Isaac (Golden Sun) in SSBB thread

[Zubyyyy]

Brawl was still in a fairly early creating phase when the fake Golden Sun DS thing was shown at that E3 (can't remember when that was, I think it was E3 a year or so ago, you all know the one). That had great feedback, lots of people got really excited, so much so that the creators themselves had to confess that they created a fake. This may have opened the eyes of either Sakurai or Nintendo, and especially Camelot, that Golden Sun was still in popular favour and people still wanted another. I would say that that fake screen could boost Isaacs chances, if not for Brawl then definitely for a third installment.

Sakurai works for Nintendo...if they wanted him to add a character badly enough, he would probably have to make it. Both parties here have pretty big balls in their courts. Nintendo could always cancel his game, stop Brawl (which would be suicide for their public image), since if they refuse Sakurai to use Nintendo characters, we would be left with a fighter that had Snake and Sonic fighting each other. Sakurai of course could refuse profusely to put in some characters that he threatens to stop making the game (I think though that he would have to have a contract, and stopping production would lead to some hefty court cases, since Brawl is one of the big guns for Nintendo). I have to say that I think Nintendo had a lot of say in character roster stuff, while Sakurai was in charge of everything else. Though I am sure Sakurai works well with Nintendo, being so highly respected all around the world and all.

Also, I wouldn't always trust a developer not telling you about a game in the making so early in, as a GS3 would be. Maybe they had already done a bit for it at the time of the interview? We wont know either ever or for a fairly long time, but I do hope that they had considered it a while ago, long enough to give Sakurai and Nintendo plenty of oportunity to work Isaac in. That would be sweet.



Heh, I love this thread, it's awfully positive most of the time, I can always come here to read some random unknown runour/source stating some new information that would lead to Isaac's definite inclusion, like with Sakurai stating that he loved the Golden Sun series, the poll, the GS3 rumours. It's awesome. While the truth remains that the poll was right and so far the only GS related thing in Brawl is the musician. But yeah, rumours rock, as does Isaac!!! ISAAC FOR BRAWL!!!

Nintendo gave Sakurai FULL CONTROL of smash as long as Mario, Kirby, Pikachu and Link appeared in the game. I read that somewhere, I will have to find the link.

 

[raphtmarqui]

You know, I haven't personally ever met an Isaac hater ^_^

I have to agree, it's a very peaceful and equanimous topic.

I would also agree, that a colourful, informative and well formatted first post would be rather nice. Although, if we do request a new topic, who would start it?

Bassoonist, are you Andrew? If so, I would vote for you to do it.

So many suggestions for movesets. One of the many, many great things about Isaac and Golden Sun =)

Dave

Yea, i think we need a better first post.

 

[Arteen]

I wouldn't mind a new thread is someone makes a great first post for it.

 

[Rubydragon]

Hmmm? Your Hero, I don't quite enjoy that moveset. I don't think unleashes should be part of his moveset, maybe for smash attacks (since characters seem to be getting pretty unique ones like Zamus and Snake), but I think his B-moves should be left with the thing he controls and uses the most- and that would be Earth Phyenergy. I'd be happy with just Isaac though, no matter what his moveset would be. Remember though, this is all just my opinion, I naturally have nothing against your moveset.

I still think his grab should be the hand, and his throws should have the name of all of the moves in Golden Sun that use the hand (Move, Force, Carry, etc.). I'm not sure if the hand should be able to be used for tether recovery though, though I do think the grab should be long-ranged, like Link's or Samus' grab.

I had started to make a new topic, with the titles of the sections having little cute suns next to them, and instead of bullets, I had suns as well (don't ask...). But that probably turned out a failure.

 

[Your Hero]

Hmmm? Your Hero, I don't quite enjoy that moveset. I don't think unleashes should be part of his moveset, maybe for smash attacks (since characters seem to be getting pretty unique ones like Zamus and Snake), but I think his B-moves should be left with the thing he controls and uses the most- and that would be Earth Phyenergy. I'd be happy with just Isaac though, no matter what his moveset would be. Remember though, this is all just my opinion, I naturally have nothing against your moveset.

