Is Sakurai losing ideas oncharacter attacks?

[Homelessvagrant]

Looking at the newcomers specials, they mostly look like moves shared by old smash characters. The Newcomers so far (besides wario) seem to be very generic.

Charizard Nuetral B= Bowser's flame attack

Side B =Jigglypuff's pound

Ike's Nuetral b=Marth's Nuetral B

up B= Kirby's sword attack

Ivysaur's Up B= Zero suit samus's up B

Pit's Nuetral B= Link's Bow (to some extent)

Metaknight's Nuetral b= Mario tornado

side B= Fox's fox illusion

down B= mario's cape

up B= Marth's up B

I know we don't know the exact properties of these attcks as of yet but it just seems so generic as of yet. What do you think

Update:
thanks for the replies, i myself actually don't believe Sakurai ran out of ideas either. One however can not truly learn about something until you question your own ideals.

Charizard's flamethrower seems to have a bigger hitbox then Bowsers and probably has different properties as well. the rest I practically BSed on. However this is not spam, I only wish to challenge your ideas.

 

[IllidR]

If you look at them without much depth they may look similar. But really, he's not running out of ideas. Charizard without his neutral B just wouldn't have been Charizard, so you know that had to have been included and I don't see how his side-B at all is Jugglypuff's pound attack. Ike's neutral B is similar to Marth's that is true but we don't know very much about it yet, and also he may be replacing Marth so that can be why. Pit's neutral B isn't at all similar to Link's.. just because they're both bows doesn't mean anything. You can control it's trajectory and we don't know if you need to charge it or anything. Metaknight's side-B doesn't look anything like Fox's illusion if you ask me.. they both charge to the side but that's not a hint that they're alike. Metaknight's down-B looks different from Mario's cape because it seems as if you can hold it like fox's reflector but without the properties of it. And lastly Metaknight's up-B looks similar to Marth's up-B but it curves backwards and it seems it might not be the end of the move just there, you might be able to glide.

 

[VA]

I think you need to go home. Pokemon Trainer is far from generic. As it says in the "Four types of special move" How to Play update, lot's of moves have similar properties:

B: A move for shooting
Side B: A movement attack
Up B: Recovery
Down B: Shield/Reflect/Unusual Action

And as for characters like Charizard, he has to have flame breath, you'd be on here complaining if he didn't. Rock Smash is no where near generic.

Basically, wait until you actually know the intricate details of the attacks before you judge them. Sakurai's ideas for the game (as we know so far) are brilliant, I'm loving every character (besides Diddy) and all the special moves he has posted.

 

[Drunken_Dragon]

I think you need to go home. Pokemon Trainer is far from generic. As it says in the "Four types of special move" How to Play update, lot's of moves have similar properties:

B: A move for shooting
Side B: A movement attack
Up B: Recovery
Down B: Shield/Reflect/Unusual Action

And as for characters like Charizard, he has to have flame breath, you'd be on here complaining if he didn't. Rock Smash is no where near generic.

Basically, wait until you actually know the intricate details of the attacks before you judge them. Sakurai's ideas for the game (as we know so far) are brilliant, I'm loving every character (besides Diddy) and all the special moves he has posted.

thats ironic lol im thinking diddy is going to have some pretty origional attacks.

 

[Chaudgobay]

don't think so...the atack are diferents, the animation are diferent, they are without ideas with doc mario, pichu

the brawl ideas are perfect for me in the moment

 

[Pieman0920]

We don't know how Charizard's attack works, and it can be very different. Instead of being held down, to prolong it, it may just be one quick shot with farther range. I don't know how you thought Charizard's forwrad smash is the same as Jigg's. I don't even know where to start on that.

Ike's forward B is clearly not Marth's what so ever if you actually look at the screen. He stabs his sword into the ground itself, and fire erupts upwards. For the Up B of Ike, again, it's not the same. Ike has super armor in this attack, unlike Kirby, and it's only the down slash that really can be considred close.

Granted that Ivysaur and ZSS Samus seem to have a simmilar recovery, but as they are both newcomers, it didn't really fit with the topic to begin with.

Pit's arrows are different, as even you conceded a bit. The move can be controlled to a much greater degree than Link's, and outside of it being a bow and arrow attack, it's as different as all the other projectiles.

Metaknight's moves in general are unkown, as they have not been seen in motion, or described what so ever. His neutral B, assuming it works like it did in Kirby is not like Mario's down B, and the Fox comparison for the side B is also completely off. His down B is made up for the game, and we don't even know how it works. (If it does reflect though, it'd be more like Fox's down B) and the Up B is going to be a loop, unlike Marth's B.

