Isaac for DLC - One day. Some day. Golden Sunday.

[RhymesWithEmpty]

Also.. I see some people wanting Felix in over Isaac, and even Alex to represent the villain.. but come on! It's Isaac / Matthew or it's nothin'!

Yeah, I readily acknowledge that it's either going to be Isaac or Matthew, or nobody at all, but that doesn't stop me from liking Felix more than both of them! He's

Spoiler

like a playable antihero - he lives up in the northern wastelands for a number of years, makes a pact with the Proxians to protect his family, has a sweet mask at the beginning of the first game, jumps off a freakin' lighthouse to save Sheba, fights pirates, survives practically drowning after getting a giant boulder dropped on him, survives a tidal wave, defeats Poseidon to discover the entrance to a hidden ancient civilization, sticks to his guns and keeps trying to return alchemy to Weyard even with what is essentially the living embodiment of God trying to stop him

...ok, some of those apply to multiple party members, but c'mon, we all know that Felix is a BAMF

That said, yeah, him, Isaac and Matthew are pretty interchangeable, but he doesn't really stand a chance compared to them. He could very easily be an AT if one of them got in, though, and I would be quite satisfied with that.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

People support Isaac yet don't want to contribute to this thread at all? BS. (-=´l-);

You know what I hope Sakurai won't be pulling off when adding Isaac? Making him possess Psynergy-attacks from his partners like he did for Ness. It would really go against the logic from his games.

 

[kisamefishfries]

I've been hoping I would see this thread. I really hope Issac is in the next game.

 

[MelMoe]

I plan to post a moveset & color swaps in the near future.

I think the reason people don't post a lot in this thread is because most consider him a shoe-in & that his moveset & playstyle isn't hard to imagine.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I know but I don't see why they won't talk about what he'd bring in the game as enthutiastically as the other character threads...

 

[Deleted member]

Fantastic OP there N3ON. Isaac is a great choice for a new character and I would be all for his inclusion in SSB4.

Shame that Pac-Man is beating out Isaac.

 

[Opossum]

In the poll, you mean, SSBF? I wouldn't worry too much about that. Sure Isaac mainly has Western Popularity, but didn't Diddy Kong as well, pre Brawl? Not to mention how unique he could be.

 

[Deleted member]

In the poll, you mean, SSBF? I wouldn't worry too much about that. Sure Isaac mainly has Western Popularity, but didn't Diddy Kong as well, pre Brawl? Not to mention how unique he could be.

I was referring to how Pac-Man's support group had more replies than that of this group. That's the disappointment.

 

[deuxhero]

I made a moveset for Isaac that aimed for minimal use of his sword a while ago

I even stuck entirely to Psynergy he can use (except Fireball/Slap which he could if he was playable in DD and Frost which he can't get the higher versions of)

Spoiler

Special note: Isaac can move while a lot of his attacks are still in progress, encouraging him to act as a mobile combo focused combatant,

Colors
Blue: Standard
Red: Red tunic with brown armor
Green: Brown pants and green armor
Special: Matthew
Special 2: Felix

Entrance: Reforms as if at the end of retreat or teleport.
Taunt 1: Isaac uses Scoop and the floaty hand digs in the ground. When items are on, this may rarely find something
Taunt 2: Isaac tries to use Cloak, but, lacking shadows, the Cloak fails instantly.
Taunt 3: A ! appears over Isaac and he jumps up and down.
Win Music: GS victory fanfare
Win pose:
Lose pose: Isaac kneels as though at critical HP

A+a+a: Isaac's weapon glows and unleashs combat dance ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WveU9_07vz0 @1:50).
Right Tilt: .Spire: A pointy piece of rock appears above and in front of Isaac and drops down: Grass damage
Up Tilt: Growth: Plants appear from the ground and attack above Isaac's head : Grass damage.
Down Tilt: Gale: A small tornado appears in front of Isaac. Enemies near its sides are launched to the sides, but ones in the center are launched upward: Electric damage
Right Smash: Fire ball: Isaac sticks out his hand: When charging is released, fireball(s) flow from his hand depending on how long the charge was held, with distance and vertical size of the hitbox also increasing with charge: Fire damage
Up Smash: Frost: A frozen pillar emerges from the ground, with size and length the pillar remains increasing with charge, Isaac and allies may use the pillar as a platform while it remains. Ice Damage
Down Smash: Gaia appears centered at Isaac's feet, hitting targets up to at least his waist with upward flying rocks. Charges increase sizes and residual effect of the blast: Grass damage
Dash Attack: A leaping slash (standard attack)

Grab: The big white hand from various utility psynergy appears, grabs the opponent, then hovers slightly above the ground
Pumel: The hand crushes the person it is holding
Down Throw: Pound: A 2nd hand appears and slams down on the foe as a fist.
Up Throw: Carry: A 2nd hand appears and with the first hand they do an upward chuck
Back Throw: Slap: A 2nd hand appears and slaps the foe
Forward Throw: Ragnarok: Ragnarok's sword comes and impales the foe: Grass Damage