I still think his grab should be the hand, and his throws should have the name of all of the moves in Golden Sun that use the hand (Move, Force, Carry, etc.). I'm not sure if the hand should be able to be used for tether recovery though, though I do think the grab should be long-ranged, like Link's or Samus' grab.

I had started to make a new topic, with the titles of the sections having little cute suns next to them, and instead of bullets, I had suns as well (don't ask...). But that probably turned out a failure.

lol kk, to tell you the truth I made it up on the spot there. I just didn't like the grab being the vines. I didn't like any of the b moves he stated so I made up my own, although I've seen other ones on this thread. and then the aaa thing being punches and kicks does not suit golden sun one bit.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

I still quite like this moveset i made ages ago. I've changed a couple of things. It only incorporates elements from the first game.

The moveset will be based mostly on Psynergy and Djinn from the first game (there is too much for me to draw from in the second game), as I really believe that is how it should be. It will focus on Isaac's primary element, earth. I guess that having a moveset with other elemental psynergies would represent the other characters a little more, but seeing how Isaac is a Venus adept, i'll leave him almost entirely as one:

Ground A moves:

Neutral A:A simple punch slash kick combo
Forward Tilt:Isaac slashes with his sword using his standard attack command from the game.
Up Tilt:Isaac slashes in an arc above his head

Aerial A moves:

Aerial Neutral A: Demon Night - Some ghosts fly around Isaac (tightly hugging him, similar to Mewtwos Neutral Aerial A except different animation for the attack).
Aerial Forward A:Condemn - slashes in large arc with a red demonic light.
Aerial Back A:Isaac kicks backwards.
Aerial Up A:Whirlwind - throws up a hand, with a mini whirlwind appearing just above it.
Aerial Down A:Annihilation - Isaac swipes his sword downwards.

Dash Attack:

Dash Attack:Helm Splitter - Isaac charges through the foe with a mighty slash, dealing good damage and knockback.


Smash Moves:

Forward Smash:Flint - The Djinn Flint appears and deals a crushing blow.

Up Smashunji Strike - The opponent is launched into the air by an explosion of Bamboo from the ground. When being charged, Isaac does a cool summoning stance. Only the tip of the Bamboo damages and launches upwards.

Down Smash:Nettle - Isaac points his hands down at the ground in front of the opponent and it explodes in a group of sharp plants. Good damage, bad knockback.


Grab and Throws:

Grab:Isaac puts one hand out and the Djinn "Ground" appears instantly holding the foe in front of Isaac using gravity.
Grab A:The Djinn Bane instantly appears and wacks the opponent doing a little damage then just as quickly dissappears.
Forward Throw:Force - The opponent is sent flying forward by a white fist.
Back Throw:The familiar white hand/glove tosses the enemy backwards
Up Throw:Lift-Opponent is launched into to the air by two white gloves. (no not like Master and Crazy Hand )
Down Throw:Stone Spire - Stalactites materialise above the opponent and then crash down into them.


B moves:

Netural B:Grand Gaia - Isaac does that cool summoning stance from the official art and the ground begins to tremor without doing damage. When fully charged it can be stored (this is to make the move actually useful!) or unleashed straight away. When unleashed the ground rips open below Isaac and many rocks come flying up in a bright light doing major damage (the rocks will fade into nothing slightly above Isaac's head) Note: the move has a relatively long charge time (think Roy's flareblade) which is why it can be stored.

Side B:Ragnarok - A giant sword comes slamming down into the ground from an angle above Isaac's head. Sword materialises above his head and disappears slightly below his feet(obviously further away from him) Attack has an explosive effect when used on the ground and does more damage + knockback.

Up B:Retreat - Isaac teleports (similar to Mewtwo's teleport but with the animation from Golden Sun, as mentioned by OP).

Down B:Halt - Isaac sticks a hand out and a ghostly clock appears around his arm, temporarily freezing the opponent in his tracks.


Final Smash:

Final Smash:Judgement.

Dave

 

[Your Hero]

I still quite like this moveset i made ages ago. I've changed a couple of things. It only incorporates elements from the first game.



