Is pessimism ruining the hype for smash 4?

[Naoshi]

The way people defend Smash 4 from critical voices, you'd think Nintendo was a non-profit and was handing out complimentary copies of Smash 4 on street corners.

Don't complain about the roster or you're entitled!
Don't speculate negatively about new mechanics or you're a Melee elitist!
Don't get exasperated over recycled content or you're a man-child!

I can't be too hard on the Smash community -- this "be grateful for what you get" attitude is prevalent in gaming culture at large. And it's ludicrous. Nintendo is a business. Businesses make money by providing consumers with what they want. If consumers don't get what they want, they complain. This is natural. This is healthy. This is what it's like to have quality standards.

There are plenty of legitimate reasons to be disappointed about Smash 4. Questionable roster choices abound. Questionable alternate costume choices abound. Many people aren't impressed by the speed or mechanics of the title. Many people are frustrated by an excess of returning stages on the 3DS version. Many people are annoyed Smash Run is local multiplayer only. And when the WiiU version rolls out, people are going to be disappointed about more things. Many of these complaints might even be justified!

Like Smash 4 if you want. Dislike Smash 4 if you want. If someone asks, be able to provide reasons for your like or dislike. Don't insult and mock people who disagree with you if their opinions are well thought-out. This isn't rocket science.

As someone who has been enjoying what I've played of SSB4... Best post in the thread. Thank you.

Like, I feel most criticism is warranted or logical, even if we disagree with them. At least just the logical criticisms.

There are of course a loud vocal that kind of overly-negative about the game and say non-sense that isn't true (like how a clone somehow takes up a "slot" of an unique character when unique characters takes many times the effort clones takes). I do actually feel some people are getting too emotional over the final roster and having meltdowns over it. It's okay to be disappointed and feel burned by the roster, but it's another thing some overacts and swears every sentence while bashing Sakurai. In time, those people will settle down I hope. One of the veteran threads I was in... some of the people there were so... ugh.

 

[Dragoomba]

oh no nope no Im staying away from that. I think the competitie side ruins smash....to a point because where is the fun D:

Smashboards is pretty much the competitive hub for Smash, y'know. lol.

 

[O.o-RITH-o.O]

I'm very negative about smash 4, simply because looks slow and have lazy mechanics (2 stocks - 5~8 minutes and ****ty things like this incomming) , i know, its made for casual players and all like brawl. The reason why i'm very negative about smash4 it's the very same reason why i don't enjoy brawl. I understand why nintendo would make the game more noob-friendly $$

 

[Joe73191]

No what lessened my hype was seeing the mechanics, lol. What I find strange though is that if someone complains about a mechanic from Melee not returning you get hoards of people saying "Go play Melee!" "Stop complaining!" "Stop living in the past and move on!" "Meleelitists are toxic!" However if someone says that the game should be more like Brawl in anyway, or if they complain about ANY other aspect of the game, people are silent. No one says anything. I found this very interesting.

 

[Accelerator]

I feel like smash fans should always accept any new installment of the game with open arms, instead of bashing it for its flaws.
I just want this game to be popular, to have a competitive scene, to be played in tournaments. but I feel that with all this overwhelming pessimism regarding this game, that this game won't survive long. and that's really what has me the most worried.

Lol

 

[Renji64]

No what lessened my hype was seeing the mechanics, lol. What I find strange though is that if someone complains about a mechanic from Melee not returning you get hoards of people saying "Go play Melee!" "Stop complaining!" "Stop living in the past and move on!" "Meleelitists are toxic!" However if someone says that the game should be more like Brawl in anyway, or if they complain about ANY other aspect of the game, people are silent. No one says anything. I found this very interesting.

It is bad to want some good elements from the sharpest entry in the series.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

The only problem I have with the game are the cuts, but those were inevitable anyway. I am a firm believer in DLC, so we'll see how that goes.

Otherwise, I am entirely hyped for this game. The demo is awesome, and I can't wait to get my hands on the full version.

 

[Gabukin]

Lol

ya, I guess it is a joke.

 

[Mr. KoopaTurtle]

It is bad to want some good elements from the sharpest entry in the series.

No, it's bad to throw a fit and get salty when those elements don't appear.