Nair: Planet Diver: Isaac gets covered in flames/reentry GFX, damaging what he runs into while keeping his momentum. Fire Damage
Dair: Helm Splitter: A "sex kick" with Isaac's sword
Uair: Quick Strike: Isaac disappears briefly and a horizontal slash appears above him. He then reppears (the disappear lacks any mechanical effect and Isaac can still be damaged during this time): Electric damage
Bair: Saber Dance: A cloud of blades appear behind Issac and travel with him.
Fair: Annihilation: Isaac strikes forward with his sword, if it connects, horobiru/to destroy; appears. Sometimes "critical" and korosu/to kill will appear with higher damage/knockback

Neutral Special: Megiddo: A small planatoid appears, growing in size as long as b is held. When b is released, the object is launched. Moving the control stick while b is held adjust the angle launched at. (A guideline appears showing what direction it will go in): Grass damage.
Right Special: Thorny Grave: A ghost flys away from Isaac. Normally travels right and disppears if it hits a solid object, it has limited homing abilitiy, but can't make sharp turns. Does no damage, but "haunts" the foe, dealing damage every time they attack
Down Special: Titan Blade: A large blade crashes down from the sky, similar to Pikachu's thunder: Grass damage.
Up special: Hover: The hover graphic appears at Isaac's feat and allows him to walk on air for some time. Can be ended (double jump off it or up-b again) and restarted in the same jump, but maintains the same timer. WHen in hover, ground moves are used instead of aerials.


Final Smash: Iris: Iris appears and all enemies are launched into the sky with heavy fire damage, while Isaac is restored to 0%.

 

[JPW]

In the poll, you mean, SSBF? I wouldn't worry too much about that. Sure Isaac mainly has Western Popularity, but didn't Diddy Kong as well, pre Brawl? Not to mention how unique he could be.

regardless of poll results or not. I saw Diddy as a shoe in from day one. Much like Ike.

Isaac. It depends how long Golden Sun could go on i guess.
I love Golden Sun. So i would love it if at least one of them Isaac, Felix, Matthew or Alex(I would love it especially) could make the list.

It breaks my heart whenever i see Preowned copies of DD at Ebgames or Jb hfi..

 

[N3ON]

Fantastic OP there N3ON. Isaac is a great choice for a new character and I would be all for his inclusion in SSB4.

Shame that Pac-Man is beating out Isaac.

Thanks! I've been a mix of busy and away (which is why its taken me over a week to reply to this ) so I haven't got to update it, but I still plan to.

In the poll, you mean, SSBF? I wouldn't worry too much about that. Sure Isaac mainly has Western Popularity, but didn't Diddy Kong as well, pre Brawl? Not to mention how unique he could be.

I think that Diddy had quite a lot of Japanese support as well, even if he was a western-created character, similar to K. Rool and Dixie for SSB4. Currently, Isaac unfortunately seems to be getting almost all of his popularity from the west (as opposed to Diddy's worldwide popularity). While Sakurai will probably look at solely western character popularity more than he did with previous Smashes when creating this roster, I think Little Mac and Ridley out popularize Isaac as characters with mostly western demand. Not to say Little Mac and Ridley will cause Isaac not to be included, but I think Sakurai will try to appease the most fans as possible and limit the amount of characters popular in only certain regions (like how he limits characters that are Japanese-only).

Isaac's (and Golden Sun in general) decline in Japanese popularity is very saddening, pre-Brawl Isaac had quite a bit more Japanese support, IIRC.

I was referring to how Pac-Man's support group had more replies than that of this group. That's the disappointment.

I agree it is disappointing that this support group doesn't get more... support, but I don't think that the number of posts in a support thread necessarily indicate popularity and demand for the character. For the most part, character threads with a lot of posts usually indicate something controversial about the character's inclusion in Smash, whether they be improbable or very unlikely, competition from a different character from the same series (or company), competition between companies, too big (), or just a ridiculous choice. Because Isaac doesn't really fall into any of these categories, people either support him or they don't; there isn't really as much to debate about him. At least, IMO.

And good moveset, deuxhero!

 

[Diddy Kong]

I made a B moveset for Isaac with great detail but it was in the old thread, so I lost it. :/

Anyway, this is what it looked like:

B: Ragnarok / Oddessey (strong automatical attack, like the Falcon Punch)
Side B: Spire / Clay Spire / Stone Spire (charge up attack)
Down B: Gaia / Mother Gaia / Great Gaia (charge up attack as well)
Up B: Growth (much like Ivysaur's Up B, but you climb on it like it's a laddar)

 

[Opossum]

I made a B moveset for Isaac with great detail but it was in the old thread, so I lost it. :/

Anyway, this is what it looked like:

B: Ragnarok / Oddessey (strong automatical attack, like the Falcon Punch)
Side B: Spire / Clay Spire / Stone Spire (charge up attack)
Down B: Gaia / Mother Gaia / Great Gaia (charge up attack as well)
Up B: Growth (much like Ivysaur's Up B, but you climb on it like it's a laddar)

I was bored, felt like giving life into the Isaac thread, and wanted to be a good person, so here you go Diddy. I found it.

