choknater
Smash Obsessed
LMAO wow.
-
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Ivysaur Moveset Discussion (Currently: Utilt)
- Thread starter Onxy
- Start date
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
a lot of people didnt know... and i wasnt totally sure when i posted it 
... but yes there is a diference...
looks like razor leaf is the strangest move on all the game... fully understanding razor leaf is gonna be hard... or maybe its just random???
... but yes there is a diference...looks like razor leaf is the strangest move on all the game... fully understanding razor leaf is gonna be hard... or maybe its just random???
CoonTail
Smash Lord
Well like i have said earlier guys lol.....this is why im taking on the task of figuring this out. Theres clearly some form of pattern its just like hieroglyphics....without the rosetta stone we are *****d lol
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
I think it's the fact that the path it travels in can be random is what makes it good (partially).
choknater
Smash Obsessed
smash razor leaf just goes a lot farther and faster and is very useful. dunno if it does more damage than tilt razor leaf. can someone test it out?
as far as trajectory goes... i can't really figure that out either... it seems like it's automatically guided toward the opponent sometimes. for example if the opponent is above, the leaf never goes down
i dunno, it just seems that way to me
as far as trajectory goes... i can't really figure that out either... it seems like it's automatically guided toward the opponent sometimes. for example if the opponent is above, the leaf never goes down
i dunno, it just seems that way to me
Everybody pretty much covered its special properties but to summerise for onyx,
Special Properties:
- You can control the distance based off a smash or a tilt. The tilt razorleaf will cover a short distance and is slower while a Smash razorleaf will cover more distance and is faster.
- Razor Leaf cannot be absorbed(ie G&W's bucket) but can be reflected
- Razorleaf goes through breakable terrain ie Luigis mansion and Castle siege statues.
- Its trajecotry is randomized(until proven otherwise). But it can curve upwarwards/downwards or straight.
- a SH razorleaf into a standing razorleaf is faster than 2 standing razorleaves
Special Properties:
- You can control the distance based off a smash or a tilt. The tilt razorleaf will cover a short distance and is slower while a Smash razorleaf will cover more distance and is faster.
- Razor Leaf cannot be absorbed(ie G&W's bucket) but can be reflected
- Razorleaf goes through breakable terrain ie Luigis mansion and Castle siege statues.
- Its trajecotry is randomized(until proven otherwise). But it can curve upwarwards/downwards or straight.
- a SH razorleaf into a standing razorleaf is faster than 2 standing razorleaves
choknater
Smash Obsessed
Ah, thanks for that last little bullet. Didn't know that one.
Does anyone know how MUCH faster it is, like frame wise?
Does anyone know how MUCH faster it is, like frame wise?
Umpadumpalump
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 2, 2008
- Messages
- 87
I don't know if I'm lucky or what, but a lot of the time the razor leaf will curve upward or downward based on the position of my opponent when I began the attack. For example, I was just playing against somebody on Pokemon Stadium, and they were standing on a platform. I used razor leaf and it curved up towards them, but didn't reach them.
CoonTail
Smash Lord
Nothing better than a vinewhip sweetspot for the kill, 23% and enough knockback to really cause a player stress when hit by this
Retro Gaming
Black and White Thinking
I think something that would be really benificial is exactly what Razor Leaf can and can't go through, as far as other projectiles are concerned. I would work on it but I won't be able to start until around the end of the week.
I like Vine Whip. If you start getting predictable its extremely easy to air dodge, though if you're trying to SS then its not as easy to punish because of the long range. If you start getting predictable I like to get in the position for Vine Whip then jump up and Nair them after the airdodge.
I like Vine Whip. If you start getting predictable its extremely easy to air dodge, though if you're trying to SS then its not as easy to punish because of the long range. If you start getting predictable I like to get in the position for Vine Whip then jump up and Nair them after the airdodge.
No need, this data already exists somewhere on the site. Check Simna, he did a lot of research on projectiles and which ones did what.
Syrus_Draco
Smash Apprentice
Gotta love their faces when they are surprised by the Vine Whip SS kill :X
Having stages like Battle Field, Pokemon Stadium, and Luigi's Mansion are great for these kinds of surprises. Just like before don't use it too often so that way you leave your opponent surprised and not seeing it coming.
Having stages like Battle Field, Pokemon Stadium, and Luigi's Mansion are great for these kinds of surprises. Just like before don't use it too often so that way you leave your opponent surprised and not seeing it coming.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
It would take a lot of practice on the stage to maneuver with Ivy... but I bet a multi-ledge stage like Norfair would greatly assist Ivy in recovery. I dunno, I've invented a lot of Sheik chain/vanish tactics on Norfair and I think Ivy would also have some decent movement enhancement capabilities on Norfair.
