Isaac for DLC - One day. Some day. Golden Sunday.

[Oracle_Summon]

Little Mac is the ground-focused newcomer.

Palutena has all those unique specials.

Robin uses a combination of swords and elemental magic.

Shulk has the midmatch stat changes.

I'd hate to think that Isaac was considered redundant...

That would stink, but there are no calling it quits until the full Official Roster is shown September 13th.

 

[Gotann]

Huh? He said that in a Miiverse post? I don't see anything odd with Shulk. Is promoting a Nintendo JRPG bad or something for him? I don't see much difference between Shulk and a Fire Emblem character, not in play style, but in the type of character he is.

Yea, he said it here: https://miiverse.nintendo.net/posts/AYMHAAACAAAYUKlkeWRiCQ
I agree, it doesn't make much sense. Maybe that part wasn't translated properly? :/

Anyways, not giving up in any way. DLC is pretty much a given, so not really worried.
I'm just keeping in mind that anything is possible. Especially when Sakurai tends to do and say some weird things like that.
Though I would still not give up, even if Isaac shows up as an AT, as naive as that may be.

 

[BSTCloud]

There's a bizallion ways to design Isaac around.
He could be a magic swordsman, but Robin's there (he could still be designed completely different though)
He could be a swordsman whose stats change when using certain commands, but Shulk's there (same as upper)

But there's still -and I personally would be okay with- a "mostly glove-psynergy focused" moveset. It's not Isaac's best shot, but it's definitely the one Sakurai decided to represent in Brawl with his AT, it would be completely different (c'mon, there's absolutely no character capable of doing that) and would hold no rival.

You can't deny that

 

[LasermasterA]

Little Mac is the ground-focused newcomer.

Palutena has all those unique specials.

Robin uses a combination of swords and elemental magic.

Shulk has the midmatch stat changes.

I'd hate to think that Isaac was considered redundant...

Good catch. Seriously now you are making it sound like he saw Isaac, then just introduced different characters based off of him.... We want the original who has all these things to him!

But still now after all this, it would sound really LAME for Sakurai to say that Isaac has nothing special!

Especially when Isaac came before Robin and Shulk!

If I have learned something being in the boards is that being overoptimistic is never a good thing you join a thread with a bunch of people that like what you like, they all make you feel like the character all you love stand a realistic chance. Then when the deconfirmation happens everybody goes to utterly dissapoinment and can't believe how Sakurai skipped in such a great addition.

I am not saying Isaac is out but staying overoptimistic at this point might leak to horrible dissapoinment, I have never been in this thread but I love Golden Sun and finished Dark Dawn for the 3rd time last week, I am not sure why everybody look at Shulk as if he is Isaac's rival. What really hurt Isaac is the saturation of swordfighters we already have.

That said I understand why Shulk is here and I approve his inclusion as said before I never understood why both characters are seen as "slot rivals" both franchises have merits. I hope this doesn't turn into a hate fest like the Chrom thread.

Isaac is not out yet but the future isn't looking bright

Actually I don't consider Shulk as a rival but more of a complement to Isaac. He might be similar in some aspects but they are both heroes of one of the only yet AMAZING JRPGs Nintendo has made. I always thought they could be in together, representing Nintendo's flagship JRPG series!

There's a bizallion ways to design Isaac around.
He could be a magic swordsman, but Robin's there (he could still be designed completely different though)
He could be a swordsman whose stats change when using certain commands, but Shulk's there (same as upper)

But there's still -and I personally would be okay with- a "mostly glove-psynergy focused" moveset. It's not Isaac's best shot, but it's definitely the one Sakurai decided to represent in Brawl with his AT, it would be completely different (c'mon, there's absolutely no character capable of doing that) and would hold no rival.

You can't deny that

Not denying that ever! Seriously Isaac has so many possible movesets that even considering above reveals, he can still be unique!

Heck a moveset around utility psynergies would also be amazing and still be unique! We can make a moveset around his Venus set, his multi-elemental set, Djinn set, summon set, party set (calling other adepts), other element set, utility set, etc! Too many possibilites! Any GS fan can see that and whoever looks at the series with even a little scrutiny!

Now you can't deny that either

 

[Oracle_Summon]

So there are people who believe Shulk hurts Isaac's chances? That makes no sense, they fight nothing alike.

Isaac's chances have not dwindled or changed since the beginning of the SSB4 E3 2013 Reveal Video.

Until we get an official deconfirmation of Isaac, I shall support him.

