire]

This Mewtwo has more competently designed hitboxes

...About that.

___________

Honestly I doubt the nair buff will make up for losing the Confusion platform trick in our worst matchups. So if Greninja's done using that meme, we could take it off their hands.

 

[MikamiLovesDeleting]

Pretty sure that x-6 is relative to Mewtwo... I'm assuming the default direction is right, so if that's the case it's a little more near / behind Mewtwo than before. And if you look to the left it would be x+6.

If the initial hitbox is much closer to Mewtwo, then does it mean that all subsequent hits connect better and opponents are less likely to be launched at an awkward angle?

Just trying to rationalize why they would nerf one of Mewtwo's few good moves

 

[SapphSabre777]

Quick question in regards to the CPU of the game. Prior to this patch, were they capable of B-reversing or wavebouncing? I had a few character CPU at Level 8 wavebounce their Neutral B at me just recently, and I don't recall them doing that in the past.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Just a little warning

It will be a matter of time before some tries to dig inside the data file

And ruin every drop of hype by finding something that leaks the 2 other emptys

 

[tpbot]

Dont know if this was said but I believe Zelda Bthrow got a buff, kills jiggs at 110 no rage, which I never remember her having until like 160 and useless percents. Given I play her a lot this is what I noticed but I have no way to test it besides videos on yt

 

[CannonStreak]

Say, have any characters not revealed officially yet been found in the latest patch yet? Just curious.

 

[LimitCrown]

Dont know if this was said but I believe Zelda Bthrow got a buff, kills jiggs at 110 no rage, which I never remember her having until like 160 and useless percents. Given I play her a lot this is what I noticed but I have no way to test it besides videos on yt

The knockback variables of Zelda's back throw haven't been altered by the two previous major updates according to the changelogs.

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Earlier you said it was three frames, is 5 the correct number?

I never mentioned G&W's b-air landing lag before this. 5 is the correct number.

What is this infinite you speak of? I'm aware of no infinite.

It requires a wall. Put Ike up against a wall, jump backwards into him, mash jab. G&W's jab hitbox extends behind him, and since Ike is against the wall and you're facing the other way, the rapid jab will constantly push you back INTO Ike instead of away. Keep holding A and they're stuck there, even if they try and DI.

It's also character specific but I don't remember all the characters it works or doesn't work on, just that Ike is the one I found it on.

So it'll probably only happen on the certain sections of Delfino and only on certain characters.

I haven't mentioned it up to this point as I was hoping Nintendo wouldn't patch it out. And they haven't yet. :3

 

[Vipermoon]

@Thinkaman Thank you for the 1.0.6 change log

I have some corrections for you:

1). Dr. Mario's Fair already did 15.68% in 1.0.4 (you have it going from 14 > 15). So what is it at now?

2). Also in the Lucina section you have the first one labled as Ftilt, that's actually F-air.

 

[SapphSabre777]

@ Shaya I don't know what your policy for this thread is with unfound changes, but the Kirby Boards have found the nerf to his sour spot F-Smash was not a change found in this patch, rather the 1.0.6 patch. Credit goes to @Bribery for noting this (albeit accidentally it seems) and @Thinkaman for supplying the data dump.

 

[LimitCrown]

@Thinkaman Thank you for the 1.0.6 change log

I have some corrections for you:

1). Dr. Mario's Fair already did 15.68% in 1.0.4 (you have it going from 14 > 15). So what is it at now?

The changelog is listing the base damage values of Dr. Mario's attacks. The base damage values of Dr. Mario's attacks are multiplied by 1.12, so it actually increased from 15.68% to 16.8%.

 

[Vipermoon]

The changelog is listing the base damage values of Dr. Mario's attacks. The base damage values of Dr. Mario's attacks are multiplied by 1.12, so it actually increased from 15.68% to 16.8%.

Well Mario's does 14%. I don't remember what damage they had Dr. Mario's Fair doing in the first version of the game, and 15.68% was a buff in 1.0.4. We can't use multipliers to get the new number.

 

[icraq]

Sorry to bug you @Thinkaman but I was curious if you had Luma changes as well. Also, is there any info on the 3 new Dlc characters? Active frames, intangibility frames, etc. Thank you so much for helping share knowledge!

 

[Schiffe]

Sorry to bug you @Thinkaman but I was curious if you had Luma changes as well. Also, is there any info on the 3 new Dlc characters? Active frames, intangibility frames, etc. Thank you so much for helping share knowledge!