Some things that haven't been mentioned about vinewhip:
Everyone already knows this, but it can actually be used as a gimping tool. Either by using instant upb running off the side or jumping down and grabbing the ledge at full length, if someone is trying to come back from below the stage and has a pretty horizontal recovery (i.e NOT marth or ike) you can vinewhip the ledge and watch them fruitlessly attempt to sweetspot. When I'm feeling adventurous (or against an opponent with pretty poor/predictable recovery i'll run off ledge, double jump into a nair to kill their momentum, and then tether. its hard to get back from for your opponent.
Everyone already knows this, but it can actually be used as a gimping tool. Either by using instant upb running off the side or jumping down and grabbing the ledge at full length, if someone is trying to come back from below the stage and has a pretty horizontal recovery (i.e NOT marth or ike) you can vinewhip the ledge and watch them fruitlessly attempt to sweetspot. When I'm feeling adventurous (or against an opponent with pretty poor/predictable recovery i'll run off ledge, double jump into a nair to kill their momentum, and then tether. its hard to get back from for your opponent.
CoonTail
Smash Lord
Yea I really do love edgehogging with the vine I like to call it spider-mannin, but when im feeling adventurous and i see a falco is trying to illusion to the edge I race him to it so I vine whip he illusions, but the thing is I do it a second early so the falco sees ivysaur off the level and thinks he can gimp me out, but MINDGAMES I grab the edge he attempts to illusion and this falco gets SPIDER-MANNED!!!!!!!!
So, to cap on some things that are definites that should be talked about:
Vine whip is a tether recovery, which gives it some unique properties. Some of these properties are quite nice; Ivysaur can sweetspot the ledge from a wide variety of different places off ledge. As is in Card's guide, about this
wide a variety. That's nice. Also, it can be used as a gimp on opponents recovering below the stage; opponents cannot grab the ledge if you are latched to it and hanging. A common way of doing this, dubbed the Instant Edgeguard, has ivy run off the ledge and instantly upb towards the stage. Ivy pops up, latches the ledge, and stalls in the air slightly before falling, still latched, underneath the stage. There are many other ways to put yourself in good gimping situations as well, be creative!
However there are many cons that come with this special recovery as well. Simply put, if someone else is on the ledge and you need to use vine whip to get back to the ledge, you're losing a stock. This means that as an ivysaur player you MUST be unpredictable with your recovery. Keeping your second jump is very important, as it gives you options as to how to move your opponent off of the ledge.
Options for getting rid of an on-edge opponent that have been mentioned:
Backwards razor leaf to bair
Forwards razor leaf at the opponent to vine whip on RL hit (to steal ledge)
Double jump into nair
Double jump into fair (from Adriel)
Wait them out and see if they roll off in time for ivy to tether the ledge
More ideas?
Also, if all hope is lost, set yourself up for a vine whip attack! If they sit on the ledge all "hurr hurr ivehsaur" sweetspot an attack and stagespike that ho. They'll die before you will if they're at average damage and not metaknight. Its won me a few games and should not be underestimated as a last resort.
One other special property that comes into play with vine whip as a recovery is your tether limit. If you attempt to tether more than three times, even if you are within range you won't latch, and instead will fall to your death. Using vine whip as a stall or a mindgame tactic can be a useful tool, but keeping your three tether limit in mind will save your ivysaur (and you) some embarrassing deaths if you implement this tactic.
Also, this move functions as a powerful attack. When on ground (or not in midair with a nearby ledge to grab) ivysaur throws out a vine at 45 degrees up in front of her. The tip is a sweetspot which does considerable knockback and 13 damage, 10 fatigued, and the rest does anywhere from 7-10, or 6-9 fatigued (so says Card's guide).
Uses for vine whip as an attack that have been mentioned:
Dthrow to vinewhip at low % (0-20ish?)
Surprise to opponents approaching over razor leaf
Hitting an opponent on a platform above you
Generally more instances where the opponent won't expect it
More ideas?
Its not the easiest thing to land, but don't let your opponent forget its there. If they come to fear it that's one more thing for them to think about, and that never hurts
Comments? Points of contention?