B: Ragnarok. Isaac / Matthew charge up their blade similary in fashion like the FE characters would (but with no freedom of letting go like them) and casts a huge sword-like projectile out of it about a Bowser and a half wide (with an awesome sweetspot in the very middle) about 2 characters in front of him. The move would be as slow almost as Ganondorf's Warlock Punch, but has around the same knockback (weaker still) and does a whopping 28~32% when sweetspotted. 19~22% if a little off, 10~14% at the very end of the move). The move would probably have some super armor as well at the last few frames of the move.


Up B: Growth. Plants grow out of the ground to attack, or grow around a ledge for Isaac to climb back to the stage (working similary to a ladder). The plants would cause a slight sort of trapping effect, and do around 5% damage, but could be a good set up for a stronger attack. The higher the other character's %, the longer they stay trapped kinda similar to how ZZS's stun works, but this one is somewhat weaker. You can escape the plants by jumping.


Side B: I'd want to put Move here, but I kinda dislike the idea of it being an attack for him so... I say this should be Stone Spire, a ranged charge up move involving stone spires falling out of the sky on an opponent. If charged for a little, just one Spire comes out, and does about 12~14% damage, and could be considered as Isaac's main projectile, as it'd be coming out as fast as PK Fire would (except it being slightly stronger and with shorter range). Charged up somewhat longer and Isaac would cast 2 Spires next to each other, each doing about 12~14% damage. Charged up fully Isaac would cast a total of 4 Spires, and the effect would be similar to Charizard's Rock Smash on earlier %s, and would have nice knockback.


Down B: Gaia. A moveable projectile you can aim at the ground, where you can create an earthy erruption out of when releasing B. Like Stone Spire, you can actually build up damage as well when holding B, but this one lacks the sheer power you can build up with Stone Spire, but it can trap better, and requires a little more skill even. It's a option only usable on SOLID ground, so not on small platforms, it can also be done around edges, but not OVER the edges as it needs ground to be preformed. And it's strongest or most effective when a character is on the ground as well. It's actually like a moveable mine of sorts, and can be as strong depending on how long you hold B. It's the same kind of story with Stone Spire, hold B briefly and release and Gaia would be a small erruption, covering about 1.5 a Mario wide and does 11~14% if the opponent gets trapped in fully. Hold it longer and you'd have Mother Gaia which'd already cover 3 Mario's wide and could do 16~18%, hold if for the longest and you have Grand Gaia, which is a massive attack doing 23~27% and delivers great knockback if the opponents gets trapped in the move fully. As a general rule with this move, the stones comming out of the erruption do the building up damage, would work KIND OF similar to the Smart Bombs.


General playstyle of Isaac would be harder to learn than most characters, as his ranged attacks are his biggest assets. His Psynergy is rather slow, but are very good setups, a small Gaia spell could be cast into a stronger Spire spell, or otherwise. He'd be highly unpredictable, but at the same time, rather slow and furnable while casting spells. He wouldn't like projectile spam himself either, but Isaac has a strong big shield to protect himself with (like, Mewtwo's big shield but slightly smaller) and a normal Spire would be fast enough to counter back with most of the time.

He's highly versitale in his B moves, and his A moves would mostly consist of sword attacks. His sword would be a little longer than Toon Link's, and are mostly swift attacks with only a few moves you can effectively kill with. As a Venus Adept he fights the best on the ground, and would perhaps have a below average aerial game and jumps. He also would be a tad lighter than Marth, but shorter as well. He would mainly be good at egdeguarding, and KOing characters from the side of the screen, not from the top. His grab game is above average though and his throws go far and do good damage, and could possibly be ranged if they implenent the Move ability from him in it (it wouldn't go as far as in Brawl, but rather about a character in front of him) to counter these seeminly broken grabs, if Isaac would miss a grab, there is some serious lag involved. His running speed is about as fast as Luigi's, maybe a little faster even. Overall he's a character you have to play with smarts, but he can be highly effective if used well. His Psynergy is powerful and great for setting up combos, but he's still rather fragile, and even though he has some speed you have to watch out for lag often.

EDIT: As a Final Smash, it must be Judgement: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_iHwgkwtMUY

The pictures wouldn't stay, though.

 

[RhymesWithEmpty]

Thought my fellow Isaac supporters might enjoy this; http://www.awkwardzombie.com/index.php?page=0&comic=073012

Good to see Golden Sun getting some fan recognition outside of this forum, heh.

 

[TheJohnMonster]

I finally saw him as the assist trophy and he was awesome, then I looked him up and watched some videos and he is awesome. He would be great in smash.

 

[N3ON]

^^^Great to have as many Isaac supporters as we can! I really feel that the more people that watch or play Golden Sun, the more support Isaac would get. Shame that the series seems to be on hiatus once again. Hopefully the next one (whenever or if ever it comes out), will be at the level the first two were at.

Also, good moveset Diddy! And thanks for finding the expanded version, Opossum! I never thought about a character creating a ladder as their recovery, but with the ladder mechanic already in place, it really makes a lot of sense. I might add it to the OP later, if that's ok.

Thought my fellow Isaac supporters might enjoy this; http://www.awkwardzombie.com/index.php?page=0&comic=073012

Good to see Golden Sun getting some fan recognition outside of this forum, heh.

I actually never thought about that, but it is pretty funny.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Opossum, many thanks!

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

You know, water being mercury also doesn't make much sense. Considering it's the closest planet to the sun.