 

[Renji64]

No, it's bad to throw a fit and get salty when those elements don't appear.

I had low expections from the start due to sakurai's hard on the casual player.

 

[Accelerator]

No, it's bad to throw a fit and get salty when those elements don't appear.

I haven't seen a single person on Smashboards or Reddit that has throw a fit because Smash4 isn't like Melee. I have seen numerous people throw fits when someone gives an inkling of criticism of Smash4, though.

 

[Farorae]

It is bad to want some good elements from the sharpest entry in the series.

It's not wrong, but understand that not everyone thinks it's the sharpest in the series. If you put in something or leave out something from a specific game in the series you can have one part of the player base who loves it and another who hates it. The developers can't win, no matter what they do people will complain.

 

[Accelerator]

It's not wrong, but understand that not everyone thinks it's the sharpest in the series. If you put in something or leave out something from a specific game in the series you can have one part of the player base who loves it and another who hates it. The developers can't win, no matter what they do people will complain.

Melee being the sharpest in the series isn't even up for debate. You can't have an opinion about something that is a fact. It is 100% the most responsive, quickest game in the Smash series.

 

[Renji64]

It's not wrong, but understand that not everyone thinks it's the sharpest in the series. If you put in something or leave out something from a specific game in the series you can have one part of the player base who loves it and another who hates it. The developers can't win, no matter what they do people will complain.

Devs can win if you put the same amount of efforts in both sides. Competitive players get little to work with other than a FD mode.

 

[Farorae]

Melee being the sharpest in the series isn't even up for debate. You can't have an opinion about something that is a fact. It is 100% the most responsive, quickest game in the Smash series.

State it as fact all you want, doesn't make it true.

Devs can win if you put the same amount of efforts in both sides. Competitive players get little to work with other than a FD mode.

People will still complain. Regardless it's hard to say how much effort was put toward both sides unless you've seen the team at work.

 

[Renji64]

State it as fact all you want, doesn't make it true.

People will still complain. Regardless it's hard to say how much effort was put toward both sides unless you've seen the team at work.

It is clear as day this game is mainly for casual/new players.

 

[Accelerator]

State it as fact all you want, doesn't make it true.

People will still complain. Regardless it's hard to say how much effort was put toward both sides unless you've seen the team at work.

But it is true. It's not my opinion, it's just a matter of fact. Which game performs inputs the fastest when you input them? We know for a fact it is Melee. We can even prove it mathematically.

 

[Farorae]

It is clear as day this game is mainly for casual/new players.

None of the games were really aimed at competitive players. This one is probably more aimed at competitive players than any. I'm not saying that it would be more successful competitively, but I don't think it's any more aimed toward casual than any other smash has been.

 

[Crome]

The people who are pessimistic about the game are in the vast minority. They just happen to be the loudest group.

"Vocal Minority".
It sucks, I would be so much more hyped if people didn't go "brawl 2.0" every discussion.

 

[HugoBoss]

The pessimism of other fans will only ruin the hype if you allow it to do so.
The complaints and criticism from various fans shouldn't stop you from enjoying this game. Smash fans struggle with this.

 

[Wizela]

Is it just me, or are people expecting the 3DS version to basically live up to Brawl and go beyond it, even though that's a pretty unfair expectation?

 

[TTTTTsd]

I understand the critical opinions on this game, and yes, VI is going to change a lot(while I will adapt and still use low % combos I can understand the idea that it's weird), but rather than let the opinions of others directly influence you, it's better to just keep them in mind. Lord knows, it might help you play the game better, or understand more!

As someone who plays every Smash to a semi-competitive and competent level, I've learned to appreciate every community. I think that promoting difference of thought more than we are now will only push the meta forward for all games. I've cooled down a bit from yesterday and yes, I can understand the negativity behind VI a bit more now. I still like the concept myself, enjoying tech chase situations in 2D fighting games like ST and others. I like the idea of VI in that you CAN escape, but you're not out of the woods due to reduced airgame. But I understand that to some, combos are way more fun.

TL;DR to each their own, but it's important to discern criticism from hateful messages. I've learned to do that a lot more in my attempts at participating in multiple communities. Play what you love, be passionate. At the very least, people will respect you.