Vine whip is a tether recovery, which gives it some unique properties. Some of these properties are quite nice; Ivysaur can sweetspot the ledge from a wide variety of different places off ledge. As is in Card's guide, about this
wide a variety. That's nice. Also, it can be used as a gimp on opponents recovering below the stage; opponents cannot grab the ledge if you are latched to it and hanging. A common way of doing this, dubbed the Instant Edgeguard, has ivy run off the ledge and instantly upb towards the stage. Ivy pops up, latches the ledge, and stalls in the air slightly before falling, still latched, underneath the stage. There are many other ways to put yourself in good gimping situations as well, be creative!
However there are many cons that come with this special recovery as well. Simply put, if someone else is on the ledge and you need to use vine whip to get back to the ledge, you're losing a stock. This means that as an ivysaur player you MUST be unpredictable with your recovery. Keeping your second jump is very important, as it gives you options as to how to move your opponent off of the ledge.
Options for getting rid of an on-edge opponent that have been mentioned:
Backwards razor leaf to bair
Forwards razor leaf at the opponent to vine whip on RL hit (to steal ledge)
Double jump into nair
Double jump into fair (from Adriel)
Wait them out and see if they roll off in time for ivy to tether the ledge
More ideas?
Also, if all hope is lost, set yourself up for a vine whip attack! If they sit on the ledge all "hurr hurr ivehsaur" sweetspot an attack and stagespike that ho. They'll die before you will if they're at average damage and not metaknight. Its won me a few games and should not be underestimated as a last resort.
One other special property that comes into play with vine whip as a recovery is your tether limit. If you attempt to tether more than three times, even if you are within range you won't latch, and instead will fall to your death. Using vine whip as a stall or a mindgame tactic can be a useful tool, but keeping your three tether limit in mind will save your ivysaur (and you) some embarrassing deaths if you implement this tactic.
Also, this move functions as a powerful attack. When on ground (or not in midair with a nearby ledge to grab) ivysaur throws out a vine at 45 degrees up in front of her. The tip is a sweetspot which does considerable knockback and 13 damage, 10 fatigued, and the rest does anywhere from 7-10, or 6-9 fatigued (so says Card's guide).
Uses for vine whip as an attack that have been mentioned:
Dthrow to vinewhip at low % (0-20ish?)
Surprise to opponents approaching over razor leaf
Hitting an opponent on a platform above you
Generally more instances where the opponent won't expect it
More ideas?
Its not the easiest thing to land, but don't let your opponent forget its there. If they come to fear it that's one more thing for them to think about, and that never hurts
Comments? Points of contention?
Gotcha. Edited in
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
I doubt the following works, but I've heard something about Dair-ing so you can stall in the air. They would roll and you Vine Whip when they're done.
Again, I doubt this works.
Again, I doubt this works.
Caasi11
Smash Cadet
D-airing is risky business over the edge since there's lag while Ivysaur tries to get back to her belly first falling position. Its better to B-air or to F-air the guy on the ledge if you're that close. Also, don't even THINK about using Bullet Seed over the ledge; it causes to much lag for startup and stopping to be efficient.
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
I didn't mean Dair-ing to hit the opponent... But it doesn't matter, since it's a bad option anyways. lol
And I was pretty sure Bullet Seed wouldn't work either.
And I was pretty sure Bullet Seed wouldn't work either.
Not to stomp on you more but dairing would really only work if you were directly next to the ledge, in which case your opponent would probably already have ledgehop baired you or something.
I like the thinking outside the box though; maybe every once in a blue moon the stall wouldn't be such a bad idea... I'll have to try it sometime for funsies
I like the thinking outside the box though; maybe every once in a blue moon the stall wouldn't be such a bad idea... I'll have to try it sometime for funsies
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
Don't worry, you're not stomping on me. Like I said, I heard it from somewhere, and I thought it might've deserved some discussion.
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
Oh my goodness. F'ing Bullet Seed. Ivysaur's combo breaker and damage racker.
It should be obvious that bigger and heavier opponents have a harder time of DIing out than smaller and lighter opponents. You must also hope they don't see it coming and DI out of the initial pop-up. But normally, if used correctly you can get off a free 20% - 40%, depending on the character.
It's also better if you can use it under platforms, since once Ivy's done BSing, he has a little bit of lag. The platform can stop the opponent from attacking him until he recovers. Smashville's moving platform is even better since once you stop, you can immediately Vine Whip them.
Also, C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER. I believe Ivy can escape from Falco's chaingrab and Sheik's F-tilt lock if you BS at the right time.