Water being Neptune might make sense since Neptune was the Roman god of the sea

 

[JPW]

I think the only reason why it was on hiatus was because Nintendo wanted a Mario Tennis from Camelot. And maybe a Mario Golf too. I'm hoping by the end of 2013 they get back to Golden Sun. I don't know how much longer i can wait.

 

[Opossum]

Opossum, many thanks!

No problem. For a cause as important as Isaac, nothing is too much to do. Especially when you're bored.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I think the only reason why it was on hiatus was because Nintendo wanted a Mario Tennis from Camelot. And maybe a Mario Golf too. I'm hoping by the end of 2013 they get back to Golden Sun. I don't know how much longer i can wait.

Well, I want a Mario Golf. We never got one

 

[JPW]

they're probably working on Mario Golf now.

 

[deuxhero]

Hopefully with a single player mode like the GBC and GBA games.

 

[N3ON]

Just a reminder that today is Isaac's day in the rate the chances thread. Remember to go there are share your Isaac support!

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=325516

 

[N3ON]

Phew, ok. Just added a new section (What Are His Chances?) with a list of pros and cons, some arguments and counter arguments, as well as an awesome hypothetical GS Smash icon made by Onyx Oblivian. Also did some minor edits to the rest.

So read through them, and if you think of anything to add, or you want criticize something I wrote, then feel free!

Happy now, disfunk?!

 

[Deleted member]

I wonder where Move should be implemented into. Perhaps it could work as a Side Smash?

As for the arguments, those are some really good arguments there. I'm not sure where people get their info that Little Mac is more wanted in the West, but eh.

This one is one argument that's important to cover. Coming straight from the dojo.

Assist Trophies allow you to enjoy even more characters who couldn’t quite make it as playable fighters.

This one can be used by detractors in that Assist Trophy characters won't be made into playable characters, mainly focusing on the "couldn't quite make it" part.

One possible argument against this you can use is that Sakurai only stated this only for Brawl and there is no indication that this will carry on for Assist Trophy characters.

There is also the matter of Sakurai only mentioning that Animal Crosser and Pikmin being worthy of a rep for Brawl. Mention how Golden Sun breaks the mold for this post-Brawl and as such, can be considered important enough to get in.

 

[N3ON]

I wonder where Move should be implemented into. Perhaps it could work as a Side Smash?

I think a Side Smash would be one option, although it would be a much smaller hand, and travel a very short distance. That would still be pretty cool though. I think the other two possible options are as a side special (in which it would work similarly to the AT effect except a little smaller and a lot less distance -- and wouldn't do damage, as I'm assuming the Side Smash would), or using the move hand to execute throws (though that would be more Catch/Carry/Grab than Move, though it's still the same hand. )

Another idea would be to not have Move or the hand as part of Isaac's moveset at all, but rather replace Isaac's AT with someone like Felix, who would work the same way.

 

[Deleted member]

I think a Side Smash would be one option, although it would be a much smaller hand, and travel a very short distance. That would still be pretty cool though. I think the other two possible options are as a side special (in which it would work similarly to the AT effect except a little smaller and a lot less distance -- and wouldn't do damage, as I'm assuming the Side Smash would), or using the move hand to execute throws (though that would be more Catch/Carry/Grab than Move, though it's still the same hand. )

Another idea would be to not have Move or the hand as part of Isaac's moveset at all, but rather replace Isaac's AT with someone like Felix, who would work the same way.

Well, if we are going to get Isaac/Matthew as a playable character and the move set isn't integrated into Isaac/Matthew, I'd say that having the vice versa have the Move would be a better idea since they are father/son, but that's just me.

 

[Deleted member]

There is also the matter of Sakurai only mentioning that Animal Crosser and Pikmin being worthy of a rep for Brawl. Mention how Golden Sun breaks the mold for this post-Brawl and as such, can be considered important enough to get in.

How does Dark Dawn break the mold? It did worse than the previous two games, and those two games were not enough to convince Sakurai to add Isaac.
If they didn't, Dark Dawn sure won't.

 

[JPW]

I actually liked Dark Dawn. I don't see why so many are critical for it.

And what should of happened with Golden Sun was they should of never had such a huge break for a third instlament they should of created games whilst they were hot rather than waste a decade of nothing on it. That's probably why it lost the appeal. The wait was too long.

I found waiting 10 years hard enough. lol. Still loved it though.

 

[Sqid]

\
Golden Sun
[COLLAPSE="Expand"]

[/COLLAPSE]

Some icons made by Onyx Oblivian in this thread (http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=326025), thought they should be posted here for those who haven't seen them.

 

[N3ON]

I already have the first icon added, and I'll add the second once I add more content to the OP (right now it's already a little image heavy IMO). Onyx did a very good job with them though.

 

[jigglover]

Neon, I have an argument that is used so often, you have to include it in the OP!
Isaac is a ground type Pokemon. Now before you say that he uses plants as well, he can be a torterra, a ground/grass type!

 

[N3ON]

I have no argument against that. It's a flawless point. And now that Isaac has to compete with all the other Pokemon, he most certainly won't get in SSB4.

Now if you'll excuse me I'm off to go catch a wild Isaac.

