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Inui says...

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2fAke

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Inui says Ganon isn't viable. Crappy approach and wake up, and all sorts of other things. I'm looking for an answer from the Ganon Bad Arses who actually attend tournies, as I don't. Casuals, please refrain from response. I want professional opinion.

Inui's argument is that camping beats Ganon, period. If anyone has a good argument, please, for all Ganon main's sake, state it. He's mentioned instances where people worse than him used Shiek to camp the ftilt and says that the choke is too easily avoided. He hasn't rained on the TS parade,but on several occaisons has said all characters greater than sign Ganon. Mind you, this guy is a high level tourny player.
 

A2ZOMG

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Pshaw, 90% of the Brawl cast isn't really tourney viable. I think you know what I mean by that.

Ganondorf isn't the worst character in the game though. Only Inui says that.
 

~ Gheb ~

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Pshaw, 90% of the Brawl cast isn't really tourney viable. I think you know what I mean by that.
Wrooooooooooooooooooong.

MK, Snake, D3, Gdubs, Falco, ROB, Marth, Wario, Lucario, Pikachu, Diddy, DK, ICs, Wolf, Pit and Zamus are all perfectkly viable and most of them go a long way solo in a tourney.

That's...about 30% of the characters.

Ganondorf isn't the worst character in the game though. Only Inui says that.
I don't see where he said that o_0

Either way, you're right. Ganon isn't the worst...CF is.
 

A2ZOMG

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*shrug* matchup values are usually dominated by the MK Snake combination as far as I know.

Oh and...uh...Marth AiB forums Ganondorf matchup discussion. Yeah. That's one of a few thousand places where he's said Ganon is the worst character.

And you might not have, but I've butted heads with Inui about that topic a fair bit in the past LOL.
 

~ Gheb ~

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Yea I just read it...well I used to think Ganon is the worst character at first too. Until i got murdered by Flying dutchman once lol
Ganon has more weaknesses imo than CF but a bit more strengths to outweigh them. You can lose to Ganon by merely underrating him / making a mistake. It doesn't work like that for Falcon imo
 

Yuna

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Wrooooooooooooooooooong.

MK, Snake, D3, Gdubs, Falco, ROB, Marth, Wario, Lucario, Pikachu, Diddy, DK, ICs, Wolf, Pit and Zamus are all perfectkly viable and most of them go a long way solo in a tourney.
Depends on your definition of viable.

"Can conceivably win major tournaments against the best players in the world"
or
"Can conceivably place high in major tournaments against the best players in the world"
 

Vyse

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Inui says "touch your toes, touch your toes".

Just look for the proof in Ankoku's Character Rankings and decide for yourself.
...
I just looked.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=165954

But hey, 5 top 8's. There's no reason that can't be you either. It's not realistic to expect any amount of practice with Dorf will win you a high level tournament, but who knows.

Yeah, it depends on your definition of viable.
 

Blad01

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It's not viable without any secondary, because Ganon has **** match-ups. But it's surprisingly not the top tier :D
 

TP

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But hey, 5 top 8's. There's no reason that can't be you either.
Yes there is. Most of us live in the middle of nowhere, and the rest are traitors (yeah Dutchman, that means you).

Thank you, 2fAke, for creating a worthless topic that states the obvious and accomplishes nothing.
 

deadpoe7

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Where were these topics when the meta-game had just reached a level of authority? I mean, first Nessman's thread and now this?...Is there some new discovery of Ganonsuck I don't know about? Otherwise, why bother posting this kinda thing while the rest of us, who are well aware of Ganon's pros and cons, are content to play the G-dorf and have fun working on him?

Wow, I just posted entirely in questions, didn't I?
 

:034:

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Where were these topics when the meta-game had just reached a level of authority? I mean, first Nessman's thread and now this?...Is there some new discovery of Ganonsuck I don't know about? Otherwise, why bother posting this kinda thing while the rest of us, who are well aware of Ganon's pros and cons, are content to play the G-dorf and have fun working on him?

Wow, I just posted entirely in questions, didn't I?
You did.

Gheb said:
Yea I just read it...well I used to think Ganon is the worst character at first too. Until i got murdered by Flying dutchman once lol
:3

Now, Lazenganon will bring destruction unto this thread!

 

hyperstation

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Two things:

1. Inui gets beat by SONIC like...ALL the time, DUH!

2. Why do you care what the Allfather of Johns has to say about your character? I compete in New York tournaments, home of some of the grossest players in Brawl, and you know what? I get my sh*t handed to me a LOT, but that's largely not because I play Ganon. It's because those guys are just DOPE at Smash.

Hylian...send this thread to HELL
 

hyperstation

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Yes. Wanna brawl :D?
LOL. Not now...I'm painting. My computer is just right next to me right now so I can check up on fartbutt sonic players like you sh*tting all over my boards. :lick:

Anyway, as I recall, our connection wasn't that good, right?
 