Don't assume anything yet.

 

[Masque]

Looking at the newcomers specials, they mostly look like moves shared by old smash characters. The Newcomers so far (besides wario) seem to be very generic.

Charizard Nuetral B= Bowser's flame attack

Side B =Jigglypuff's pound

Ike's Nuetral b=Marth's Nuetral B

up B= Kirby's sword attack

Ivysaur's Up B= Zero suit samus's up B

Pit's Nuetral B= Link's Bow (to some extent)

Metaknight's Nuetral b= Mario tornado

side B= Fox's fox illusion

down B= mario's cape

up B= Marth's up B

I know we don't know the exact properties of these attcks as of yet but it just seems so generic as of yet. What do you think

This post strikes me as very ignorant.

Charizard without Flamethrower is just absurd. A connection between two firebreathing moves, however, is inherent. Rock Smash seems nothing like Pound. If anything, it's closer to Falcon Punch. I don't see a connection between Ike's Standard Special and Marth's. Ike's Up Special is more of a combo than Kirby's, carrying the opponent skyward and then crashing down. Ivysaur's Vine Whip has been around since '96, so it's the other way around with ZSS. Even so, Sakurai mentioned that more than one character could utilize the Tether Recovery. A bow is a bow, and that's that. Link's arrows travel in a straight line, though, while Pit's are subject to the player's directional input. Mach Tornado is much more mobile in the Kirby games than Mario Tornado is in Smash. Mario's cape reflects, while Meta Knight's cape simply absorbs or negates.

The problem here is that the moves are executed in Smash very closely to how they are executed in their respective original games. Somehow you are deluded enough to believe that the moves seem "generic". The moves are similar, yes. But generic implies a lack of creativity, something of which Sakurai could never be rightfully accused. Furthermore, these assumptions are based largely on screenshots--single moments, digitally captured--that give no background to the move's process, just a small portion. Don't assume anything yet.

EDIT: Haha, Pieman, I didn't even read your post before posting the exact same last line as you did. I'm not plagiarizing intentionally. But I'm glad that we agree! =)

 

[Homelessvagrant]

thanks for the replies, i myself actually don't believe Sakurai ran out of ideas either. One however can not truly learn about something until you question your own ideals.

Charizard's flamethrower seems to have a bigger hitbox then Bowsers and probably has different properties as well. the rest I practically BSed on. However this is not spam, I only wish to challenge your ideas.

This thread can close

 

[Hong]

Aether to me is a one-of-a-kind recovery. The fact he throws Ragnell upwards can rule out multiple forms of edge guarding. Ragnell pretty much clears the path so he can make a safe recovery. That and another thing about him throwing it up is it could be used as a nice anti-air measure, though this is already available with Final Cutter.

I'd also like to point out that we don't know if Aether is like the Aether in the game. Will it steal a bit of life? Will Ike use the second attack if he lands on the ground with the first?

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Charizard's B-Up will most likely be Fly, that doesn't mean Sakurai is running out of ideas though.

 

[pkmnrngr]

i saw on the blog update for futismu mag there is charazard doing earthquake

 

[Caael]

This is worse than the ' Ridlii will b a boosa clone cuz dey boff breaf phire'

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

How do you think Vine Whipe and Whatever the hell Zero Samus' up attacks work when they are not near a cliff?

 

[SenorPresidente]

i saw on the blog update for futismu mag there is charazard doing earthquake

that may have been the end result of rock smash. they both had the same shade of brown.

 

[Problem2]

Look, there are 104 different special moves in Melee. Of course they're will be some that are similar, but I know Sakurai won't make them extremely identical. Even Mewtwo's Shadow ball possesses different properties than that of Samus's Charge Beam.

Sakurai is still putting out plenty of unique moves. Ivysaur's bullet seed attack is the best example. There's also Squirtle's Waterfall attack, Both of Wario's revealed Special attacks, and Diddy Kong sounds promising himself.

 

[Spartan_187]

Look, there are 104 different special moves in Melee. Of course they're will be some that are similar, but I know Sakurai won't make them extremely identical. Even Mewtwo's Shadow ball possesses different properties than that of Samus's Charge Beam.

Sakurai is still putting out plenty of unique moves. Ivysaur's bullet seed attack is the best example. There's also Squirtle's Waterfall attack, Both of Wario's revealed Special attacks, and Diddy Kong sounds promising himself.

Took the words right out of my mouth.