 

[jigglover]

I have no argument against that. It's a flawless point. And now that Isaac has to compete with all the other Pokemon, he most certainly won't get in SSB4.

Now if you'll excuse me I'm off to go catch a wild Isaac.

Yeah? Well I've got a shiny Isaac!

 

[Altais]

Being one of mine favourite RPG series of all time, I would love to see Isaac from Golden Sun appear in the upcoming Smash title, maybe along with Felix. Though I do find his Dark Dawn outfit pretty cool, I would very much prefer his younger appearance from the previous games. Oh, and just like in the original Golden Sun, I hope Isaac (if he does get in Smash Bros) has absolutely NO dialogue.

I will consider writing a detailed move set for Isaac (I already have an up-special and onscreen appearance in mind), though it would probably take me quite a while, given the many options Isaac has.

[EDIT] GAH...for some reason, it always bugs me when I end up starting a new page.

[EDIT] I threw together this move set last night. I will admit, it was a tad rushed, so pardon me if it is a little flawed or unbalanced. Anyhow, here it is:

[COLLAPSE="Isaac Move Set"] Index:

1). Regular Attack
2). Other Moves & Actions
3). Tilt Attacks
4). Smash Attacks
5). Aerial Attacks
6). Special Moves
7). Grab Attacks
8). Taunts, Poses, Etc.
9). Final Smash



[COLLAPSE="1). Regular Attack (or "jab")"]• Jab 1: Isaac performs a two-handed downward vertical slash that knocks the opponent away a little, but keeps him/her in range for a combo.
• Jab 2: Isaac brings his sword up with a second vertical slash that knocks the opponent away a little, but keeps him/her within arm’s length.

• Regular Attack (with item): Isaac performs a swift two-handed vertical slash with the weapon. Damage, speed, and knockback depend on what item Isaac is wielding.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="2). Other Moves & Actions"]Note: In terms of speed, weight, and power, Isaac is very much like Roy.

• Initial Jump Animation & Height: Isaac leaps into the air with his sword hand relaxed and free hand balled into a fist and held close to his waist. Has about the same height and distance as Roy’s jump. Isaac descends with his arms spread and feet close together.

• Initial Jump Animation & Height (backward): Isaac leaps backward with his arms spread and feet close together. About the same height and distance as Roy’s jump.

• Secondary Jump Animation & Height: Isaac does a quick somersault. About as high and far as Roy’s double-jump.

• Secondary Jump Animation & Height (backward): Isaac does a quick back flip. About as high and far as Roy’s double-jump.

• Spot Dodge Animation & Duration: With his sword sheathed and hand still on the hilt, Isaac leans to the side with his free hand held out in front of him. A tiny bit shorter than Ike’s spot dodge.

• Air Dodge Animation & Duration: Isaac spins his body with his sword pointed downward and his free hand held out in front of him. Roughly as long as Ike’s air dodge.

• Dash Attack: Isaac cuts through and past the opponent with blinding speed. The attack sends the opponent flying straight upwards. Instant startup.

• Dash Attack (with item): Isaac leaps upward a tiny bit and performs a strong two-handed vertical strike. Damage, speed, and knockback depend on what item Isaac is wielding.

• Get-up Attack (face up): Isaac performs a quick, but weak, low vertical slash in front of him, then a weak thrust behind him.

• Get-up Attack (face down): Isaac thrusts his Sol Blade in front of him, then behind him. Not particularly powerful.

• Edge Climb Attack: Isaac performs a quick, but weak, backhand horizontal slash.

• Second Edge Climb Attack (when damage percent is high): Isaac performs a weak and slightly slow diagonal slash.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="3). Tilt Attacks"]• Forward Tilt: Isaac lunges forward, performing a swift two-handed vertical slash that knocks the opponent away. Good horizontal and vertical range. Slightly slow startup. Inflicts a decent amount of damage. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.

• Forward Tilt (with item): Isaac lunges forward, performing a swift two-handed horizontal strike. Damage, speed, and knockback depend on what item Isaac is wielding.

• Upward Tilt: Isaac swings his Sol Blade over his head, knocking any nearby opponent straight in the air. Like Ike’s up-smash, Isaac’s up-tilt covers his entire body. Great horizontal and vertical range. Very slightly slow startup. Inflicts a decent amount of damage. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.

• Downward Tilt: Isaac thrusts his Sol Blade along the floor at the opponent. Great horizontal range, but very little vertical range. Quick startup. Inflicts a decent amount of damage, and pushes the opponent back a good distance. Good for “spacing”. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="4). Smash Attacks"]• Forward Smash: Isaac performs two gust-fast two-handed strikes, the first of which cuts through the opponent, dealing a good amount of damage, the second of which sends the opponent flying. Quick, almost instant startup. Can kill at high percentages if charged. As this move is charging, a tiny purple ghostly creature shaped like a wing can be seen circling Isaac. During the entire attack, Isaac’s sword glows a bright purple. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.

• Forward Smash (with item): Isaac performs a strong two-handed vertical slash. Damage, speed, and knockback depend on what item Isaac is wielding.