 

[Spatman]

I recently made a post on Tumblr [which you can find here] about how most smash fans are being completely pessimistic about this game, which sadly is draining the hype outta me. So my question is as the title says, Are Negative opinions ruining your hype for smash 4?

your post on tumblr is exactly my thought about smash community.
yes, Melee was fantastic, but come on! we have to go ahead!
to repeat exactly the same game every gen. would be totally illogical

 

[Ragna22]

Gamers are pessimistic about everything these days, too afraid of a game failing, making a big deal of even the smallest changes, losing faith in companies who've made mistakes because for some reason every company is perfect and isn't supposed to make mistakes even though they're runned by people who are just as human as we are, ect.

Just don't mind them, don't let them bring you down on whatever game you're hyped for and just be happy with your video game.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Just don't mind them, don't let them bring you down on whatever game you're hyped for and just be happy with your video game.

In the end, I think this is the most important thing. Regardless of how successful Smash 4 will be at the tournament level, from what I have played in the demo, I just enjoy how the game FEELS. Combos are fun too, but game feel is just great.

What's most important, beyond worrying about the tournament scene(this is purely your decision to make) is if you had a positive experience with the game.

 

[Wintropy]

Is pessimism ruining the game? Sure, if you want it to.

Is it something you should concern yourself with? Sure, if you feel like it's a vauable use of your time.

Does it bother me personally? Nah man.

Will I play and enjoy both versions of the game all the same? Oh yes I will me bucko.

It all boils down to your own perspectives, really. Opinions mean nothing unless you accept the implications of those self-same opinions and infer irrational condemnation from them. Examining them from the context of "does this really impinge upon my happiness and enjoyment of the things that I like?" reveals that, in actuality, such opinions mean about as much as rain falling on the ocean.

Additional commentary: I don't play competitively and don't follow the tournament rulesets so all of these silly arguments about vectoring and Melee versus Brawl is just so much background chatter to me. Great popcorn muncher, though.

 

[Accelerator]

your post on tumblr is exactly my thought about smash community.
yes, Melee was fantastic, but come on! we have to go ahead!
to repeat exactly the same game every gen. would me totally illogical

In this scenario, moving ahead entails going backwards in quality.

Is pessimism ruining the game? Sure, if you want it to.

Is it something you should concern yourself with? Sure, if you feel like it's a vauable use of your time.

Does it bother me personally? Nah man.

Will I play and enjoy both versions of the game all the same? Oh yes I will me bucko.

It all boils down to your own perspectives, really. Opinions mean nothing unless you accept the implications of those self-same opinions and infer irrational condemnation from them. Examining them from the context of "does this really impinge upon my happiness and enjoyment of the things that I like?" reveals that, in actuality, such opinions mean about as much as rain falling on the ocean.

Additional commentary: I don't play competitively and don't follow the tournament rulesets so all of these silly arguments about vectoring and Melee versus Brawl is just so much background chatter to me. Great popcorn muncher, though.

When did this board become so full of casuals?

 

[Wintropy]

In this scenario, moving ahead entails going backwards in quality.



When did this board become so full of casuals?

Not everybody likes Melee as much as you do.

Please don't speak in objective absolutes and use pejorative terminology when making your arguments. It makes for sloppy debating.

 

[Accelerator]

Not everybody likes Melee as much as you do.

Please don't speak in objective absolutes and use pejorative terminology when making your arguments. It makes for sloppy debating.

Putting things in people's mouths makes for sloppy debating as well. I didn't mention Melee in my post towards you. I lamented on the fact so many casuals are here now.

 

[Wintropy]

Putting things in people's mouths makes for sloppy debating as well. I didn't mention Melee in my post towards you. I lamented on the fact so many casuals are here now.

In this scenario, moving ahead entails going backwards in quality.

I was referring to this, actually. ;3 I didn't even notice your latter comment until you edited it in thereafter.