 

[Arteen]

Assuming the speculation of five more characters is true, most of those will probably be veterans (Ice Climbers, Lucas, Wolf, maybe Mewtwo). And if there's a newcomer there, I wouldn't expect anything other than a Rhythm Heaven character. And if it is someone else, there's no reason to expect it'll be Isaac given how many other newcomers there could be.

I feel Isaac's chances of appearing in the stock game are far too low. The best we can hope is DLC, and that "assist trophy" really does mean "almost a fighter" to Sakurai. We could just as easily get Cat Mario and Cat Peach fighter DLC so Nintendo can sell some cat amiibos.

 

[ShinyRegice]

I am not saying Isaac is out but staying overoptimistic at this point might leak to horrible dissapoinment, I have never been in this thread but I love Golden Sun and finished Dark Dawn for the 3rd time last week, I am not sure why everybody look at Shulk as if he is Isaac's rival. What really hurt Isaac is the saturation of swordfighters we already have.

I'm pretty sure that Isaac would use mainly psynergy as a way to attack, using his sword as a very secondary weapon. Robin seems to equally use tomes and swords as an SSB4 fighter, but IMO Isaac is primarily a psynergy attacker who only uses swords occasionally. I easily imagine Isaac use sword attacks only as his aerials, due to the fact that a lot of psynergy attacks he uses like Gaia or Earthquake would make little sense in the air.

Well, before today, I didn't see it either.
But if what they're saying is true, and Shulk indeed changes stats with one of his specials... Then I'm afraid I have to lower my expectations for Isaac considerably... That was a thing, in Golden Sun. Even if it's not the most popular gimmick to have, I always thought that'd be it. Changing stats when different elemental Djinnis are used.
Shulk took that for himself, now almost all hope is lost... Unless it's that rare ocassion where two unrelated Newcomers share a gimmick?

Yes, a stat-changing gimmick, that was how I imagined Isaac's special moves, before unleashing the djinni to attack and losing the stat change once the djinni is unleashed by using the same special move again. When I saw Shulk my hope for a such unique gimmick for Isaac was lost. Maybe his special moves will consist only of unleashing those djinn without the stat change gimmick.

With the update of the official site today I saw that an Assist Trophy section was added, and I obviously hoped to not see Isaac again at this role. Fortunately he's still not deconfirmed yet, and we instead have a Dr. Kawashima Assist Trophy. I read the description... and I now feel that he's the most amazing AT implemented in Smash. This title belonged to Isaac in Brawl, but now that Isaac isn't the most amazing AT anymore in my eyes I feel that he deserves even more to be promoted to playable!

Realistically our only hope for Isaac is this remaining slot in the stage selection screen. I don't think that all the stages has been unlocked on the leak, because it would be really ugly. We have to hope that this last slot is for an unlockable, unrevealed Golden Sun stage related to unlockable Isaac, but a Rhythm Heaven stage related to an unlockable Rhythm Heaven rep seems more likely.

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

Even if Isaac gets a changing mechanic like Shulk's they won't be anything alike, because Isaac would focus on psyenergy while Shulk just gets buffed. Real heros don't get buffed by blades, real heros get buffed by their travels and by climbing Elemental Lighthouses.

 

[e105beta]

I'd settle for a clone of Robin

 

[RhymesWithEmpty]

If I have learned something being in the boards is that being overoptimistic is never a good thing you join a thread with a bunch of people that like what you like, they all make you feel like the character all you love stand a realistic chance. Then when the deconfirmation happens everybody goes to utterly dissapoinment and can't believe how Sakurai skipped in such a great addition.

That's the thing I feel like a lot of people here fail to realize - all of us here, in this thread, exist in a pro-Isaac bubble. A bubble that is super-focused in on one particular character from one particular, somewhat niche series. The rest of the world is not losing their minds that no Golden Sun related info has been released for Smash 4. We are, because we specifically came here to discuss exactly that, so of course our point of view is going to be heavily skewed XD So when people express such disbelief that Isaac may not be in or that no Golden Sun stuff has been shown off yet, as much as I want Isaac, I kind of have to laugh - it's not that Sakurai is spiting us, it's just that Golden Sun doesn't have as much drawing power we have deluded ourselves into thinking it does. In this thread, it's a travesty, but everywhere else, it's more a statement of fact. I hate to be a bummer, I really do, but regardless of whether or not Isaac makes it in, the sad reality is, we're in the minority.

