Legends of History - Roy Videos & Critique Thread

Gawain

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Hi everyone! Here are some fights against Elexiao one of the best french player.
Can you give me some advice :)
Thanks

:4feroy: Game1 :4pacman:
:4feroy: Game2 :4greninja:
:4feroy: Game3 :4greninja:
Pretty nice set there, the PAC man setups and item play was actually pretty neat. My number one advice would be to add Nair hit 1 into your game plan. There were a couple of opportunities where you used the full nair and you could have gotten a lot more percent by extending into a combo. There were also a few punishes that could have been tweaked a little(if it won't kill it's generally better to use jab instead of ftilt since you can confirm into a kill or mixup edit:: I need to work on this too. It's hard not to instinctively ftilt)

The other thing is, and I say this to pretty much all Roys, you shouldn't really be using dthrow past 30 percent UNLESS you have programmed your opponent to airdodge after a throw OR you want to mixup for whatever reason. Fthrow is a LOT better. If they DI anything except hard away you get free follow-ups. If they DI away you get a tech chase. It's one of the best and most underappreciated throws in the game. Try to really nail your tech chases from fthrow and especially dtilt. If you score a hard knockdown where they land near a ledge, all you have to do is reaction tech chase with up tilt, fsmash or throw etc and you should be able to always get a follow-up (or kill at high percent).
 
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Ffamran

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More Roy on terminalkai; 17 matches, 5 on 3DS and 12 on Wii U, of Roy vs. Falco: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4p3Z4BeQaRk. Different players, so critique appropriately.

Edit: I forgot to mention that I didn't watch it when I made this post... So, I didn't know Roy was basically getting stomped on in this video.
 
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Mario & Sonic Guy

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This probably isn't anything new, but ever since I've purchased Roy today, I was rather surprised that a fully charged Flare Blade now delivers less knockback than the lower charge levels. The video below shows me getting 4748.3 ft. in Home-Run Contest with Roy, and the Flare Blade wasn't even at full power.

 

Croph

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Just throwing a heads up. But I'm going to start a series of highly in-depth and fun guides on Roy since I feel there is a lot of misconception and outright wrong information about our boy. Each video will be covering small, bite-sized topics about the character, starting with the basics and then moving on to more advanced setups, option selects and the like. So if you feel you are already familiar with Roy's basic strategies you may (or may not) want to give this one a pass. If you're just picking him up then I highly recommend giving it a watch. But here it is, Part 1: Basic Neutral Options.

I can't believe I missed this awesome guide! And I totally I love the sprite animations. Did you make the Captain Falcon sprite yourself? But yeah, the thing is there are a lot of mediocre guides or ones that have false information out there, which I'm always hesitant to put in the OP. So it's refreshing to see guides like the one you made.

I've been on the hunt for good quality guides, so if you guys know of any others feel free to post 'em. I'd be a great help.
 

Gawain

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I can't believe I missed this awesome guide! And I totally I love the sprite animations. Did you make the Captain Falcon sprite yourself? But yeah, the thing is there are a lot of mediocre guides or ones that have false information out there, which I'm always hesitant to put in the OP. So it's refreshing to see guides like the one you made.

I've been on the hunt for good quality guides, so if you guys know of any others feel free to post 'em. I'd be a great help.
Yeah, I actually hacked a ROM and recorded the gameplay for that part of the footage. I just replaced some character with the Falcon sprite I made. There will be more to come for sure.
 
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Ffamran

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Weird... Neath's sets weren't posted here? Strange since I saw them in this thread and thought: http://smashboards.com/threads/top-10-videos-of-each-character.415516/page-4#post-20656140... I think I saw Neath mentioned in the CCI thread too... Welp, Neath's Sonic and Roy vs. Yoyod's ZSS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8buyP6a2yU.

Neath's Roy vs. Homika's Rosalina & Luma (Winners Finals): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssPyOn7KGmE.

Neath's Roy vs. Homika's Rosalina & Luma (Grand Finals): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI8AhgfRwjs.
 
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ZaeemZ

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Did some Anther's Ladder with Roy. Second day on Anther's ladder. Won 2 - 0 but I want experts to, let's say judge my play.