• Upward Smash: Isaac balls his free hand into a fist and then thrusts his hand into the air, palm open. In that same instant, a jet of water and ice bursts from the ground beneath him, knocking any above or adjacent opponent upwards, sometimes briefly freezing them. Slightly slow startup. Good vertical range, but poor horizontal range. Can kill at high percentages, especially if charged. As this move is charging, a tiny blue ghostly creature with a pincer-like tail can be seen circling Isaac--Isaac also has a faint blue aura. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.

• Downward Smash: Isaac raises his sword with both hands and then brings it down to the ground with bone-breaking force, creating a scorching flame that damages opponents multiple times before finally knocking them away. Medium horizontal range, low vertical range. Slightly slow startup. Can kill at high percentages if charged. As this move is charging, a tiny red ghostly creature with horns and a fire-shaped tail can be seen circling Isaac. During the entire attack, Isaac’s sword glows a bright orange. Can be “jab-cancelled” into.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="5). Aerial Attacks"]• Neutral Aerial: Isaac swings his Sol Blade in a circle (similar to Ike’s neutral aerial. Faster than Ike’s, but weaker), knocking away nearby opponents. Slightly slow startup.

• Forward Aerial: Isaac performs a swift two-handed vertical strike that covers the front of his body. Decent horizontal and vertical range. Quick startup. Inflicts a decent amount of damage.

• Backward Aerial: Isaac turns around whilst performing a swift horizontal strike. Decent horizontal range, poor vertical range. Quick startup. Inflicts a decent amount of damage.

• Upward Aerial: Isaac thrusts his palm into the air, and from it unleashes a bright burst of energy. Slightly slow startup. Can kill at high percentages, though a little hard to land.

• Downward Aerial: Isaac performs a downward strike that covers a wide area below him. Somewhat slow startup. Capable of Meteor Smashing (or spiking), though slow startup makes this move predictable.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="6). Special Moves"]• Standard Special (Supernova): Isaac sheaths his sword and thrusts his palm forward, conjuring a ball of magma in front of him that soon explodes. Slightly slow startup. The explosion has a splash effect that damages opponents that are farther away. This move can be charged. The damage, knockback, and radius of the explosion depends on how long the move is charged; if used immediately, it will only make a weak explosion that covers a small area--if fully charged, it will create a strong, wide explosion that can kill at any percentage. Like Ike and Roy’s standard specials, Isaac’s Nova takes a fairly long time to fully charge; Isaac also takes damage if the move is fully charged. Isaac is propelled backward a little after executing this attack.

• Side Special (Astral Blast): Isaac sheaths his sword and thrusts his palm forward, shooting three consecutive star-shaped laser projectiles that expand as they travel. The stars cut through the opponent(s) whilst pushing them away. Fairly quick startup. This move can be charged; the speed and distance at which the stars travel as well as the damage they inflict depends on the duration of the charge.

• Upward Special (Planet Diver): Isaac leaps high into the air (almost as high as King Dedede’s super jump, but a bit lower), then comes diving downward in a straight line, wrapped in a force field of flame. Very slightly slow startup. Isaac’s dive trajectory can be altered from a 70º angle to a 10º angle. If he collides with a person (or object), his force field will explode, sending the opponent flying--however, he will also enter “helpless frames” immediately after. The splash effect of the explosion will also damage nearby enemies a little bit. Can kill at high percentages. The beginning of the move has a “wind effect” that pushes away nearby opponents. As he is diving, Isaac can still take damage from hits, but he will not flinch in the slightest. If he collides with an explosive item during the dive, he will still take damage but will not be knocked back.

• Downward Special (Earthquake): Isaac pumps his free hand into a fist and raises his sword in the air, conjuring an earthquake that damages nearby opponents as well as any opponents on an above platform. Like Donkey Kong’s down-special, this move can be held indefinitely, but it leaves Isaac open for an aerial attack. At the end of the attack, any nearby opponent will be briefly buried into the ground, unless he/she is airborne.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="7). Grab Attacks"]• Grab Animation & Speed: Isaac thrusts his free hand outward, palm open. At the same time, a ghostly hand about as big as Isaac grabs at the opponent. Fairly long range, but slightly slow startup. Dash-grab is a little faster, but has lower range. Pivot grab is fastest and has the longest range. Can be used for “tether recovery”. If this is used on an opponent from the air, instead of grabbing the opponent the hand will knock the opponent away.

• Pummel: The ghostly hand squeezes the opponent as it is wrapped around him/her. Somewhat slow.

• Forward Throw: Isaac twirls his wrist and thrusts his palm outward. At the same time, the ghostly hand sends the opponent flying away with a punch. Right when the hand punches the opponent, it bursts like a firework and disappears. Does a decent amount of damage. Can kill at high percentages if used near the edge of a stage.

• Backward Throw: Isaac turns around and thrusts his palm outward. At the same time, the ghostly hand turns with Isaac, releases the opponent, and sends him/her flying away with a slap. The hand then shrinks and disappears. Does not do too much damage, but it does knock the opponent a fair distance.

• Upward Throw: Isaac brings his palm to his body then thrusts it upward. At the same time, the ghostly hand tosses the opponent above Isaac. Afterwards, a second hand appears and then both hands, palms open, slam into the opponent with a clap. As they make contact, both hands burst like fireworks and disappear. The opponent is send flying upward. Does a decent amount of damage.