That said, I find it funny that Sakurai said Shulk isn't the kind of character that would usually appear in Smash Bros, because that's exactly how I felt about him. Not because he doesn't fit, but because he's so recent. I really felt like only appearing in one title from a new series just didn't give him enough relevancy or history with Nintendo to warrant an appearance as a playable character. I guess with the new Xenoblade game coming out, and their porting his game to the 3DS, however, things are a bit different. Seems like it was a combination of "Hey, we've got this new IP with a lot of groundswell that we want to turn into a huge thing!" and "We can make him a unique character by letting him change his stats!" Which, admittedly, is pretty neat, and I feel like it works more smoothly than having Isaac change classes would have. I was never a fan of the more gimmicky Isaac movesets, to be honest - I just want to see him with a straight up sword/earth psynergy combo type of moveset, with maybe some other psynergies or a few Djinn attacks peppered in. So Shulk doesn't really infringe on Isaac's territory in my mind, and I'm glad that they at least made him unique. With any luck, Xenoblade will become a hugely successful series that retroactively warrants his place in Smash... and with even more luck, Isaac will somehow manage to squeeze in there as well, although I remain skeptical in my support.

Anyways, I'm done rambling now Just trying to bring a healthy dose of reason to the thread, so don't hate on me too much I hate to see people getting so worked up on either side of these will-he-won't-he make it in arguments, so I will merely recommend that you all try to remain reasonably prepared for either outcome, haha.

 

[LasermasterA]

So there are people who believe Shulk hurts Isaac's chances? That makes no sense, they fight nothing alike.

Isaac's chances have not dwindled or changed since the beginning of the SSB4 E3 2013 Reveal Video.

Until we get an official deconfirmation of Isaac, I shall support him.

I don't know why the reveal changed anything. Even after the leak, which most believed to be true about Shulk and Bowser Jr. at the least, we didn't think Isaac's chances were any less. We still thought Shulk was in and thought it did not affect Isaac's chances.

Assuming the speculation of five more characters is true, most of those will probably be veterans (Ice Climbers, Lucas, Wolf, maybe Mewtwo). And if there's a newcomer there, I wouldn't expect anything other than a Rhythm Heaven character. And if it is someone else, there's no reason to expect it'll be Isaac given how many other newcomers there could be.

I feel Isaac's chances of appearing in the stock game are far too low. The best we can hope is DLC, and that "assist trophy" really does mean "almost a fighter" to Sakurai. We could just as easily get Cat Mario and Cat Peach fighter DLC so Nintendo can sell some cat amiibos.

Seriously that would make me cringe! Cat Mario or Cat peach as fighter!?!? And I don't see all this about Rhythm Heaven reps, they just look like black and white blobby stick figure people. I am so sorry to offend any Rhythm Heaven fan, haven't played the game but I just don't get all the hype behind them. Only newcomer candidate that I don't understand.

That's the thing I feel like a lot of people here fail to realize - all of us here, in this thread, exist in a pro-Isaac bubble. A bubble that is super-focused in on one particular character from one particular, somewhat niche series. The rest of the world is not losing their minds that no Golden Sun related info has been released for Smash 4. We are, because we specifically came here to discuss exactly that, so of course our point of view is going to be heavily skewed XD So when people express such disbelief that Isaac may not be in or that no Golden Sun stuff has been shown off yet, as much as I want Isaac, I kind of have to laugh - it's not that Sakurai is spiting us, it's just that Golden Sun doesn't have as much drawing power we have deluded ourselves into thinking it does. In this thread, it's a travesty, but everywhere else, it's more a statement of fact. I hate to be a bummer, I really do, but regardless of whether or not Isaac makes it in, the sad reality is, we're in the minority.

That said, I find it funny that Sakurai said Shulk isn't the kind of character that would usually appear in Smash Bros, because that's exactly how I felt about him. Not because he doesn't fit, but because he's so recent. I really felt like only appearing in one title from a new series just didn't give him enough relevancy or history with Nintendo to warrant an appearance as a playable character. I guess with the new Xenoblade game coming out, and their porting his game to the 3DS, however, things are a bit different. Seems like it was a combination of "Hey, we've got this new IP with a lot of groundswell that we want to turn into a huge thing!" and "We can make him a unique character by letting him change his stats!" Which, admittedly, is pretty neat, and I feel like it works more smoothly than having Isaac change classes would have. I was never a fan of the more gimmicky Isaac movesets, to be honest - I just want to see him with a straight up sword/earth psynergy combo type of moveset, with maybe some other psynergies or a few Djinn attacks peppered in. So Shulk doesn't really infringe on Isaac's territory in my mind, and I'm glad that they at least made him unique. With any luck, Xenoblade will become a hugely successful series that retroactively warrants his place in Smash... and with even more luck, Isaac will somehow manage to squeeze in there as well, although I remain skeptical in my support.

Anyways, I'm done rambling now Just trying to bring a healthy dose of reason to the thread, so don't hate on me too much I hate to see people getting so worked up on either side of these will-he-won't-he make it in arguments, so I will merely recommend that you all try to remain reasonably prepared for either outcome, haha.