Game 1 :4feroy: vs. :4palutena:: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kkm3krr8KEE

Game 2 :4feroy: vs. :4falcon: (less phenomenal) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PSQbcVYj7w
First off you don't grab enough roy's grab is amazing in my opinion, as u can see in the second video the falcon noticed that and just shielded all your approaches and almost won from those punishes. another issue is you use many smash attacks even when the enemy doesn't seem close though that might be a hard read sometimes not the best idea. also u seem to get very kill hungry and that could be the reason for smash spam. though dair is a nice spike the frame data of it is bad and i would suggest not to use it as much as you used it in the falcon match. maybe a bit more use of dancing blade would help build damage and the use of specials in general could help. But other than that you did a okay job as a roy, and this is my opinion a am not a pro player but have seen many roy's.
 

ZaeemZ

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMrMG6YhfMY

I'm pretty bitter about this one, but can anyone shed any light on what I could have done differently at the end to prevent that KO. Any other pointers are welcome too.
To avoid what ryu did u should have smash di toward him since he was moving forward always to get out of the combo. (not 100% sure if it will work since roy fast falls but it would work for other chars and i think it would work if u di up and toward him) Also i would say try not to get too hungry for kill because u used many forward smashes and that kind of put u in that position to begin with.
 

Noso

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To avoid what ryu did u should have smash di toward him since he was moving forward always to get out of the combo. (not 100% sure if it will work since roy fast falls but it would work for other chars and i think it would work if u di up and toward him) Also i would say try not to get too hungry for kill because u used many forward smashes and that kind of put u in that position to begin with.
I thought he was gonna roll behind me so that's why I threw those out and they were supposed to be ftilts but I have poor button pressure control and hit it harder than I should since I was tense., thank you for the advice btw, I'll try that next time if I get in that situation.
 

Neath

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Hey y'all !
I'd like to show you some of my tournament matches so you can give me some advices. I know that these replays are a bit old but there are the latest material that I have to show. besides, I don't think that my level got any higher since then so here they are :
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8buyP6a2yU
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssPyOn7KGmE
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cI8AhgfRwjs

Personally, I'd like to improve in technical section but I don't know what are the useful AT with Roy.
If you come up with any other suggestion, please let me know.
Thanks !

Edit : Didn't see Ffamran's post higher. I didn't know that those matches had already been posted here =D. Well, my request still stands on =p
 
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teluoborg

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Hi everyone! Here are some fights against Elexiao one of the best french player.
Can you give me some advice :)
Thanks

:4feroy: Game1 :4pacman:
:4feroy: Game2 :4greninja:
:4feroy: Game3 :4greninja:
Have you tried to stop being a sac ? :colorful:

No but more seriously most of the errors in the set were simple mistakes where you whiffed a move or tried to space with something unsafe, so stop throwing random moves at random times (I know it's hard for you) and this problem should go away on its own.

Few pointers :
-double jabs on shield don't work on true opponents, stop doing that
-almost no Bairs, FOR SHAME. Such a great move
-your timing for Fthrow to dash attack is off, you have to dash attack asap if you want it to connect, it'll hit with the sourspot but it's better than not hitting at all
-speaking of dash attack don't use it in the neutral
-gaffe au Usmash, c'est pas comme tous les autres persos à la con qui ont des hitbox pour cueillir les adversaires à tes pieds (tousse ROB tousse), faut l'utiliser uniquement si la personne est sur la lame
 

Koby_T

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Hey everyone! I'm brand new to the Chicago smash scene and competitive Roy. I got to play my first streamed match tonight and would really appreciate feedback on what I'm doing so I know how to focus my practice. Thanks! (Starts 4 minutes in)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qIvaZpZw1tc
 
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Thirtyfour

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Haven't found much use for the Dair buff outside of SH F-Air mix ups with 2nd jump on shield or using it like Falcon and Ganon's Dair in Melee. Vid related

I have some tournament footage from last week of Roy vs mainly Dark Pit and mid level Ryu, but I can't link it since I can't use twitch on this laptop.
 
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Croph

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Got some pretty aggressive stuff from Ryo



^ @7:40 That counter tho... scary stuff.
 