It should be obvious that bigger and heavier opponents have a harder time of DIing out than smaller and lighter opponents. You must also hope they don't see it coming and DI out of the initial pop-up. But normally, if used correctly you can get off a free 20% - 40%, depending on the character.
It's also better if you can use it under platforms, since once Ivy's done BSing, he has a little bit of lag. The platform can stop the opponent from attacking him until he recovers. Smashville's moving platform is even better since once you stop, you can immediately Vine Whip them.
Also, C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER. I believe Ivy can escape from Falco's chaingrab and Sheik's F-tilt lock if you BS at the right time.
choknater
Smash Obsessed
Bullet Seed is an EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT out-of-shield counter. It has a really fast frame startup and the initial hit covers his whole body. Basically, this move gives him a wonderful defensive option that can pretty much save him from being a horrible character.
Because it's so punishable, I wouldn't really consider risking its use unless you are definitely sure that it will connect. It's always best to use the initial hit to guarantee popping them up into the middle of the seeds, then they will have to DI or smash DI out of it. A lot of guaranteed damage.
Ivysaur reminds me of ZSS... he has good spacing with his vine and leaf attacks, but his close range options are strange (utilt, nair, bullet seed) but an Ivysaur who masters these moves can REALLY do well. Ivysaur is a character that needs very strategic spacing... if you happen to mess up your spacing, block and hope to shield counter someone for 30 damage.
Because it's so punishable, I wouldn't really consider risking its use unless you are definitely sure that it will connect. It's always best to use the initial hit to guarantee popping them up into the middle of the seeds, then they will have to DI or smash DI out of it. A lot of guaranteed damage.
Ivysaur reminds me of ZSS... he has good spacing with his vine and leaf attacks, but his close range options are strange (utilt, nair, bullet seed) but an Ivysaur who masters these moves can REALLY do well. Ivysaur is a character that needs very strategic spacing... if you happen to mess up your spacing, block and hope to shield counter someone for 30 damage.
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Bullet seed has pretty good range, but it helps ivy so much because it turns her close range game from meh to great, its so good to catch someone on bulletsedd, and this attack deals more damage when fatigued, because it deals the same damage per hit(1%) but it has less knockback so its harder to DI out if it
but it sucks when people block/di out in the first hit
but it sucks when people block/di out in the first hit
Caasi11
Smash Cadet
Let me start by saying this: I'm glad they chose to make Ivysaur's B-neutral Bullet Seed over Solarbeam because its way better than a slow-charging beam of light that hits ONE point with vast amounts of lag in between. >_>
Bullet Seed is a VERY useful tool for Ivy's anti-air game, as well as for frustrating the opponent. As said before, it could rack up damage without much effort (10-50%), as well as being a useful combo breaker; but it could also be used as two other things.
The first thing that it could be used for is as a counter for rolldoging opponent that keeps overlapping Ivy's rolldodges. You must be quick to use it in this situation, because if this move hits the opponent as they rolldodge, they WILL be sent up to the very top of the stream, getting a very easy 45% (if you decide to let if go that far). This can be tied into a F-tilt or S-smash when they land, so take advantage of it.
Another thing that you could pull off with Bullet Seed is to create a wall for characters who have purely horizontal recoveries (Star Fox characters, Ike, Marth, Wario on his bike, etc.). For example, let's say you B-throw a Fox over the left side of Final Destination, but he doesn't go that far.
O = Ivysaur
X = Opponent
< = Direction of force
-----------------------
-----------------------
--X< < --------------
-----------------------
--------____O_____
In this case, he'll go for his B-side recovery to get back on stage without having to face Ivy in the air.
-----------------------
-----------------------
--X-> >--------------
-----------------------
--------____O_____
This is where you get near the edge and use Bullet Seed.
:: = Seed Stream
--------------::-------
--------------::-------
---> > >----X-------
--------------::-------
--------____O_____
What will most likely happen is that Fox will go right into the top of the stream, and he'll take a good 15% or so of damage (depending on how high up he is). Then you can bust out a S-smash, F-tilt, or even B-throw him again for a little more damage.
There are two main flaws with Ivy's Bullet Seed though, there is lag for startup as well as cooldown and that opponents could pop-up over the stream if they're too light. Well, turns out that there's a way to solve these problems: come from the air. Specifically, at a 90 degree angle with your opponent. This IS risky since you can eat U-tilt in this position, so be cautious.