 

[Joe73191]

I think it is so funny that people get upset at Smash 4 being called Brawl 2.0 as if that is a bad thing. They admit by there reactions that being Brawl 2.0 is bad because they don't want anyone to say that. Yet they also don't want it to be more like Melee as shown when they attack anyone who says it should be more like Melee. They get upset either way. Either you say, yeah it is similar to Brawl and they get upset as if being similar to Brawl is a terrible thing, or you say it isn't close enough to Melee and they get upset at you for wanting it to be like Melee and for "not being able to move on" because being like Melee is terrible. It seems like no one wants it to be like Brawl or Melee. Which Smash game did anyone even actually enjoy? Doesn't seem like anyone likes either game cause no one wants it to be like either one.

Either you are happy that it is like a Brawl 2.0 or you are upset that it isn't more like Melee. You can't have it both ways, that is illogical and it makes it look like you want to be upset for the sake of being upset. Those people will only be satisfied when no one says anything at all.

 

[Accelerator]

I was referring to this, actually. ;3 I didn't even notice your latter comment until you edited it in thereafter.

My post towards him was not an opinion either, but an absolute fact. From a competitive standpoint, Smash4 is a much more shallow game when compared to Melee. You won't understand as a casual, but when you intentionally take out various dimensions of game play, you are casualizing it; I.E dumbing it down.

This isn't even up for debate, as Sakurai himself stated his intent to make the game like so.

 

[Wintropy]

My post towards him was not an opinion either, but an absolute fact. From a competitive standpoint, Smash4 is a much more shallow game when compared to Melee. You won't understand as a casual, but when you intentionally take out various dimensions of game play, you are casualizing it; I.E dumbing it down.

This isn't even up for debate, as Sakurai himself stated his intent to make the game like so.

Well, then, I hope you enjoy playing the games you like to play. Nobody has the right to impinge upon your satisfaction of the product as you see fit to enjoy it, and as you are an autonomous, free-willed human being, I won't begrudge you the right to prefer what you choose to prefer.

It was nice debating with you all the same, good sir! ^_^

 

[TTTTTsd]

Are you speaking of depth purely on a mechanical scale, or does this factor in how deep players take the game and its interactions? Because the latter is a pretty important factor.

 

[Accelerator]

Well, then, I hope you enjoy playing the games you like to play. Nobody has the right to impinge upon your satisfaction of the product as you see fit to enjoy it, and as you are an autonomous, free-willed human being, I won't begrudge you the right to prefer what you choose to prefer.

It was nice debating with you all the same, good sir! ^_^

Casuals. Quick to play, quick to leave.

Are you speaking of depth purely on a mechanical scale, or does this factor in how deep players take the game and its interactions?

Only on a purely mechanical scale at the moment.

 

[Spatman]

In this scenario, moving ahead entails going backwards in quality.



When did this board become so full of casuals?

no, in this scenario moving aehad means play a new game

you can dislike it and play melee for the rest of your life, of course, but the most important thing is to cease to judge new games with melee criteria

 

[TTTTTsd]

Alright, then by that alone I cannot deny the simplification. Thank you for the clarification.

 

[Accelerator]

no, in this scenario moving aehad means play a new game

you can dislike it and play melee for the rest of your life, of course, but the most important thing is to cease to judge new games with melee criteria

Who said I dislike it? I have a code and I've been playing it since Saturday. It's a fine game.

 

[Gabukin]

In this scenario, moving ahead entails going backwards in quality.



When did this board become so full of casuals?

Casuals?
I'm just as competitive as any other guy out there. Whether it be melee, brawl or PM, I love every smash game and in each game I enjoy playing competitively. I see a large amount depth with each game.

My post towards him was not an opinion either, but an absolute fact. From a competitive standpoint, Smash4 is a much more shallow game when compared to Melee. You won't understand as a casual, but when you intentionally take out various dimensions of game play, you are casualizing it; I.E dumbing it down.

This isn't even up for debate, as Sakurai himself stated his intent to make the game like so.

This is the pessimism I was talking about when I made this thread. why do you have to compare it to its previous iteration?
Why does it matter if its not as deep as melee? It shouldn't matter, the core mechanics of the game are the same, build up your opponents %'s and knock them off the stage.

 

[Spatman]

Who said I dislike it? I have a code and I've been playing it since Saturday. It's a fine game.

i don't know, in fact i said "you can", not "clearly you dislike it". Although the first impression i had reading your post was it