Dave

The up b should change to something that would damage the enemy and not take too long to do.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

The up b should change to something that would damage the enemy and not take too long to do.

I imagined it, taking about the same time as sheik's up B. It would be a very quick animation =)
It could possibly be the same length as Zelda's teleport, it could be very similar?

Or would you still prefer something different?

Suggest away, a bit of discussion is always fun <(^_^)>

Dave

 

[Your Hero]

I imagined it, taking about the same time as sheik's up B. It would be a very quick animation =)
It could possibly be the same length as Zelda's teleport, it could be very similar?

Or would you still prefer something different?

Suggest away, a bit of discussion is always fun <(^_^)>

Dave

the problem is it's something hard to think up, atleast something that does damage. You know how some weaponry specials make you jump in the air? maybe it could be something like that.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

the problem is it's something hard to think up, atleast something that does damage. You know how some weaponry specials make you jump in the air? maybe it could be something like that.

Ah, in that case, your best bet is Megiddo. Although I can't really see that working, entirely too well. Seems more like Final Smash material.

I quite like Retreat, since it's a trademark of the earth adept, and is used a lot throughout the game. Also the moveset I designed, already appears to have a lot of fire-power. So I think retreat is suitable.

I quite like his down B as Halt. I think that is kind of cool, although perhaps it is too much of a Mewtwo rip. Other possibilities would be reflective or shielding attacks, such as those that the Djinn do.

What reflective/shielding psynergy was there in the game? Forgetting defense boosts and stuff like that.

Dave

 

[Your Hero]

I'll check now
*scurries off to find his golden sun games*

 

[WindSquirrel]

I prefer all of his special moves to be from his Slayer class. His smash attacks should be Djinni unleashes, while his FS should be a summon or Megiddo.

Anyways, it's pretty logical for him to have Retreat as his B^. I'm thinking for him to have quake sphere as his BV, Gaia as his neutral B, and Ragnarok/Odysee as his B>

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

I prefer all of his special moves to be from his Slayer class. His smash attacks should be Djinni unleashes, while his FS should be a summon or Megiddo.

Anyways, it's pretty logical for him to have Retreat as his B^. I'm thinking for him to have quake sphere as his BV, Gaia as his neutral B, and Ragnarok/Odysee as his B>

The problem with that, is that three of his B moves would be purely offensive, not really having much synergy between them.

Which is why I originally stuck Halt in there. I figured that by having a disabling move, it would give him the time necessary to pull off a Grand Gaia or Ragnarok, presuming they have longer than norm start-up times.

Although of course, Quake Sphere as down special, doesn't have to be purely offensive, it could say ground nearby opponents temporarily. In which case, imagine a Quake Sphere to a Grand Gaia xD

Dave

 

[Durbl Piij]

Your moveset is still pretty good, but I think the down B is too much like copying mewtwo. I've said it before that down b should be eathquake. Isaac is an earth adept after all. It could work similar to Wario's down b, hold it for longer and it will get bigger. Like, using it instantly will make it the normal eathquake from the game, 3 blocks move, then if you hold it it will grow to the really large one, the 3 blocks moving numerous times. It could be cool, with it affecting the ground all around Isaac but he just stands there with that pose of his.
I like the gaia idea, but would the beam keep going up? If it goes too high, like top of the screen it could be deemed ridiculous (but then again, Pikachu's thunderbolt one does it). I don't mean liek a ridiculous idea, but a ridiculously powerful move. And I suppose if earthquake is a move too and is chargeable then it wouldn't be right to have more than one charge move. But gaia is a really cool move.
Up b could possibly be meteor strike or whatever its name was. But then again, they might go with vines, since Isaac sometimes uses those, even though Ivysaur will have the exact same move. I do like teleport though.

Hey, just had a thought about Isaac. It would be great if he was unlockable, and that he battled you at some point in the SSE. Think about he, he could be fighting for the Subspace Army, but not really know the whole truth. He fights you, then if you beat him it's like you tell him that the Subsapce army are bad, what you are doing is good, then he joins you. Be similar to Lost Age, though something only the fans would get. Heh, I am listening to boss music from the original, so I am thinking epic standards here.

