Is Link Really Considered Mid-Tier?

[Sarix]

Lately I've been playing around with wavebouncing arrows and the boomerang to see where I can use it in my zoning game. I still need to master Short Hop Double Bomb though, that creates some silly pressure.

 

[KariteSama]

I've had friends say that Ness is OP. People who suck use OP as an excuse for getting their asses handed to them.

 

[BigHairyFart]

Sounds to me like your friends are just sore losers.

 

[Player -0]

I've had friends say that Ness is OP. People who suck use OP as an excuse for getting their ***** handed to them.

If your friends like to sit and shield and not actively dodging aerials and PK Fires I can see that. Especially if they don't SDI. PK Fire -> PK Fire, Repeat!

Also, Oli and MK respectively in brawl.

 

[KariteSama]

If your friends like to sit and shield and not actively dodging aerials and PK Fires I can see that. Especially if they don't SDI. PK Fire -> PK Fire, Repeat!

Mostly a predictable approach followed by a bair to the face.

 

[Crescent Monkey]

Stop playing your friends so often and start going to more local events. Both parties will benefit from this

 

[KariteSama]

I'm trying to get to some locals but I just got home from college and I've been really sick. :/ I'll probably make it out next week to xanadu.

 

[Player -0]

I'm trying to get to some locals but I just got home from college and I've been really sick. :/ I'll probably make it out next week to xanadu.

Woot, let's see a Link player at Xanadu! I'll critique you if I see you. (And if I remember)

 

[Fortress]

I'd love to make it to something like Xanadu, but if I were any further away from anything in the country, I'd probably be closer.

 

[Player -0]

I'd love to make it to something like Xanadu, but if I were any further away from anything in the country, I'd probably be closer.

Awkward, there might be some stuff in Canada.

We should move this talk into a social thread or something now.

 

[EmptySky00]

Bomb punting also has use in zoning since its bounce trajectory lets it cover a lot of space especially in tandem with an arrow or the boomerang. The best time to use it is when you know you have the space to perform it without being punished.

Wavedash has too many utilities to list despite Link having the 2nd shortest one in the game. DACUS is good to mix-up your approach with and is fantastic combo filler for Link that allows him to follow up moves that he normally couldn't. AGT is an air dash and a free 3rd jump basically, so its uses should be a bit more obvious.

Is it SERIOUSLY the second shortest in the game?

....Why?

 

[Fortress]

Well, technically Yoshi can't wavedash. So, if his shield physics remain the same, Link could be third. But, I swear that Jigglypuff, Zelda, Bowser, and Peach all have shorter WD's than Link.

 

[Rarik]

Well, technically Yoshi can't wavedash. So, if his shield physics remain the same, Link could be third. But, I swear that Jigglypuff, Zelda, Bowser, and Peach all have shorter WD's than Link.

? Yoshi can wavedash, just not Out of Shield (given same properties as Melee)

 

[Fortress]

Oh, silly me, I'm thinking of whatsitcalled. Glide Tossing.

 

[Sarix]

Is it SERIOUSLY the second shortest in the game?

....Why?

It's been that way since Melee. I don't know why they didn't change it but Link has tools to mask it.

 

[Hylian]

Is it SERIOUSLY the second shortest in the game?

....Why?

Why not? Someone has to have the 2nd shortest lol. Changing it would require changing his physics which most people probably wouldn't want.

 

[BigHairyFart]

Wow, I knew it wasn't great, but I didn't realize it was THAT bad.

 

[EmptySky00]

Why not? Someone has to have the 2nd shortest lol. Changing it would require changing his physics which most people probably wouldn't want.

But Link though? What did he do or what does he have to deserve having such an abysmal wavedash?

 

[Fortress]

Nothing. His physics just warrant it. To change up his wavedash would require changing everything else; run speeds, fall speeds, jump heights, friction, and all of that. Besides, his great DACUS and zoning game more than make up for it, and I think his F-smash would be ***** out of a wavedash, personally. When you talk good WD moves, you're wanting something that has one hit, and hits hard. Link's smashes all hit multiple times, most of them weak until the final hit. Besides, Link gets some great distance and speed from his DACUS, more than most characters gain from their WD, anyway.

 

[Sarix]

Outside of his wave dash Link has plenty of usable mobility options to make up for the short distance it has. The ability to constantly AGT as well as wave bouncing the boomerang and arrows both allow Link to take advantage of his air speed along with DACUS to give him a sudden burst of ground speed.

 

[BigHairyFart]

I feel stupid for asking this, but what's wavebouncing? This is the first time I've heard the term.

 

[Sarix]

Don't feel stupid haha. It's a technique that isn't brought up much. With Link basically you Jump Forward/Backward > Bow/Boomerang > Instantly press backwards. The effect will make Link reverse the momentum of his jump and face the opposite way to move with the bow or boomerang. This can used for approaching or retreating boomerang throws or arrow shots that take advantage of Link's air speed.

I hope that properly explains it. If I'm wrong someone can correct me.

 

[BigHairyFart]

Oh, I knew how to do that, I've just never heard it called wavebouncing.

 

[Player -0]

Don't feel stupid haha. It's a technique that isn't brought up much. With Link basically you Jump Forward/Backward > Bow/Boomerang > Instantly press backwards. The effect will make Link reverse the momentum of his jump and face the opposite way to move with the bow or boomerang. This can used for approaching or retreating boomerang throws or arrow shots that take advantage of Link's air speed.