• Downward Throw: Isaac raises his palm and thrusts it at the ground. At the same time, the ghostly hand places the opponent on the ground face-up. A second hand then appears. Both hands then clasp together, and as the opponent squirms (similar to Koopa/Bowser’s down-throw) slam down on him/her. As the hands make contact, they burst into a dozen star-shaped bits and disappear. Does a decent amount of damage. The opponent flies upward a little. Can chain-grab certain opponents, depending on their weight and damage percentage.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="8). Taunts, Poses, Etc."]• Up-Taunt: Upon facing the screen, Isaac will sheath his sword and do one of the following: 1) Isaac appears to be thinking, with his left elbow rested on his right forearm--he will then raise his head and index finger, and a white word bubble containing a light bulb will appear over his head with a familiar “Bling!” sound. 2) Isaac, with his feet together and arms to his side, smiles faintly at the screen--at the same time, a white word bubble containing a smiley face will appear above him. 3) Isaac droops his body forward--at the same time a white word bubble containing a sweat icon will appear above him.

• Side-Taunt: Isaac faces the screen, and then a strange tiny brown creature leaps onto his shoulder from beneath his cape. Isaac cups the Djinni with his hand, holding it in front of him with a faint smile. The Djinni then spins in the air and disappears.

• Down-Taunt: Isaac faces the screen, pulls out a large gold coin, and tosses it in the air. As the coin descends, Isaac deftly catches it.

• Victory Pose 1: With his sword sheathed, Isaac raises his fist into the air in triumph, a content smile on his face.

• Victory Pose 2: Facing the screen with a calm, confident expression, Isaac sticks the tip of his Sol Blade into the ground, never letting go of it.

• Victory Pose 3: Nodding to himself in contentment, Isaac then raises both hands into the air and his body begins to glow. He then transforms into a large shining sphere that divides into smaller spheres as it ascends, eventually disappearing from the screen.

• Idle Pose 1: Isaac briefly glances above him.

• Idle Pose 2: Isaac briefly glances from side to side.

• Onscreen Appearance (when the match begins): A myriad of tiny rainbow-coloured spheres gather from all around, forming Isaac’s shape from bottom to top. All the while, Isaac spins in the air. Once Isaac is fully materialized, he lands on the ground and readies his Sol Blade.[/COLLAPSE]



[COLLAPSE="9). Final Smash"]Final Smash (Megiddo): A black message box appears at the bottom of the screen, saying “Isaac’s Sol Blade lets out a howl! Megiddo!” At the same instant, the entire scenery is engulfed in flame, and Isaac leaps sky high. A large meteor falls from the sky, towards Isaac. With both hands on the hilt of his sword, Isaac flies above the meteor, raises his sword, and brings it down on the enflamed rock, sending it plunging to the earth. As the meteor hits the ground, it creates a large explosion that all but engulfs the stage. Any opponent whom is so much as grazed by the meteor or caught in the blast is instantly KO’ed.[/COLLAPSE]
[/COLLAPSE]

 

[Altais]

Sorry for the double-post, but the thread was nearly on the second page, so...(shrugs).

Anyway, I just came up with these stage and Assist Trophy ideas a while ago. For the Assist Trophy, the character I chose was Felix, since he is the main character of the second Golden Sun. I tried to put some imagination into these. Pardon my frequent use of the word "eventually".

[COLLAPSE="Felix Assist Trophy Ideas"]1). Felix performs the Psynergy technique "Move" like Isaac did in Brawl.

2). Felix walks and jumps around the stage for a while. Whenever he gets close to an opponent, he summons a myriad of thorny vines that damage and immobilize the opponent(s). He then raises his sword for a powerful strike--at the same time, a tiny brown ghostly creature briefly appears above him--and brings his sword down on the entangled enemies, dealing a large amount of damage but not knocking them back. Immediately after, Felix's attack "echoes", knocking the opponents a far distance or even KO'ing them, depending on their damage percentage. Right before Felix disappears, he performs a final attack in which he summons several sharp stones and telekinetically hurls them at the opponent(s) (similar to the "Stone Justice" attack in The Lost Age); any opponent hit by the stones will be knocked away or even killed.

3). Felix thrusts his free hand into the air. At the same time, a brown ghostly creature circles around him, and a barrage of bright brown energy balls shoot upward from the ground, knocking any opponents high in the air.[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Stage Ideas"] The Sea of Time:

The players fight on a large winged ship (about as long as the Green Hill Zone stage and as high as the Shadow Moses Island stage) with a dragon-shaped head at the end. At the rear of the ship is a cabin and a mast the players can jump or grab onto. The ship starts off cruising at sea. In the background, many whirlpools, rough currents, and rocks can be seen. The sky is all but blackened by thunder clouds. If a player falls off the ship and into the water, he/she will be swept away and KO'ed, unless he/she acts very quickly. Occasionally, the ship will be rocked by a tide.

Eventually, the ship will take flight--when this happens, for a couple of seconds the ship's wings glow and a distinct humming sound is heard. The players are also briefly blown back by a strong wind. If you are in the water when the ship takes flight, consider yourself screwed. As the ship soars through the air, the scenery is enshrouded in thunder clouds. The thunder clouds eventually clear, leaving the ship soaring in the blue sky.