 

[Rhubarbo]

I don't like those B moves...

B> Flint: Isaac jumps in the air, then homes towards the foe.
Bv Ragnarok: It is less exagerated than it is in the actuall game, and moves slightly quicker.
B^ Growth/Retreat
B Spire: Similar to Zelda's B, but it bursts from underneet the foe.

FS Judgement

 

[raphtmarqui]

Isaac definitely needs Grand Gaia in his moveset.

 

[ledhead]

I would love to see Issac be the final boss of Classic, when the player finds out that Master Hand was Issac's Psyenergy hand all along.

 

[Magically Enhanced Hobo]

This probably wouldn't work, but has anybody thought of using the vines for an Up+B? Sadly, it'd probably end up being more like Marth's or Link's Up+B, just some generic upward slash.

 

[Your Hero]

I would love to see Issac be the final boss of Classic, when the player finds out that Master Hand was Issac's Psyenergy hand all along.

All playable characters in ssb series : trophy-like toys
Master Hand: The kid's hand that plays with the toys
Crazy Hand: The kid's other hand that plays with the toys.

The fact that the kid can play with four trophies at a time kind of surprises me, unless if he's some sort of super-freak :|

 

[error_alt_delete]

All playable characters in ssb series : trophy-like toys
Master Hand: The kid's hand that plays with the toys
Crazy Hand: The kid's other hand that plays with the toys.

The fact that the kid can play with four trophies at a time kind of surprises me, unless if he's some sort of super-freak :|

you brought the song "super freak!" to my mind....

and yes I was wondering that too, but then again, this world IS his imagination

but ya, Isaac can fill many roles in the sunspace emissary since we know so little about it.

his ^B I would think could be him lifting hiself with the big hand thing.

 

[Boofer]

Anybody have a list of Isaac's moves (and descriptions) from Golden Sun? It's been so long since I've played it, I can't remember most of his moves.

 

[SmashChu]

This probably wouldn't work, but has anybody thought of using the vines for an Up+B? Sadly, it'd probably end up being more like Marth's or Link's Up+B, just some generic upward slash.

The vine could work well.

There aren't that many characters with UpB Tether recoveries. Hmmm.

 

[Aqua Rock X]

I support Issac for Brawl. I just recently caught up in this thread, so I'm just now posting. I thought his chances were minimal, but after reading through this thread, I have more faith in his appearence. I didn't read the rumors clearly enough, beacuse I didn't know Nintendo themselves wanted camelot to produce a third game. That combined with the fact that Issac got multiple mentions from Sakurai leads me to believe he'll be in Brawl in some form, most preferably playable. It's been awhile since I've played GS so I can't make a moveset at this time.

I would also go with Felix (though I want Issac slightly more), GS needs playable representation in Brawl.


ISSAC FOR BRAWL!!!

 

[Your Hero]

I support Issac for Brawl. I just recently caught up in this thread, so I'm just now posting. I thought his chances were minimal, but after reading through this thread, I have more faith in his appearence. I didn't read the rumors clearly enough, beacuse I didn't know Nintendo themselves wanted camelot to produce a third game. That combined with the fact that Issac got multiple mentions from Sakurai leads me to believe he'll be in Brawl in some form, most preferably playable. It's been awhile since I've played GS so I can't make a moveset at this time.

I would also go with Felix (though I want Issac slightly more), GS needs playable representation in Brawl.


ISSAC FOR BRAWL!!!

I'd personally prefer felix over issac, but I dont mind ig It's issac instead, since he will basically be Roy's replacement (haitstyle wise).

Dont forget that there's a composer from Golden Sun in the Brawl Musicians list.

 

[Aqua Rock X]

I'd personally prefer felix over issac, but I dont mind ig It's issac instead, since he will basically be Roy's replacement (haitstyle wise).

Dont forget that there's a composer from Golden Sun in the Brawl Musicians list.

Yes, that only adds to his chances. And between the djinn, the summons, the magic, and even weapons he's got great moveset potential. I mean, he can summon a meteor for a normal attack! (Meggido right?) And yeah, I think Judgement would be an excellent Final Smash.