Lady Kuki

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Guuuuys get hyped! Finally managed to record a match of mine! There was another match I had, but I couldn't upload it due to it being too long :<

I already noticed a ton of mistakes in the vid: I didn't use Nair often enough, I was too passive, I jumped a lot, and I made a lot of wrong inputs. I do know how important Nair is; you see, I'm practicing spacing a little, which is why I'm using Fair a lot. If there's a way to space with Nair, let me know.

I also fought the guy's Bayonetta. Should've recorded that one. He was a bit difficult because I lack Bayonetta experience and because there was a bit of lag in the fight. I need to record more of my losses so that critiques may be more helpful.
 
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EnGarde

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Guuuuys get hyped! Finally managed to record a match of mine! There was another match I had, but I couldn't upload it due to it being too long :<

I already noticed a ton of mistakes in the vid: I didn't use Nair often enough, I was too passive, I jumped a lot, and I made a lot of wrong inputs. I do know how important Nair is; you see, I'm practicing spacing a little, which is why I'm using Fair a lot. If there's a way to space with Nair, let me know.

I also fought the guy's Bayonetta. Should've recorded that one. He was a bit difficult because I lack Bayonetta experience and because there was a bit of lag in the fight. I need to record more of my losses so that critiques may be more helpful.
Ok, let's go. One thing to note: Zelda doesn't have many options for keeping Roy out, so you definitely want to pressure her. Once you get in on her, it's harder for her to push you off, so giving her little breathing room, while still maintain safe spacing, is the goal here. Remember every MU is different, and this wouldn't apply to opponents like Mario, who has a very fast jab and nair.

Considering this, as you mentioned, you're playing way too passively here. From the start of the match, the Zelda immediately takes stage control from you, though doesn't apply effective pressure (probably because For Glory lol). After whiffing the grab, you respond by running away, which isn't the best solution, since you gave the Zelda stage control (idk if either of you were explicitly thinking about that; probably not because For Glory lol). But, that's something you should explicitly think about. Roy has great mobility, so you can use that to space, but you need room to move around in on the stage in order to do that effectively, so try to think about where you are on the stage relative to your opponent while playing.

You don't always execute your aerials properly, which resulted in them whiffing when it should've hit, or getting only weak hits of nair. Sometimes you executed the wrong aerial based on the Zelda's position relative to you (using nair instead of uair or bair when applicable). It's a good idea to learn the hitboxes of your moves on an intuitive level. I would recommend you take some time to try hitting the CPU in training mode with your aerials in certain situations, like the tip of short hop fast fall (shff) nair, or spacing the back hit of falling uair. Try stepping back and hitting the CPU with these moves, properly spaced, from a forwards short hop. Just take some time to get used to knowing where your hitboxes are, and where you need to execute the aerials in order to put hitboxes where you want. Also, keep in mind that sometimes you don't want to fast fall your aerials, specifically nair, so that you get both hitboxes to hit your opponent. Remember that many of Roy's aerials can set up for another aerial as well if they don't DI it, so keep combo strings in mind. Zelda doesn't really have many options to push you away once you start nairplaning her, so keep that in mind, but be careful of characters like Mario, who have fast nairs that can pop you (though, Mario's range is noticeably less, especially when comparing nairs, so well-spaced nairplaning is still possible, you just have be smart about it lol).

I would also recommend you start trying to keep track of what options your opponent has at their disposal based on what options they've already chosen. For example, at 2:18, the Zelda commits to an up+b, and as she descends, she's completely helpless. Your response was to run up and then shield, allowing her to land for free, even though she could not attack you, since she was still in helpless from using her up+b. There was no need to shield, because she couldn't hurt you, so you could easily have gotten her with your dash attack, running upsmash, or a pivot tilt/fsmash, for example.

Your opponent has limited options after doing certain actions. For example, when the opponent commits to a dash, they can no longer use jabs or tilts without pivoting first. When they are in the air, if they don't have a command grab, they usually can't do anything about your shield without landing first, though tomahawk grabs ARE a thing if you're just chilling in shield underneath them lol (also be careful of characters that have moves that deal heavy shield damage, like attempting to shield bowser bomb). If they are sitting in shield, they must wait 7 frames for their shield to drop to use most of their options except roll/spot dodge, grab, and jump cancelled options, though characters like ZSS, who has a frame 1 jab, can still drop shield and respond with jab to intercept your options effectively.