I agree that we might be in a pro-Isaac bubble BUT Golden Sun used to be really popular! One of the best games on GBA and a big thing in that! Sure, many GS fans have lost hope, some have just moved on that is why this thread seems like that. It is now 2014, 13 years after the 1st game (please be lucky for GS) that the series has lost its steam that we are now seeming somewhat too optimistic or unreasonable to people. If Brawl had come closer to Golden Sun 2 then it actually did, we wouldn't even be on this thread, since Isaac would have been a veteran!

Even if Isaac gets a changing mechanic like Shulk's they won't be anything alike, because Isaac would focus on psyenergy while Shulk just gets buffed. Real heros don't get buffed by blades, real heros get buffed by their travels and by climbing Elemental Lighthouses.

So right! Isaac no matter which sword he uses is epic! And the Sol Blade just buffs that while his main power is psynergy! A solo psynergy character might be the way to go for Isaac after all this! The sword could be used just for any counter mechanic, aerials and Meggido!

 

[e105beta]

Anyways, I'm done rambling now Just trying to bring a healthy dose of reason to the thread, so don't hate on me too much I hate to see people getting so worked up on either side of these will-he-won't-he make it in arguments, so I will merely recommend that you all try to remain reasonably prepared for either outcome, haha.

Well if we're gonna be bummers, the more successful Xenoblade Chronicles is, the lower the chance Golden Sun has at a comeback.

"But e105beta! They aren't competing!"

Bull. They're both second-party, traditional JRPGs beholden to Nintendo, and Nintendo has never really been one to spread their resources around sub-series. I've already seen this happen with Castlevania, where after the comeback flops, the series dies off, because why spend resources on bringing back an old "niche" RPG when they have a new one that everyone is fawning over.

We might see it otherwise, but Dark Dawn was received with a yawn at best. Golden Sun needs this Smash Bros pretty badly.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

That's the thing I feel like a lot of people here fail to realize - all of us here, in this thread, exist in a pro-Isaac bubble. A bubble that is super-focused in on one particular character from one particular, somewhat niche series. The rest of the world is not losing their minds that no Golden Sun related info has been released for Smash 4. We are, because we specifically came here to discuss exactly that, so of course our point of view is going to be heavily skewed XD So when people express such disbelief that Isaac may not be in or that no Golden Sun stuff has been shown off yet, as much as I want Isaac, I kind of have to laugh - it's not that Sakurai is spiting us, it's just that Golden Sun doesn't have as much drawing power we have deluded ourselves into thinking it does. In this thread, it's a travesty, but everywhere else, it's more a statement of fact. I hate to be a bummer, I really do, but regardless of whether or not Isaac makes it in, the sad reality is, we're in the minority.

Anyways, I'm done rambling now Just trying to bring a healthy dose of reason to the thread, so don't hate on me too much I hate to see people getting so worked up on either side of these will-he-won't-he make it in arguments, so I will merely recommend that you all try to remain reasonably prepared for either outcome, haha.

If people want to get hyped up on Isaac let them, telling them not to serves no real purpose, regardless if you do it with good intentions.

I see Isaac's chances as good as they have ever been, but other people don't think so, that is pretty much the people who have talked negatively about Isaac's chances in a nutshell.

So, are we going to discuss the chances of Isaac getting in, instead of hypothesizing how big his series is?

Edit: You claim Isaac supporters are in a "bubble", but you have failed to realize that the Isaac support thread has been on its toes since the beginning or have you yet to recall the "At this point it is better not to see Isaac at all" statements that have been made in this Thread?

 

[LasermasterA]

If people want to get hyped up on Isaac let them, telling them should not serves no real purpose, regardless if you do it with good intentions.

I see Isaac's chances as good as they have ever been, but other people don't think so, that is pretty much the people who have talked negatively about Isaac's chances in a nutshell.

So, are we going to discuss the chances of Isaac getting in, instead of hypothesizing how big his series is?

He has a great chance of getting in still! So there!

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

So right! Isaac no matter which sword he uses is epic! And the Sol Blade just buffs that while his main power is psynergy! A solo psynergy character might be the way to go for Isaac after all this! The sword could be used just for any counter mechanic, aerials and Meggido!

In the movepool I made, I suggested Isaac to be a mono-elemental character from the Square class, the only psyenergy that wasn't part of the Squire class was Growth (except in Dark Dawn, when Growth was also available to the Squire class, but not Mad Growth and Wild Growth).