 

[Boofer]

Yes, that only adds to his chances. .

Yeah, but it doesn't mean he won't be an assist trophy (which I think would be a stupid mistake). Isaac has the potential to be a great character.

 

[Aqua Rock X]

Yeah, but it doesn't mean he won't be an assist trophy (which I think would be a stupid mistake). Isaac has the potential to be a great character.

You've got a point, that concerns me too. I can't shake off the possibility of Issac appearing for 5-10 secs to summon Meggido or a Djinni.

Still, I believe December will bring a whole mess of new characters. Here's hoping one of them is Issac.

 

[Bassoonist]

If Isaac is an AT I will give up on this game. Really only a few of the new characters interest me, and the boring updates as of late have really killed my hype for the game.

Unfortunately, I can see it happening. Isaac isn't one of those "shoe-in" characters. This is why I want to know whether he's playable or not ASAP. December needs to bring with it the announcement of Isaac as playable. It's going to be a really stressful month for me.

 

[firedragon_jing]

All the Isaac supporters go here and vote for him
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=125751

 

[Arteen]

I still quite like this moveset i made ages ago. I've changed a couple of things. It only incorporates elements from the first game.
<snip>

I'm not really a fan of the down or up B moves. Both of those are very similar to Mewtwo's moves, and I don't think that having two non-damaging specials would be that fun. Halting moves (Jiggly's B^, DK's B>, Mewtwo's BV) never seem to be that useful or fun anyway.

My B-moveset:
B-up: Megiddo - Isaac leaps up and swipes with a giant molten sphere, like in the game.
B-neutral: Ragnarok - Ethereal sword slams down like in the game.
B-down: Grand Gaia - I have no strong opinion on what this move should be, but Grand Gaia would be fine.
B-side: Hover - It would be similar to a long wavedash and Fox/Falco's B-forward. Isaac would essentially wavedash horizontally for some distance, and he could attack during it. If done in the air, he would still slide horizontally in the air. He would only be able to do it once in the air, but he would be able to jump (if he still has a jump left) or recover afterward. I would make a very nice second recovery option.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

I'm not really a fan of the down or up B moves. Both of those are very similar to Mewtwo's moves, and I don't think that having two non-damaging specials would be that fun. Halting moves (Jiggly's B^, DK's B>, Mewtwo's BV) never seem to be that useful or fun anyway.

My B-moveset:
B-up: Megiddo - Isaac leaps up and swipes with a giant molten sphere, like in the game.
B-neutral: Ragnarok - Ethereal sword slams down like in the game.
B-down: Grand Gaia - I have no strong opinion on what this move should be, but Grand Gaia would be fine.
B-side: Hover - It would be similar to a long wavedash and Fox/Falco's B-forward. Isaac would essentially wavedash horizontally for some distance, and he could attack during it. If done in the air, he would still slide horizontally in the air. He would only be able to do it once in the air, but he would be able to jump (if he still has a jump left) or recover afterward. I would make a very nice second recovery option.

I would disagree on M2's disable not being fun. Nothing like tricking your opponent into an attack, wavedashing back and forward into a disable, it's so much fun! xD (I don't claim to be any good at it, but it's awesome anyway =D)

Fair enough, I could agree on the down B changing, but I would stick with WindSquirrel's suggestion of Quake Sphere for it.

As for Retreat, it's one of an Earth Adepts signature moves, throughout both games. I think it's worth it, despite a few characters possessing similar moves. Of course, none of these moves have to work as I imagine them. They could all have entirely different properties, yet still, essentially, represent the same move from the GS games.

Also Megiddo as an Up special could work, I guess. It would have to be toned down alot though from how it looked in the game, which is why it might work better as a Final Smash. Also, it seems a little out of place as a recovery move. Fair enough, it would gain Isaac some height, but something about unleashing a giant ball of fire downwards, at the end, doesn't seem to fit too well. What if you want to just grab the edge to get back on: "I must grab the ledge!" *jumps* "Aha, I have it, but I must fire my giant sphere of fire before I catch it! RAWR!!!" *Fires giant sphere of fire...* *falls*

I think Ragnarok is more suited to being a side special, because it seems largely directional, whereas Grand Gaia, and Quake Sphere don't have to be. They seem to suit Neutral Special and Down Special respectively, rather well. They can both occur in the characters position. Of course they don't have to.