Be cognizant of your spacing relative to your opponent, though, while you keep this in mind, because smart opponents will try to bait you into an option by deliberately whiffing a punishable option when you're too far away to actually punish, and then turning the tables on you when you rush in to punish. In situations like that, you have to keep track of what option they choose to follow with if the bait is unsuccessful. Do they usually roll back after a failed bait? Do they spotdodge? Do they throw out a jab or smash attack just in case you're going to run in recklessly?

I know trying to keep track of so much during matches is tough, it's something you'll have to build towards as you get used to playing, but if you're able to keep better track of what's going on in matches, and respond accordingly, even if it's simply on an intuitive level, you'll find yourself more able to intercept the opponent, win neutral exchanges, and prolong advantageous states to maximize damage and win matches. Anywho, I hope this helps lol. :)
 

Ffamran

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Rice is playing another character... again... Anyone wanna critique Rice's Roy? Rice's Roy vs. Scourge's Sonic and Corrin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQyq8CsA1aA. Scourge should have stayed as Sonic as his Corrin was... meh and that SD early on didn't help solidify the idea his Corrin was competent.

And this is Rice's Roy and Marth vs. Hitaku's Mewtwo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5cIFMlLz_s. I don't know much about Roy, but Rice seems to be doing fairly well except against Hitaku who was once a known Sheik player in California, but has apparently switched to Mewtwo. Then again, Rice plays pretty much the entire cast and does well with them all, but against dedicated mains and top players, he does struggle. The last memorable set I remember of Rice was his Yoshi against Zex's Sheik and Diddy? where he was able to get a bracket reset. I think he lost in the end, though. After that, don't think he's been doing anything great, but he is PR'd.
 

ItsFX

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Saved a lot of games and decided to pick this one out. Roy vs Samus, any help is appreciated.

 
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EnGarde

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPQqf2nGrVU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meu2qftBLF0

This is a set I recently had with a good Rosalina on Anther's Ladder. I could've done worse, but I still got 2-0d. Please tell me how I can improve my Roy! I'm still very much a novice at playing him.
Looks like the primary place where you lost these matches was offstage/on recovery. 3 of the 4 stocks were taken offstage. You tried to land onstage numerous times, which resulted in you eating a lot of uairs, and you tried to recover from mostly below the stage, where Rosa's dair is most effective. I'd recommend trying to recover from more to the left of the ledge and angle it in, so that you're harder to edgeguard and you can use the up+b hitboxes better. Also be sure to mix up your recoveries and don't try to recover from straight below every time. Make sure you know how to angle your recovery so you auto-snap to the ledge as well. Roy's weakness is recovery, so that's why it's important as a Roy player to mix it up.

Not sure why you picked Town and City again for game 2. While that isn't a bad Roy stage per se, it does give Rosa some greater camping potential, since it's hard for us to pressure the upper platforms as effectively.

There were a few times when you caught Luma (but not Rosa) in jabs, something to experiment with is to keep jabbing the Luma to force Rosa to approach in those situations. Luma can't break out of spaced jabs from Roy on its own, so you can force Rosa to approach and read her options from there. Just something to experiment with.

Saved a lot of games and decided to pick this one out. Roy vs Samus, any help is appreciated.

Samus exels in controlling the midrange, so your roll-back habit fed into giving her her optimal spacing each time. She kept setting traps to force and controlling your approach options, like bombs to force an option out an option so she could punish (i.e. the double bombs which you chose to jump over getting punished by fair). Remember that bombs don't go off immediately unless you throw out a hitbox, so dashing in and grabbing is a good idea, but only if you're close enough. You retreated the full stage away a few times, which gave her plenty of room to work her keep away game on you, with her spaced zairs and short hop super missiles to condition you to land and shield / airdodge into the ground, so she could try for grabs. She'd missile on shield to allow her to follow up on your shield drop with dash attack. Tbh this Samus had a pretty great mastery of zoning and conditioning tactics lol. Note how she set up nearly every one of her grabs and dash attacks with something else first? Bombs, zairs, and short hop missiles the most. Remember that bombs are on a timer (unless you hit them with an attack), so you can run past a newly-placed bomb and grab when she tries that. Would have been a good idea to spot dodge after on reaction to bait out and punish that grab lol. The thing to do against a good Samus is to take space away from her, but be careful not to over commit. Especially by the end of the match, she was spacing very carefully away from you in order to charge her charge shot and setup for the charge shot kill. Don't let her have that space, but also don't approach recklessly. Because you only ever moved towards her in anticipation of making an attack, she was able to handle your options much easier. If you had spent more time getting a feel for her zoning habits by weaving in and out of her space, you might have been able to mix up your recoveries a bit better. Also, be sure to use your tilts on punish instead of just fsmash: fsmash is slow and especially on the ledge, can still end in a kill.