OK, here's the set up:
O = Ivysaur
X = Opponent
------------------------
------------------------
---------O-------------
------------------------
______X_________
Here, you're above the oponnent (let's say, Fox using his lazer) at a 90 degree angle. Now, what you want to do is either fastfall and use Bullet Seed, or use Bullet Seed normally, the latter works the best. Anyway, the pop-up should not affect Fox, but here's what it will look like:
@ = Fox overlapped with Ivy
------------------------
---------::-------------
---------::-------------
---------::-------------
______@_________
Whoever was your poor victim should go up all the way to the top, and take about 50% if they're heavy-weights, about 30% if they're lighter and have good DI.
Overall, Bullet Seed is potent to the heavy-weight, and a handy weapon against aerial attackers. The only thing that makes this move not totally broken is the lag.
P.S: Doing those ASCII illustrations made me feel like I'm writing a guide instead of an analyzation.
Bullet Seed is a VERY useful tool for Ivy's anti-air game, as well as for frustrating the opponent. As said before, it could rack up damage without much effort (10-50%), as well as being a useful combo breaker; but it could also be used as two other things.
The first thing that it could be used for is as a counter for rolldoging opponent that keeps overlapping Ivy's rolldodges. You must be quick to use it in this situation, because if this move hits the opponent as they rolldodge, they WILL be sent up to the very top of the stream, getting a very easy 45% (if you decide to let if go that far). This can be tied into a F-tilt or S-smash when they land, so take advantage of it.
Another thing that you could pull off with Bullet Seed is to create a wall for characters who have purely horizontal recoveries (Star Fox characters, Ike, Marth, Wario on his bike, etc.). For example, let's say you B-throw a Fox over the left side of Final Destination, but he doesn't go that far.
O = Ivysaur
X = Opponent
< = Direction of force
-----------------------
-----------------------
--X< < --------------
-----------------------
--------____O_____
In this case, he'll go for his B-side recovery to get back on stage without having to face Ivy in the air.
-----------------------
-----------------------
--X-> >--------------
-----------------------
--------____O_____
This is where you get near the edge and use Bullet Seed.
:: = Seed Stream
--------------::-------
--------------::-------
---> > >----X-------
--------------::-------
--------____O_____
What will most likely happen is that Fox will go right into the top of the stream, and he'll take a good 15% or so of damage (depending on how high up he is). Then you can bust out a S-smash, F-tilt, or even B-throw him again for a little more damage.
There are two main flaws with Ivy's Bullet Seed though, there is lag for startup as well as cooldown and that opponents could pop-up over the stream if they're too light. Well, turns out that there's a way to solve these problems: come from the air. Specifically, at a 90 degree angle with your opponent. This IS risky since you can eat U-tilt in this position, so be cautious.
OK, here's the set up:
O = Ivysaur
X = Opponent
------------------------
------------------------
---------O-------------
------------------------
______X_________
Here, you're above the oponnent (let's say, Fox using his lazer) at a 90 degree angle. Now, what you want to do is either fastfall and use Bullet Seed, or use Bullet Seed normally, the latter works the best. Anyway, the pop-up should not affect Fox, but here's what it will look like:
@ = Fox overlapped with Ivy
------------------------
---------::-------------
---------::-------------
---------::-------------
______@_________
Whoever was your poor victim should go up all the way to the top, and take about 50% if they're heavy-weights, about 30% if they're lighter and have good DI.
Overall, Bullet Seed is potent to the heavy-weight, and a handy weapon against aerial attackers. The only thing that makes this move not totally broken is the lag.
P.S: Doing those ASCII illustrations made me feel like I'm writing a guide instead of an analyzation.
PkTrainerCris
Smash Ace
Oh yeah, i forgot to add that an aerial bullet sedd has more range than a grounded one, so use that on your advantage
@ Caasi: I understand your need to go in depth (clearly I do it as well) but many of your ideas don't seem very practical.
I'm gonna hold off on writing a friggin essay like I have been so as to let other people put in their two cents. Putting a big cover-all seems to diminish creativity which is no good
Two uses that haven't been mentioned yet is a through-platform poke (best for grounded opponents on a platform) and jumping onto a platform while bullet seeding. If bullet seed is started just as you leave the ground, you can often catch your opponent in the stream right off, or if not the popup is diminished, leaving for more damage.
I'm gonna hold off on writing a friggin essay like I have been so as to let other people put in their two cents. Putting a big cover-all seems to diminish creativity which is no good
Two uses that haven't been mentioned yet is a through-platform poke (best for grounded opponents on a platform) and jumping onto a platform while bullet seeding. If bullet seed is started just as you leave the ground, you can often catch your opponent in the stream right off, or if not the popup is diminished, leaving for more damage.