Now, even with Shulk's reveal, I will keep supporting Isaac and even if he gets deconfirmed, I can always use my Adult Isaac Mii to join the fray.

 

[LasermasterA]

In the movepool I made, I suggested Isaac to be a mono-elemental character from the Square class, the only psyenergy that wasn't part of the Squire class was Growth (except in Dark Dawn, when Growth was also available to the Squire class, but not Mad Growth and Wild Growth).

Now, even with Shulk's reveal, I will keep supporting Isaac and even if he gets deconfirmed, I can always use my Adult Isaac Mii to join the fray.

Yea supporting Isaac all the way. I don't think Shulk goes against him but complements him as 2 JRPG heroes are always better than one

It is funny how more people are coming to lower our confidence after Shulk's reveal. Talk about positivity...

 

[shinhed-echi]

Little Mac is the ground-focused newcomer.

Palutena has all those unique specials.

Robin uses a combination of swords and elemental magic.

Shulk has the midmatch stat changes.

I'd hate to think that Isaac was considered redundant...

He could still have a Mix & Match Djinni system where he can Summon a variety of summon creatures from the game.

Little Mac has a total of 5 Smash Attacks. I see no reason why Isaac couldn't have 6 specials, 4 of them being Elemental Djinni being the Summon button. And that last one being the recovery option.

It's the only thing left he has going for him, imo. The other would have been a tag-team with any of his fellow party members... but we have a no transformation rule now.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

If I have learned something being in the boards is that being overoptimistic is never a good thing you join a thread with a bunch of people that like what you like, they all make you feel like the character all you love stand a realistic chance. Then when the deconfirmation happens everybody goes to utterly dissapoinment and can't believe how Sakurai skipped in such a great addition.

I am not saying Isaac is out but staying overoptimistic at this point might leak to horrible dissapoinment, I have never been in this thread but I love Golden Sun and finished Dark Dawn for the 3rd time last week, I am not sure why everybody look at Shulk as if he is Isaac's rival. What really hurt Isaac is the saturation of swordfighters we already have.

That said I understand why Shulk is here and I approve his inclusion as said before I never understood why both characters are seen as "slot rivals" both franchises have merits. I hope this doesn't turn into a hate fest like the Chrom thread.

Isaac is not out yet but the future isn't looking bright

If people want to believe in Isaac that is there choice, saying anything otherwise or trying to "remind everyone" to not get too optimistic serves no real purpose.

Isaac's future has not changed since the beginning.

Those people who say that Isaac's chances are low have yet to realize and confirm that Isaac's chances have not changed since E3 2013.

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

It is funny how more people are coming to lower our confidence after Shulk's reveal. Talk about positivity...

This is something that kinda bugs me, because we are here to support Isaac, this thread is about supporting Isaac, no matter how low his chances may get, so unless people come to support Isaac for Smash 4, they can go do something else, because we are here to support Isaac, not to bring him down.

 

[Skyblade12]

What new ATs have we seen?

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

What new ATs have we seen?

The new ATs are:

• Ashley
• Chain Chomp
• Color TV-Game 15
• Dark Samus
• Dillon
• Elec Man
• Ghirahim
• Isabelle
• Magnus
• Midna
• Mother Brain
• Nightmare
• Phosphora
• Prince Sable
• Skull Kid
• Takamaru

 

[Oracle_Summon]

What new ATs have we seen?

Dr. Kawashima from Brain Age who was revealed on the Assist Trophy section on the Official Site.

Source:

http://www.smashbros.com/us/howto/entry6.html

 

[shinhed-echi]

The Force is strong in Isaac. I believe he could be a unique ground-elemental character. Grass and ground are hard to come by in the roster.

Wii Fit Trainer has the only ground move in the entire game, and Ivysaur is most likely cut... Which leaves a BIG gap for Isaac to fill.

 

[Skyblade12]

Dr. Kawashima from Brain Age who was revealed on the Assist Trophy section on the Official Site.

Source:

http://www.smashbros.com/us/howto/entry6.html

Thanks. I was hoping some of the old hidden ATs would have been revealed, though.

 

[e105beta]

If we can't get Isaac in the base roster, the last thing I would want him to be is an AT. If he's not in the game at all, he can be DLC. But if he's an AT? That would pretty much spell the end of it.

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

I think that the ultimate troll from Sakurai would be a POTD revealing Matthew's AT and in the same day we get a trailer, featuring Isaac defeating other Swordsmen, like Link, Marth, etc. The vice-versa option would also be awesome, even through I'd rather see Isaac instead of Matthew, but both are my most wanted newcomers. (Isaac being 1st).