Hope this helps both of you :)
 

ILOVESMASH

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Could someone critique my Roy? Bear in mind, I was playing online so lag was a factor.

LINK
 

Jamble

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I'm a fairly new Roy main myself but I think I have some decent input. One of the good points of that vid is your edgeguarding is really solid with Roy, which is an important part of his game. You keep the pressure on while he tries to recover, and you're good at maneuvering on and off stage with your aerials and blazer while edgeguarding.

On the less positive side, you do something that I am also incredibly guilty of and trying to train myself out of; you throw out a lot of stray attacks in neutral. Roy's attacks have very quick startup, but very punishable endlag. Dash attack especially is one I noticed you used a lot; it has dreadful endlag, and it's a move I'd avoid using all that much unless you can just about guarantee it'll land. If you're going to approach from a good distance, you're much better off approaching with a SHFF nair or fair than dash attack. Dash attack usually will only land when you can catch your opponent off guard in some way within a fairly short distance I find.

A lot of players could have capitalized a lot more on some of your whiffed attacks you threw out at various points in the match. At the same time, you both tend to overuse shield a bit, which leaves you open to grabs -> various follow ups. If I were to condense it down to one particular piece of advice, I'd just be a lot more choosy about attacks you throw out. Roy leaving himself vulnerable like that usually gets him punished, and hard.

Just my two cents worth
 

ItsFX

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Back again with some more recordings. This time vs a Villager. I thought the games were a lot of fun but I felt like I could've done a lot better. I'd appreciate any relevant feedback.

 

JCav

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Hey guys, here are a few videos of me from a tournament this past weekend where I got 3rd out of 82 entrants. I played smart and beat some decent opponents but I could certainly use more feedback. My set against Waves (ROB main) I got dominated by gyro. The commentators also point out that I was predictable while getting off the ledge, any advice on this would be appreciated too. Still waiting for Winner's finals to be posted but check these out in the meantime.

vs Meetbeef :4yoshi:
https://youtu.be/dd5Ezs7LnYs

vs Nibble :4mario:
https://youtu.be/NjJkacFocvs

vs Waves :4rob: (Loser's finals)
https://youtu.be/JyGNlvW4sy4


Someone also made a gycat for me ;)
https://gfycat.com/SomeChiefBaldeagle
 
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Jiom

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Hey guys, here are a few videos of me from a tournament this past weekend where I got 3rd out of 82 entrants. I played smart and beat some decent opponents but I could certainly use more feedback. My set against Waves (ROB main) I got dominated by gyro. The commentators also point out that I was predictable while getting off the ledge, any advice on this would be appreciated too. Still waiting for Winner's finals to be posted but check these out in the meantime.

vs Meetbeef :4yoshi:
https://youtu.be/dd5Ezs7LnYs

vs Nibble :4mario:
https://youtu.be/NjJkacFocvs

vs Waves :4rob: (Loser's finals)
https://youtu.be/JyGNlvW4sy4


Someone also made a gycat for me ;)
https://gfycat.com/SomeChiefBaldeagle
The rob played very well and knew how to punish ledge options. I'd say to just know which option you are going to use from the ledge and commit or try to use the invincibility frames to your advantage. Really seems like a guessing game with rob's gyro, not sure which options from the ledge work better against it.
 