I don't really like the suggestion of Hover, it seems, a little, out of place.

 

[raphtmarqui]

Psynergy Seal would be a cool attack. Isaac could put that Seal over their head (like in the game) and then they couldnt use any B moves for a short time.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

Psynergy Seal would be a cool attack. Isaac could put that Seal over their head (like in the game) and then they couldnt use any B moves for a short time.

Hey, that's pretty original, nothing like it at the moment. Although, how would it work? Would there be a recharge time, so it couldn't be abused?

Would it be that useful, bearing in mind, a lot of the offensive attacks from a character come from their A moves?

EDIT: I think I figured out it's greatest use - stopping the enemy from recovering, then knocking them out.

Dave

 

[AlbelNox]

Theeere is a bad new round there:

Super Smash Bros Menu 1:
Composition Supervisor: Hirokazu Ando
Arrangement Supervisor: Motoi Sakuraba

So Sakuraba being a musician doesn't raises Isaac chances...

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

Theeere is a bad new round there:



So Sakuraba being a musician doesn't raises Isaac chances...

Personally, I've never thought the whole musician thing, had much to do with chances.

Even if a song is confirmed from Sakuraba, who says there is only one?
It could represent any number of songs really. And if any more are Golden Sun related, who says it has to be representation in the form of a playable character.

I'm almost entirely sure, that if the characters and music of Golden Sun are owned by Nintendo, there will be some sort of representation. That, I have no doubt what-so-ever. I just fear for Isaac and Golden Sun being represented with a playable character. Nothing except a confirmation, can assure me of that.

Chances, whether true or not, are meaningless IMHO (at least in this context). Although I guess they serve to give some hope. The greatest boost for his "chances", was the revelation, that Nintendo, owns the rights to the characters and music, as seen in the credits scene of the original Golden Sun.

In which case I honestly think Nintendo would be complete idiots, not to represent Golden Sun, and rather foolish not to represent the games with a playable character in Brawl.

Dave

 

[Rubydragon]

The moveset potential for this guy is endless! I'll see if I can make up my own moveset for him soon.

 

[AlbelNox]

IF there were to be another GS characters, which one do you think it would be?

I thought Jenna would be the better for that. Because, you know, she wouldn't be a clone (Felix would, you know it), she's a rather relevant character (she's the only one of the Lost Age that was playable in the first game), she has her own battle music, she's a woman...

Well, I think that, if there are two GS reps, they would be Isaac and Jenna. What do you think?

 

[Your Hero]

Alex would be the second, unless if they want to add another girl PC, then in that case it would be jenna.

 

[Dave the Perspicacious]

IF there were to be another GS characters, which one do you think it would be?

I thought Jenna would be the better for that. Because, you know, she wouldn't be a clone (Felix would, you know it), she's a rather relevant character (she's the only one of the Lost Age that was playable in the first game), she has her own battle music, she's a woman...

Well, I think that, if there are two GS reps, they would be Isaac and Jenna. What do you think?

And she also uses a staff/rod as a weapon good sir! =D

I would love for it to be Alex! He's just so badass, has that awesome levitation and teleport thing going for him, and has amazing mercury psynergy (I assume he does anyway xD).

Isaac and Alex, both playable... Wow. I would honestly, explode with delight.

Dave

 

[AlbelNox]

And she also uses a staff/rod as a weapon good sir! =D

I would love for it to be Alex! He's just so badass, has that awesome levitation and teleport thing going for him, and has amazing mercury psynergy (I assume he does anyway xD).

Isaac and Alex, both playable... Wow. I would honestly, explode with delight.

Dave

Though I prefer having Jenna, Alex would be pretty good. He being a villain and all that stuff increases his chances indeed. And remember, he's the only one in the whole series who can modify his own thoughts when you read his mind xDDD