Echk Sorry onyx, I lagged on the vinewhip write up so I'll do both in one go.
Vinewhip:
Uses: Recovery, Kill move
DMG: 7-10%, 13% Sweetspot (when fatigued 6-9%, 10% Sweetspot)
AT: Instant Tether
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVSmzY_VRrw
Special properties when tethered:
- Used as tether recovery, push A to pull yourself to the edge to edge hog
- Includes Advance technique Instant tether, for followups goto http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=198927
- When tethered to the stage you can re-tether up to 3 times before you have to touch the floor to reset.
- You can cancel a tether by pushin down/back. benefits to this are Instant Tether cancelling and platform cancelling
Special properties when used offensively:
- Has a sweetspot at the end of the vine that causes a whip sounds if hit correctly
- The sweetspot gets good knockback from48% or higher and is a great kill move after 80%
- You can instantly do a pivot vinewhip by pushing u/b+b(great after an utilt)
- If you do it in the air it gives you a small jump before releasing it.
- Can be linked from a fair at certain percentages:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie8PtTlcVu8
- Can be used to stage spike someone edgehogging you
Bullet Seed
Uses: Punishment, Damage rack up
Frames: 4
DMG: 4,2,2,2,2,2,2,1,1,1,1…..% (when fatigued 2,1,1,1,1,1,1……%)
Special properties:- 1st hit covers half a body length on either side and causes the opponent to pop up
- Great Out of shield/Out of dodge followup. Used for punishment
- If you dont DI the 1st hit you are almost garunteed 30+% from the stream
- There is also a hitbox underneath Ivysaur if you do an arieal Bulletseed
- can be used to interrupt combos and chaingrabs
I have a question, can someone test and see if the seeds beat out snakes fallin mortar. if they do then it is actually a really good move to use against a snake that does boost/sankedashing
Also guys if you could try to shorten your summaries, I know there is alot of stuff that you can cover but no one likes reading long paragraphs. Try to keep them short and straight to the point. Bulletpoints are good too
Vinewhip:
Uses: Recovery, Kill move
DMG: 7-10%, 13% Sweetspot (when fatigued 6-9%, 10% Sweetspot)
AT: Instant Tether
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVSmzY_VRrw
Special properties when tethered:
- Used as tether recovery, push A to pull yourself to the edge to edge hog
- Includes Advance technique Instant tether, for followups goto http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=198927
- When tethered to the stage you can re-tether up to 3 times before you have to touch the floor to reset.
- You can cancel a tether by pushin down/back. benefits to this are Instant Tether cancelling and platform cancelling
Special properties when used offensively:
- Has a sweetspot at the end of the vine that causes a whip sounds if hit correctly
- The sweetspot gets good knockback from48% or higher and is a great kill move after 80%
- You can instantly do a pivot vinewhip by pushing u/b+b(great after an utilt)
- If you do it in the air it gives you a small jump before releasing it.
- Can be linked from a fair at certain percentages:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ie8PtTlcVu8
- Can be used to stage spike someone edgehogging you
Bullet Seed
Uses: Punishment, Damage rack up
Frames: 4
DMG: 4,2,2,2,2,2,2,1,1,1,1…..% (when fatigued 2,1,1,1,1,1,1……%)
Special properties:- 1st hit covers half a body length on either side and causes the opponent to pop up
- Great Out of shield/Out of dodge followup. Used for punishment
- If you dont DI the 1st hit you are almost garunteed 30+% from the stream
- There is also a hitbox underneath Ivysaur if you do an arieal Bulletseed
- can be used to interrupt combos and chaingrabs
I have a question, can someone test and see if the seeds beat out snakes fallin mortar. if they do then it is actually a really good move to use against a snake that does boost/sankedashing
Also guys if you could try to shorten your summaries, I know there is alot of stuff that you can cover but no one likes reading long paragraphs. Try to keep them short and straight to the point. Bulletpoints are good too
Wii4Mii 99
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2007
- Messages
- 1,859
As far as my testing has confirmed, the seeds do not beat out Snake's mortar. The initial pop-up at the beginning doesn't either.
And I have nothing to add to your post. Those are pretty good summaries.
And I have nothing to add to your post. Those are pretty good summaries.
Toby.
Smash Master
I've talked to Successor of Raphael about it in the past and after recording and examining it he is sure that its 1 frame. 1 frame is extremely fast, so I wouldn't be surprised if he'd made an error, but meh. It's probably less that 4 at any rate.