EnGarde

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Hey guys, here are a few videos of me from a tournament this past weekend where I got 3rd out of 82 entrants. I played smart and beat some decent opponents but I could certainly use more feedback. My set against Waves (ROB main) I got dominated by gyro. The commentators also point out that I was predictable while getting off the ledge, any advice on this would be appreciated too. Still waiting for Winner's finals to be posted but check these out in the meantime.

vs Meetbeef :4yoshi:
https://youtu.be/dd5Ezs7LnYs

vs Nibble :4mario:
https://youtu.be/NjJkacFocvs

vs Waves :4rob: (Loser's finals)
https://youtu.be/JyGNlvW4sy4


Someone also made a gycat for me ;)
https://gfycat.com/SomeChiefBaldeagle
Rob in particular has some really great ledge options, once he gets the gyro in place like that, it allows him to cover nearly every ledge option. The gyro itself covers normal, attack, and jump getups, the Rob player will generally cover roll getup with something like an upsmash, especially at higher percents.

Remember not to shield the gyro because when you shield the gyro, it is destroyed instantly, which give the Rob player access to another one immediately after, which enhances his pressure game. Roy has gyro setups he can turn against the Rob player if you steal the gyro, the gyro will send the opponent in the direction you're facing, so you can do gyro combos with it (this is also described at the beginning of the video if you want to see). I have linked a video time-stamped at the Roy section.


If you are uncomfortable / unable to try for gyro setups, you can also toss the gyro up, which means that it'll be in the air for a long time (it drifts back down kinda slowly), which at the very least denies the Rob player access to another gyro for a period of time.

Also, would you mind sharing the challonge? I'm one of the people that helps maintain the Roy tournament results spreadsheet (here is the link on that, and here is the thread here on Smashboards for it as well, if you're interested), and if you used Roy more than 80% in the tournament, I'd like to add your results to the document.
 

JCav

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Rob in particular has some really great ledge options, once he gets the gyro in place like that, it allows him to cover nearly every ledge option. The gyro itself covers normal, attack, and jump getups, the Rob player will generally cover roll getup with something like an upsmash, especially at higher percents.

Remember not to shield the gyro because when you shield the gyro, it is destroyed instantly, which give the Rob player access to another one immediately after, which enhances his pressure game. Roy has gyro setups he can turn against the Rob player if you steal the gyro, the gyro will send the opponent in the direction you're facing, so you can do gyro combos with it (this is also described at the beginning of the video if you want to see). I have linked a video time-stamped at the Roy section.


If you are uncomfortable / unable to try for gyro setups, you can also toss the gyro up, which means that it'll be in the air for a long time (it drifts back down kinda slowly), which at the very least denies the Rob player access to another gyro for a period of time.

Also, would you mind sharing the challonge? I'm one of the people that helps maintain the Roy tournament results spreadsheet (here is the link on that, and here is the thread here on Smashboards for it as well, if you're interested), and if you used Roy more than 80% in the tournament, I'd like to add your results to the document.
That was pretty helpful, never thought of using the gyro like that before, here's the challonge

http://challonge.com/Charity6Singles
 

JCav

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
1,217
Location
Michigan
Here's my match against Nom, who is a PR player in Michigan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BC6_uRoBZgU

After playing this match I realized something. I was going for the 2 frame with Flare Blade while Fox was recovering. I've noticed that only a certain part of the sword can hit an opponent on the ledge. However, this is extremely difficult to do and I still haven't done the 2 frame with Flare Blade successfully to date.

What I realized is that I should have positioned Roy at the very edge of the stage charging Flare Blade. With this, you can catch Fox's illusion before he grabs the ledge. I haven't tried this yet but I think it's a good way to edgeguard Fox and Falco. Can anyone give any more info on this idea?

And as always, feedback for my match is appreciated. This set I struggled once again on the ledge, but I feel like I played the neutral pretty well.
 

ItsFX

Smash Rookie
Joined
Mar 20, 2016
Messages
16
Location
The Netherlands
Here's my match against Nom, who is a PR player in Michigan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BC6_uRoBZgU

After playing this match I realized something. I was going for the 2 frame with Flare Blade while Fox was recovering. I've noticed that only a certain part of the sword can hit an opponent on the ledge. However, this is extremely difficult to do and I still haven't done the 2 frame with Flare Blade successfully to date.

What I realized is that I should have positioned Roy at the very edge of the stage charging Flare Blade. With this, you can catch Fox's illusion before he grabs the ledge. I haven't tried this yet but I think it's a good way to edgeguard Fox and Falco. Can anyone give any more info on this idea?