 

[LasermasterA]

I think that the ultimate troll from Sakurai would be a POTD revealing Matthew's AT and in the same day we get a trailer, featuring Isaac defeating other Swordsmen, like Link, Marth, etc. The vice-versa option would also be awesome, even through I'd rather see Isaac instead of Matthew, but both are my most wanted newcomers. (Isaac being 1st).

Yup! That is how it should be! Matthew replacing Isaac as an AT while Isaac comes in as playable. And in his trailer he beats up the other swordsmen? Awesome!

But the ULTIMATE troll would be even different. He reveals young Isaac as an AT and then reveals ADULT Isaac as playable. I can't see any other troll way to top that! Although this trolling method will be really painful for us at the start and too awesome at the end. Extremely bitter -------> Very sweet

 

[Arteen]

I think I'd prefer seeing adult Isaac as the AT, just to have a bit of hope that Golden Sun as a franchise will be remembered for more than its two GBA games.

 

[LasermasterA]

I think I'd prefer seeing adult Isaac as the AT, just to have a bit of hope that Golden Sun as a franchise will be remembered for more than its two GBA games.

Yea just switch around the ULTIMATE troll move then. Adult Isaac is announced as an AT and then young Isaac is playable! Plus this will be less painful at the start since we will still hope for Isaac as playable in his iconic look.

The end result is still, Isaac = playable challenger in Sm4sh!

Yea Golden Sun needs to be remembered more than the GBA games which were legendary but still!

 

[Sandfall]

I think I'd prefer seeing adult Isaac as the AT, just to have a bit of hope that Golden Sun as a franchise will be remembered for more than its two GBA games.

I'd prefer to focus on the GBA games. While I still like Dark Dawn, it just doesn't compare to the original and TLA

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

Reggie reffered to Golden Sun as legendary RPG's from the GBA era and we all know that Reggie's body was ready when he made that statement, so now it's time for Sakurai to learn from Reggie, so Masahiro Sakurai, you'd better ready your body and give us an Isaac reveal, with him showing a true display of both swordsmanship and the awesome devastating powers of psyenergy, things that not even an elven master of arms or a boy wielding a led sword could ever aspire to do.

 

[RhymesWithEmpty]

If people want to get hyped up on Isaac let them, telling them should not serves no real purpose, regardless if you do it with good intentions.

I see Isaac's chances as good as they have ever been, but other people don't think so, that is pretty much the people who have talked negatively about Isaac's chances in a nutshell.

So, are we going to discuss the chances of Isaac getting in, instead of hypothesizing how big his series is?

Edit: You claim Isaac supporters are in a "bubble", but you have failed to realize that the Isaac support thread has been on its toes since the beginning or have you yet to recall the "At this point it is better not to see Isaac at all" statements that have been made in this Thread?

Hey now, I never told anyone not to get hyped. People can get as hyped as they want. I am merely saying, being completely shocked over him not getting any spotlight as of yet is rather silly, and that people should try to stay level headed and not act as if the world as we know it has been flipped on its head if he remains an assist trophy. Make no mistake, I will be really bummed if that happens, but I will not be thrown into a state of disbelief XD Aside from that, though, get as hyped as you like!

And yes, Isaac supporters are in a bubble, as are many supporters of various other characters. The notion that it's better not to see him works if you believe he will be a hidden newcomer... but I feel like that's a belief that is further supported by this bubble. And I know that we have been saying that all along, but I don't see how that changes anything? We've always been in our own little bubble. The reason the idea of him being a hidden newcomer is getting harder to believe now is that we have a leak which, with Shulk's reveal, confirms many of the remaining newcomers, and leaves much less room for Isaac than previously thought. Does he still have a shot? Of course. But unless we're getting, like, a 60 character roster, he's got a lot of competition with very limited space.

 

[FalKoopa]

Yea just switch around the ULTIMATE troll move then. Adult Isaac is announced as an AT and then young Isaac is playable! Plus this will be less painful at the start since we will still hope for Isaac as playable in his iconic look.

The end result is still, Isaac = playable challenger in Sm4sh!

Yea Golden Sun needs to be remembered more than the GBA games which were legendary but still!

That probably won't happen. Really, would you like it they labelled them as "Young Isaac" and "Adult Isaac" to identify them?
I'm pretty sure I would be weirded out by that.

Isaac is either playable or an Assist at this point. Nothing more, nothing less. I'm ruling out being less than an AT, as that hasn't happened with most franchises.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Hey now, I never told anyone not to get hyped. People can get as hyped as they want. I am merely saying, being completely shocked over him not getting any spotlight as of yet is rather silly, and that people should try to stay level headed and not act as if the world as we know it has been flipped on its head if he remains an assist trophy. Make no mistake, I will be really bummed if that happens, but I will not be thrown into a state of disbelief XD Aside from that, though, get as hyped as you like!