I hope that properly explains it. If I'm wrong someone can correct me.

That's B-reversing I think. Wavebouncing is different.

 

[Sarix]

Yeah I believe I confused it for something else so I looked it up again. Basically it allows Link to quickly alter his air momentum to throw the boomerang but move backwards in the air. It's performed by: Jumping Forward > Backward Boomerang then smash the Joystick forward. To get down the timing for the boomerang to forward transition I've been practicing immediately flicking to the opposite side after inputting Side B. It's also applicable to arrows but trickier to time. The wave bounce gives Link a way to throw the boomerang while retreating so he doesn't get punished.

 

[Hylian]

Wavebounce shouldn't be a term really. Double b-reverse or Turn around B-reverse is more accurate.

A normal B-reverse reverses your momentum with b moves by pressing the b move first and then smashing the control stick the opposite direction as opposed to a turn around which just fires the opposite direction and requires you to press backwards first. A double b-reverse is cancelling your forward momentum and moving backwards slightly in the air while still firing the projectile forwards and is done by b-reversing a turn around projectile.

 

[BigHairyFart]

Okay, I think I get it now.

 

[EmptySky00]

I really don't care about his WD length. Even if I wish it wasn't abysmal because WD is fun. I was just asking, really.

I find it hilarious how characters like Dedede and Wario both run faster and WD further than Link?


But dat air speed is pretty good, no?

 

[Player -0]

Wavebounce shouldn't be a term really. Double b-reverse or Turn around B-reverse is more accurate.

A normal B-reverse reverses your momentum with b moves by pressing the b move first and then smashing the control stick the opposite direction as opposed to a turn around which just fires the opposite direction and requires you to press backwards first. A double b-reverse is cancelling your forward momentum and moving backwards slightly in the air while still firing the projectile forwards and is done by b-reversing a turn around projectile.

I thought there was a way to shoot forward while moving forward, with like, PK Fire.

 

[Sarix]

I do agree that wave bounce is a rather inaccurate and even misleading term for a double B reverse.

 

[Lethalx]

i would give link Top mid border line top tier

 

[NickRiddle]

I'll admit that I'm no pro at P:M, but I do go to bimonthly tournaments in my area and place relatively high (2-4 out of 20) with Link every time. On top of that, since I've started going, the first place winner is ALWAYS a Link player. He just outplays me and all of the other people that go, including high-pressure characters like Fox, Falco, and Shiek. I've given up on Link, not because he's become awful, but because all of my friends complain that he's OP as *** after I wipe the floor with them. Their main issues with Link are projectile abuse and spin attack. Are my friends just awful with their characters? Because everyone on this character discussion page is sure making it sound that way.

Hi, I'm thr Link from Arcade Odyssey you mentioned. I feel like Link is high-mid. He has the tools to win, but has a hard time with the best characters, asuming they know the match-up.

 

[BigHairyFart]

Hi, I'm thr Link from Arcade Odyssey you mentioned. I feel like Link is high-mid. He has the tools to win, but has a hard time with the best characters, asuming they know the match-up.

Yeah, he's probably one of the most versatile characters, but doesn't seem to handle rushdown characters very well.

 

[Stryker]

After putting in quite a bit of practice with projectile work with Toon Link in brawl, i find this Link is a beast.You guys aren't the only ones hearing cries of OP from your casual friends. Basically, my friends complain about Links projectiles being "too fast" and that they can't get through them.
This makes me giggle, as my favourite part of playing link is projectile mixups/ combo-ing off projectiles. I am a particular fan of short hop>rang>Charged Arrow> Throw pre pulled bomb and then close in accordingly. (Even though I know it's risky, Link's running smash is hella fun)
I kind of ask for it though. My friends can't wave-anything and I'm fairly certain they don't L-cancel, so I shouldn't expect much.

 

[BigHairyFart]

At least you have friends to practice on, I can't convince anyone I know to try out Project M.

 

[Spire]

I'll admit that I'm no pro at P:M, but I do go to bimonthly tournaments in my area and place relatively high (2-4 out of 20) with Link every time. On top of that, since I've started going, the first place winner is ALWAYS a Link player. He just outplays me and all of the other people that go, including high-pressure characters like Fox, Falco, and Shiek. I've given up on Link, not because he's become awful, but because all of my friends complain that he's OP as *** after I wipe the floor with them. Their main issues with Link are projectile abuse and spin attack. Are my friends just awful with their characters? Because everyone on this character discussion page is sure making it sound that way.

This is what happens between my friends and I. I typically sweep with Link every time, and I like to think we're evenly matched players.

I mean, I'm not really complaining because being a life-long Link main I've been oh-so-challenged and now it seems I have the upper hand. However, I hope my upper hand is my skill and not by tier.

 

[Deleted member]

Hi, I'm thr Link from Arcade Odyssey you mentioned. I feel like Link is high-mid. He has the tools to win, but has a hard time with the best characters, asuming they know the match-up.

pretty much this.

the reason why link isn't above mid tier is his problem with pressure and no reliable way to gimp at low %s

 

[Radical Larry]

I would have to say that personally, I see Link within the top 10, in the high/top tiers. Link has had very extenuating buffs that give him rather tremendous results if played correctly.