I don't know as much as he does when it comes to frames or the code in general, but it's pretty hard to understand the current DLC characters information in the files. The main reason is that we don't have "past versions" of these characters, so we (well, on my side) have to guess what is what by testing in-game as well. Can take qutie a while if we were to do this 1 by 1.

Maybe Thinkaman found a way to know what is what in the files, but I wouldn't know until I tested every single animations/attacks..

 

[LimitCrown]

Well Mario's does 14%. I don't remember what damage they had Dr. Mario's Fair doing in the first version of the game, 15.68% was also a buff in 1.0.4. We can't use multipliers to get the new number.

What do you mean? The sweetspot of Dr. Mario's front air attack originally had a base damage value of 14%, which means that its actual damage output was 15.68%. The 1.0.4 update increased the attack's knockback growth, but it didn't increase that attack's damage output.

 

[Vipermoon]

What do you mean? The sweetspot of Dr. Mario's front air attack originally had a base damage value of 14%, which means that its actual damage output was 15.68%. The 1.0.4 update increased the attack's knockback growth, but it didn't increase that attack's damage output.

Nevermind, I thought it increased the damage ouput in .04. You're right. So that solves that. But the damage was raised in 1.0.6. What exact damage does it do now? I'm sure thinkaman has the exact number.

 

[LimitCrown]

Nevermind, I thought it increased the damage ouput in .04. You're right. So that solves that. But the damage was raised in 1.0.6. What exact damage does it do now? I'm sure thinkaman has the exact number.

The attack's actual damage input is currently 16.8%.

 

[Vipermoon]

The attack's actual damage input is currently 16.8%.

Okay. I thought you first that number by multipying it by 1.12 but that makes 17.56 so nvm

 

[BJN39]

Also, can somebody test out Zelda's forward tilt and see if it still has trouble whiffing up close for certain characters? It was mostly the very thin ones like Zero Suit Samus or Wii Fit Trainer. It seems to still have the issue for me.

Still whiffs as of 1.0.8.

 

[LimitCrown]

Okay. I thought you first that number by multipying it by 1.12 but that makes 17.56 so nvm

15 multiplied by 1.12 equals 16.8. The base damage value of the sweetspot of Dr. Mario's front air attack is 15%, so its actual damage output is that number multiplied by 1.12.

 

[CannonStreak]

Say, have any characters not revealed officially yet been found in the latest patch yet? Just curious.

I don't mean to be pushy, but is anyone going to answer this?

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

I don't mean to be pushy, but is anyone going to answer this?

There was nothing of interest that was data mined in 1.0.8.

 

[CannonStreak]

There was nothing of interest that was data mined in 1.0.8.

If you say so. Thanks.

 

[OtterCups]

Robin changes make things a bit awkward sometimes
Wondering what the thought was that made them make that change.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Robin changes make things a bit awkward sometimes
Wondering what the thought was that made them make that change.

Because this tech is fun, and it bothers me to think some rapid jabs didn't work.

 

[Schiffe]

I don't mean to be pushy, but is anyone going to answer this?

Nothing concerning any future DLC or feature is in the new patch. Only the basics; Lucas, Ryu, Roy, extra Stages, trophies, music and balance patch.

And from here, I highly doubt Sakurai is going to repeat his infamous mistake. Anything concerning future/upcoming content will probably no longer be in patches. Not after the Roy/Ryu Fiasco. I'll definitely keep an eye on the files of upcoming updates, but we're almost 100% sure we won't find anything more than will be announced.

 

[CannonStreak]

Nothing concerning any future DLC or feature is in the new patch. Only the basics; Lucas, Ryu, Roy, extra Stages, trophies, music and balance patch.

And from here, I highly doubt Sakurai is going to repeat his infamous mistake. Anything concerning future/upcoming content will probably no longer be in patches. Not after the Roy/Ryu Fiasco. I'll definitely keep an eye on the files of upcoming updates, but we're almost 100% sure we won't find anything more than will be announced.

Well, did you find anything else?

 

[Schiffe]

Well, did you find anything else?

Nah, nothing good is in there my friend. Maybe the currently unused K.K. Slider Mii Outfit English Text, but he'll come out anyways so there is nothing good from my (our) searches atm. I'll dig more in the text files later, see if there's anything of value.