And as always, feedback for my match is appreciated. This set I struggled once again on the ledge, but I feel like I played the neutral pretty well.
I've found nair can catch them out further if timed well (for the side-b of course), while also providing a nice knockback making it hard for them to get back after that. I don't really see neutral b as an edgeguarding tool from the edge. It's fine to cover getup options imo but not to intercept recovery.

A 2-frame window means you have to predict the move and then also release at the correct timing so you don't miss, it's totally unreliable I'd say even if you do manage it.
 
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Jiom

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
474
Here's my match against Nom, who is a PR player in Michigan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BC6_uRoBZgU

After playing this match I realized something. I was going for the 2 frame with Flare Blade while Fox was recovering. I've noticed that only a certain part of the sword can hit an opponent on the ledge. However, this is extremely difficult to do and I still haven't done the 2 frame with Flare Blade successfully to date.

What I realized is that I should have positioned Roy at the very edge of the stage charging Flare Blade. With this, you can catch Fox's illusion before he grabs the ledge. I haven't tried this yet but I think it's a good way to edgeguard Fox and Falco. Can anyone give any more info on this idea?

And as always, feedback for my match is appreciated. This set I struggled once again on the ledge, but I feel like I played the neutral pretty well.
From my experience, the little burst that comes from flare blade, you kinda want to position the center of it on the ledge, so "half" of it is on stage, other "half" is just over the edge.

For falco/fox illusion you charge flare blade and release it when they are even with the ledge, I.e. They would sweet spot the ledge if they side b now. If they side b early and don't go for the ledge you can punish them for doing it to high. If they go for the ledge they get hit out cleanly by flare blade, granted you get the timing right. Just know when they are horizontally within reach of sweeetspotting the ledge with side b.

Also keep in mind, there are separate variations of flare blade, uncharged has smallest hitbox, semi charged Roy screams and the explosion seems to be increased, maybe hitbox increasing as well.
 
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Jiom

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
474
Here's my set against a DK from last Thursday that I mentioned. Any tips on this matchup would be greatly appreciated!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dyrtWHes9U
For DK, you kind of want to abuse the fact he wants a grab. Grab is one of his fastest and most reliable options so always recognize a situation where dk is able to get an easy grab. It could mean just being more aware of DK's grab range from standing and from a dash.

DK has to respect your fast ground game and aerials because he's just so big and if he just rushes in with a dash attack that's easy to adjust to. A lot of times when you're in the air DK will resort to shield, hoping you throw out something he could shieldgrab.

If you're able to make him respect your quick neutral options it shouldn't be hard to make him want to shield. Take advantage of this by staying out of DK's immediate OoS options such as his grab or bair. You want to make him wear down his shield for easy pokes. Good moves to threaten him when his shield is low are DED and nair.

If you're able to wear down his shield DED could mean easy damage or if his shield is really low nair/fair could be a good poke.
DK is really big so it's not that hard to get a shield poke.

Another problem DK has is landing. Once you get him in the air make it difficult for him to get back to his feet. Don't commit to chasing him in the air unless you are in clear advantage and want to maybe bait an air dodge. If he's facing away from you expect a bair upon his landing, which you should be able to shield grab if you don't give him the distance to space it properly.
If he does get the distance to properly space a bair on your shield, just drop shield and wait for his next option or reset to neutral, don't try to punish it if you know you can't. Your neutral is stronger than DK's so don't force anything if you don't have to, he punishes mistakes hard.

Kind of lost my thought but that's pretty much the jist of it. Overall keeping DK in the air is good, he doesn't have great options to come down with. If you get a free punish on DK dair is a good move to setup a juggle on him and send him in the air. I'm not sure how flare blade does against his recovery but I've seen people abuse DK's huge hitbox during up b and you can maybe even dair him out of his ledge snap.
 
Joined
Oct 3, 2011
Messages
1,296
Here is an Anther's set from yesterday. Could you guys please critique my gameplay and give me any possible suggestions on what to work on? I prefer asking for critique on sets where I lose, but this is my only recent set-like gameplay that was recorded and there's likely a few mistakes and areas I can still improve on right off the bat:

 
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