And yes, Isaac supporters are in a bubble, as are many supporters of various other characters. The notion that it's better not to see him works if you believe he will be a hidden newcomer... but I feel like that's a belief that is further supported by this bubble. And I know that we have been saying that all along, but I don't see how that changes anything? We've always been in our own little bubble. The reason the idea of him being a hidden newcomer is getting harder to believe now is that we have a leak which, with Shulk's reveal, confirms many of the remaining newcomers, and leaves much less room for Isaac than previously thought. Does he still have a shot? Of course. But unless we're getting, like, a 60 character roster, he's got a lot of competition with very limited space.

Your initial comment says otherwise about how people should not get any more hyped and keep themselves at a "realistic" level.

Again, you say Isaac supporters are in a bubble when they are not. Isaac's chances have not changed in the slightest since E3 2013.

Isaac still has a shot since the full official roster has not been confirmed.

In response to bold: Except Isaac is not competing with anyone nor is anyone else, unless you think Dixie Kong and King K. Rool are competing with what seems to be one last DK franchise spot.

Until characters like Dr. Mario, Duck Hunt Dog, and Dark Pit get confirmed then the leak would have some serious backing to it and even then the supposed "leak" proposes that not all characters have been unlocked.

 

[iam8bit]

Aye, things aren't looking good. At least it seems that the CSS roster was indeed incomplete.

I'll admit, Shulk looks really good. But I couldn't help but think that it could've indeed been Isaac there instead of Shulk. If only.

Anywho... No losing hope until the end. Embarrass

 

[LasermasterA]

Hey now, I never told anyone not to get hyped. People can get as hyped as they want. I am merely saying, being completely shocked over him not getting any spotlight as of yet is rather silly, and that people should try to stay level headed and not act as if the world as we know it has been flipped on its head if he remains an assist trophy. Make no mistake, I will be really bummed if that happens, but I will not be thrown into a state of disbelief XD Aside from that, though, get as hyped as you like!

And yes, Isaac supporters are in a bubble, as are many supporters of various other characters. The notion that it's better not to see him works if you believe he will be a hidden newcomer... but I feel like that's a belief that is further supported by this bubble. And I know that we have been saying that all along, but I don't see how that changes anything? We've always been in our own little bubble. The reason the idea of him being a hidden newcomer is getting harder to believe now is that we have a leak which, with Shulk's reveal, confirms many of the remaining newcomers, and leaves much less room for Isaac than previously thought. Does he still have a shot? Of course. But unless we're getting, like, a 60 character roster, he's got a lot of competition with very limited space.

If Sakurai would believe that Dr. Mario is a more worthy character than Isaac then that would be a sad day for Nintendo. Not counting Dark Pit as Sakurai just adores Kid Icarus: Uprising and would love it give it as bias as he wants!

Although I still think you are sort of discouraging us as @ Oracle_Summon said Isaac still has the same chances he had as when Smash 4 was announced since we neither have any inclusion teasers or exclusion hints.

Aye, things aren't looking good. At least it seems that the CSS roster was indeed incomplete.

I'll admit, Shulk looks really good. But I couldn't help but think that it could've indeed been Isaac there instead of Shulk. If only.

Anywho... No losing hope until the end. Embarrass

As long as the CSS roster is incomplete Isaac stands a chance. It is normal for us to root for Isaac and seeing a trailer in which we thought Isaac might be present we got Shulk, that is a natural reaction.

Thanks for your positiveness! Keep up the spirit! No losing hope!

Isaac for Sm4sh!

 

[Bassoonist]

It may be too early to say this, but I'm feeling pretty pessimistic here...

I just can't believe that Golden Sun apparently didn't even get a 3DS stage. I really liked the idea of having a 3DS and Wii U version with separate stages for that reason: Getting a bunch of stages that we wouldn't get otherwise. But even with a portable SSB made specifically to better cater to portable iterations/series Golden Sun still isn't even worthy of a mere stage?

It is no joke when so many members in here worry about Golden Sun being flat out forgotten. Golden Sun gets a new title and receives little (or possibly even no) new representation, while Kid Icarus gets a new title and gets two whole new characters and a great amount of other kinds of content.

(I know I harp on the KI representation a lot, but it is absurd how much bias went toward it in this game and I will never be able to look at Sakurai the same ever again)

 

[BluePikmin11]

If Sakurai would believe that Dr. Mario is a more worthy character than Isaac then that would be a sad day for Nintendo. Not counting Dark Pit as Sakurai just adores Kid Icarus: Uprising and would love it give it as bias as he wants!