2fAke

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It looks like asking for professional opinions that differ with Inui's is somehow stating the obvious, my bad. Didn't mean to create a worthless thread, I just figured some Ganon main could point out a few instances where he is wrong. Worry not, I won't post any more threads in regards to opinions, as that is apparently pointless. I happen to be a Ganon fan, so I wasn't trying to dis my own main.
 

Minerva

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Hm, peeking back in. 2Fake's wife here.

Lol, I was at Shoryuken & Texas Showdown at Anime Matsuri when Inui lost to Mr 3000's Sonic w/Pit, so I believe 2F's well aware of that.

Inui is, however, the first pro gamer we've really had lots of direct contact with--y'know, someone who really devotes time and travel to it. We've had debates over Ganon's "viability" for a while. Generally when Inui says it, he says Ganondorf is "completely unviable" as a character, but doesn't denounce any of the others like that. He mentions others as bottom-tier, of course--Captain Falcon, Sonic, Yoshi, etc etc. It's only Ganon that's marked "completely unviable" in his books.

Personally, I'm well aware that Ganon will never be considered high-tier, but I do believe he's not entirely the worstest character EVAR, or "completely unviable" in those terms.

I think what 2F is looking for here is a little bit of conversation amongst the pros: "THE worst character"? "Completely unviable"? I've been interested to hear an opinion other than Inui's, since he gets all bent out of shape that we don't automatically listen to the words of a "pro". It was mostly a matter of looking for another opinion than his.

Yerp.

But will leave it be now, I s'pose.
 

hyperstation

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It looks like asking for professional opinions that differ with Inui's is somehow stating the obvious, my bad. Didn't mean to create a worthless thread, I just figured some Ganon main could point out a few instances where he is wrong. Worry not, I won't post any more threads in regards to opinions, as that is apparently pointless. I happen to be a Ganon fan, so I wasn't trying to dis my own main.
LOL. Take it easy on yourself there, hoss.

Perhaps you aren't aware of the Inui John phenomenon that took SWF by storm a few weeks ago. Inui lost to a sonic in a tournament and then unleashed a torrent of Johns including "I was climbing a mountain the night before and cut up my hands really bad" and "I got really drunk the night before". He's being a good sport about it, but SWF is making sure he never lives this down. Thus, I was just doing my duty by shutting down the validity of his opinion in the most childish way possible. Bust his chops about the mountain climbing next time you see him...because it's your job as a Smash player. LOL.

I'll give you the honest answer, now.

Ganon is one of the worst characters in the game. There are a handful of brutal Ganon's on this board who can go toe to toe with pretty much any character out there, but they'll all admit to you that it's a STEEP uphill battle. Ganon has, perhaps, one or two even or barely advantageous match-ups. Everything else is a struggle (or worse (or SIGNIFICANTLY worse)). Holistic problems include: bad recovery, relatively easy to gimp him, can be punished in lag if he misses a (handful of) move(s), poor grab range, RCO lag, etc etc etc.

Characters like Sheik, DDD, and Falco can just take Ganon to the wash. I mean, you can put the best Ganon against a mediocre Sheik, DDD, or Falco and there's a really good chance he'll still get whooped.

So the basic idea (for me) is that though I can do pretty well in a competitive scenario, if my path to the finals includes a set against Sheik, DDD, Falco (among a few others), I'm kinda in a bind. I can and have beaten high level players of every character, but it's NOT easy. You'd be significantly better off knowing a secondary or two (or just MK, lol) to counter these horrendous match-ups. However, I'm a staunch Ganon advocate and won't counter pick for the best Sheik this world's produced . . .

.
.
.

Thus I don't place well tournaments. :lick:
 

Kinzer

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LOL we are Sonic boarders, telling you that we are the official counter to Inui.

Good Steak G2FTW.

:093:
 

Minerva

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Oh, I can confirm that 2fie has secondaries, it's mostly a matter that Inui "lolz, troz"es at him for even humoring Ganon.

I know. He's gonna be pissed at me if he reads this, but Inui does make a lot of johns. Ironic, since he says "no johns" every five minutes IRL. He made a john about losing the 3000's Sonic when it happened, even. I've witnessed his opinions of a character shift dramatically from week to week, so I tend not to take it too seriously. It went from "sonic sucks" to "sonic is badass" to "sonic sucks". "Wario is garbage" became "Wario is good". "Olimar is trash", which I argued against, because "omg Olimar is soooo good.", etc etc.

Hence why I -- and probably 2fie -- find it refreshing to go to other sources of information. No offense, Inui, but... yeah.
 

Hylian

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Bye bye thread
 
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