Eventually, the ship will begin to descend--when this happens, players are suspended in the air and blown back a little until the ship lands. The ship then lands in the open sea. Off in the distance, various continents bearing either grasslands, ice lands, mountains, or deserts, can be seen, along with a few islands and rocks. Eventually, the ship ends up back in the cloud-covered sea with the rough currents.

Rinse and repeat.


Venus Lighthouse:

The match begins atop the lighthouse (this area is roughly as large as the New Pork City stage). There are three major platforms: the large middle platform where the beacon is, and two surrounding platforms that act as elevators. Between the elevator platforms and the beacon platform are a few tiny platforms that descend a little when a player lands on them. Every once in a while, one of the elevators will descend, taking any players that were on it with it to be KO'ed. In the background, surrounding the beacon are four female statues wearing dresses and bearing tree branches. The sky is also blue and a little cloudy.

Eventually, the players will be transported within the lighthouse (similar to the Fire Emblem stage in Brawl). In here there will be three medium-sized floating platforms in a staircase formation. Under the platforms is a river of sand. Players can walk on the sand; however, they will be carried away by it at a fast pace (not like in the Big Blue stage, but nevertheless hazardous) making it a bad spot on which to idle. In the background, dark grey walls and pillars and various mechanisms can be seen.

Eventually, the players will be transported to another area in the lighthouse. This area will be a large cubicle room with a large female statue in the background. The players fight on a flat ground, where only side-screen and star KO's are possible.

Eventually, the players will be brought back to the top of the lighthouse, and the process repeats.


Mars Lighthouse:

The match begins atop the lighthouse (again, the area is about as large as New Pork City). There are three major platforms: the large middle platform where the beacon is, and two surrounding platforms that act as elevators. Between the elevator platforms and the beacon platform are a few tiny platforms that descend a little when a player lands on them. Every once in a while, one of the elevators will descend, taking any players that were on it with it to be KO'ed. In the background, surrounding the beacon are four dragon statues. The sky is also dark, with a snowstorm raging.

Eventually, the players are transported within the lighthouse. In here there will be a single pillar-platform roughly as large as Final Destination. In the middle of the platform are two large, conjoined ice pillars, the left of which bears two ice platforms (one on the top and one near the bottom), the right of which bears only one (in the middle). The ice pillars, along with their platforms, can be destroyed by the players; however, the ice pillars will leave behind a row of icicles that will damage any player whom walks or falls on them.

Eventually, the players are transported to another area in the lighthouse. In here there will be a flat ground, save for two pillar-platforms on either side of the stage. In the background is a large purplish-red room, the floor of which is all but encroached in icicles. Mounted on the far wall is a metal dragon head. Every once in a while the dragon head will shoot a huge fire ball that will hit the center of the stage, taking out any unlucky player.

Eventually, the players will be brought back to the top of the lighthouse, and the process repeats.[/COLLAPSE]

 

[N3ON]

That's a pretty good and fairly detailed moveset Altais, good job. ^_^
The only thing I noticed (and correct me if I'm wrong) is that there isn't much use of Venus and earth-based psynergy other than the down special (and arguably the FS). Not that the moveset is bad or anything, I just think that it's likely that Isaac would probably use mostly Venus psynergy in Smash if he was included. I mean, I don't think that all of his attacks would be Venus (Move is Mars, IIRC) but probably the majority. Really no other qualms though, its a good moveset.

As for Felix, if Isaac is made playable in Smash, and we do still get a GS AT, I think it would come down to him and Matthew (if Matthew wasn't an alt. costume or something). And if Isaac doesn't use some variation of Move in his moveset, than there's a good chance the GS AT would get it. Other than that, there's just so much potential with GS characters, really most AT effects, including yours, would be plausible and work well. Though I'm guessing Sakurai would want to avoid those already in Isaac's moveset.

And as for your stage ideas, they're very good, I'd be happy seeing any of them, although I suspect a Lighthouse is the most likely GS stage possibility. The Sea of Time would work too of course, but I'm guessing that if we get any new ship stage, it will be Gangplank Galleon.

Anyway, these were all good ideas, thanks for contributing!

 

[Altais]

I am glad somebody liked the ideas. I honestly did not think anyone would care much for them.

Yeah, the move set I made does lack some Venus-oriented attacks, now that I think about it. I originally intended to make Isaac's smash attacks earth-based, but I wanted the four elemental Djinn to be represented somehow, and I had already decided on his special moves (for some weird reason, I have always liked Astral Blast in the games, and really wanted to have it in his move set. Part of the reason why I chose Supernova was because I just wanted Isaac's specials to have astronomy-oriented names). I also originally planned to have Flint as Isaac's forward smash, but ultimately chose Gust, and thus ended up putting Flint in Isaac's side-taunt (again, I just wanted to represent all four elemental Djinn).

 

[Sqid]

Yeah, I like the moveset but I'd say only one or two psynergy attacks wouldn't be Venus, and almost all of them would be. I like how the Djinn are incorporated (pale wisp around Isaac's head, floating).
I love the picture you've painted in my head of Isaac's final smash though. Nice job.