Although I still think you are sort of discouraging us as @ Oracle_Summon said Isaac still has the same chances he had as when Smash 4 was announced since we neither have any inclusion teasers or exclusion hints.



As long as the CSS roster is incomplete Isaac stands a chance. It is normal for us to root for Isaac and seeing a trailer in which we thought Isaac might be present we got Shulk, that is a natural reaction.

Thanks for your positiveness! Keep up the spirit! No losing hope!

Isaac for Sm4sh!

Dr. Mario has more history and importance with Nintendo than Golden Sun just so you know.

 

[Gotann]

That's the thing I feel like a lot of people here fail to realize - all of us here, in this thread, exist in a pro-Isaac bubble. A bubble that is super-focused in on one particular character from one particular, somewhat niche series. The rest of the world is not losing their minds that no Golden Sun related info has been released for Smash 4. We are, because we specifically came here to discuss exactly that, so of course our point of view is going to be heavily skewed XD So when people express such disbelief that Isaac may not be in or that no Golden Sun stuff has been shown off yet, as much as I want Isaac, I kind of have to laugh - it's not that Sakurai is spiting us, it's just that Golden Sun doesn't have as much drawing power we have deluded ourselves into thinking it does. In this thread, it's a travesty, but everywhere else, it's more a statement of fact. I hate to be a bummer, I really do, but regardless of whether or not Isaac makes it in, the sad reality is, we're in the minority.

That said, I find it funny that Sakurai said Shulk isn't the kind of character that would usually appear in Smash Bros, because that's exactly how I felt about him. Not because he doesn't fit, but because he's so recent. I really felt like only appearing in one title from a new series just didn't give him enough relevancy or history with Nintendo to warrant an appearance as a playable character. I guess with the new Xenoblade game coming out, and their porting his game to the 3DS, however, things are a bit different. Seems like it was a combination of "Hey, we've got this new IP with a lot of groundswell that we want to turn into a huge thing!" and "We can make him a unique character by letting him change his stats!" Which, admittedly, is pretty neat, and I feel like it works more smoothly than having Isaac change classes would have. I was never a fan of the more gimmicky Isaac movesets, to be honest - I just want to see him with a straight up sword/earth psynergy combo type of moveset, with maybe some other psynergies or a few Djinn attacks peppered in. So Shulk doesn't really infringe on Isaac's territory in my mind, and I'm glad that they at least made him unique. With any luck, Xenoblade will become a hugely successful series that retroactively warrants his place in Smash... and with even more luck, Isaac will somehow manage to squeeze in there as well, although I remain skeptical in my support.

Anyways, I'm done rambling now Just trying to bring a healthy dose of reason to the thread, so don't hate on me too much I hate to see people getting so worked up on either side of these will-he-won't-he make it in arguments, so I will merely recommend that you all try to remain reasonably prepared for either outcome, haha.

Yea, I thought about Shulk being too recent at first, but then I thought about Pikachu and Jigglypuff.
Altough, it is Pokemon. And this is just one example, every other character had a decent history or had more than one game. Pokemon GS was also on its way to being released when Smash Bros 64 first came out.
So Shulk is kind of in the same situation. Just that Pokemon was a lot more popular, maybe that's why he needed to bring that up.
So yea, in that sense Sakurai's quote makes a lot more sense. Which means nothing to Isaac, so that's good.


Even when looking at these newcomers, I still don't think it would be a problem coming up with a unique moveset for Isaac. Two of the most iconic things when I think about Isaac is his Hand Psyenergy moves and Earth moves, which no other characters have. When I think about earth moves, I think about earth pillars coming off the ground and throwing rocks, so digging doesn't really count.
And that's just the simple stuff. I don't think he needs a special gimmick, because he could still be unique without one. A lot of the newcomers for Smash 4 came with a unique gimmick but not all of them. A lot of veterans are pretty simple and they are still unique.
But if Sakurai wanted to go deeper into it, he could easily do that as well. Even take moves from other characters or bosses, like he's already done in the past.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Dr. Mario has more history and importance with Nintendo than Golden Sun just so you know.

Your bias is showing BluePikmin11. Dr. Mario was a Puzzle game introduced in the NES era. Dr. Mario has more history with Nintendo, but not his importance.

Panel De Pon is the main puzzle game series from Nintendo, not Dr. Mario.

Dr. Mario is Mario in a Doctor suit who got a playable spot in Melee.

Isaac is from the Golden Sun series that brought new light and capabilities to the RPG franchise. It was also critically acclaimed as one of the best RPGs.

Dr. Mario is a puzzle game series.